MPG Mystery SOLVED!

[otterhere]

Okay; I'm a dipstick... Was driving some guys around for the first time since I got the car and was complaining mighily about my disappointing mileage... One remarked that the engine seemed to be running awfully hard and fast; then they started listening for the gears to shift (it's a automatic) and determined that they weren't shifting correctly... Of course I'm having visions of days and weeks spent taking this LEMON back and forth to the dealer or arguing with them about replacing the car when someone noticed my gearshift... Apparently I've been driving it in "3" all this time instead of "D" (I thought it was kind of strange that I had to pull it down and then over, but figured this was just *more* bad design). Boy, did that engine ever settle down and drive smooth after that (also takes care of the "loud engine" complaint), and the guys also all assured me my mileage would improve from now on...

Just goes to show; sometimes it takes a guy!!!

:wub:

[rningonfumes]

Sheesh...lol

[tuckevalastin]

let's just pretend it didn't happen....

[otterhere]

Well, I maintain it's really bad design; what's with all the little indentations, and why double-up two of the gears together? My Swift (not to go on and on about my Swift) had just a straight line of gears, all separate; user-friendly for the "dumb girl" driver.

[Chupacabra]

OMFG.......LOL!!! A classic. Just goes to show you that it "is" important to read the owner's manual.

[otterhere]

After figuring it out, I put it back in 3rd for a minute and thought, man, no WONDER I was griping!!! hahahahaha

Anyone happen to have a photo of that gear thang so I can redeem self to friends???

[Mikeb Yaris]

Well, I maintain it's really bad design; what's with all the little indentations, and why double-up two of the gears together? My Swift (not to go on and on about my Swift) had just a straight line of gears, all separate; user-friendly for the "dumb girl" driver.

First, let me congratulate you for being a good enough sport to post what was actually wrong!

Now, I for one, used to be with you - thinking the gated shifter was stupid. I thought it was just European uselessness / gimick. UNTIL I discovered DCFO that is. The gated shifter makes popping into 3 @ 1100 rpm to maintain DCFO then up into N at stoplights SUPER easy and you can be absolutely certain what gear you'r in without looking at the indicator on the dash or the shift lever. Pop, pop, pop, pop = great gas mileage! I tried doing this on my other cars with straight shifters and was ALL OVER THE PLACE!

I'm a converted fan of the gates!

[otterhere]

"...popping into 3 @ 1100 rpm to maintain DCFO then up into N at stoplights..."

I'm also a good-enough sport to post that I have no idea what you're talking about here.

[TinyGiant]

lol... that happens alot i guess

the dealer i bought our yaris from had us sit in the car before we drove it and said .. okay put your foot on the break and put it into gear ... so my wife slid it down to 3rd also .. not noticing the d.. i guess all dealers dont do that.. but should

[lita_g]

To be honest, I don't get how people get it all the way to 3rd without noticing, the D is right after N, why dragging it one more spot? and isn't it obvious in the dash when it says "3" instead of "D"?. No offense, I just truly don't understand how it's possible.

[otterhere]

With me, it was because I had to pull it down and "zig-zag' it (sorry, but it's not a straight pull down; not like on the Swift and other - more sensible - cars) that I figured I just had to zig and zag some more; because all the gears are "in gear" when on the extreme left, I applied that also to that one SHARED gear. And too many cup holders!!!

[lita_g]

Lol, well, I used to have a mazda6 a couple of years ago, and had to also zig-zag to get to "D", I got used to it though and found it much better than the straight line gears, my previous car had all the gears in a straight line and many times I wouldn't get the right one, although I always looked at the panel in the front to make sure I was picking the right one, it was easier than looking down at the gear box.

You know, you don't HAVE to use the cup holders, I rarely use them (only when I have my husband with me) and they're not an inconvenience, especially since they're always closed. Sometimes I even use the one to my left to put my cell phone in.

[Sodium Duck]

All your posts sound more like, "user errors." How could you not notice the huge LCD display next to your speedometer that tells you what gear you're in? Or the big lighted letters and numbers on the shiter? Stop complaining, if you hate the Yaris so much, then sell it and cut your loses.

