Quick question

[raz1121]

I bought a sub on crutchfield not to long ago and it was buy one get one free. Right now i only put one sub in but would there be much of a difference if i got a new box and put both in but kept it on the same amp?

subs --- http://www.crutchfield.com/p_107MM2104/Polk-MOMO-MM2104.html?tp=111

amp--- http://www.crutchfield.com/p_065GT50/Boston-Acoustics-GT-50.html?tp=115

[brendenr89]

yes, but not much, you'll notice a difference.
but for subs, that seem like a smaller wattage amp.

i have to tens as well in the del sol's trunk with 1200 watts so then again, i could be wrong. but have you decided what box to get for the tens?

if the back seats fold down, i'd suggest a vented box

[raz1121]

seats fold down and i was looking at this box http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007TJDGG/sr=1-79/qid=1232924493/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&qid=1232924493&sr=1-79&seller=

[talnlnky]

you'll probably see an improvement around 4dB. each time you double cone area and keep amp power the same you see +3. each time you double power you can see UP TO 3dB (HUGE emphasis on UP TO)... so... my guess would be 4... maybe 5dB. that's actually a big increase in output. depending on your ears... it MIGHT sound as if it is around twice as loud. All that is based on other variables remaining the same (like box volume/construction) electrical system being able to run that amp at 2ohm vs 4ohm without any trouble, etc...)

[raz1121]

talnlnky do you mean if i double the power and put both in it will be twice as loud or just twice as much cone area will make it sound up to twice as loud?

[brendenr89]

not bad for the money, but if you wanna get some bang, get a bigger sealed, i'll take a pic of mine. also, it looks to be a hatchback box. sometimes, it's all about the box.

i think talnlnky will back that up

[talnlnky]

talnlnky do you mean if i double the power and put both in it will be twice as loud or just twice as much cone area will make it sound up to twice as loud?

double cone are & same wattage TOTAL = +3dB
double wattage & same cone area = UP TO 3dB

Double Both Cone area & Wattage and you get UP TO 6dB.

+3dB is a doubling in pressure... but human ears usually don't percieve a doubling in pressure/sound volume until it reaches +6dB - 10dB. Our ears suck.


going with a bigger sealed box really won't change much... going with a ported box however could drastically give you more volume... if done right.

[YarisSedan]

not bad for the money, but if you wanna get some bang, get a bigger sealed, i'll take a pic of mine. also, it looks to be a hatchback box. sometimes, it's all about the box.

i think talnlnky will back that up

I thought smaller subs like 10s hit little harder than larger subs. Just larger subs give you that deeper fuller bass.

I noticed the 2 10s in my 240sx with cheapo amp and speakers hit harder than my 2 12s in my acura legend with a better quality amp and speakers. But depending on what im listening to like hip hop music the 12s gave a deeper sound but if im listening to punk rock the 10s gave more punch. And actually sounded better. So maybe it all comes down to what music you listen to the most and what you are trying to achieve.

I see a lot of cars come into my shop with systems but all it really is , is a amp and a huge subs in the back. They dont change out the factory deck or speakers and never match thier subs to compliment the system. They just want thier car to boom. So loud it drowns out all the vocals.

I think personally the subs should be the last thing done to the car and if tuned right you should not even be able to tell when the subs are comming on.

[Spades]

nah dude, a 10 wont hit harder than a 12 or 15 if the conditions are the same. it takes more power to move a larger cone, but the larger the cone, the more air moved. everyone says that a 10's cone will "bounce back faster"...thats sometimes true, but generally with a quality speaker, they will be capable of having the proper surround, spider, and magnet structure to allow the speaker to move in and out properly with each hit. differing cone sizes have affect on sound, but if all things were equal with the exception of perhaps a bit more juice to the larger speaker, a 10 wouldnt have a harder hit...cause its not moving as much air...cause with todays speaker materials...the voice coil structure will slide out and pull back just as fast on a 12 as it would on a 10.


maybe someone else can correct my thinking...but as far as i know thats how it works.

p.s. i love bass. you would hate my car. i do have infinity referance components up front...but they are on deck power. and i have two 12" and two 5" subs... bass, i love you.

[talnlnky]

everyone says that a 10's cone will "bounce back faster"...thats sometimes true, but generally with a quality speaker, they will be capable of having the proper surround, spider, and magnet structure to allow the speaker to move in and out properly with each hit. differing cone sizes have affect on sound, but if all things were equal with the exception of perhaps a bit more juice to the larger speaker



i disagree... here is a tech doc written by a speaker designer & electrical engineer who's worked in acoustics for over two decades, and has been a part of many companies related to acoustics and sonar systems.

http://www.diycable.com/main/pdf/WooferSpeed.pdf


the "speed" all comes down to the Le (inductance) of the woofer, and to a lesser extent the configuration of the box you install it in. It has nothing to do with the size/weight of the cone.


Think of size & weight effecting efficiency, but the Inductance effecting how quickly it can respond.


I had a 12" sub that had an rms of 1600watts, I ran as much as 2000rms to it... It had a very stiff suspension, and was still capable of playing 12khz tones. I know because I tried it... it also had a very low Le unlike most subs


the old JBL GTI subs were great, they had Le's under 1mH, I think some of those subs were around .4mH. The lower the Le the "quicker" it sounds.


as for the "hitting hard"... generally speaking 15's>12's>10's... we both agree on that. However, i'm not sure, but I would hypothesize that having a very heavily dampened box (like an undersized sealed box) will give a quick "jab" like hit, which may sound more impactful/forceful, while in reality it would be less impactful (less pressure) than a regular, or large sized sealed box.

Also, a sub that creates a lot of harmonic distortion will appear to be louder than a sub that has very low distortion levels... when in actuality it may be much louder.

[talnlnky]

I thought smaller subs like 10s hit little harder than larger subs. Just larger subs give you that deeper fuller bass.

The ability to play "deep low, full" bass is based on a couple of factors, Box choice/configuration is HUGE. the size of a speaker does have some bearing, but I could show you a 15" speaker that can hardly play below 50hz in any type of box... and I can also show you a 4" speaker that can play below 50hz in the proper box.

Most car subs will play decent down to 40hz... below that it really depends on the goals the company had in making the sub...

The biggest clue to look for is the "FS" value or the Resonant frequency of the sub. It basically tells you the POTENTIAL of how low your sub can play (in the right box).

Some subs have FS values of 50hz .. others as low as the teens. Most quality car subs will be in the mid 20's to low 30's

There are a few more, but they are a bit trickier to understand and depend on other variables at the same time.

[Spades]

hrm...well, i mean, im sure on a cheaper speaker, that size would make a differance when the 15" and the 10" use the same magnet structure, voice coil, and materials...but, you are telling me that a high quality 12" would be unable to hang with a 10"? i know its more mass to move, and physics are involved, but with todays materials the differance is still vast?