What the Yaris community needs to take the Yaris to the next level

[regal]

Note I didn't post in the wheels section because the focus there is mainly "how to drop your car and add big wheels to impress your friends." Nothing wrong with that but the Yaris has much more potential.

I'm a Honda convert due to the fact that Honda abandoned its lightweight hatch niche.

The Yaris has a lot of potential with its 2200 lb curb weight, I'd say more potential than anything new short of a Lotus or Miata.

Now the problem is there is no real hard data as to what mods give us.

I would love to see something like this : TRD suspension + sway bar+ sticky tires give .9x g lateral acceleration and 7x mph slalom.

With the old Honda's there were formulas you could follow and know your track results at least ballpark figures. Nothing put a smile on my face more than buying a clean 93 Civic for $3000 and adding a formulated $2000 tires/suspension that guaranteed 70+mph Slalom and .9 gs. Cars that can handle like this for cheap are special and just make the daily commute FUN.

With the Yaris I am about to install $1500 worth of "stuff" and I have no idea what it gets me other than a better stance.

We should push TRD and other vendors to start doing track results, or possibly the magazines.

This will be the first step in making the Yaris a true tuner car, it has everything going for it but needs to be taken to the next level. Right now I see the Yaris owners making it a show car, but there really is potential modding into a fun sports car. And don't tell me it is a lacking power econobox, 8 second 0-60 mph is more than respectable as a sports car over the last 35 years and there has to be some real performance handling gains to be had.

I plan on finding somewhere to have a slalom and lateral acceleration measured after upgrading my suspension this weekend, anyone know where this could be done in the mid-atlantic area?

[mrbond]

I. Agree. With. This. So much. I have held off on major cosmetic modifications and spent my money on suspension, tires, and the like for the effect you're talking about. I'll see if I can talk to one of my friends that works for Super Street magazine about doing something along the lines of Yaris track performance.

[Loren]

I've already pulled .98G average on a skidpad on street tires with bolt-on mods. You're right, the Yaris has lots of potential. The "formula" might not be readily available as it is in the Honda world, but the potential and the parts are available. Instead of following forumulas (that may or may not be right, suspension is a very personal thing), I prefer to do research and testing and learn how to set the car up for myself.

Believe it or not, this topic would fare better in the Wheels/Tires/Suspension forum. Nobody in the "General" forum cares. Yes, there are the "lower the car for looks" types there, but there are also some true performance and handling types there. We generally try to stay out of each other's way. :laugh:

[eTiMaGo]

Agreed with Loren, it's better here :smile:

Well, from what I've noticed lurking around here so long (:laugh:), the Yaris is a very new car without so much of an established record (at least in the US), compared to Civics... Call it what you want, but it seems it is very much an entry-level car, on which most of those who wish to modify it will only really be dabbling their toes, while only a relative few "heavies" will cannonball into the pool :laugh: So yes, it's going to take a while to build up a proper high-level tuning community... I suppose it was the same when the Civics first came around in the US, who would have ever thought they'd be such an omnipresent force in motorsports? But we'll get there...

As for hard numbers... There was one magazine that, if I recall correctly, tested one of the manufacturer demo cars, I believe the Fujita Sedan, and went over 1G laterally... On my own very unprofessional testing (My head unit has an optional G-sensor to calculate a bunch of stuff on the fly, but no idea if it's truly accurate), I managed 0.95G's in a long fast curve...

We do have a basic "formula"... rear sway bar, good tires, dump some weight, springs/dampers or coilovers if possible, and you've got a very healthy chunk of the maximum grip you could achieve with the car, without spending a fortune on it (i.e. refer to that performance primer I wrote, and Tamago's handling guide :smile:)

[Tamago]

i'm breaking my silence to say this:

if you want to take the yaris community to the next level:

INNOVATE, DON'T DUPLICATE

asking other members of the same car "what can i do to my car" will yield a few answers:

1. well i did a, b, c, d, you could do those
2. you gotta pay to play
3. it sucks there's no parts for "our cars"

the next level will come from innovation. Innovation comes from breaking the mold. quit buying bolt-on parts, and do something original. swap an engine, fit 9" wide wheels, get the car in a magazine once or twice. i know everyone likes to think that their car is "unique" but in reality.. without custom work (custom meaning one-off) it's a cookie cutter car. sure, buying $2000 wheels from jah-pan is "unique" because you didn't buy rotas, but just imagine where that money could have gone! toward innovation!

now: we all know why this will never happen. very few of 'you guys' bought a yaris simply to cut it up and make it different. i know there's the drift yaris, and a few actually quick yarii out there, but the average buyer of an econobox bought it because they either A: couldn't afford a bigger/better car, B: liked the fuel mileage, or C: genuinely liked the car at first sight. so that cuts out 2/3 of buyers right there. the person who fell in love with the car will be your innovator. he (or she) won't care about fuel mileage, won't care about possibly chopping a hood or notching a frame rail, if it means running a better powerplant.. so we'd better hope that all the "C" buyers paid cash for their cars and have another vehicle to get them back and forth. no? good luck getting to the next level.

[Tamago]

lol and yes, my post is highly off topic for this thread :D

[kngrsll]

With the new Tokico HTS coming out soon, we have an excellent set of high quality dampers coming our way. I think what we need next is the Yaris equivelent of "Ground Control" coilovers. I would love to get them to produce a sleeve coilover set. The Honda's that i knew about that handled best and would hand me my ass were usually running Koni's, Ground controls, and sticky tires. We have the dampers on the way from Tokico, now we need to push GC to bring an application for our car. This would give us the freedom to choose any spring rates we desire. Some custom upper mounts to give more stroke in the front and eliminate slop would be great as well, but that will take some R&D. We have sticky tires, wheel options, and a great community, so the pieices are there.

This is a GREAT thread btw, best ive seen in ages. I am intrested to hear what else you guys have to say.

[tomato]

To the OP: :clap: Great post!

I'm glad you posted in the general section because I might not have noticed your post otherwise. Your post makes a lot of sense, even to me, a lay person who doesn't know anything about mechanics, and very little about cars, but really, really, enjoys driving them :smile:.

I might spend the money and modify the car some, if I could find some data out there (not just "yo, do it man, cause it's rad") telling me what these mods do exactly, and how does the modified car handles compare to say, a Honda , or another car.

And for the record, I am, too, a Honda convert, for the same reason: Honda no longer makes a small, light hatch.