Too many cupholders, seriously? What's the next miniscule thing you'd like to pick out and complain about?

[Sodium Duck]

i thought this was a Yaris enthusiast Forum and not Yaris whine forum

+1, It's a shame Toyota just didn't have her to design the entire car specifically the way she wanted. We could've avoided all this mess and blatant overuse of cupholder design.

[tuckevalastin]

well I know I have certainly accidentally popped it into 3rd at least once or twice and didn't notice it for a second.... it may not be a yaris whine forum but its also not a yaris flame every other user forum either....

[Bob_VT]

Huh.... read that owner's manual!

[otterhere]

well I know I have certainly accidentally popped it into 3rd at least once or twice and didn't notice it for a second.... it may not be a yaris whine forum but its also not a yaris flame every other user forum either....

It must be the Yaris Blind Zealous Loyalty forum (I failed to notice that sign, too)...

Hey, it's a great little car, guys, and the best of the lot, but it's not perfect. Should be okay to post the good along with the bad, esp. if it could help someone else avoid the same dumb mistake and thus love Yaris even more.

:rolleyes:

[Mikeb Yaris]

"...popping into 3 @ 1100 rpm to maintain DCFO then up into N at stoplights..."

I'm also a good-enough sport to post that I have no idea what you're talking about here.

There's a sticky on the mileage thread about it, but here's the short version. The Yaris is programmed to literally shut off the gas to the engine every time you lift off the accelerator above 1100 rpms. This has the effect of engine braking, but more importantly the engine doesn't idle burning fuel when you are decellerating. When the engine speed goes below 1100 rpm, gas is again fed to the engine at idle rate.

SO, if you let off the gas (early) when coming to a stop, allowing the engine to do the braking instead of maintaining a constant speed and hitting the brakes, you will save gas! Also, as you decellerate, if you pop the gear shift over into 3 when the rpms hit 1100, you will maintain this effect for a longer period - right up to the point where you HAVE to put the brakes on to actually stop.

When at a stop light in D, the engine is trying to move your car and your foot on the brake prevents it. This puts a load on the engine causing it to burn more fuel than simply at idle. So, you pop the shifter into N and this releases the load on the engine and you'll burn less fuel at the stop lights.

So, you see, when I'm driving in town I cycle from D when maintaining speed, lift off the gas early when I see a light ahead, pop it into 3 to extend the fuel savings and increase/continue engine braking, pop into N when I've come to a stop and then back down into D when the light changes.

I'm currently averaging just over 41 mpg with my lowest tank at 38. This and running max tire inflation are the things I credit my success to.

[lita_g]

It must be the Yaris Blind Zealous Loyalty forum (I failed to notice that sign, too)...

Hey, it's a great little car, guys, and the best of the lot, but it's not perfect. Should be okay to post the good along with the bad, esp. if it could help someone else avoid the same dumb mistake and thus love Yaris even more.

:rolleyes:

+1.

I've read of several other guys on the forum that have set it on 3rd too, I don't understand how anyone would not notice, BUT it's no reason to crucify someone over it. Hopefully otterthere will end up loving the yaris like we all do, or if not, she'll find something else to love.

[gid]

well I know I have certainly accidentally popped it into 3rd at least once or twice and didn't notice it for a second.... it may not be a yaris whine forum but its also not a yaris flame every other user forum either.... when we 1st testdrove an '08 sedan . This could be a danger when traveling at fairly fast speeds or down hills on snow , ice , or rain soaked roads . I would think VEHICLE STABILITY CONTROL could help correct the situation .

[otterhere]

"Also, as you decellerate, if you pop the gear shift over into 3 when the rpms hit 1100, you will maintain this effect for a longer period - right up to the point where you HAVE to put the brakes on to actually stop."

How do you know when your rpms hit 1100; is this yet another signal I'm not seeing?

