Installed 10mm PG spacers on a 15x7 +25 wheel

[kngrsll]

Alright, so as many of you know by now, i use the 15x7 +25mm wheels from Team Dynamics. 13 lbs, great offset, $99, mega deal. The rears NEVER rub. I have never heard the front rub, but the fender liner shows some light wear most likely front the extensive track time. The only thing I have done that would have improved the front fitment would be running as much front camber as possible by using the smallest OEM strut bolt available from Toyota, which is an easy of a mod as one can do.

So with the current set up i have, the 15x7 +25 has been excellent and has produced no rub.

I installed the PG rear spacers this weekend while doing some fluid changes on the car. In addition, we did some light fender rolling.

If there is stuff in the car (ie people, cooler, car parts, anything really) there is heavy rubbing on compression of the rear suspension (pretty much the smallest bump.) Without the crap in the car, there is no rubbing. This NEVER happened before the spacers.

So from this analysis, i would assume that the maximum rear offset for a 7" wheel lies between +25 to +15. If we take the average 7" wheel with an offset of say, +38, that is a +25 with a 13mm rear spacer. Identical to the wheel i am running now (without spacer). No rubbing, no hassle. If you are running a +35, you can easily run the 10mm spacer with the same effective offset.

We had a cookout at the shop while i was installing the spacers, everyone agreed that the spacers look MUCH better, the car looks better for sure. It really fills out the rear. Unfortunately i have the rubbing even with a light fender pull, which still managed to chip my paint.

An additional benefit to the spacers is an improvement in rear track. I am not sure what this has done to the car quite yet, and i will get back to you after this weekend at CMP. The rear of the car feels more stable and more "rotatable" if you will. The spacer was the only change to the suspension settings made, thus any change resulting comes from the increased track. It feels different, and good. A weekend of abuse should extract the exact benefits.

Due to the rubbing, i may remove the spacers and throw them on when i go to the track. I think if i had stiffer rear springs, the rubbing would not occur. Also, i found out it would bump me up a class in NASA TT due to increasing the track of the car by MORE than 3". The 15x7 +25 wheels increase the track over the stock alloys by exactly 3". I would really like to get a set of hoosiers, build a splitter, and go race in Time Trial next year legally.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_XhaUiwjGRbw/Sj-u_TqXxnI/AAAAAAAAAFU/S68pwS0PFHo/s800/DSCN1251.JPG

15x7 +25, NO SPACER... Perfect fit, no rubbing.

[Tamago]

cool, let us know how the camber shims help with rubbing..

is that pic with the spacer installed or no?

[kngrsll]

i should have mentioned that... this is with a single PG shim to add about a degree of negative camber and around zero toe.

[AdeJong 03]

i actually just picked up 16x7 +38 team dynamics wheels myself and already planned on using the pg 10mm spacer for the rear

once i have it installed with the suspension i will decide whether or not i should get a full set of 10mm H&R spacers for it and i can throw in some feedback as to whether or not i get any rub. with the pg spacers the rear will be +28 and if i run H&R it will come down to +18. i dont intend to roll the fenders so well see what happens but i wont know until the new suspension and wheels are even installed.

[Tamago]

i actually just picked up 16x7 +38 team dynamics wheels myself and already planned on using the pg 10mm spacer for the rear

once i have it installed with the suspension i will decide whether or not i should get a full set of 10mm H&R spacers for it and i can throw in some feedback as to whether or not i get any rub. with the pg spacers the rear will be +28 and if i run H&R it will come down to +18. i dont intend to roll the fenders so well see what happens but i wont know until the new suspension and wheels are even installed.

PG has 13MM too :)

[kngrsll]

so we ran a track day with the spacers installed. although there was rubbing on the streets, with the spare and other junk removed, there was no longer any rubbing. If you remove a little weight, you can get away with the 15x7 +10.

The really important thing is how the car drove. My co-driver and i did 2 sessions a piece. He has driven the car at ever event that i have, so his feed back is just as valuable. The spacers had a noticeable increase in rear stability. It made it a little easier to carry speed into the corner without the rear wanting to chase you, so turn-in speeds may have been a little faster. What was more important was stability increased the "trust" in the car in the corner. As you may know, if you feel confident about the car, you will be able to drive it well.

Since I needed to remove the spacers for street use, i pulled them off before the last session. The rear end felt a little more unstable (duh) and if you gave the same inputs as before, the back end would tend to slide a little more. That may be good for autox, but not for the track. As easy as the are to take on and off, i may swap them on depending on the type of course. Tight courses may favor the spacers out, while the more open courses (like the one we were one) would be better with the rear spacers in.

All in all, i think they helped with the stability of the car. If i were not running such low offsets, i would continue to use them. If you have anthing more than a 35 mm offset, they are a no brainer, they easily fit and increase rear stability. The 10 mm should put the track in the front and rear dead even, while the 13 mm spacers may make the rear track greater than the front.

Great mod, track approved :)

[Keith Tinari]

So Im guessing they may not be the best option for me? I was going to do them for pure aesthetics to make the track look a little more even. But even now I rub when someone else is in the car. Only the R/R but it still rubs none the less. Mine are 15x7.5 +32 with a 5mm on the front and rear. I was going to lose the 5mm spacer in favor of a 13mm PG spacer.

[Tamago]

So Im guessing they may not be the best option for me? I was going to do them for pure aesthetics to make the track look a little more even. But even now I rub when someone else is in the car. Only the R/R but it still rubs none the less. Mine are 15x7.5 +32 with a 5mm on the front and rear. I was going to lose the 5mm spacer in favor of a 13mm PG spacer.

what springs are you running? at the track, having weight removed from the car will help with the rubbing issues. also remember that you're compressing your suspension on the highway going over bumps. when you corner with a trailing arm type suspension (torsion) the compressed side of the car will tuck into the fender as the rear torsion beam flexes.. this means if you rub going over bumps, you may not rub as much going around corners :)

[Keith Tinari]

I have S-Techs on right now. its funny you mention that because on these rural PA back roads you get all kinds of terrain. Mostly tight,windy,hilly fun roads. I take them all fairly hard and come to think of it have only a little rub in hard cornering and only from the Right Rear wheel.

[kngrsll]

using this: http://www.1010tires.com/WheelOffsetCalculator.asp

according to this, your wheel (without spacers) is the nearly the same effective offset as mine. so, with a 5mm spacer, you rub? that would be like me running a 15x7 +20. Do you have the PG rear shims? i would try them, i think your set up would stop rubbing with the little extra camber.

[marlondog]

What size tires are you running?

using this: http://www.1010tires.com/WheelOffsetCalculator.asp

according to this, your wheel (without spacers) is the nearly the same effective offset as mine. so, with a 5mm spacer, you rub? that would be like me running a 15x7 +20. Do you have the PG rear shims? i would try them, i think your set up would stop rubbing with the little extra camber.

[kngrsll]

195/55/15 dunlops

[Keith Tinari]

using this: http://www.1010tires.com/WheelOffsetCalculator.asp

according to this, your wheel (without spacers) is the nearly the same effective offset as mine. so, with a 5mm spacer, you rub? that would be like me running a 15x7 +20. Do you have the PG rear shims? i would try them, i think your set up would stop rubbing with the little extra camber.


Thanks, I was trying to find out if they did offer a little negative. I think I rub though because of the taller tire. I will surely be ordering the PG spacers soon.