[Loren]

lol and yes, my post is highly off topic for this thread :D
I was sort of thinking the same thing. :wink: Not at all the direction the OP was talking about.

[regal]

The main thing that made the original Rabbit the Hot hatch in the 80s was it was a budget car that could pull serious g's and slalom times. That car is sort of the mold-breaker that led to the modern Yaris.

I am not so much into expensive coil-overs and extreme modification. What peaks my interested is take $2000 buy A,B,C and pull 1g. Daily Driving 100% streetable car/go-carts are so much fun that the daily boring commute to work because the best part of your day.

I suspect the typical TRD setup gives a very good performance, but the crazy thing is no one has any numbers. If we had some real data, the industry world take notice and better improvements would be developed. Right now we are shooting in the dark, mainly because the OEMs sell us cars with comfort suspensions. All modern rides are riding on soft springs and shocks now-days, what really matters is how the car transforms with a proper suspension. The 240sx was considered a bland old mans car until people started replacing parts and bolting stuff on, now look at what you can do. The Yaris is still in that stage that the 240sx was in around the mid-90's.

[supmet]

Note I didn't post in the wheels section because the focus there is mainly "how to drop your car and add big wheels to impress your friends." Nothing wrong with that but the Yaris has much more potential.
With the old Honda's there were formulas you could follow and know your track results at least ballpark figures. Nothing put a smile on my face more than buying a clean 93 Civic for $3000 and adding a formulated $2000 tires/suspension that guaranteed 70+mph Slalom and .9 gs. Cars that can handle like this for cheap are special and just make the daily commute FUN.

I plan on finding somewhere to have a slalom and lateral acceleration measured after upgrading my suspension this weekend, anyone know where this could be done in the mid-atlantic area?

Really? I see a few show cars and big rim threads, but there are also a LOT of people running 15" konigs, ssrs, on other light weight rims. There are also good discussions on the handling of different springs, sway bars, etc.

I'm pretty sure there was a thread on here about 2 TRD vioses - I'm sure the skidpad, slalom, and other useful information is somewhere out there on them.(I know they were running on a track, so they SHOULD have all that anyway)

The other thing is, the show people which you seem to have something against, are doing more than anyone else as far as getting people to pay attention to the yaris. The more sponsors see yaris, the more likely they are to produce parts, and test the parts like you want.

Also, we'll have to see the world's reaction to garm's monster once he gets it fired up!:burnrubber:

[Loren]

Huh? How much do you think you need to spend on a coilover kit?

I have about $950 in my coilover kit, $80 in a set of rear springs (I went stiffer than what came with the kit), and about $160 in a rear swaybar. Those are my suspension mods. That and a set of $89/each 15x7 wheels and a $400 set of tires. That's it. Less than $2000 for the whole works INCLUDING wheels and tires.

I'm not sure what your complaint is other than your lack of knowledge about what's available for the Yaris and how to set it up.

The typical TRD setup is just a mild street upgrade from the stock suspension, it's really nothing special. Not sure what you want for numbers. Slalom times? Skidpad numbers? You realize that those things are highly dependent on what tires are on the car and how well the car is driven, right? They are highly subjective measures. Nobody can say "put TRD springs, shocks and rear swaybar on your car and pull .9 G's" because the stock tires won't pull .9 G's. And guess what? You could put really good tires on the STOCK suspension and pull well over .9 G's.

You might be shooting in the dark... I'm not. :wink:

[regal]

I appreciate and love the looks of the show cars with the $3k 18" rims (that rub) and 3" drop on soft springs. Just that obviously they won't perform well and that is not what I'm interested in. To me the big wheels and soft spring drops should be in the cosmetic section.

What I am interested in is what is the potential of the Yaris with $1k, 2K, etc invested with real data. I think this will only help the evolution of this platform.

[anonymous user]

Nice thread. I love reading the really few "quality" posts nowadays on this site. I considered transforming this car to a track car, but IMO, think it needs a lot of work. To compete against similar cars, or modifications past "tuner classes" would have the yaris destroyed. I'm quite interested in where this thread is going, and look forward to your build, sir. If I didn't have $50k invested in a current track car, I'd seriously consider this one, although a miata is very close to power to weight ratio.
I have done mods to make the car perform better, none of the "cosmetic" ones yet. I do have a set of coilovers coming though. :cool: I'll race the yaris this season for a bit while my wrx is being downed for work. We'll see how it does.

Best of luck to you.

[BLAZINBLUEVITZ]

[QUOTE=regal;297821
What I am interested in is what is the potential of the Yaris with $1k, 2K, etc invested with real data. I think this will only help the evolution of this platform.[/QUOTE]

not trying to disrupt thread flow but in this country our platform is only 3 years old with a majority of its owners who post his/her findings on this website. we have a vast diversity in age between owners and this makes for some interesting reads and surprisingly helpful/informative threads. my point IS this car is not a CIVIC and if you want that kind of information your gonna have to trial and error yourself or just sit back like the rest of us and see what happens.

btw: TRD USA will not lift a finger to support us or from what ive seen any platform that is in the toyota brand. ive been trying that for the past 2 years now.......

[Tamago]

so, to break 1.0G ........ buy a set of used Toyo R888's and mount them to an otherwise stock yaris.. $200 for 1.0G ?

[Loren]

so, to break 1.0G ........ buy a set of used Toyo R888's and mount them to an otherwise stock yaris.. $200 for 1.0G ?

Sounds like a good "formula" to me, Tomago. :biggrin:

Are we talking peak G's or average G's? That setup would easily be good for 1.2 G's peak... right before you tossed the car onto its roof. :tongue:

[Tamago]

Sounds like a good "formula" to me, Tomago. :biggrin:

Are we talking peak G's or average G's? That setup would easily be good for 1.2 G's peak... right before you tossed the car onto its roof. :tongue:

factor in a $160 swaybar then? and $24 for some camber bolts.. $60 for a custom alignment..

so, $444 to break 1.0G

[YarisSedan]

We should just have all the professional auto X members post thier entire suspention setup and thier results. And it gives a good platform for people new to base thier setup on.

[Loren]

Do the alignment on the cheap (I've never paid to have my Yaris aligned). Slot the lower strut holes, no need for camber bolts.

Swaybar would be good.