I am familiar with the practice of putting the car in "N" while at stop lights to prevent its "pulling" on the engine and thus saving gas, but the 3rd gear thing is new to me... Aren't you afraid you're going to wear out the stickshift with all that manipulating???

But it's worth a try; 41 mpg would make up for a multitude of sins.

Honestly, after I noticed the "R" BLINKING at me when in reverse (why does it have to blink???), I think I got in the habit of just ignorning that particular area... I also now ignore the "passenger air bag on" light (why does it have to be on???). Hey, even my passengers remarked on all the lights/bells going on and off in this car (seat belt, etc.).

[4MPG]

I can't believe someone is comparing the build quality and design of a Suzuki swift to a yaris, at least not unless your laughing at how terrible the swift is. Its a SUZUKI pete's sake.

And stability control? What do you need stability control for on a 2300 pound econobox for? You can pick up a yaris in the $11,500-$15000 range for a reason. Not to mention that I have yet to ride in a car with "stability control" that would actually help out on snow/ice etc.... its built to prevent you from over driving the car around a corner in a performance situation. The thing to do with a yaris is avoid anything to do with "performance situations" in the first place... its an econobox.

[Mikeb Yaris]

"Also, as you decellerate, if you pop the gear shift over into 3 when the rpms hit 1100, you will maintain this effect for a longer period - right up to the point where you HAVE to put the brakes on to actually stop."

How do you know when your rpms hit 1100; is this yet another signal I'm not seeing?

I am familiar with the practice of putting the car in "N" while at stop lights to prevent its "pulling" on the engine and thus saving gas, but the 3rd gear thing is new to me... Aren't you afraid you're going to wear out the stickshift with all that manipulating???



My car (I think all sedans are) is equipped with a tachometer. Without a tach, you should be able to feel the car start to coast more freely when the gas kicks in. I'll do an experiment on the way home to see at about what speed this happens. Anyway, if you do not have a tachometer (that would be the dial to the left of the speedometer), just feel for the point when the engine isn't braking you anymore and then pop in down into 3.

I'm not at all afraid of wearing out the shifter. Think about it this way - I'm shifting 2/3 less than someone with a manual transmission. No chance I'm gonna wear this thing out!

[texkid]

Just goes to show you that it "is" important to read the owner's manual.

Damn, you beat me to it.

[tuckevalastin]

My car (I think all sedans are) is equipped with a tachometer. Without a tach, you should be able to feel the car start to coast more freely when the gas kicks in. I'll do an experiment on the way home to see at about what speed this happens. Anyway, if you do not have a tachometer (that would be the dial to the left of the speedometer), just feel for the point when the engine isn't braking you anymore and then pop in down into 3.

I'm not at all afraid of wearing out the shifter. Think about it this way - I'm shifting 2/3 less than someone with a manual transmission. No chance I'm gonna wear this thing out!



Not all sedans have a tach.

[yarisugi]

How many miles did you drive in "3" before you found out? Anyway freeway time during that boo-boo?

[LtNoogie]

I did the same thing the day I picked up the car at the dealer. On the way home on the freeway, I'm thinking... This thing is revving way too high all the time. Not until the next day, did I notice the little "3" on the instrument cluster and noticed the D on the shift assembly. Doh!!!

I'm an engineer. We don't read no stinking owners manuals.

[otterhere]

How many miles did you drive in "3" before you found out? Anyway freeway time during that boo-boo?

Oh, quite a few... I'd estimate about four round-trips of 100 or more miles on the interestate at around 70 mph each... Poor engine...


:cry:

[landrym28]

When I first took the car for a test drive, I paid attention to all the little gadget and lights, just to see how it all works and what needs to be done or not done for lights on the display to show.

[Revsson]

My car (I think all sedans are) is equipped with a tachometer. Without a tach, you should be able to feel the car start to coast more freely when the gas kicks in. I'll do an experiment on the way home to see at about what speed this happens. Anyway, if you do not have a tachometer (that would be the dial to the left of the speedometer), just feel for the point when the engine isn't braking you anymore and then pop in down into 3.

