Plastic soup the size of the US found in the Pacific

[Black Yaris]

http://www.oskarlewis.com/weblog/archives/5473

here is a brief snip-it
A “plastic soup” of waste floating in the Pacific Ocean is growing at an alarming rate and now covers an area twice the size of the continental United States, scientists have said.

The vast expanse of debris – in effect the world’s largest rubbish dump – is held in place by swirling underwater currents. This drifting “soup” stretches from about 500 nautical miles off the Californian coast, across the northern Pacific, past Hawaii and almost as far as Japan.
http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00015/plastc050208_15074a.jpg

[rg570lvr]

WTF, is that for real?

[Malaya1221]

nice, keep throwing them plastics!:eek:

[BailOut]

WTF, is that for real?

Unfortunately, yes. It was first reported a little over a year ago. The plastics are said to come from all over the Pacific but that California is thought to be the largest contributor.

For what it is worth my wife and I just returned from our local and organic food coop where they offer lots of "bulk" liquids as well as solids. Reusing our containers and bags we brought the following bulk items home:

Shampoo
Conditioner
Lotion
Dish soap
Laundry soap
Olive oil
Eggs
Maple syrup
Pancake mix
Lentil beans
Leeks
Spinach
Mushrooms
Spaghetti pasta
Farafelle pasta
Earl Grey tea
Chai tea

All of that and the few packaged items we bought were brought home in our reusable cloth bags. Once cosumed any reusable packaging will indeed be reused and all other packaging will be recycled locally.

These are small steps that anyone can take to greatly reduce the amount of plastics and other waste in general that they introduce into the stream. Avoiding bottled water and soda is another. The less you waste the less chance there is for the remaining waste to end up somewhere horrible like the middle of the Pacific, or the local landfill.

[ChinoCharles]

It still amazes me how many people don't know about stuff like this. Good post.

[DFA]

I brought this matter up just today in my environmental engineering class. I guess I was wrong, since I recalled it being as big as the UK.

This really needs to get out more.

[m911gt]

great post, very interesting. thanks Joe

[Black Yaris]

my thought is, why not scoop it up little by little and take it to a recycling facility..... that would benefit everyone, just widdle away at it till it is gone

[MadMax]

That's bullshit! It is environmentalist propaganda!

For one, no one would be in the middle of the Pacific Ocean in a boat that small! Two, the Pacific moves is too damn dynamic for that much shit to accumlate in one place!

If anything, that is probably some river in China or somewhere else in Asia. But this story is as bogus as the Condom Reef (http://www.snopes.com/risque/penile/reef.asp) called out on Snopes. It won't be long before this one will be on there as well!

Cheers! M2

[nsmitchell]

my thought is, why not scoop it up little by little and take it to a recycling facility..... that would benefit everyone, just widdle away at it till it is gone
Exactly my thought. It would be a full time job and could make smoeone very rich. Especially if you could crush/melt the plastic into ingots for easy removal from your ship and wouldn't take up as much space. Japan and China go through crazy amounts of plastic.

[nsmitchell]

That's bullshit! It is environmentalist propaganda!

For one, no one would be in the middle of the Pacific Ocean in a boat that small! Two, the Pacific moves is too damn dynamic for that much shit to accumlate in one place!

If anything, that is probably some river in China or somewhere else in Asia. But this story is as bogus as the Condom Reef (http://www.snopes.com/risque/penile/reef.asp) called out on Snopes. It won't be long before this one will be on there as well!

Cheers! M2

Tokyo Harbor once resembled that mess. Now it's much cleaner.

[ChinoCharles]

That's bullshit! It is environmentalist propaganda!

For one, no one would be in the middle of the Pacific Ocean in a boat that small! Two, the Pacific moves is too damn dynamic for that much shit to accumlate in one place!

If anything, that is probably some river in China or somewhere else in Asia. But this story is as bogus as the Condom Reef (http://www.snopes.com/risque/penile/reef.asp) called out on Snopes. It won't be long before this one will be on there as well!

Cheers! M2

Right.

It is actually called the "Great Pacific Garbage Patch," and no, it isn't bullshit or propaganda or anything else you'd like to call it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_Garbage_Patch

[Shroomster]

I don't doubt that something like this exists but I'm calling b/s on the location of it....

- look at the top right of the picture is that coastline or rock embankments?

- look at the name of the boat then down a few inches and to the left there is a LIVE water plant of some sort sticking up through the debris

- what is with the rope that stretches across the picture in front of the boat?

- and like Mad Max said a boat that size isn't going to be out in the middle of the pacific 500 miles away from land...unless there are a lot of little islands inhabited out there...this pic is obviously just to represent the scale of the size....that or it really is just a hoax to get people to wake up

[BailOut]

For one, no one would be in the middle of the Pacific Ocean in a boat that small!
Wrong. I spent a fair amount of time at sea in the Pacific and there are places out there that only swell above a foot or so when it storms. I've even seen a patch of water in the middle of the ocean so still and smooth on a low hanging overcast day that it looked like we were moving on a mirror.

On a related note I was once disciplined for confronting a working party that was jettisoning the ship's trash overboard. This was not an isolated incident.

Two, the Pacific moves is too damn dynamic for that much shit to accumlate in one place!
See above. Another example of how things get stuck can be found in most streams, rivers and even water parks. All it takes is cross currents or back currents meeting to produce eddies. The Pacific is chock full of differing currents.



As for your idea that it is propaganda I disagree. This has been seen and reported on by many people and groups in the environmental circles that I trust for solid information, though when I first learned of it a year ago it was estimated to be the size of Texas. You are certainly welcome to take the Ostrich approach while the rest of us figure out a way to clean it up, which is no easy task as it can't currently be monetized and no one will accept any responsibility for it.

[ChinoCharles]

Who cares if the pic is BS? Maybe the pic was taken from a lake to represent the idea of the patch. When you go to a business web site and they use a stock photo of some random dude in a suit, do you call BS?

I love you guys and all, but seriously, just shut up and nod your head and say "yeah, that is disgusting" instead of trying to repudiate the obvious.

[darthbauer]

Could you imagine falling into this crap?

[Shroomster]

Who cares if the pic is BS? Maybe the pic was taken from a lake to represent the idea of the patch. When you go to a business web site and they use a stock photo of some random dude in a suit, do you call BS?

I love you guys and all, but seriously, just shut up and nod your head and say "yeah, that is disgusting" instead of trying to repudiate the obvious.

hey come on charles I never once said the problem was bs don't get upset.

[ChinoCharles]

I'm sorry man... I'm just sayin'. :smile:

[Shroomster]

I'm sorry man... I'm just sayin'. :smile:

it's all good last thing I need is a mod mad at me


hell I just got a jury summons today so my day has been screwed from the get-go hehe

[ChinoCharles]

I don't get mad. I get EVEN. :slice:

[Shroomster]

more importantly, has anyone on here actually heard of any efforts to clean it up?

THERE are lots of articles about the problem but not one that has a solution or idea about what to do....

I don't get mad. I get EVEN. :ninja:

lmao.....

[Thirty-Nine]

Yes, it's true. However, I had heard it was the size of Texas, not the size of the U.S. The coordinates for the mass are out there, and it's viewable by Google Earth.

[jclo3313]

That makes me sick. People are pigs.

[SailDesign]

Here's an article from '03

http://www.mindfully.org/Plastic/Ocean/Moore-Trashed-PacificNov03.htm

And from July of this year

http://discovermagazine.com/2008/jul/10-the-worlds-largest-dump

[MadMax]

Who cares if the pic is BS? Maybe the pic was taken from a lake to represent the idea of the patch. When you go to a business web site and they use a stock photo of some random dude in a suit, do you call BS?

I love you guys and all, but seriously, just shut up and nod your head and say "yeah, that is disgusting" instead of trying to repudiate the obvious.

I care, because it is an obvious case of disinformation if that picture is not of the actual patch!

OK, I will back off on my claim that it is bullshit, but this article is because if it is exaggerated then it is a lie. Environmentalists are reknown for blowing these things out of proportion (take a look at the so-called Global Warning issue) and by posting a pic that isn't truthful, they are producing propaganda in an effort to get people to act in a desired fashion. It is just yet another example of the everyday use and abuse of persuasion!

I will also agree that pollution is a problem, and that in many places it has been addressed but in others, such as China, it is still out of control. But this article is trying to lead you to believe that there is an entity of plastic the size of the United States floating around in the Pacific Ocean, enough to almost be able to walk on, and that just isn't true!

I will see if my US Navy brethren at work can provide some insight as to what the patch really looks like and how big it really is! But I am pretty damn sure there isn't a patch of plastic the size of the United States that looks anything like the picture given!

M2

[SailDesign]

I care, because it is an obvious case of disinformation if that picture is not of the actual patch!

Then I assume you also believe the war in Iraq to be bogus because there were no WMDs?
Actually, I KNOW you don't think that way, but you should if your quote above is accurate of the way you feel. Or do you just think the Greenies are overstating their case?

[Appalachian Trail 2007]

Yes, it's true. However, I had heard it was the size of Texas, not the size of the U.S. The coordinates for the mass are out there, and it's viewable by Google Earth.

you can't see it from google earth, I just looked.

[rg570lvr]

It still amazes me how many people don't know about stuff like this. Good post.

If you're referring to me since I was the only one to ask if it was real, I apologize for my ignorance, I had no idea it would amaze anyone.

[Black Yaris]

Yes, it's true. However, I had heard it was the size of Texas, not the size of the U.S. The coordinates for the mass are out there, and it's viewable by Google Earth.

trying to find it on Google earth as well

[rg570lvr]

Unfortunately, yes. It was first reported a little over a year ago. The plastics are said to come from all over the Pacific but that California is thought to be the largest contributor.

For what it is worth my wife and I just returned from our local and organic food coop where they offer lots of "bulk" liquids as well as solids. Reusing our containers and bags we brought the following bulk items home:

Shampoo
Conditioner
Lotion
Dish soap
Laundry soap
Olive oil
Eggs
Maple syrup
Pancake mix
Lentil beans
Leeks
Spinach
Mushrooms
Spaghetti pasta
Farafelle pasta
Earl Grey tea
Chai tea

All of that and the few packaged items we bought were brought home in our reusable cloth bags. Once cosumed any reusable packaging will indeed be reused and all other packaging will be recycled locally.

These are small steps that anyone can take to greatly reduce the amount of plastics and other waste in general that they introduce into the stream. Avoiding bottled water and soda is another. The less you waste the less chance there is for the remaining waste to end up somewhere horrible like the middle of the Pacific, or the local landfill.

Thank you for doing all you do to recycle, I recycle everything I can also. I stopped drinking bottled water or softdrinks years ago and I bought a reusable 20ounce water bottle that I fill with tap water, that's all I drink now. We don't have recycle pickup here so I have to drive out of my way to the recycle drop-off but it's worth it. Thanks.:clap:

[rstb88]

most of that stuff probably was made with chemicals pre0recycling standards, the best you could do is remove from the water and dump in a landfill. One complication would be drying it, iirc to recycle the items must be dry, alot of that stuff looks like containers. thats alot of crap to stir up to dry out. Don't imagine falling in it, imagine the animals that live in it or around it.

[Doc Zaius]

Wow!! I've never heard about this. This'll be one of the few things I forward to friends. Holy crap!

[drummerboy2004]

I have never seen this either, and it is a very alarming wake-up call...
I myself, recycle everything I can get my hands on, never use too much water, and keep my electric usage very low.
Thanks for the info...

Matt

[GeneW]

You are certainly welcome to take the Ostrich approach while the rest of us figure out a way to clean it up, which is no easy task as it can't currently be monetized and no one will accept any responsibility for it.

Tragedy of the Commons.... if people were allowed to own parts of the Ocean this would never happen. Since the oceans are "officially" part of "mankind's common heritage" no one takes a strong interest in them.


Sounds to me like a lot of petrochemicals tied up in one place. Be nice if someone could find a way to gather that crap and turn it into petroleum residues, suitable for making new items out of or turning it into fuel.

Maybe use Ocean Temperature Gradient Technology for the the energy source, maybe even make OTGT machines out of it, and then transport them.

Of course if the UN decides it wants a cut of the proceeds... well, too bad, it probably won't happen. Like it or not, the people who get things done in this world usually seek a profit.

Gene

[MadMax]

Then I assume you also believe the war in Iraq to be bogus because there were no WMDs?
Actually, I KNOW you don't think that way, but you should if your quote above is accurate of the way you feel. Or do you just think the Greenies are overstating their case?

Give me a break, once again you are using false comparisons to make a point, which is the same thing this article does by including a picture that isn't of the topic! If this problem is as big as the article claims, then they should have no problem providing a picture of it. But the reality is that a real picture of it wouldn't have as much of an impact as one of some polluted river in China, so they use this one instead to draw up some emotion.

And yes, I do believe the Greenies are overstating their case yet again! Global Warming is a classic example, and they realize that to garner any media attention you have to exaggerate. I am not saying there isn't a pollution problem on the planet, but to claim that there is that amount of garbage the size of the US floating in the middle of the Pacific Ocean is not believable.

By the way, I spent 25 years of my life in uniform, and continue to serve the US military as a contractor. I work with guys who have been to and fought in Iraq, and did two trips to Afghanistan myself, as well as one to Bosnia. I also see troops who have lost their limbs to WMDs all the time at Wilford Hall and Brook Army Medical Center here in San Antonio, and I recognize their sacrifice and courage; so I don't appreciate your comparison between the war in Iraq and some exaggerated claims of plastic floating around in the Pacific! I can tell the difference between what is real, and what is made up...can you?