Okay, let's clarify the formula and make it repeatable:


Slot front struts, set front camber to -1.8 degrees static (will be well over -2.5 on the outside when the suspension is compressed while turning), 0' toe. Total cost = $0.00
New set of 195/50-15 Toyo R888 on stock wheels. $123 each plus mount & balance. Total cost = $550
23mm Rear Stabilizer Bar from MicroImage. Total cost = $164.95

1.0 G's easily for less than $800.
(do be careful with the aggressive transitions, though)

[YarisSedan]

I remember when i used to work in a alignment shop cars would come in and they would specifically request not to touch thier camber even though it was negative only adjust the toe.

How much of a difference do you think the tire wear will be. Like 5 percent 10 percent 20 percent more wear?

Sure you should not be too concerned if you are going to be aggresive especially if you are going to auto x and go through tires very quickly.

But just from a curiouse standpoint as well for a daily driver im asking cause you are one of the few experience members when it comes to suspention. As there are other members who are strong on stereo etc..

[Loren]

I remember when i used to work in a alignment shop cars would come in and they would specifically request not to touch thier camber even though it was negative only adjust the toe.

How much of a difference do you think the tire wear will be. Like 5 percent 10 percent 20 percent more wear?

Sure you should not be too concerned if you are going to be aggresive especially if you are going to auto x and go through tires very quickly.

But just from a curiouse standpoint as well for a daily driver im asking cause you are one of the few experience members when it comes to suspention. As there are other members who are strong on stereo etc..

This question has been answered before (many times). With modern tires, camber only affects tire wear noticeably if you do a great majority of your driving in a straight line without some aggressive cornering the balance it out.

Agressive TOE settings are what chew up tires. Toe PLUS camber is a bad combination, and will make it look like the camber is the problem, but it isn't. This is the typical situation when a car is lowered and not aligned. Most suspensions are designed such that camber goes negative when the car is lowered... side effect is that toe also goes WAY out of spec (goes out if the tie rods are on the back side of the axle, in if they're in the front). If you correct the toe to zero, as long as you're not doing cross-country interstate road trips and never exploring curves, that will take care of your wear issues.

If you're not the kind of driver who's going to push the car a little bit in the turns pretty regularly, you shouldn't even be reading this thread!

[cali yaris]

Was there a lot of aftermarket support when the Civic had been out only 3 years?

I know the Yaris has been sold overseas for a number of years, but considering that the USDM is new, I think there is pretty good range of product support so far. Give it ten years... :wink:

[Tamago]

We should just have all the professional auto X members post thier entire suspention setup and thier results. And it gives a good platform for people new to base thier setup on.

results are relative in autocross

[Tamago]

Was there a lot of aftermarket support when the Civic had been out only 3 years?

I know the Yaris has been sold overseas for a number of years, but considering that the USDM is new, I think there is pretty good range of product support so far. Give it ten years... :wink:

not to mention, the yaris has MORE AFTERMARKET than my car, and it's been out since 2000? (in japan)

[CASTREX]

Talking about Yaris potential... and a little off topic as well but,
People haven't put much attention to the
2ZR-FE swap due to the lack of appeal of it's not very impressive performance...

However, this power plant transforms the Yaris completely... and it should be pretty much a drop in swap if you can get a salvaged Scion xD engine and ECU. This should be easy in a couple of years.
The 1.8L will put down up to 125WHP and a very linear 120Tq with the current bolt on mods available (Intake/ exhaust/ UPulley).

I can tell you that people who jumps in for a ride on a twisty road on my car, can't believe what the little bean can do. And I'm not by any means a very skilled driver... just a little above the average I would say.

And I agree with Loren... No need to spend a lot of money on suspension...

$800 Tein Basics Coilovers
$150 TRD sway bar
OE 17" heavy ass Toyota wheels
$400 Azenis RT-615 (215/40/17)
$25 camber bolts

The extra TQ of this engine has no problem moving the heavy ass wheels and tires... But some light weight 16's are on my future plans.

[Tamago]

Was there a lot of aftermarket support when the Civic had been out only 3 years?


what, 1979?

LMFAO

[Kaotic Lazagna]

A magazine did a test with a Yaris sedan. They just used Tein SS coilovers and racing slicks. I think they pulled either 1.05 or 1.08 g's. No other mods, just the coilovers, rims, and tires.

[Tamago]

A magazine did a test with a Yaris sedan. They just used Tein SS coilovers and racing slicks. I think they pulled either 1.05 or 1.08 g's. No other mods, just the coilovers, rims, and tires.

back in 2007..


c'mon what's taking you guys so long? busy buying short shifters and underdrive pullies?

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Being a college student. LOL. No money for anything, even REAL food.

[Tamago]

Being a college student. LOL. No money for anything, even REAL food.

:iono::iono: refer to my first post then?

[Kaotic Lazagna]

:iono::iono: refer to my first post then?

I wish I knew how to fab up my own stuff...

[TOUGEghost]

So maybe I'm the only one who thinks this way, but I'm perfectly happy just bolting stuff on my Yaris, having fun with it, and not worrying about anything. I don't need numbers and data to convince me that my car is fun. I don't even care if some guy with a Scion and a turbo kit thinks he's better than me because of it. What is this "next level" anyway? It must be the place where my car can smoke Evos and still get 50mpg. :iono:

[Loren]

I sort of agree, I don't get too hung up on the numbers as long as the car does what I want it to do. Part of what I want it to do is handle well enough to be competitive (or at least damned frustrating to people with "faster" cars) in autocross and other events. The only reason I know the lateral G's my car can pull is that it was part of a competition that I did. Were it not for that, all I'd know is that "it handles really well".

[ChinoCharles]

I :wub: this thread.

This community needs a few things:
1. Some exposure
2. More willing buyers
3. A viable piggyback tuning option
4. A formula and/or bolt on kit for reliable boost
5. Cheaper, more available upgrades geared toward 4: pistons, cams, head gasket, intake manifolds etc etc

For now Garm is going to be the blueprint. I'm trying to show what NOT to do (:bellyroll:) and the supercharged people can wave while the turbo people pass them. Sorry guys, but I truly think you're all crazy. :wink: Still love ya though.

[Tamago]

so explain how garm is the blueprint, when none of you (arguably) will follow in his footsteps? and what about all the xa and xb "blueprints" floating around? i'm not tooting my own horn, just asking a viable question, since garm is basically just reverting to an xb/xa/echo powerplant...


??

[ChinoCharles]

Its my personal belief that the Yaris is enormously more appealing than the xB and xA to modify, and that will run its course. If Toyota runs with this car for 5 years and enough current owners actually take them to the track, it'll make a little name for itself. Its kind of a big deal, the little Vitz.

[ChinoCharles]

... of course, I say that looking through the rosy lenses of my YW glasses. :smile: It may all be a pipe dream. Who cares, lets mod!

[Tamago]

Its my personal belief that the Yaris is enormously more appealing than the xB and xA to modify, and that will run its course. If Toyota runs with this car for 5 years and enough current owners actually take them to the track, it'll make a little name for itself. Its kind of a big deal, the little Vitz.

and i agree, ON PAPER the yaris IS a better car. just don't open the hood or look at that ECU..


and yes, with a little support from toyota, you may see some good factory championships.. but the VITZ already did that, so why would toyota bother again? remember toyota's motorsports law?

"cheat til we get caught and penalized, the win, then quit"

[ChinoCharles]

Yes, the ECU is an evil, evil mistress. Someone needs to kill it.

[Tamago]

Yes, the ECU is an evil, evil mistress. Someone needs to kill it.

yes, but certainly none of us, let's all sit back and wait for the magic wand

[ChinoCharles]

Us laymen with a little bit of money have to sit around and wait for a real tuner to get off their ass and figure this ECU out.

Wait, isn't that you? :laugh: Get in the garage biotch! Whatchya waitin' for?

[Morgan]

nothing can happen without someone stepping up and trying different things, even if they don't work or you got really really close and the shift cables were the issue.... you'll never know til you personally try something

[Tamago]

Us laymen with a little bit of money have to sit around and wait for a real tuner to get off their ass and figure this ECU out.

Wait, isn't that you? :laugh: Get in the garage biotch! Whatchya waitin' for?

if one of you lillyfooted yaris owners would loan me their car i'm sure i'd have that "professionally tuned" AEM FIC working just fine.




but none of you have




:clap:


:iono: excuses ?

[Tamago]

nothing can happen without someone stepping up and trying different things, even if they don't work or you got really really close and the shift cables were the issue.... you'll never know til you personally try something

i applaud you for actually saying "hell, it might work", spending the money, and are now able to say "hell, it didn't work"



but i'll guarantee that one of these blokes will disagree with you, even though you know first hand ;)

[Morgan]

thanks, I tried... that was my contribution




....would have been awesome though... damn those tempting scion short gears...

[Loren]

I missed this one... Scion transmission fits, but shift cables don't? Did you try using the cables from the Scion? If they don't fit the Yaris shifter... did you try fitting the Scion shifter? Seems like a pretty small problem to deal with to reach a worthy goal.

[Morgan]

I missed this one... Scion transmission fits, but shift cables don't? Did you try using the cables from the Scion? If they don't fit the Yaris shifter... did you try fitting the Scion shifter? Seems like a pretty small problem to deal with to reach a worthy goal.

ok well I tried fitting the transmission, sensors worked and bolted in, transmission mounted to the block but the rear engine stabilizer mount was missing on the scion trans because they have a different subframe... and the scion shifter cables are totally different that the yaris and the shifter assemblies are different...

so if you want the shorter scion gears dont fool around with installing the transmission just swap the gear sets and be done with it, if I had the actual gear puller this may have been a possible modification but I didn't so I cut my losses and returned the scion transmission

but yes I did make a blog post about this a few weeks ago when I tried it.... :)

least I know how the subframe goes in and out of the car know, always good to know - secret hit, its really easy I don't know why people mess with trying to do things from the top its like 6 bolts....

[PETERPOOP]

and the supercharged people can wave while the turbo people pass them. Sorry guys, but I truly think you're all crazy. :wink: Still love ya though.

easy to say when you've bought a 500$ turbo kit, but is slowly falling apart. you still haven't dyno'd your car. let's see some numbers before you wave to an imaginary s/c yaris. :wink: But for a fact, you are definately putting down more whp. We are all just curious to see how much, and I highly doubt you'll be in the 13s on a 1/4. But good luck.

*when i retune with a larger tb/injectors, we might be seeing similar numbers if you don't upgrade your kit. :iono:

[Tamago]

*when i retune with a larger tb/injectors, we might be seeing similar numbers if you don't upgrade your kit. :iono:


translation


*when i've spent a total of $5000, i'll surely have beat your $500 turbo kit




good job buddy

[dallas]

Sadly the Yaris is too underpowered as a starting point for some people, so no Tuners take the car too seriosly. Hence a lack of really knowledgable tuners, or suppliers who want to build us a reliable turbo kit.

While its light and a fun car to drive, tuners feel there are not enough people lining up to go crazy with the car. Sadly, we just end up with suppliers flogging the same old basic bolt on parts, without any real R&D in tuning or a Supercharger or Turbo formula to sell us. maybe that will change in the near future.

If you go look at some other forums for example the Cobalt SS foum, Hyundai Genesis forum, Ford Focus forums and see the progress they're suppliers have made in such a short time, its sad our forum moves so slowly ahead.

I have to give credit to the trailblazers like Lt Noggie, Chinocharles, Peterpoop,Caliyaris and others who keep at it.

I think if there was a reliable 130-150 hp kit to be had there would be a lot more people ready to spend the money.

[Tamago]

the reason there's innovation on other forums for their specific cars is because they're actually worth modding "for speed"

[dallas]

I agree, and sorry I forgot your one of the trailblazers as well. I feel the Yaris is overlooked, for its fun potential. I guess with for example with a 150 hp turbo kit we would still get our asses whopped by a lot of stock performace cars, so the tuners decide its a waste of time to develop stuff.


and if there were more people interestedthe reason there's innovation on other forums for their specific cars is because they're actually worth modding "for speed"

[PETERPOOP]

translation


*when i've spent a total of $5000, i'll surely have beat your $500 turbo kit




good job buddy

lol panda boy. why are you back? get banned on a scion forum?

Definately not 5k. I could have gone the turbo route easily too if I wanted and made a ghetto setup like you and run a panda hood, but I decided to go with blitz. I got the money, no biggie. Not in debt, and don't need to make plans to get out of debt by the end of the year or something stupid like that.

[Tamago]

lol panda boy. why are you back? get banned on a scion forum?

keep in mind what got YOU banned..

do the right thing, ignore me, and i'll ignore you from now on

[PETERPOOP]

Please add me to your ignore list.

[kngrsll]

honestly, i dont see why you guys are doing superchargers and turbo kits. its a little K car, its not going to be fast in a straight line, but it can be a fun little car. bolt on some sticky tires and nice suspension, and its like a fwd miata; light, fun to drive and cheap.

[ChinoCharles]

its not going to be fast in a straight line


False.

easy to say when you've bought a 500$ turbo kit, but is slowly falling apart. you still haven't dyno'd your car. let's see some numbers before you wave to an imaginary s/c yaris. :wink: But for a fact, you are definately putting down more whp. We are all just curious to see how much, and I highly doubt you'll be in the 13s on a 1/4. But good luck.

*when i retune with a larger tb/injectors, we might be seeing similar numbers if you don't upgrade your kit. :iono:

I've got one bad bolt, Peter... lets keep it in perspective. The kit isn't "falling apart." It doesn't change the fact that $3500 is a hilarious amount of money to spend on 50 HP. I just don't get it.

We need a turbo kit.

[Nexus1155]

Its can be made into an under 2000 lb car with a built engine and a turbo you can be sure as hell it will be fast in a straight line...

Ok we can't argue over whose supercharger or turbo charger is better, they all have their advantages/disadvantages.

Supercharger

Ease of install
colder air charge if turbo is run without intercooler
no oil/coolant lines
but has parasitic loss from the engine and consumes power before it even makes power.

Turbo
easy to install if you have all of the piping/parts
boost can be adjusted at will
damn oil/coolant lines
need an intercooler
takes energy from exhaust and recycles it :P

But honestly if you had a turbo kit vs. a supercharger kit and all the parts laid out and ready to slap on there without doing any work to the car. I would take the turbo kit, but this is A's and B's since this car isn't going past a certain amount of power without some major work done. And also if you were going to want power with upgraded internals on a SC kit, you would have an eaton right now... But if i just wanted it for fun spirited daily driving i would pick the Blitz supercharger kit that Garm has...

They both have their fair share of reliability issues where pulley slips or shreds belts on the SC or the, well you know i haven't really seen a turbo get messed up from itself, someone chime in if they can think of something

[yarissr57]

Hey i agree too.

Recently had my yaris lowered on TRD springs and new alloys and tires fitted. Once finished, hoping to write to Banzai. Maybe they could do something about the Yaris scene.

[anonymous user]

I seriously wish we could get back on topic and THREAD specific.
There's fast drivers and fast cars. This thread is obviously for fast drivers.

All the S.C./T.C. comments need to stay away. Yes, we all know that the car can be made "faster" in a straight line. Enough to be as fast as a stock corolla. Or a stock scion. Or a stock,xxx. You see where i'm going with this? If you wanted to build a fast straight line car,
for the price of what you threw down, you coulda had a matrix xrs,corolla xrs, etc. And since you're not doing any real racing, still have your warranty. B/C i know many who modify here won't blame the parts when something breaks, they will want toyota to pay for their mistakes. :thumbdown:

You gotta pay to play, bottom line.

[anonymous user]

Its can be made into an under 2000 lb car with a built engine and a turbo you can be sure as hell it will be fast in a straight line...

Ok we can't argue over whose supercharger or turbo charger is better, they all have their advantages/disadvantages.

Supercharger

Ease of install
colder air charge if turbo is run without intercooler
no oil/coolant lines
but has parasitic loss from the engine and consumes power before it even makes power.

Turbo
easy to install if you have all of the piping/parts
boost can be adjusted at will
damn oil/coolant lines
need an intercooler
takes energy from exhaust and recycles it :P

But honestly if you had a turbo kit vs. a supercharger kit and all the parts laid out and ready to slap on there without doing any work to the car. I would take the turbo kit, but this is A's and B's since this car isn't going past a certain amount of power without some major work done. And also if you were going to want power with upgraded internals on a SC kit, you would have an eaton right now... But if i just wanted it for fun spirited daily driving i would pick the Blitz supercharger kit that Garm has...

They both have their fair share of reliability issues where pulley slips or shreds belts on the SC or the, well you know i haven't really seen a turbo get messed up from itself, someone chime in if they can think of something

Nexus,
Those who heavily track their turbocharged cars need to let it cool down before shutting the power off, be it oil or water cooled. I have seen some nasty nasty mishaps.

[PETERPOOP]

False.



I've got one bad bolt, Peter... lets keep it in perspective. The kit isn't "falling apart." It doesn't change the fact that $3500 is a hilarious amount of money to spend on 50 HP. I just don't get it.

We need a turbo kit.

You are proving my point by you putting the price of the S/C into perspective. It's easy for you to talk when you got the kit at a ridiculous low price. Let's face it, if that offer didn't come about, you would definately still be N/A right now. Can we agree on that? Some people were just dying for boost, no matter what the cost. The blitz had to suffice.

ps: I got the kit for much cheaper than you listed. Shhh.. Don't tell anyone. :wink:

K i'm done back to the topic. But yah, seriously, let's be honest....not many people besides garm or tamago are crazy enough to fab their own turbo kits for this engine (besides people out of states). People want a foolproof kit, tuned,proven, and ready to be plug and play. Heck, that's why I got the blitz. Before the yaris, I would think that most of the blitz owners have no experience with boosted engines (myself), and this was a fun alternative way of getting some extra power. And when there is such limited supply of kits out there, for the blitz, it's supply and demand. That's all......... :)

[ChinoCharles]

You could source the same turbo, manifold, BOV, piggyback and wastegate used on my kit for around $1250.

[Tamago]

let's also keep in mind, garm is not fabbing his own turbo kit. he's paying someone to do it for him..

[ChinoCharles]

I wonder if someone could just make and sell piping for a kit and let people source their own stuff? The biggest challenge about it right now is getting the kit piped and flanged right and all that crap.

Yes, I'll post the f'n map eventually. :laugh:

[BLAZINBLUEVITZ]

let's also keep in mind, garm is not fabbing his own turbo kit. he's paying someone to do it for him..
:eek:

[Tamago]

I wonder if someone could just make and sell piping for a kit and let people source their own stuff? The biggest challenge about it right now is getting the kit piped and flanged right and all that crap.

Yes, I'll post the f'n map eventually. :laugh:

get friendly with your local muffler shop.

they're already set up to do this for you.

[ChinoCharles]

Going back to my list of crap we need...

1. Some exposure
2. More willing buyers
3. A viable piggyback tuning option
4. A formula and/or bolt on kit for reliable boost
5. Cheaper, more available upgrades geared toward 4: pistons, cams, head gasket, intake manifolds etc etc

I'm trying to work on the exposure end of things as best I can, but Garm is gonna take care of that soon methinks. Either way, we need 5 or 10 people to step up and say "I'm building a kit." It can be done.

[PETERPOOP]

You could source the same turbo, manifold, BOV, piggyback and wastegate used on my kit for around $1250.


You forgot to mention intercooler. But everything you mentioned there ended with "used." eww. And I definately would not use the emanage blue, but i follow ya. i COULD have, but wouldn't. You COULD have, but you wouldn't have either. You got the used kit. Just putting things into perspective..

[ChinoCharles]

Its the only thing that we know of ATM that works short of a standalone. Yes, I would have bought it.

The E-manage blue may end up being the solution anyway. I called my tuner today, once the money tree grows a few more leaves I'm going to see what we can do.

[Tamago]

You forgot to mention intercooler. But everything you mentioned there ended with "used." eww. And I definately would not use the emanage blue, but i follow ya. i COULD have, but wouldn't. You COULD have, but you wouldn't have either. You got the used kit. Just putting things into perspective..

you dont' need an intercooler.

[PETERPOOP]

let's also keep in mind, garm is not fabbing his own turbo kit. he's paying someone to do it for him..

And that is why it looks 20x better than yours, will put out more power.

[PETERPOOP]

you dont' need an intercooler.

True, but his kit came with one. And he was implying that i could buy everything he has from his kit used. That's all.

[Tamago]

And that is why it looks 20x better than yours, will put out more power.

not on stock block.

also remember i barely broke $1000 out of pocket

try touching that with your shiney and annoyingly noisy setup

[Tamago]

and i think this thread has now turned to shit, we're discussing shiny stuff.

[PETERPOOP]

blingbling. clean it up chino, or lock it. ;) I'm done proving my point in this thread.

[ChinoCharles]

LOL Tamago.

I wasn't implying used... turbo, sure, but if you buy a 14b new its your own damn fault. There are numerous shops in Ohio where I could walk in with a beat 14b and exchange it for a rebuilt one. Do you know how many DSM owners make it paycheck to paycheck doing that? :laugh:

The rest of it isn't all that expensive. Most expensive part is the manifold, and you won't find one used.

[ChinoCharles]

Peter, you haven't proven anything other than the fact that you're touchy about buying an overpriced supercharger. :laugh:

It isn't out of hand. Just don't take crap personally and we can have a good old time arguing. This is what car forums are all about. :wink:

[Tamago]

blingbling. clean it up chino, or lock it. ;) I'm done proving my point in this thread.

yes, you have been trying very hard to prove a moot point.

you like spending money on shiney stuff because you're too scared to step outside your comfort zone and try something new.

enjoy your car that's now almost as quick as a stock scion tC lmfao

[Tamago]

Most expensive part is the manifold, and you won't find one used.


i have one, $75 shipped

[ChinoCharles]

OK, you'll find 1.

$75 is a ridiculously good deal BTW.

[ChinoCharles]

... wait, the xA manifold fits the Yaris?

I retract my previous statement, they're probably all over Scionlife.

[Tamago]

yup, same bolt pattern..

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/fatherdutami/Photo0947.jpg

no, it's not bolted down, but dimensionally it was VERY close

[ChinoCharles]

Woah, who the hell does that belong to?

[Tamago]

Woah, who the hell does that belong to?

almost belonged to you ;)

[kurokoma-kun]

ahh nice, at last we have arrived at the pointless bickering, vicious infighting and drama-queenery stage... does this mean we are a "real" car community now? :biggrin:

[Tamago]

ahh nice, at last we have arrived at the pointless bickering, vicious infighting and drama-queenery stage... does this mean we are a "real" car community now? :biggrin:

nope, just a car specific forum.. they're all like this.

[BLAZINBLUEVITZ]

It isn't out of hand. Just don't take crap personally and we can have a good old time arguing. This is what car forums are all about. :wink:

:clap:

[ChinoCharles]

I don't see it as "pointless bickering." I'm learning from this thread today.

[kurokoma-kun]

j/k you dopes, the truth is i :wub: every last one of you, almost as much as the yaris itself

[ChinoCharles]

j/k you dopes, the truth is i :wub: every last one of you, almost as much as the yaris itself

We :wub: you too, oh boosted autocrossing one.

[kurokoma-kun]

well, i hate to be brutal charles, just dont be dishing out the s/c hate if you are gonna cry just because poopie brought up your bolt problem.. instead why don't you get us some ink in that newspaper you work for... please? :wink::respekt:

not to single you out that goes for all of you... Yaris Pride y'all

[ChinoCharles]

Turbo on Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/JDM-14B-Turbo-02-housing-j-pipe-oil-return_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a3 Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3 a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem1703248520 74QQitemZ170324852074QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fP artsQ5fAccessories) - $150
Tamago's manifold $75
HKS SSQV BOV (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-HKS-SSQV-Blow-Off-Valve-WRX-STI-Civic-RX7-240SX-BOV_W0QQitemZ260387665178QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item260387665178&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A130 8) $160
TiAL wastegate (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/TIAL-MVS-M-VS-38MM-EXTERNAL-WASTEGATE-1-BAR-POLISHED_W0QQitemZ200332582632QQcmdZViewItemQQptZM otors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2003325 82632&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8) - $260
Some generic intercooler - $75
Couplers, pipe - $150
E-mamage blue - $300
Exhaust - depends... lets say $500

Total: about $1700?

[kurokoma-kun]

Total: about $1700?

Honest question: how much professional help is likely to be needed, for the average person, and how much does that cost? As Tamago pointed out, lots of folks (like Garm) need/want help with their projects.

Another hypothetical question: for the "innovator" level, what do you all think is an acceptable failure rate for mods (knowing you may lose money but will gain valuable knowledge if nothing else). I see people saying you got pay to play, but for this car how far is "too far"?

[ChinoCharles]

Honest question: how much professional help is likely to be needed, for the average person, and how much does that cost? As Tamago pointed out, lots folks (like Garm) need/want help with their projects.

Its a lot of work, won't lie. Lots of flanges, lots of welding, but with proper preparation and documentation and all of the parts on hand and in front of you I don't see any reason why an install couldn't take place in a weekend. What do you think Tamago? You did it.

Also, that isn't counting the tune, which would likely take a day on its own.

[Nexus1155]

lol I know this is in the wheels section, but the thread is labeled as it is so youre going to get the spill over...

Also, you've seen people not warm up / cool down the turbo... thats not the turbos fault, thats drive stupidity and error. A turbo kit like Tamagos can be had for damn cheap, you dont even need much piping, you can just use silfab flex hose and it holds the psi fine for the cold side. Hot side you wold need pipe obviously.

The only thing on this car that is rocket science is the ECU, which you can get around with some tinkering.

[ChinoCharles]

^^ Hopefully.

The thread will revert back to suspension and traction discussions once the normal members come back. Its a nice Saturday, we're the only suckers here. :wink:

[Tamago]

Turbo on Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/JDM-14B-Turbo-02-housing-j-pipe-oil-return_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a3 Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3 a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem1703248520 74QQitemZ170324852074QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fP artsQ5fAccessories) - $150
Tamago's manifold $75
HKS SSQV BOV (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-HKS-SSQV-Blow-Off-Valve-WRX-STI-Civic-RX7-240SX-BOV_W0QQitemZ260387665178QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item260387665178&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A130 8) $160
TiAL wastegate (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/TIAL-MVS-M-VS-38MM-EXTERNAL-WASTEGATE-1-BAR-POLISHED_W0QQitemZ200332582632QQcmdZViewItemQQptZM otors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2003325 82632&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8) - $260
Some generic intercooler - $75
Couplers, pipe - $150
E-mamage blue - $300
Exhaust - depends... lets say $500

Total: about $1700?

pick up a stock Bosch diverter valve from an A4 for $40, skip that SSQBOV noise.. ;)

oh and save yourself money and buy an internally wastegated turbo.

[ChinoCharles]

There ya go... $1600.

[Tamago]

Its a lot of work, won't lie. Lots of flanges, lots of welding, but with proper preparation and documentation and all of the parts on hand and in front of you I don't see any reason why an install couldn't take place in a weekend. What do you think Tamago? You did it.

Also, that isn't counting the tune, which would likely take a day on its own.

my build took me about 4 months iirc. total build time was almost a year. the car was down for 6 weeks, wheels in the air: that's a long time, and here's why....


i spent a lot of time waiting for good parts deals to come along as the need arose. for instance, i didn't have all the parts gathered because i simply didn't know what all parts i actually would need!

i skimped in places i shouldn't have (used 1/4" plate for my uppipe flanges instead of 3/8:) and some of my engineering was just... not strong enough. cracked a few welds, went thru a TON of my own home made copper exhaust gaskets (between manifold and uppipe) and i'll attribute that to using too-thin plate for that flange. it was warping under heat, causing hot spots and burning up the copper.

if i were to do it again, knowing what i know, i'm confident that i could even have a custom setup done in a weekend, given the starting point is friday afternoon, and the ending point is sunday night, at least 12 hr days. gotta give your eyes a rest from welding.

[Tamago]

There ya go... $1600.

ummm, delete ssq bov and tial wastegate, add $40, that adds up to 1300...


i'd recommend a wideband and some larger injectors in the mix.

[ChinoCharles]

Good point. Forgot about that. You make the list. :laugh:

[regal]

Personally FI on this car is of no interest to until someone cracks the ECU, otherwise you will fail the OBDII and have terrible gas milage.

The car has plenty hp for me, what I am interested in know what $= howmany lateral g's.

[Tamago]

what I am interested in know what $= howmany lateral g's.

it's already been covered.

[regal]

No there's just one data point when expensive coil-overs and slicks.

[kurokoma-kun]

Personally FI on this car is of no interest to until someone cracks the ECU, otherwise you will fail the OBDII and have terrible gas milage.

I have 5 months of records that show my gas mileage actually improved a bit.

I was concerned about emissions so I took the car to a trusted exhaust shop for a check. The owner told me there was no reason why I should fail the test.

When you get your parts on regal, I hope you'll be able to gather some more data for us. :smile: Unlike the civic (or miata, etc) this car is new to the US market and fewer buyers are interested in immediate performance gains, so little testing has been done so far.

[Loren]

No there's just one data point when expensive coil-overs and slicks.

And you completely and totally missed the point. You can't equate parts to G's. The parts all have to work together, the car has to be set up properly, the driver has to know how to drive it properly, and the TIRES are a huge part of the equation.

If you want easy (and largely inaccurate) answers... you should have stuck with the Honda community. Just because someone says "this combination is good for .9 G" and "that combination is good for 1.05 G" doesn't mean that it's TRUE. Don't be a sheep, do your own research and experimentation. You don't necessarily need to be an "innovator" like Tamago says, but... do your research and learn about things.

[ChinoCharles]

Loren, what about roll cages and their effects on handling on a car like the Yaris? Is a roll cage automatically going to make the car feel better or does it depend on the car and/or setup?

[ChinoCharles]

Oh and yeah, that terrible gas mileage post is totally false. My gas mileage didn't change a bit.

[Tamago]

Loren, what about roll cages and their effects on handling on a car like the Yaris? Is a roll cage automatically going to make the car feel better or does it depend on the car and/or setup?

you'll feel much more turn-in confidence (stiffens the car immensely) and adds a LOT of weight to the car, so be prepared to yawn on take-off.

[Loren]

A cage provides a more rigid foundation for the suspension, so that the car's body becomes less of an "undamped spring" in the grander scheme of things. The Yaris has a pretty stiff structure, anyway, so it's not going to make the degree of difference that it would in some cars.

Same with braces and bars. A well-engineered bar in the right place (such as the X-brace in the rear) can make a difference in the handling of the car. A good rear brace will have a similar (but more subtle) effect to adding a larger rear swaybar. You're keeping parts that aren't supposed to move from moving (even though they might only move a millimeter on the Yaris), which makes the suspension that bolts to those parts more effective.

But, unless you're building an all-out race car that NEEDS a cage for safety, you're far better off without one. Weight is king.

[ChinoCharles]

Right on! Thanks Loren and Tamago, good stuff.

[regal]

Oh and yeah, that terrible gas mileage post is totally false. My gas mileage didn't change a bit.


You had to have taken a 30% hit just running 93 octane. Fact is there is no elegant OBDII scan compliant way to tune a FI Yaris. If your running a piggy back to keep the OBDII port you must be running dangerously lean to not see a decline in mpg. If you threw away the OEM ECU and OBDII you have an off-road vehicle in most states.

This has been a great discussion and hope it opens some eyes to what a great platform the Yaris could be.

Lack of an ECU hack and simple lack of performance data with various mid-level suspension upgrades are all we need to keep the ball rolling.


I installed TRD springs, Kokico Blue shocks, and a TRD sway bar on the rear axel today, its like a new car literally. Doing the fronts tomorrow. I have a funny feeling that the car will handle better with the stock shocks/springs up front, maybe even better with the front sway bar removed. But we need data. Can you tell I am an engineer (Harley-Davidson)?

Keep the dialog going, I don't mind being told I am wrong about things, it wouldn't be the first time my info was out of date.

[Loren]

I installed TRD springs, Kokico Blue shocks, and a TRD sway bar on the rear axel today, its like a new car literally. Doing the fronts tomorrow. I have a funny feeling that the car will handle better with the stock shocks/springs up front, maybe even better with the front sway bar removed. But we need data. Can you tell I am an engineer (Harley-Davidson)?
You're right, the car probably will ultimately handle better with the TRD springs and stiffer shocks on the rear and the stockers up front. It will look goofy (too tall in the front), and the steering response will be sloppy because the front will be so soft... but I would expect almost no understeer from a setup like that!

Ditto with removing the front swaybar. It's going to make the front end feel sloppy, but in spite of feeling a little off, it's going to stay HOOKED UP.

If you're an engineer, then you know that any data is only valid in its test environment when all outside variables are controlled. That's one of the hardest things about working with suspension OUTSIDE of a controlled test environment. Things change. Everybody's on different tires, the weather is different from day to day, tire pressures vary, road conditions vary, and on and on.

Best you can do is find a safe place to test and come up with a valid test method. Run a skidpad of of a fixed diameter and time two laps in each direction and take the average. (you can calculate the G's from that if you really want to, but it's not relevant) Make ONE change to the car and try it again. If you make more than one change between tests, you'll never really know which one worked.

[ChinoCharles]

You had to have taken a 30% hit just running 93 octane. Fact is there is no elegant OBDII scan compliant way to tune a FI Yaris. If your running a piggy back to keep the OBDII port you must be running dangerously lean to not see a decline in mpg. If you threw away the OEM ECU and OBDII you have an off-road vehicle in most states.

Once I have a wideband I'll be able to tell you more about the AFR, but for now I can tell you I'm running Shell 93, getting 35 MPG and pushing lots more power.

[regal]

Once I have a wideband I'll be able to tell you more about the AFR, but for now I can tell you I'm running Shell 93, getting 35 MPG and pushing lots more power.

what are you doing for engine managment?

[ChinoCharles]

E-manage blue.

[HTM Yaris]

PFFFT . Someone is doing something innovative with the Yaris . You will see the results by next summer :wink:

If you want to crack the Yaris ECU , contact Toyota Headquarters .

If Yaris World wants to set itself apart from other car forums it should sponsor a little league sports team (ANY) then get someone to write an article about it . To sponsor a sports team anywhere in the US it would cost about $350-$500 . If everybody anties up $5-$10 Yaris World could have their own team :headbang: ? How kool would that be ? Seeing a bunch of 5th graders running up and down the field with Yaris World shirts on , or even better (Headline) "Yaris World , League Champs" :headbang:

[yarstar]

I got $5 for the Team!!

[GnomeBody]

Ive been reading alot about the yaris in the last year and a half. Id say the most useful information has mainly come from members of this forum. First of all Id like to say thanks to you all for shareing the knowledge gained from trying to mod the yaris in what ever way you have.

So with that said, Id like to get to what I think is the heart of what seems to be keeping us from "unlocking the Full potential" of the yaris

The damn ECU.

Im not going to BS and say its a simple fix, because it isnt. What we need if a way to either replace or reprogram it. I think getting an aftermarket ECU is a last resort due to the exspense of it. What Ive been looking for is a way to "break into" the stock ecu and map it. I assume that it would have aready been done by some one if it wern't for some of the features like the "learning" ability and the VVti. Ultimately I personaly would like to derive a way to replace the ECU with a netbook PC running a ECU "emulator".

To do this I we need a few key components
-Orignal ECU map/image (or posiably the sofware itsself)
-usb to ECU cable harness converter
-"yaris ECU emulator" software

all three step are a huge undertaking in themselves. Weather its feasiable at all is yet to be seen.

[regal]

There are aftermarket ECU's that can run the Yaris via DBC, but you are left with a track vehicle.


We need one of these to be developed:

1. I hacked Toyota ECU - wont hapen to little demand
2. Stand Alone engine management with a functioning OBDII port
3. An OBDII port simulator that gives you a pass when big brother plugs into your car, it should be so simple I am tempted to aplly for a patent.


I am very sorry if I offend the piggy back users here, I just see them as a compromise not offereing a tune as good as factory with holes and dangerous lean spots. Hope i am wrong.


Back to the original topic on suspension upgrades I finished adding Kokico shocks, TRD springs, and a TRD sway bar, the car is completely transformed, I wish I had lateral g and slalom results to report, but for my daily commute I am completely satisfied. This is the suspension Toyota should have made an option, it is very good, Better than my EG Civic with Koni struts.springs.

[CtrlAltDefeat]

How hard would it be to make an ECU replacement? Maybe it could be done with a programmable chip like an Arduino or 3 or some other programmable chips? I guess it's probably too complex to do this, but I'd like to know for sure. Any electronic engineers out there?

[regal]

How hard would it be to make an ECU replacement? Maybe it could be done with a programmable chip like an Arduino or 3 or some other programmable chips? I guess it's probably too complex to do this, but I'd like to know for sure. Any electronic engineers out there?

Sure you can replace the ECU, but in my state it becaomes an offroad vehicle wih out a viable OBDII port. The fact the standalone developers haven't included an fuxtioning OBDII port is really missing the mark. We are probably just a few years awa from a OBDII simulator which would open the Yaris to kille opportuniies, Pretty good typing for 5 xanaxx's:wub:

[ChinoCharles]

Pretty good typing for 5 xanaxx's:wub:
EPIC FAIL!