I'm not at all afraid of wearing out the shifter. Think about it this way - I'm shifting 2/3 less than someone with a manual transmission. No chance I'm gonna wear this thing out!

She drives a LB, and has no tach. I don't have one, until I either install one
or get a ScanguageII. I would be interested in knowing what the RPMs are
at different speeds. I know that I saw somewhere about what speeds to
shift at, but not what the RPMs are at those speeds. I have the 5 speed
and she has the automatic transmission.

Also, how does your car handle in snow with max tire pressure?

[Sodium Duck]

Honestly, after I noticed the "R" BLINKING at me when in reverse (why does it have to blink???), I think I got in the habit of just ignorning that particular area... I also now ignore the "passenger air bag on" light (why does it have to be on???). Hey, even my passengers remarked on all the lights/bells going on and off in this car (seat belt, etc.).

:laughabove: LoL, this has to be a joke or something, right? I can't believe how critical you are of this poor little Yaris. God, stop picking on it, Yarii have feelings too you know.

...T-REX ATTACK!!!...

[landrym28]

Your "R" blinks? Mine doesn't.

I thought all those things you're referring to about bells and lights are standard on all cars, aren't they?

[MadMax]

Honestly, after I noticed the "R" BLINKING at me when in reverse (why does it have to blink???)

This from the person who didn't realize she's been driving around in third gear for weeks now?!? :iono:

Your owners manual clearly explains how to drive an automatic, and if you didn't read it--especially since you seem to be less familiar with cars than most of us--then no other word besides ignorant better describes what you did.

You've been complaining about this car, but in reality the car should be complaining about you!

Some days I honestly wonder how some people make it through life...

[Sodium Duck]

:laughabove:

[Sodium Duck]

Good point. Also, if you're in reverse, how is it that you are looking foward? When I go into reverse, I automatically turn around... to see where I am going...

[lita_g]

Good point. Also, if you're in reverse, how is it that you are looking foward? When I go into reverse, I automatically turn around... to see where I am going...

Actually I do look at the panel first, I then turn around and then start moving.

[gid]

I can't believe someone is comparing the build quality and design of a Suzuki swift to a yaris, at least not unless your laughing at how terrible the swift is. Its a SUZUKI pete's sake.

And stability control? What do you need stability control for on a 2300 pound econobox for? You can pick up a yaris in the $11,500-$15000 range for a reason. Not to mention that I have yet to ride in a car with "stability control" that would actually help out on snow/ice etc.... its built to prevent you from over driving the car around a corner in a performance situation. The thing to do with a yaris is avoid anything to do with "performance situations" in the first place... its an econobox. only adds $250 to the price . If all vehicles had V.S.C. it would be less expensive . The Liftback is light in the rear as well , so could help in those hair raising moments .

[gid]

the brake assist could be hazardous when descending a hill during snow and ice . I've noticed if you hit the brake pedal to firm / sudden it'll give a good jolt that may put the car into a loss of control . Especially if your not an good / nervous driver in poor weather . This applies to the '08 automatic sedan we own . The tranny kicks down to 3rd gear ( sometimes abrupt )when brakes are applied on a descent .

[1NZYaris1]

Oh, quite a few... I'd estimate about four round-trips of 100 or more miles on the interestate at around 70 mph each... Poor engine...


:cry:


Oh well at least it will be well and truely run in , :laugh: if only in three gears .:burnrubber:

[Chupacabra]

In all seriousness though.....this should have been something that you took to the grave with you. I am not so sure that you could/will ever live this down. I mean driving around for weeks in D3. I could see maybe a day or two....but weeks???? One word comes to mind -- CLUELESS.

[otterhere]

The gearshift design sucks... That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it...

[gid]

geesh people . Lighten up a bit . 'Tis the season to be ... :biggrin: .

[gid]

The gearshift design sucks... That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it... and is hard to see on display .

[1NZYaris1]

the brake assist could be hazardous when descending a hill during snow and ice . I've noticed if you hit the brake pedal to firm / sudden it'll give a good jolt that may put the car into a loss of control . Especially if your not an good / nervous driver in poor weather . This applies to the '08 automatic sedan we own . The tranny kicks down to 3rd gear ( sometimes abrupt )when brakes are applied on a descent .

I would agree with you some what , but it is also a life saver .
$ weeks ago while on a 3000km road trip, it help save my bacon ,
a car in front of us skided on a oil patch ,spun out hit a on coming car .
Which crossed over behind us hitting the car behind .
Mean while i was hard on the brakes , and the car did nothing but stop in a straight line .With out any problems apart from hoping no one would hit us .
A total of 6 car s crashed only 3 had abs and 1 of those had vsc, and he was hit by a on coming car swerving to miss every thing.

[Appalachian Trail 2007]

I've got a stick shift so I'd like to see a picture of this "accused" gearshift design.

[lita_g]

I've got a stick shift so I'd like to see a picture of this "accused" gearshift design.

This is the best picture I found on google:

http://www.auto-searchphilippines.com/images/Toyota_Yaris_gate_type_automatic_transmission.jpg

[MadMax]

The gearshift design sucks... That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it...

Sure, and the tens of thousands of other Yaris drivers who figured it are just that much smarter than you are!

Y'know, if you hadn't moaned all about the Yaris you probably wouldn't be getting so much flak for this; but you were so critical of your Yaris--and actually claimed the Suzuki Swift was a better vehicle :barf:--where it turns out you were to blame.

And now you are claiming it is a design fault!

Sorry, but what sucks is your ability to accomplish simple tasks such as driving an automatic (c'mon, it's about as hard as driving a golf cart) or reading the owners manual (takes all of about ten minutes to accomplish for your average adult, so you should be able to comprehend it in an hour or two).

I don't mind people who realize their limitations and ask for help, but to blame the shifter design only further demonstrates your ignorance. I am glad I don't live anywhere near Frankfort, Kentucky as the mere thought of you operating a motor vehicle on public highways scares me more than brake failure and/or teenagers!

[MadMax]

This is the best picture I found on google:

http://www.auto-searchphilippines.com/images/Toyota_Yaris_gate_type_automatic_transmission.jpg

Yeah, I could see how that is confusing!

Dear God, how did you ever manage to drive a stick?!? :iono:

[Chupacabra]

...
Sorry, but what sucks is your ability to accomplish simple tasks such as driving an automatic (c'mon, it's about as hard as driving a golf cart) ...

Sorry...but this had me laughing pretty hard. Most of all because...well, it's true.:laughabove:

[gid]

it's easy to knock the shifting lever from OVERDRIVE to 3rd gear . If you look at the picture you'll see a oval shaped indicator . The lever can be pushed from right ( O.D. ) to left ( DRIVE , 3rd ) with litte force . This is an electric contact to the computer telling it which gear you've selected . If you have kids , pets , or are fiddling around it's not that difficult for it to be bumped into 3rd gear . This could be dangerous if pet(s) , kids , or other are not paying attention or goofing around .

[YAR1S]

wtf. I could have sworn i made a comment on this thread but cant find it, haha.

[tuckevalastin]

what anyone who hasnt used the auto shifter doesnt know is that D and 3 are the same position except that 3 is a slight tap of the shifter to the left of D. Anyone who isn't used to it could easily make the mistake by simply applying some pressure to the shfter as they are moving it to D... also as others have confirmed an accidental tap of the shifter to the left will put it into 3


I also love how some people believe because they drive a shift they are brain surgeons...

[MadMax]

it's easy to knock the shifting lever from OVERDRIVE to 3rd gear . If you look at the picture you'll see a oval shaped indicator . The lever can be pushed from right ( O.D. ) to left ( DRIVE , 3rd ) with litte force . This is an electric contact to the computer telling it which gear you've selected . If you have kids , pets , or are fiddling around it's not that difficult for it to be bumped into 3rd gear . This could be dangerous if pet(s) , kids , or other are not paying attention or goofing around .

If you have that many distractions going on then you shouldn't be piloting a vehicle down public roads in the first place!

Even without a tach, anyone with half a brain can tell when the engine is revving much higher in third gear than in drive.

Quit making excuses, the Yaris automatic transmission shifter is not a faulty design; the fault lies in people who can't be bothered to 1) read the owners manual or 2) pay even the simplest attention when driving. Turn down the radio, put the cell phone away, tell the kids to shut up and leave the dog at home. And eat the fast food at the fast food joint, not while you are hurdling down the road in a several thousand pound vehicle.

And I love how people who drive automatics think they only have to get in and smash down one pedal or the other! Automatics only mean the transmission shifts by itself, they don't mean you can put your brain in autopilot and mentally wander off to la-la land. Or in other words, they are not idiot-proof! You still have to drive the car and one of those responsibilities includes paying attention to what is going on with your vehicle, to include knowing what friggin' gear it is in; even with an automatic!!

[LtNoogie]

This is the best picture I found on google:

http://www.auto-searchphilippines.com/images/Toyota_Yaris_gate_type_automatic_transmission.jpg

It's like the scary maze game on the Internet. If you are able to move the shift lever all the way to the bottom, Linda Blair screams at you through your stereo.:smile:

[CTScott]

Oh, quite a few... I'd estimate about four round-trips of 100 or more miles on the interestate at around 70 mph each... Poor engine...


:cry:

If you did that much driving in 3rd, I would highly recommend getting the tranny checked out and its fluid changed. Starting off in 3rd puts a lot of stress on an auto.

[LtNoogie]

Is this why people leave YW? Because of all of the preaching?

[tuckevalastin]

Is this why people leave YW? Because all of the preaching?



yup

[Luna V 2.0]

The design doesn't suck. It can't be in a straight line because if it was it would slide around from one gear to the other, since it doesn't have a button to push in to unlock it, like older cars do.

And before you say that it should be in a straight line and have a button on it instead like I'm sure your beloved Swift had, some people happen to like this design better.

I have Rheumatoid Arthritis, this new design makes it literally less painful for me to drive when I have flare ups because it uses minimal force to shift. You my dear need to learn how to read. 3 is clearly not D. And if you don't pay attention to that, you should have noticed the roaring of the engine since you were in 70 mph on freakin 3.

I'm a girl too, know nothing of cars, and my old car was an old 92 Tercel that had the same "simple straight line design". Guess what, I looked DOWN when shifting and never made that mistake. You seriously have no excuse.

And I don't get how any of these people are being "preachy". I'm not defending the Yaris, I just won't make excuses for stupidity. After complaining so much on other threads about how much you spent on the car, I'd expect you to be more careful with it, not abuse the damn thing, and then blame IT for being "too complicated".

Since when is reading complicated?

[RejectedDemo]

^Completely pwned. This thread attracted me because of the sheer stupidity of it. I mean, otterhere, you make all women just look horrible.

[gid]

lighten up . No need for name calling , etc..

[Kal-El]

The gearshift design sucks... That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it...

It's a typical gated shifter (similar to what's in most cars)...

Even Suzuki :tongue:

The Yaris is pictured first, followed by other models...

[Kal-El]

Ottahere, what year Swift (Geo Metro) did you have?

[eTiMaGo]

for what it's worth, this is not the first person to have made what is really a simple mistake (and I am sure there are many more who haven't told us about it :wink:)

So there' no need to get tempers flared up about it...

[eTiMaGo]

If you did that much driving in 3rd, I would highly recommend getting the tranny checked out and its fluid changed. Starting off in 3rd puts a lot of stress on an auto.

Actually it does not force the car to stay in 3 all the time but rather limit the highest gear it will use... so the "D" would give you the full 1-2-3-4 range, "3" just 1-2-3, and so on...

[eTiMaGo]

Anyway I am closing this thread, remember guys, the Yaris is an entry-level car, we need to expect people with limited driving experience to be fellow owners, and the more experienced ones should do their best to be supportive, not bash on them :wink:

Cars are like computers now, a commodity that you don't need to be an expert in, in order to own/use one. Be that for better or worse :laugh: