Rear suspension

[Maitre_Te_Te]

Sorry for my english.

I have an yaris 1.5L

I don't know why but check your reat suspension. The rear suspension assembly can be jack 2 inchs at the pivot.

Do you know why?

http://s3.postimage.org/NXIfJ.jpg
http://s3.postimage.org/NXFLA.jpg

[Loren]

Oh, I like that one!

I'd have to go out and look at the car and really think about it... but do you suppose that it's a factory designed option to improve the geometry of the rear suspension for a lowered "sport" version?

Interesting.

[cali yaris]

definitely, I'll be under my car looking at that too - never noticed before, I wonder.

[Maitre_Te_Te]

With the original car, the rear suspension have for example 35 degree. If you drop your car, the rear angle is not the same, it's maybe 20 degree. If you jack your pivot 2 about inch, you can not have the exactly 35 degree beacause you know you can drop 2 inch, 1.5 inch, 1 inch, But you can have 30 degree. So, If your drop is 1 ich, I think that this mod is not important.

I look under the car et I think that the gaz tank and other thing is not a problem.

Tell me about your impression!

[Maitre_Te_Te]

Oh, I like that one!

I'd have to go out and look at the car and really think about it... but do you suppose that it's a factory designed option to improve the geometry of the rear suspension for a lowered "sport" version?

Interesting.

Don't forget, in japan, you have a race series with a yaris (vits and vios) and maybe toyota have do this mod option for the race series!

[lilredrocket]

Ok so it was really slow at work today and I thought I would move my axle to this new discovered position. Right now I am running DF210's and a TRD rear sway bar I also am only running on stock wheels, tires, and shocks. After I moved my axle I took a quick test drive and......... OMG it is freaking amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The car feels completely different better turn in and feels like it has less body roll than before!!!! I took me about 30 mins to an hour to move my axle (I think this was easier to do with my car on a lift then just jacking it up although it could be done that way) I say if you want to expirement I say do it because it is easy to return to stock if need be!!! Hope this helps you out!!! if you have any questions let me know

[1NZYaris1]

Ok so it was really slow at work today and I thought I would move my axle to this new discovered position. Right now I am running DF210's and a TRD rear sway bar I also am only running on stock wheels, tires, and shocks. After I moved my axle I took a quick test drive and......... OMG it is freaking amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The car feels completely different better turn in and feels like it has less body roll than before!!!! I took me about 30 mins to an hour to move my axle (I think this was easier to do with my car on a lift then just jacking it up although it could be done that way) I say if you want to expirement I say do it because it is easy to return to stock if need be!!! Hope this helps you out!!! if you have any questions let me know


I dont suppose you could put better photo's up :iono:

[Thirty-Nine]

I'll have to take a look at this. My coilovers make the rear sit lower than I want already, though ...

[advocate]

Interesting find for sure. Anybody else going to give it a try?

[lilredrocket]

I dont suppose you could put better photo's up :iono:

I will take my camera to work tomorrow and show you where this is and how it looks. OOOHHHHHH and just ot let you know it actually does not lower the car any. I thought it was going to because the holes are like 2-3" apart but I still have the same ride hight!!!

[Maitre_Te_Te]

I don't know what, but I think that you will say "tank you" for this mod !!! :P

I will do this mod the next week.

Picture please with this mod :P !!!

[1NZYaris1]

I will take my camera to work tomorrow and show you where this is and how it looks. OOOHHHHHH and just ot let you know it actually does not lower the car any. I thought it was going to because the holes are like 2-3" apart but I still have the same ride hight!!!

Your my Hero :thumbup: , peterpoop loves you :laugh: bad joke sorry .:bellyroll:

[Cosmonaut]

i am very curious about this now.

[WolfWings]

I'm not running lowered, but I'm tempted to try this and see how things change. May be one of those 'harsher/noisier ride' changed that has no downsides for handling even for non-lowered perhaps?

[2006fronty]

Isn't this just changing the instant center? Or is anti-squat what it changes???
:iono:

[supmet]

I will take my camera to work tomorrow and show you where this is and how it looks.

interested and waiting for more pictures :D

[lilredrocket]

My bad guys I FAILED!!! I forgot to grab my camera on the way out the door this morning so I will snap a few good pics tomorrow before I wash my car.

[lilredrocket]

I don't know what, but I think that you will say "tank you" for this mod !!! :P

I will do this mod the next week.

Picture please with this mod :P !!!

THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS TO OUR ATTENTION!!!!!!

[Maitre_Te_Te]

No problem guys.

[Loren]

Damn, I'm gonna have to give this a try.

It shouldn't affect ride height at all, btw. Ride height is set with the spring height between the spring perches and this won't change that. It just changes the "static" angle of the beam axle assembly, presumably to a more favorable angle for a lowered car.

Basically, it should make whatever effects are designed into the movement of the beam axle (anti-squat, dynamic toe, etc) that are optimized to work at stock ride height... be more optimal for a car that's lowered. It's got to be a good thing.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

How easy would it be to move it to the said point?

[kngrsll]

wow... crazy! good find.

[Loren]

I'd guess that it would require removing the bottom shock bolts to decompress the spring. Then just removing the two pivot bolts, moving the axle assembly down, putting the pivot bolts back in, and putting the shock bolts back in.

Should be as easy as pie. (Mmmmmm... pie!)

[lilredrocket]

I'd guess that it would require removing the bottom shock bolts to decompress the spring. Then just removing the two pivot bolts, moving the axle assembly down, putting the pivot bolts back in, and putting the shock bolts back in.

Should be as easy as pie. (Mmmmmm... pie!)


Actually you are moving the front of the rear axle up. I did this on a car lift with lift stands and air tools took about 30 mins to an hour. Probably about 2 hours laying on the ground.

This mod completely changed the way my car rotates. I would have to say this is great for people that track or auto-x their cars.

[lilredrocket]

Here are the pics that I snapped. You can see where the bolt was before by how clean it was under it. Don't say anything about the dirty car I washed it right after I took these. Sorry they are so big I didn't resize because I wanted to make sure you could see what I was talking about.

[Maitre_Te_Te]

It just changes the "static" angle of the beam axle assembly, presumably to a more favorable angle for a lowered car.

Exactly. I will do this this mod this week. Seriously, i'm very happy to talk to you about this mod and it work just... great!!! I wish to test it the next summer at lapping day! Just one thing. Before torque you axle beam bolt at your pivot, just swing your car 2 to 3 time juste for set your bushing. After, torque the bolt, car not jacked. If not, your bushing work hard!

This is the toyota procedure ;)

[Loren]

Yes, that makes sense. Torquing the pivot bolts with the suspension drooped will cause the bushings to be preloaded when you set the car down.

[lilredrocket]

Good point I will have to take my bolts loose again and retorque them...

[rningonfumes]

Bump!

[gsf1200m]

I thought more people would be trying this! Hopefully I will be doing this tomorrow afternoon to my xD.

lilredrocket, any tips for this or is it as simple as it seems?

[ozmdd]

I did it. Super easy. I put the car on jack stands at the rear jack points, used floor jacks to support the weight of the axle and keep the springs from fighting me, and removed the rear wheels, both for weight reduction and access.

You need a 17mm socket with either a breaker bar or an impact wrench to loosen it. It has loctite from the factory, so I'd have some handy for the re-install.

The swap is really easy, but a small prybar or big screwdriver will aid in lining-up the holes, which is the hardest part of the process. Take your time and wiggle the arm around till you can get a thread started, then you're home free. I forgot the exact torque spec, but you want it on there really good, 90-100 ft/lbs, maybe? (I'll check that # tonight and edit this post.)
That's it. Took me 30 minutes total, working alone.

[bigbang]

wow good one Maitre_Te_Te
just step out check yes its on the sedan

[ozmdd]

Clarification, please: Are you saying it is better to torque the bolts while the suspension is unloaded, or after the car is on the ground in order to preload the bushings?

[gsf1200m]

ozmdd, have you taken it out yet? How does it feel?

[ozmdd]

Yes, but havent' been able to push it hard yet. It definitely feels better - more planted - on the turn-in. Not sure if it altered the effective spring rate or preload on the spring, although it seems like it would a little.

[Loren]

You want to torque either on the ground or with the suspension otherwise supporting the weight of the car. (on ramps, suspension on a jack or jackstand, etc) If you torque with the suspension drooped, when you put the weight on the car, there will be a twisting load on the bushings which can cause the rear of the car to sit artificially high and/or damage the bushings over time.

[Loren]

I'm gonna bet the primary effect in play here is the "toe curve" of the rear suspension. It's designed to be slightly toed in at the factory ride height, and as the suspension compresses in a turn, it toes in a little more for stability. This effect is all built into the rear axle assembly and the angles at which it rotates. So, by changing to the upper holes on a lowered car, you're effectively putting things back into the alignment they were designed for.

To verify this, someone should carefully measure their rear toe before and after making this change. If I'm right, you should see less static toe out after than before.

[detroiter]

Thanks for the finding! I'm curious though, what exactly is the benefit/gain of doing this procedure? I'm not quite sure I completely get what the end result is. Also, any negatives to it?

[kngrsll]

I'm gonna bet the primary effect in play here is the "toe curve" of the rear suspension. It's designed to be slightly toed in at the factory ride height, and as the suspension compresses in a turn, it toes in a little more for stability. This effect is all built into the rear axle assembly and the angles at which it rotates. So, by changing to the upper holes on a lowered car, you're effectively putting things back into the alignment they were designed for.

To verify this, someone should carefully measure their rear toe before and after making this change. If I'm right, you should see less static toe out after than before.

hmm,i need an alignment, perhaps i will try this...

[YarisSedan]

I'm gonna bet the primary effect in play here is the "toe curve" of the rear suspension. It's designed to be slightly toed in at the factory ride height, and as the suspension compresses in a turn, it toes in a little more for stability. This effect is all built into the rear axle assembly and the angles at which it rotates. So, by changing to the upper holes on a lowered car, you're effectively putting things back into the alignment they were designed for.

To verify this, someone should carefully measure their rear toe before and after making this change. If I'm right, you should see less static toe out after than before.

Hmmm i just had a alignment done few weeks ago. When i get a chance ill do this and get a second alignment done and see the difference and post results for you guys Ill also take a few pics more pics if no one has done it by then to make a little more detailed DIY for those who dont know exactly what we are talking about yet. GOOD FIND!

[detroiter]

Thanks for the finding! I'm curious though, what exactly is the benefit/gain of doing this procedure? I'm not quite sure I completely get what the end result is. Also, any negatives to it?

[cali yaris]

I did it. Super easy. I put the car on jack stands at the rear jack points, used floor jacks to support the weight of the axle and keep the springs from fighting me, and removed the rear wheels, both for weight reduction and access.

Exactly how I did it also. Alignment next week, will compare to the last one I did.

[Indianspringsaz]

Getting ready to put some DF springs on. Should I move them to the upper hole during the install? Where do you guys trust to do the alignments? I hate going to shops and have to explain to them how to do their job.

[YarisSedan]

Exactly how I did it also. Alignment next week, will compare to the last one I did.

Did you hand torque it down or just hit it with a breaker bar as hard as you could? I am guessing it should be torqued to about 145ft lbs. And maybe some threadlocker for some extra insurance. I am going to do this at home on my driveway hopefully tonight. Usually i hit everything down with a impact gun but by hand i like to get torque specs to be on the safe side.

[Tamago]

that's some serious torque there ...

[Loren]

Those pivot bolts don't need to be super-tight. The factory manual is available online, though... look it up!

[detroiter]

Is there some reason my question has been skipped over twice so far? Just curious.

[mojoyaris]

If you read above Lorens Posts

"I'm gonna bet the primary effect in play here is the "toe curve" of the rear suspension. It's designed to be slightly toed in at the factory ride height, and as the suspension compresses in a turn, it toes in a little more for stability. This effect is all built into the rear axle assembly and the angles at which it rotates. So, by changing to the upper holes on a lowered car, you're effectively putting things back into the alignment they were designed for."

And on the previous pages you'll get an idea of how it adjusts the suspension geometry

When you lower the suspension in the front you can get bump steer. There are devices to install in the front to adjust and compensate for this. This is something akin to that but in the rear suspension where you level out the torsion beam and realign the toe.

I guess an illustration would be the best way to describe this.

[Loren]

Is there some reason my question has been skipped over twice so far? Just curious.
Um, yeah. I may not have addressed you by name, but your question has been answered. Read.

[YarisSedan]

Those pivot bolts don't need to be super-tight. The factory manual is available online, though... look it up!

I took your advice and looked it up. For those who are interested the factory spec is exactly 67 ft lbs.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Dang, my crappy torque wrench doesn't go that high =(

[Tamago]

Dang, my crappy torque wrench doesn't go that high =(

certainly does not need to. i removed my rear axle over 5 years ago and never used a torque wrench to re-install it. "tight" worked just fine.

[ddongbap]

So whats the end end of this?

Raise the bolt location then X happens?

Idk if people think a stable rear is better for handling?

I'd assume that having a happier rear end, or a rear end with a TOE OUT setting is better for turning? That would also make the rear end feel like its gonna get in front of you, right? Ahh, Loren, help me out.

[advocate]

I would assume then this is for the Japanese following of the car for when it's lowered and being raced? Seems easy enough for me... Drill an extra hole for people who want to race it and leave one for the stock height...

Too bad it took us forever to find it =(

[detroiter]

I didn't mean to come off as the feeling of being ignored, I was meaning that I did read all of the previous posts and pages, I just didn't fully get it what the end result is supposed to be like and what the pros/cons would be to moving it. My apologies

[Loren]

The final word on this discussion will have to wait until someone does some before and after alignment checking.

My speculation is that it simply improves the toe curve on a lowered Yaris, letting the rear suspension work more like it would at stock height. It's not gonna give you "toe out", just "less toe in".

Now... here's a question for those who have done it. (I'm freakin' lazy, could be months before I get around to it) Is there enough slop in those pivot bolts that the alignment of the rear axle becomes an issue? Can you end up "dog-tracking" due to the rear axle assembly not pointing straight along the centerline of the car? Or are they tight enough that it's not a concern? (probably another question that it will take an alignment rack to answer accurately)

[YarisSedan]

I should take my car to one of those "free alignment checks" like firestone and wheel works. And see how it looks afterwards.

[fmicle]

I should take my car to one of those "free alignment checks" like firestone and wheel works. And see how it looks afterwards.

Let us know what they say. I just did this last weekend and I'm curious too.

[GnomeBody]

I just lowered my yaris a little while ago and I still havent gotten around to adressing the toe and camber alignments yet. I was gunna just shim the rears but I think this in combo with the shims might be a better solution.

here's my basic explanation on what this mod would change(see pictures attached)

I think that on a stock height car, this mod isnt needed.

[YarisSedan]

So if i go back to my technical schooling days it looks like that mod changes the caster. But caster dosnt really make much difference unless it is on the steering tires.

[Loren]

The way the rear axle assembly is designed, it also changes toe. (caster is irrelevant, as the rear wheels don't steer)

At stock height, the car has a certain amount of toe-in. As the axle rotates up (when the suspension compresses... or when the car is lowered) on its pivot point, the angle goes more inward.

If you lower the car and DON'T move the pivot point, you have more static toe-out than stock, which isn't good for turning. (great for going straight)

Moving to the higher pivot point on a lowered car should bring the toe back closer to factory spec.

[YarisSedan]

The way the rear axle assembly is designed, it also changes toe. (caster is irrelevant, as the rear wheels don't steer)

At stock height, the car has a certain amount of toe-in. As the axle rotates up (when the suspension compresses... or when the car is lowered) on its pivot point, the angle goes more inward.

If you lower the car and DON'T move the pivot point, you have more static toe-out than stock, which isn't good for turning. (great for going straight)

Moving to the higher pivot point on a lowered car should bring the toe back closer to factory spec.

Ahhhhh i 100 percent got you now. Explains why every reponse is only feeling a difference on turns. So pretty much a cheap and easy way to correct the toe without involving use of shims on lowered vehicles. I am curiouse why toyota did not mention to do this with the instructions that come with the TRD springs it seems like a no brainer.

[GnomeBody]

my uber simple drawing don't really show the effect on the toe and camber very well but this mod does effect both.As the caster angle changes toe turns into camber and vise-versa. If there were absolutlely no stock Toe or Camber than it wouldnt matter, but that isnt the case.

[PHXDEMON]

Awesome discovery. I have had mad rubbing issues on the rear since installing the PG rear hub spacers because of how much toe in there is. Hopefully doing this mod will compensate enough to clear a lot of it up.

[YarisSedan]

I did mine on a rack today and it was a real PAIN in the ass to get the back side of the bushing lined up. Ended up having to disconect the shocks so i could get the torsion beam to move a bit to get it to finally lined up. Took me with a flashlight and another guy with a pry bar prying on the end of the bushing to get the bolt hole to line up.

After test drive i notice you have this feeling like the car is more leveled or like the rear end is sitting lower now. Also going over bumps i started to hear this clank clank sound. Turns out the torsion bar sits higher up now i guess because of the angle. So its banging against my megan tie bar. I am going to see if i can get a file and file it down. If not looks like i may have to remove it. So for those who have that rear little bar by the gas tank that seems like it has no use at all make sure you remove it first before you do this mod.

[lilredrocket]

Now... here's a question for those who have done it. (I'm freakin' lazy, could be months before I get around to it) Is there enough slop in those pivot bolts that the alignment of the rear axle becomes an issue? Can you end up "dog-tracking" due to the rear axle assembly not pointing straight along the centerline of the car? Or are they tight enough that it's not a concern? (probably another question that it will take an alignment rack to answer accurately)

There is very minimal space in there I doubt you would make your car dog-track. The metal on the inside of the bushings where the bolt goes throught is fairly tight in the slot. I would have put this on the alignment rack up at work but our rear heads don't calibrate so I wouldn't be able to tell you

[YarisSedan]

There is very minimal space in there I doubt you would make your car dog-track. The metal on the inside of the bushings where the bolt goes throught is fairly tight in the slot. I would have put this on the alignment rack up at work but our rear heads don't calibrate so I wouldn't be able to tell you

Sounds like the alignment heads at my old shop. Good old "set the toe and let it go" Tell your owner to get a laser system. No more comping heads again.

[YarisSedan]

Hmm i can almost swear the rear of my car sits lower now. The fender gap is the same but the rear of the car is lower. Its as if the car has 15s in the front and 17 inch rims in the back. And then i swapped out the 15s back in the back. Before and after. It looks like i lowered the car about a inch more looking strait on from the back. I dont think its some placebo effect either looking strait on it does look lower. But looking from the side from the wheel and fender it looks the same. If someone is planning on doing this mod please take a tape measure and measure from fender to ground and rear bumper to ground before and after please.

[yaris 2sz]

from these that you write, the axle going down but the height is the same.

maybe that is...

[kngrsll]

Hmm i can almost swear the rear of my car sits lower now. The fender gap is the same but the rear of the car is lower. Its as if the car has 15s in the front and 17 inch rims in the back. And then i swapped out the 15s back in the back. Before and after. It looks like i lowered the car about a inch more looking strait on from the back. I dont think its some placebo effect either looking strait on it does look lower. But looking from the side from the wheel and fender it looks the same. If someone is planning on doing this mod please take a tape measure and measure from fender to ground and rear bumper to ground before and after please.

that doesnt seem unreasonable... the spring sits slightly fore of the center of the wheel. if you change the pitch of the beam, you can raise or lower the spring perch as well. personally, i would think it would make it sit a little higher as the perch is tilted slightly higher.

[kngrsll]

oh, we need a sticky on this topic btw

[PHXDEMON]

Now that I look back at it as Loren stated it should help lessen the amount of toe out. My only concern is with that part of the axle postioned up higher wouldn't it make the wheel go back towards the rear of the car more when it is flexing. My problem is my tire is rubbing in this area.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m218/PHXDEMON/rearwheel.jpg

[PHXDEMON]

pic of my rear wheel after spacer install.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m218/PHXDEMON/img1245300864968.jpg

[PHXDEMON]

Maybe the suspension expert himself can shed some light on this :) I just don't want to spend 2 hours doing this just for it to make my rear rub worse.

[fmicle]

Last night, I was installing my new wheels, took the car for a test ride and when I got back I looked at it from behind very carefully. I might be wrong, but I swear I can tell the toe-in on the rear wheels. If you look carefully, along the tire walls, trying to align one edge with the opposite edge, looking along the vehicle, in a horizontal line, right above the center hub, you will see that the imaginary line hits the body somewhere in the front, it doesn't stay parallel to the centerline. And I noticed that with the axle mounted on the higher bolt. Imagine how much more toe-in you get on the lower bolt, since turning the axle forwards would probably increase the toe-in angle even more...

[PHXDEMON]

Yeah I am starting to think this mod may be the exact opposite of what I need to do for my rubbing issue :iono:

[YarisSedan]

Yeah looking at my tire after this mod. Instead of it being centered between both sides of the fender its leaning more towards the back fender. So if thast the area you are rubbing against it will make your situation worse.

[Loren]

I might be wrong, but I swear I can tell the toe-in on the rear wheels.
You can easily measure toe with a tape measure. If you think there's so much that you can SEE it with the naked eye, you should certainly be able to measure it with a tape measure.

Pick a groove on the tire, measure from side to side at the front of the tire, as high up as you can get without interference. Measure the same grooves at the back of the tire. Difference = toe. Narrower in front = toe-in.

This won't give you exact numbers, as you can't get measurements at exactly the vertical center of the wheel, and you're potentially dealing with some tread flex, etc. But, it's close enough to get an idea of what's going on.

[fmicle]

I agree, and what I'm trying to say is that it would be MUCH WORSE (as in more toe-in) if you DID NOT do this mod for a lowered car...

I am just trying to confirm the theory on this thread with my empirical observations.

[fmicle]

Yeah I am starting to think this mod may be the exact opposite of what I need to do for my rubbing issue :iono:

Yes, this might not be the solution to the rubbing issue, but it is the right solution for keeping the toe-in closer to factory spec after lowering.

[YarisSedan]

http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/tiebarset.jpg

Whenever i go over bumps now my rear axle slams against this tie bar. I tried to sand down the horrible welds so it is pretty much smooth and even then there is still banging. Sadly i either have to take it off or put the axle back to the factory position =(

[detroiter]

So is it the general consensus that this is a good mod to do if your vehicle is lowered? That's what I'm getting but want to be sure. From that drawn diagram on one of the pages, it looks like with a lowered vehicle that by putting it up on the top bolt hole, it's putting things near back the stock suspension position. If that's the case, why would that be more beneficial than leaving it in the bottom hole and having the rear toe changed?

[fmicle]

I thought you couldn't change the rear toe on the Yaris...

[fmicle]

http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/tiebarset.jpg


Aren't these springs installed upside down?

[ddongbap]

I thought you couldn't change the rear toe on the Yaris...

http://shop.microimageonline.com/product.sc;jsessionid=46F6E6D45244A2090850C92D64A9 E6ED.qscstrfrnt04?productId=77&categoryId=4

And I don't think it really matters if springs are upsidedown or not.

[YarisSedan]

Aren't these springs installed upside down?

Are they? Yeah i dont think its possible really to install them upside down since they will function the same way still. But that could explain why i get some creaking noise occasionally while others do not with the same springs.

[RacerFreakXXX]

http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/tiebarset.jpg

Whenever i go over bumps now my rear axle slams against this tie bar. I tried to sand down the horrible welds so it is pretty much smooth and even then there is still banging. Sadly i either have to take it off or put the axle back to the factory position =(

Aren't those stock shocks? that would be one of the reasons why your car would be hitting that brace imo :iono:

[YarisSedan]

Yeah changing to tokiko shocks is on my list of things to do.

[detroiter]

So I woke up this morning and I guess almost instinctual, I set out to the garage and grabbed the tools to do the job. I'd definately have to say that having two people is much easier (it always is usually anyways when it comes to cars) but it's not too bad if your going solo. The hardest part, like someone else mentioned, was the rear bushing. It was a pain in the rump to try and line it up just right so you could start threading the bolt through all the way.

I took it for a quick test drive after I was finished and for me speaking, I can think of a few choice words to sum up my initial impressions. Refined, smooth and reactive.
It reminds me alot of the stock suspension ride, how it's calm and smooth feeling. All of that feeling now with the lowered suspension components. It certainly feels more "planted" in the rear with even less boat motion feeling. The turning feedback definately increased has well. I jerked the steering wheel side to side to see what it would do, and it reacted quick and precise. Much better than when the rear axle beam was in the lower position.

One thing I noticed though is that the rear certainly doesn't appear to be lower or any of that. If anything, it almost looks like it's a slight pinch higher. Could be just a mind trick since the axle beam is tucked up underneath a bit more and it allows to see more space under the car. Also, I don't really see any difference in the tire being more "towards the rear". Looks the same gap to me towards front or rear of the fender. Another thing I'd be a little concerned with is taking the time to adjust to how it drives now. The steering and reaction during my quick test drive is much nicer feeling and quicker, better handling...but along with that, I believe you could get yourself into some trouble if it's wet or slick out. I'm concerned about a more likely possibility of snap oversteer if you jerked or steered too suddenly.

It's a given though that anytime someone changes a part on a car that alters it's powertrain or suspension, that the person takes it easy so they can learn what is different and how it reacts. Too many countless stories of some kid that throws a turbo on a Civic and goes out that night to get it on. Ends up crashing the car because it's completely different than what it used to be and the driver had no idea how to react. Essentially, the car is NOT the same car as what you used to drive. Be safe out there.

[YarisSedan]

So I woke up this morning and I guess almost instinctual, I set out to the garage and grabbed the tools to do the job. I'd definately have to say that having two people is much easier (it always is usually anyways when it comes to cars) but it's not too bad if your going solo. The hardest part, like someone else mentioned, was the rear bushing. It was a pain in the rump to try and line it up just right so you could start threading the bolt through all the way.

I took it for a quick test drive after I was finished and for me speaking, I can think of a few choice words to sum up my initial impressions. Refined, smooth and reactive.
It reminds me alot of the stock suspension ride, how it's calm and smooth feeling. All of that feeling now with the lowered suspension components. It certainly feels more "planted" in the rear with even less boat motion feeling. The turning feedback definately increased has well. I jerked the steering wheel side to side to see what it would do, and it reacted quick and precise. Much better than when the rear axle beam was in the lower position.

One thing I noticed though is that the rear certainly doesn't appear to be lower or any of that. If anything, it almost looks like it's a slight pinch higher. Could be just a mind trick since the axle beam is tucked up underneath a bit more and it allows to see more space under the car. Also, I don't really see any difference in the tire being more "towards the rear". Looks the same gap to me towards front or rear of the fender. Another thing I'd be a little concerned with is taking the time to adjust to how it drives now. The steering and reaction during my quick test drive is much nicer feeling and quicker, better handling...but along with that, I believe you could get yourself into some trouble if it's wet or slick out. I'm concerned about a more likely possibility of snap oversteer if you jerked or steered too suddenly.

It's a given though that anytime someone changes a part on a car that alters it's powertrain or suspension, that the person takes it easy so they can learn what is different and how it reacts. Too many countless stories of some kid that throws a turbo on a Civic and goes out that night to get it on. Ends up crashing the car because it's completely different than what it used to be and the driver had no idea how to react. Essentially, the car is NOT the same car as what you used to drive. Be safe out there.

Yeah i have simular conserns as you. I went to take a really quick turn after i did this mod to see how it would react. And if you ever watched initial D when the character makes that face when his car does something unexpected that same thing happend to me. It scared me for a second cause it was completely unexpected. Going to have to slowly get used to it. Its as if you have to turn to wheel less while going into a sharp turn. If you jerk the wheel too hard you will have to turn it back the other way to correct it otherwise you will drive into whatever you are cornering around if thta makes sense.

All i know is my car just got really a lot lot more fun ot drive :biggrin:

[RacerFreakXXX]

yay for oversteer!!!!! at least it's not understeer

[fmicle]

Are they? Yeah i dont think its possible really to install them upside down since they will function the same way still. But that could explain why i get some creaking noise occasionally while others do not with the same springs.

Well, I'm not an expert, but yours are upside down from the ones in this DIY (pictures 6 and 7 are relevant): http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1096

So, either both ways are fine, or one of you has them upside down :wink:

The reason I brought it up is because I have similar looking springs, where the lower coils are closer together than the higher ones and I installed mine according to the DIY above. Also, the ends are not exactly the same, since one end gets a rubber cap and the other end sits in a groove on a plate on the axle. One end brings the coil almost to a circle, while the other kind of ends open. So at least from a geometry perspective, it's not the same. But it might be just fine... I don't know... that's what I'm trying to figure out :smile:

[YarisSedan]

Well, I'm not an expert, but yours are upside down from the ones in this DIY (pictures 6 and 7 are relevant): http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1096

So, either both ways are fine, or one of you has them upside down :wink:

The reason I brought it up is because I have similar looking springs, where the lower coils are closer together than the higher ones and I installed mine according to the DIY above. Also, the ends are not exactly the same, since one end gets a rubber cap and the other end sits in a groove on a plate on the axle. One end brings the coil almost to a circle, while the other kind of ends open. So at least from a geometry perspective, it's not the same. But it might be just fine... I don't know... that's what I'm trying to figure out :smile:

I installed mine based on the instruction manual that came in the box from toyota. But now you got me wondering if i installed them right or not lol.

http://shop.microimageonline.com/images/12122602779381392564535.jpeg

going by this picture for tannabe it looks like the tightly coiled are supose to be on top since thats how the label is printed on the coil.

[AL441]

is good or bad to do this ? what is the positive and negative advantage of this mod?

[fmicle]

is good or bad to do this ? what is the positive and negative advantage of this mod?

It is good, IF you're lowered. As explained above, the rear axle has some built-in camber and toe which will be off if you lower your car. I got mine to an alignment shop last night and the rear axle was right within factory specs - no adjustment needed. I'm pretty sure the alignment would have been off if I hand't done it after changing the springs.

The only disadvantage someone mentioned about this mod is that you might get some rubbing because if the modified geometry. Look above on this thread for a picture. I don't have that problem on my hatchback with a mild drop (1.4") But if you don't do it, you would either have to adjust the alignment with some spacers or you will get uneven tire wear.

[fmicle]

But now you got me wondering if i installed them right or not lol.

I'm glad I could help :laugh:

[AL441]

what is the advantages of this mods? what is the positive advantages?

[fmicle]

what is the advantages of this mods? what is the positive advantages?

Scroll up 3 posts! :drinking:

[ddongbap]

Anybody had a chance to see what sort of changes the pivot change makes, compared to not changing the pivot?

[cali yaris]

^ it's a free mod, just the kind you like. TRY IT. (You'll like it)

[evo165]

Yeah! I shifted up the pivot point of my rear arm. The very first impression given me is, WoW!! My ride feel so much more balance especially on the rear suspension during hard cornering.

In the past after i drop my ride with Tanabe NF springs, i do gain the look of it but somehow i lose a little on the "corner handling" & "cornering balance" if i corner really hard. The reason is due to the "super soft" spring rate of the NF spring gave & i bear in mind that NF springs is strictly meant for "Comfort" usage. I am already used to it and live with it of the "soft" & "floating" cornering of the NF springs!!

Till yesterday i change the rear of my suspension pivot point, while i'm testing it, i smile to myself!!!!!! :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin: Feeling "unbalance" & "floating" in the hard cornering will be a thing of the PAST!!!:headbang:

Thank you, Yaris World & all mates to share in this forum!!:headbang:

As i'm not sure how the rear camber or toe angle change after shifting to the upper pivot point. Below are the points i figure it out after the mod, i really can see the rear wheel being "extend" to the rear end. Meaning having a longer wheel-base after the change. Below are the points i thought which really make sense to have the longer wheel-base after the change.

1. Once our ride is lowered, our rear arm will move/angle "upward" where this will "shorten" our wheel-base a little depending on how much u lowered.
More lowered = Shorter wheel base

2. In order to enjoy back the near stock/longer wheel base, where this addtional hole is there for. Upon shifting the pivot point higher, the arm will now have the most "level" & "parallel" to the ground, for this we'll gain back the stock/longer wheel base.

Please do not frame me if the above pointers are wrong or does not make sense to any of you. Pls correct me if i'm wrong. As i'm still learning and want to share with you guys with my logic. :thumbup:

[detroiter]

For those who have done the mod, even though it's much more stable feeling now while turning and cornering, would you agree that it seems the rear end ride comfort is a bit more uncomfortable/harder feeling?

[evo165]

For those who have done the mod, even though it's much more stable feeling now while turning and cornering, would you agree that it seems the rear end ride comfort is a bit more uncomfortable/harder feeling?

Yes sir, i do agree with you on this point!! Before the change, in fact my ride are way "too" comfortable to do any street or hard cornering for my liking. After this mod, my ride comfort doesn't affect much to it. In fact, my gf mentioned it feel more comfortable because she felt her body roll lesser than before. (Same gf, same corner speed, same location, same dry weather)

It is all depending on what ur liking & habit to drive your Yaris. :wink:

More comfortable ride = Less stable ride OR
Less comfortable ride = More stable ride

[YarisSedan]

For those who have done the mod, even though it's much more stable feeling now while turning and cornering, would you agree that it seems the rear end ride comfort is a bit more uncomfortable/harder feeling?

I think it puts more force on the springs i could be wrong. When i put my springs back in place it took a heck of a lot more effort than before. I think they are being compressed slightly more somehow thus allowing a slighter higher spring rate?

[detroiter]

^^

That's exactly what I was thinking. It basically preloads the spring at a higher rate, giving it the harsher feel and better reaction.

Why did you have a hard time putting the springs back in, just curious? Mine never fell out or needed to be moved/adjusted

[YarisSedan]

^^

That's exactly what I was thinking. It basically preloads the spring at a higher rate, giving it the harsher feel and better reaction.

Why did you have a hard time putting the springs back in, just curious? Mine never fell out or needed to be moved/adjusted

Well i did mine on a lift and was fighting to put the bushing back in. I needed to remove the shock to give me more play when i did that the spring fell out and one thing led to another lol. Finally got it in and when i went to put the spring back it was much more difficult and had to use a tranny jack under the beam where the shock bolts up to get everyhing back together. What i should have done is used 2 tranny jacks one on each side before i unbolted everythign to support it all. Same as if soemone was doing it on the ground using 2 additional floor jacks. Would have probally went much more smooth.

But i think it does preload the spring more. I can feel more harshness at higher speeds especially. But man its so worth it. Makes me really wana get some new shocks now. Should have taken advantage of the 10 percent off deal.

[kngrsll]

so i did this yesterday. i think the car sits SLIGHTLY lower but that may be an illusion.

as for the ride, the car is more comfortable! that is really the thing i noticed the most! I didnt notice a huge change in handling, but i also just installed an LSD which i only drove on for one day, which made a huge change in handling. over bumps on the interstate, the car is not nearly as jolting, it was quite pleasant driving it home! which is very unusual, after about an hour in the car, the body starts to feel quite fatigued.

as i said already, i didnt notice a huge handling difference, but that is probably due to getting to used to the LSD (which is very different than the car was before.)

another thing, i think an alignment using the SPC shims is a good idea after this mod. i think there is enough slack there to create some subtle alignment changes. once the bolts are torqued down, they beam is in place. then i would correct it with the shims.

great find!

[fmicle]

I don't see how this can preload the springs at a higher rate, since it's the weight of the car that's loading the springs, which is the same. The only thing that changes is the angle of the axle plate versus top plate, which hold the springs in place. With the axle down those plates are almost parallel, with the axle up the plates are at a certain angle.

[fmicle]

(Same gf, same corner speed, same location, same dry weather)

:bellyroll:

[frantic]

im on coilovers... you reckon this mod will do any good??

[fmicle]

I guess that depends on your setting. If you're lower than stock by 1 inch or more in the back, I'd say yes.

Disclaimer: don't take auto mechanical advice from software engineers :wink:

[kngrsll]

im on coilovers... you reckon this mod will do any good??

yeah, that doesnt matter.

[YarisSedan]

Hmm new issue now. Over really really hard bumps or potholes the rear beam smacks against the gas tank and put some scrapes in it already. Kinda scared over time if it may wear a hole through the plastic. Looks like its time to swap out to some performance shocks.

[Loren]

The beam axle is contacting the fuel tank? Photos?

[YarisSedan]

The beam axle is contacting the fuel tank? Photos?

Ill try to take some tomorrow if i have time. It only happens if i go over say a speed bump really fast. You can hear a slight clunk and today i was doing a brake flush i figured id take a look at everything to see if something looked loose and that when i noticed scratching on the side of the gas tank. Nothing major but over time it might put some wear. So now i drive lot slower pulling out of driveways and going over bumps or holes =(. With the car on a drive on rack there really is little clearance between the beam and the gas tank. That little bar i showed in a pic before cant really be removed with a load on the car. Had to put it on a conventional lift to take the load off the beam so it would drop enough down. So even with the bar removed there is still some slight contact but with the tank now. Before it would make contact with the tie bar even going slowly out of a driveway. Any twisting seemed to make it contact on the drivers side of the beam. Now where its contacting is slightly on the drivers side still but none on the passanger side. I cant imagine what would happen if i had passangers in the rear now lol.

[ddongbap]

I got an alignment done, and i have the alignment numbers on a stock bolted rear end, dropped on Megans.

.. but its in the car.

[ddongbap]

Okay, here are my alignment specs. I'll include my fronts anyways, even though its technically not related. This alignment was after I installed the adjustable camber bolts from Garm.

Front before: camber / toe
Left -3.13 // 7/8
Right -2.64 // 9/16

After: camber // toe
L -1.96 // 0
R -1.92 // 0

Rear:
L -.76 // 1/4
R -1.23 // 1/8

I have rear shims I'm gonna add before my next track day.

[kngrsll]

what were the before and after rear settings with the beam change?

[ddongbap]

what were the before and after rear settings with the beam change?

I didn't do the beam change yet. If the beam change would add toe in, I don't think I'll end up doing it. I just wanted to put out there, what my alignment was with an agressive drop. The bottom of my chassis is scratched up from speed bumps and such. Thats how low I am.

[kngrsll]

it should reduce toe in and improve bumps in the rear so you may want to consider it. the lower you are, the more it should help since the geometry is further from stock than normal.

[ddongbap]

Improve bumps how?

I have some rear shims I'm going to add later on.

[ozmdd]

I'm getting the alignment checked this week to see the before/after results of the rear axle relocation, and I felt that the rear was more "planted" at the last autocross I did.

That being said, I also discovered/confirmed that there is some "clunking" in bigger dips, from contact between things that shouldn't be doing so, so I'm probably going to put it back to stock. I'll take picks when its up in the air to zero-in on the offending parts. I'll also post the alignment numbers just so everyone can get an exact idea of what the mod does.
It definitely does reduce the toe-in that results from lowering, which is nice. Maybe I can run the alternate setting when I get the coilovers installed and am able to have more control over the suspension settings.

[detroiter]

I 3rd the happening of clunking on hard bumps or dips. I don't know what it is that's hitting but I'll be straight forwards when saying whatever it is, it sure doesn't sound too healthy.

[kngrsll]

i havent noticed it, but i dont run slammed, and i have a 6kg rear spring

[enobmort42]

Hmm. I'm lowering my car now, and I may be wrong, but from what I've gathered after reading this thread, I either need an alignment or I should adjust the pivot point?

[YarisSedan]

I 3rd the happening of clunking on hard bumps or dips. I don't know what it is that's hitting but I'll be straight forwards when saying whatever it is, it sure doesn't sound too healthy.

I felt the same way till i looked at it in the air and its the gas tank!

But i like how the car handles so much now i dont want to put it back the way it was. I am glad im not the only one who hears occasional clunking. I am hoping some stiff shocks may correct this issue. If not may have to get stronger springs.

[Loren]

Hmm. I'm lowering my car now, and I may be wrong, but from what I've gathered after reading this thread, I either need an alignment or I should adjust the pivot point?

Both.

After lowering, you need to align the FRONT of the car, it's the end that has factory adjustments.

In the rear, the only thing that changes with lowering is the toe-in, and there's no way to adjust it without shimming. This new "modification" should minimize or possibly eliminate the toe change, but be aware that it's a very new idea and the potential downsides (contact between axle and fuel tank?) are just being discovered.

[Loren]

Whoever does this next, if you have time, do this:

You should be removing the springs to accomplish this task, anyway. So, before you reinstall the springs, after you put the bolts into the higher pivot point position, raise the rear wheels/hubs to max height and see exactly where and just how bad the contact is. Take pictures of where it is making contact, and of how close the upper and lower spring perches are to each other. (how much would the spring be compressed if it were there?)

The problem could potentially be dealt with by lengthening the bump stop. Of course, that's going to mean that very low cars will be resting on the bump stops and essentially have no suspension travel... which defeats the purpose of damn near any suspension mod. (assuming the goal of a suspension mod is to make the car handle better in real world conditions)

Could potentially also be dealt with by just trimming some material on the axle assembly somewhere, or maybe relocating or modifying something that is bolted TO the axle. Need to take a close look and see exactly what's going on.

[ddongbap]

I kinda get the feeling that people with regular drop springs aren't supposed to do this.

[enobmort42]

I kinda get the feeling that people with regular drop springs aren't supposed to do this.


I hope that's the case! I just have some TRD springs on my stock shocks, until I have enough for the TRD ones... The instructions don't say anything about the pivot point...

[fmicle]

I've been running with this mod for almost 2 weeks now and haven't had any issues so far. I've only had the baby in the back, no other loads or longer trips and the roads are decent where I drive, so no big bumps or anything. I haven't heard any bumping, other than just the springs a couple of times after I installed them, probably from just setting in...

I am running on Progress springs though, with a medium drop of 1.4". I'll keep an eye on it though, but I've seen the alignment numbers on the rear axle with this mod and they look perfect, I would probably do my best to keep it that way.

Oh and the handling (with the new Toyo T1R's that I got) is amazing :drool:

[ddongbap]

I think the T1Rs are doing the grunt work of the handling.

On a side note, I installed the 23mm rear sway bar. IDK what I'm supposed to be feeling though.

[detroiter]

I just got an alignment check and everything came back well within factory specs while using the higher bolt point. ill throw the numbers up soon...

[kngrsll]

I kinda get the feeling that people with regular drop springs aren't supposed to do this.

why do you feel that? to me, that seems like the ideal candidate.

[ddongbap]

Cause Toyota sells TRD shocks and springs w/o saying anything about the second set of holes.

[fmicle]

IDK what I'm supposed to be feeling though.

Less body roll (swinging from side to side) when cornering, changing lanes, etc. The car should feel more "planted" on the road and you should be able to take turns at higher speeds than before.

Disclaimer: please drive responsibly! :smile:

[fmicle]

Cause Toyota sells TRD shocks and springs w/o saying anything about the second set of holes.

Toyota also says you can put 14" and 15" wheels on your car and no mention of bigger sizes and as far as I know there was a photo posted here with someone having 19" wheels on the Yaris. Plenty of people have 17"s and I had 16"s until 2 weeks ago :wink:

[YarisSedan]

Hmm i put my car on rack tonight and took a bunch of pictures. Ill post everything tonight if i have time when i get home. The rear springs look partially compressed. Half the coils are compressed and touching. You couldnt even fit ap iece of paper between half of them. I think this could be why the rear end feels lower and appears to be lower. It actually is. Also why the rear feels stiffer because this should increase the spring rate since its under a big preload now. . The rear beam is only maybe 2-3 inches away from the gas tank. I think the clunk is either the beam making contact with the filler neck or the top of the tank or the springs just bottoming out and hitting the bump stop. I think it could be a combination of any of them.

So i think if you did this mod on factory springs you would have some gain. Would even out the rear end so it dosnt sit abnormally high and get all the benifit still without the issue some of us who lowered the car have. Ill post the pics tonight so you guys can see what i mean. Hopefully loren can take a look at them and give us his thoughts.

[YarisSedan]

http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm1.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm2.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm3.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm4.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm5.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm6.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm7.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm8.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm9.jpg

[YarisSedan]

So first picture the area i circled is the area i am concerned about. But now that i think about it when i removed the bar i had to struggled so its a possibility it may have caused some of the scratching on the gas tank. My plan is to put some chalk on that area tomorrow and then drive it over some bumps and see if it rubs it off.

Second picture you can see the small distance between the beam and the gas tank. When i had my tie bar installed there it was literally less than inch from beam which is why it kept clanking against it.

The second picture with the circle mark shows how close the beam is to the filler neck of the gas tank. I suppose if you had a bunch of heavy set people in the back seat and went over a really hard pothole there is a chance it could make contact. Also the fewer last pictures you can see how tightly wound the coil spring is. I am not sure if this is suppose to be normal. But the top portion of the springs are all touching. I am thinking the clunk is the spring completely compressing and making contact with the bottom but not 100 percent sure.

Still hoping loren will take a look at this pics and give us some insight.

[Loren]

Remove the springs. Then you can easily move the axle through its complete range of motion to check for interference with the fuel tank or anything else.

The pix are good, they tell us the area of concern... but they don't show any actual contact.

[cali yaris]

If there were contact, you'd see it - the paint would be worn/chipped/rubbed.

[ddongbap]

Less body roll (swinging from side to side) when cornering, changing lanes, etc. The car should feel more "planted" on the road and you should be able to take turns at higher speeds than before.

Disclaimer: please drive responsibly! :smile:

I'm already on coilovers, so most of the bodyroll reductions went down after the coils.

[fmicle]

I think it's normal for the coils to look the way they do, same thing with mine, even though different brand, the first 3 or so spirals touch each other...

[yaris 2sz]

yarissedan, did you cut the bump stops when installed the springs?
if you did it, maybe it's from this.

by the way, i asked the tte.de about bump stops cutting and told me that i don't have to do this. i have the tte springs

[lilredrocket]

I have not been on for a couple of days but every once in a while I have heard a noise from the rear after dips. I have a little bit different exhaust sets up than everyone else and I believe that the axle is very close to the exhaust. I noticed this when moving my axle up to the higher position I will take pics later this week

[YarisSedan]

yarissedan, did you cut the bump stops when installed the springs?
if you did it, maybe it's from this.

by the way, i asked the tte.de about bump stops cutting and told me that i don't have to do this. i have the tte springs

No havent touched the bump stops. I dont think theres bump stops really to cut in the rear its a different type of setup than in the front. Its spring and shock combo.

[AND189]

hmmm

[AND189]

DIY anyone ???


First jack her up i put the mounts as far away as posable so i have lots of room to play
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12619.jpg

pull the wheels off
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12620.jpg

position jack so it is under swing arm and to get the bolt out you need to slightly tap the mount up to take the cross load off the bolt http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12621.jpg

this is the bolt you will be taking out only one of mine seamed to have lock tight so when putting them back i used locknut on both with some grease
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12622.jpg

so once the bolts are taken from both sides you can back prop one first and this is the fiddly part, if you have only one jack ... to get the holes to line up you need to keep the axel at the same hight as both sides if you don't you will fined it easy for one side and real hard for the other, so if you can use two people with two are you can just prop one side as high as you can the go back to the other and so on until the holes match up
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12626.jpg

as i was alone i had to back prop it took a little longer when moving the axel up i used the cares weight to move the axel with a jack (so i am not lifting the car) (loren)for the sake of others that putting a jack under the center of the beam axle is a bad idea. It can be bent in that manner.

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12627.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12628.jpg

You can see the thread is shaved for the first 5mm witch means if you are having problems getting the bolt in you can give it a little tap with a hammer
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12632.jpg

After putting it all back i took if for a test run down bluegum road and it was crazy it just cuts into corners at speed and i did not see a drop or lift in hight, But i did fine the rear a little more bouncy, other mods i have done are the trd springs and struts, sway bar, strut brace, tires and wheels and this has been the cheapest and i enjoyed it to good luck !!!

some other pics of my old mans car and mine
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12639.jpg

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12640.jpg

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/firkins_2000/SDC12641.jpg

[Loren]

AND129, I think you know this by the fact that you mentioned being careful not to lift the car at this point, but it's worth mentioning for the sake of others that putting a jack under the center of the beam axle is a bad idea. It can be bent in that manner.

Neat that you were able to do this without pulling the shock bolts and removing the springs. Probably a toss-up as to which way is actually easier. (only two bolts to drop the shocks and it should make the whole process of fitting those pivot bolts a lot easier)

[AND189]

ok thanks as i did say the car was not lifted by the axel only its own weight and i didnt have to many problems i will note it thanks mate

[ddongbap]

LLLO U HAVE A EVO.

LOL @ EVOS. HAHAHAHAHA

Jk. I'm just jealous. =[

[YarisSedan]

AND129, I think you know this by the fact that you mentioned being careful not to lift the car at this point, but it's worth mentioning for the sake of others that putting a jack under the center of the beam axle is a bad idea. It can be bent in that manner.

Neat that you were able to do this without pulling the shock bolts and removing the springs. Probably a toss-up as to which way is actually easier. (only two bolts to drop the shocks and it should make the whole process of fitting those pivot bolts a lot easier)

I would highly reccomend removing the shock bolts. I tried to do this without doing so being lazy and it costed me 30 minutes of fighting with the bolt hole and cursing and after simply just removing the shock bolts and taking out the springs it was bolted in place a few minutes later. Because of the tension one side of the bushing will line up while the other will not. I was able to get one in without removing the bolts but required assistance of another person usinga pry bar to get the inner bushing lined up while i jammed in the bolt from the outer side.

[AND189]

as i said i had no problems simple unbolt jack up bolt on that is the way i did it but if you think your way is easy go for it ether way once its done it is off tap

[AND189]

ddongbap
LLLO U HAVE A EVO.

LOL @ EVOS. HAHAHAHAHA

Jk. I'm just jealous. =

ha ha as i said it is my dads new toy he seams to get a new one every year nice car though only problem it is full of computers and shit ... nice car but i would not get one :)

[kngrsll]

i didnt unbolt the springs or shocks either. i did one side and then the other with two separate jacks.

[AND189]

i didnt unbolt the springs or shocks either. i did one side and then the other with two separate jacks
Hi five

[AND189]

Ok well i just took my car on dirt road and it is like the back wheels are on ice they are just so taily good fun

[docB]

I can not really comment about a change in toe or camber, seems like they couldn't go too far off given the amount the axel pivot will move. The real deal here is the roll center. A dynamic point that the rear suspension seems to move around. Moving a suspension pivot point like this definitely changes that roll center. That relates to anti squat and has a BFD effect on suspenstion action and overall handling. This change is really several in one shot. Toe, camber (in the rear this also is called anti-squat), and the roll center. Changing the roll center's height will also change the roll axis. This means it changes how the front suspension relates to overall handling. I know you all want learn more about suspension design. Read some books so that you can learn more about this stuff. An author Fred Puhn wrote How to Make Your Car Handle. Lots of good easy to understand info. Most bok stores have it.
doc

I'll try it soon.

[Brentorius]

Any updates on interferences with this mod? It seems to correct the rear alignment after lowering.

I am going to be swapping in new shocks next week and can easily do this while everything is off.

[YarisSedan]

I just learned to adjust my driving to prevent the clunking sound. I looked at my gas tank the other day theres some scratches on either side but cant say for sure that could have been from when i removed my upper tie bar brace.

[advocate]

I say paint the gas tank and look for new scratches after hearing the clunking sound

[fmicle]

I bought a hydraulic jack a couple of weeks back and while I was trying it out I decided to take a look at that. From what I've seen, without taking the springs off though, I believe the axle can't really hit the tank, there seems to be a well designed groove where the axle swivels and it didn't seem to me like it could hit anything under there. Also I've had 2 more adults in the car since I lowered it and I can hear the clunks, but I bet it's just the springs, nothing else...

[lilredrocket]

I believe it is hitting on the exhaust. I will put my car up on a rack this week and see if I can tell where some rubbing has happened.

[YarisSedan]

Well i do know that my tie bar that i had bolted to the gas tank was getting hit hard by the rear beam and put a bit of scratches in it. After removing it the clunking got 95 percent better. But the fact that i heard somethign still i assumed it was something in that area that was getting hit still.

It could be possible it could be the springs fully compressing.

[Brentorius]

I relocated the rear suspension today along with upgrading to Tokico blues.... no issues thus far and will report with rear alignment numbers next week.

[ddongbap]

Some one should get 200 lbs in the rear, and find alignment numbers.

[Brentorius]

I heard some clunking today during a sharp turn at low speeds to the left. The noise seemed to come from the rear drivers side. I am going to look tomorrow to see what it could be hitting...

[mojoyaris]

Just curious. For those of you who are experiencing clunking in the back.

What is your suspension setup?

Lowering springs with stock dampeners
Lowering springs with stiffer dampening
Coilovers w/ two finger width gap from fender well to tire
Coilovers slammed!
Stock ride height....

[YarisSedan]

im running trd springs on stock struts i only get the clunking noise on hard potholes or gonig over speedbumps too fast

[lunjiaow]

i just did this adjustment too. I get clunking noises on every bump i go over with 4 people in the car. My problem is the rear sway bar holder hitting the fuel tank. I am running Whiteline sway bar setup so it is different to UR and TRD swaybars. Will check it out tomorrow to see what i can do about it. Otherwise i will put it back to where it was. But driving i do feel a difference, much smoother when driving in straights, dont hear the wheels scrubbing.

[detroiter]

I used to hear the clunking as well but lately I havn't heard it at all. I'm not really sure what happened but it's non existent now.

[lunjiaow]

Well had a look at the rear swaybar holders. They hit my fuel tank (has scratch marks), so i adjusted them to the sides equally and no more clunking sounds. I have at least 2cm clearance in between beam and fuel tank..

[detroiter]

rear sway bar holders?

[cali yaris]

there are no rear sway bar bushings on the Yaris? :iono:

[Loren]

Look a couple posts up, he has a Whiteline rear bar.

[fmicle]

I started hearing the clunking sounds ever since I installed the new springs (Progress, 1.4" drop) and shocks (Tokico blues). I shortened the bump stops by about half an inch in the back and about 1 inch in the front. Right after the install I took it for a ride and heard the clunks while going over the driveway curb. I thought the coils needed to set in. After that, nothing for more than a month. Then I had 2 adults in the car, one in the front, one in the back and heard the same sounds again a few times. I checked under the car and couldn't see anything bad, no rubbing, no scratching. I don't see how the sway bar could hit anything, since mine (Ultra Racing) is installed right under the axle...
I believe the clunking comes from the fact that my Progress coils are different than the stock ones, the first 3 spirals sit on top of each other so there is more contact between the coils thus, more potential for clunking noise...

[evo165]

I started hearing the clunking sounds ever since I installed the new springs (Progress, 1.4" drop) and shocks (Tokico blues). I shortened the bump stops by about half an inch in the back and about 1 inch in the front. Right after the install I took it for a ride and heard the clunks while going over the driveway curb. I thought the coils needed to set in. After that, nothing for more than a month. Then I had 2 adults in the car, one in the front, one in the back and heard the same sounds again a few times. I checked under the car and couldn't see anything bad, no rubbing, no scratching. I don't see how the sway bar could hit anything, since mine (Ultra Racing) is installed right under the axle...
I believe the clunking comes from the fact that my Progress coils are different than the stock ones, the first 3 spirals sit on top of each other so there is more contact between the coils thus, more potential for clunking noise...

I'll say put it back to the original position (lower pivot point and then problem solved) I put it back on mine and it "comfort' level is back & there is no longer any strange sound fro the rear. :biggrin:

[lunjiaow]

I'll say put it back to the original position (lower pivot point and then problem solved) I put it back on mine and it "comfort' level is back & there is no longer any strange sound fro the rear. :biggrin:

Yep, i too did the same. Would rather not have a hole in my fuel tank =)

[detroiter]

Not sure the clunking could come from hitting the gas tank with the axle. Not sure how a metal axle beam and a plastic gas tank could equal "clunk" if they hit together. Anyone find out something definitive on what the clunk could be? Like I said, when I first did the mod I heard some clunking over big bumps and such, but even know when I run over big bumps, I don't hear it anymore. It ended up going away. Just not sure what could have happened. The car handles too good and feels great to want to put it back to the lower position

[Brentorius]

Today I jacked up the yaris with the rear tires off and did not see any scratches on the gas tank. I did not see any interference issues with the suspension either (at full sag). I then individually compressed each side with another jack and can not see where it would be hitting. I haven't heard any odd noises in a while, but the tein springs are very compressed at static ride height and maybe the noise is the coils? There are about 6 coils touching.

[fmicle]

Yep, that's what I think as well, the noise must come from the coils themselves and not from the axle touching anything. The Toyota engineers who designed this could not have overseen such a simple thing...

If you think about it, by moving the pivot point up, you are actually increasing the distance of the axle from the gas tank, which is above the pivot point. I am personally not worried about any damage with this configuration, but whenever I'll have some time I will jack up the car, remove the springs and the shocks and try to swing the axle all the way to see if it could theoretically hit anywhere, just like Loren suggested a while ago. Until then I'm not losing any sleep over this :smile:

Another thing that crossed my mind: if you think about it, the springs are not compressed between two parallel planes (as they are in the front), but they are compressed between two planes at an angle. I'll try to illustrate this in a drawing below. What I'm trying to say is that if you push the spring straight forward, it's unlikely that the coils will slip or otherwise rub unevenly, but if you compress the spring at a certain angle, you may get some slipping - hence the clunking noise. By moving the axle up that angle will increase considerably, I was actually thinking how come the springs stay in there and don't just snap out :smile:

I have exaggerated the angles in my drawing to make the point, because I believe depending on the drop, moving the pivot point up is just a necessary correction. If the spring drop is less than the distance between the two pivot points, then the angle will be slightly increased (or decreased if you measure it against the vertical).

http://cqr1dw.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pMcU7-jfNARi-8-cxFq0_MHXH2otxXUtoZlfogoEOEMgneokmcz_penAbsY7bUMy2 TSm54_DjhBaQPuRb7NCaru5gmGsNxIwL/Suspension.png

[Brentorius]

When I first relocated the pivot point, I moved the axle through its range of motion to free up the bushings before I installed the shocks. I did not see any problems...

[Loren]

When I first relocated the pivot point, I moved the axle through its range of motion to free up the bushings before I installed the shocks. I did not see any problems...
This is what I suggested that someone do a few weeks ago. Answers the clearance question definitively. If you were able to completely bottom out the suspension without hitting anything, then there is no clearance issue.

[evo165]

Yep, that's what I think as well, the noise must come from the coils themselves and not from the axle touching anything. The Toyota engineers who designed this could not have overseen such a simple thing...

If you think about it, by moving the pivot point up, you are actually increasing the distance of the axle from the gas tank, which is above the pivot point. I am personally not worried about any damage with this configuration, but whenever I'll have some time I will jack up the car, remove the springs and the shocks and try to swing the axle all the way to see if it could theoretically hit anywhere, just like Loren suggested a while ago. Until then I'm not losing any sleep over this :smile:

Another thing that crossed my mind: if you think about it, the springs are not compressed between two parallel planes (as they are in the front), but they are compressed between two planes at an angle. I'll try to illustrate this in a drawing below. What I'm trying to say is that if you push the spring straight forward, it's unlikely that the coils will slip or otherwise rub unevenly, but if you compress the spring at a certain angle, you may get some slipping - hence the clunking noise. By moving the axle up that angle will increase considerably, I was actually thinking how come the springs stay in there and don't just snap out :smile:

I have exaggerated the angles in my drawing to make the point, because I believe depending on the drop, moving the pivot point up is just a necessary correction. If the spring drop is less than the distance between the two pivot points, then the angle will be slightly increased (or decreased if you measure it against the vertical).

http://cqr1dw.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pMcU7-jfNARi-8-cxFq0_MHXH2otxXUtoZlfogoEOEMgneokmcz_penAbsY7bUMy2 TSm54_DjhBaQPuRb7NCaru5gmGsNxIwL/Suspension.png

Bingo on the springs. As i mentioned it on my Tokico structs thread(post number 7). :wink:

http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24722

[detroiter]

So I'm wondering what others opinions are on if you keep the springs tightened up while you have it in the upper bolt position for quite some time, if you decide to lower it back to the lower bolt position will the springs return to their standard stiffness and reaction or will the springs be permanently compressed because of being tightened down for so long from being in the upper position?

In other words, will the springs rate and reaction be ruined because of being compressed for so long? Almost like if you take a slinkee and stretch it out too much, it never returns to it's original state. But this case being the opposite. Being compressed for so long, maybe it won't return to it's normal state?

[docB]

The spring rate is determined by material properties, number of coils, diameter of the coils, diameter of the wire. Some think color makes a giant difference but that is for another post... Moving the beam may cause a slight change in installation height, but the spring rate will remain constant.

[ozmdd]

To answer an earlier question about setup, I am running NF210's on OEM struts/shocks w/ a TRD sway bar. The clunking never went away after several months, but closer inspection seems to indicate that the "clunking" is primarily within the springs themselves (as speculated by several posters), and possibly at the swaybar mount, though that is hard to say since road crap keeps interfering. We have some good weather now, so I'm going to put it through some rough roads and sharp curves later today and immediately lift it and inspect for marks after chalking the supected rub areas.

I'm installing coilovers this week after that test, so its a bit of a moot point, but others may find the info useful.

I AM positive that the axle is free of interference throughout its full range of motion, unlike what I initially thought.

Performance-wise, there is no doubt that this improves turn-in for autocross situations. I was very inpressed with the results at this weekend's event, even on cold tires/concrete.

[fmicle]

The spring rate is determined by material properties, number of coils, diameter of the coils, diameter of the wire. Some think color makes a giant difference but that is for another post... Moving the beam may cause a slight change in installation height, but the spring rate will remain constant.

+1, I don't agree that the springs are more compressed with the axle beam moved up. The are just compressed at a different angle and the forces acting on them are slightly different. It's the weight of the car that compresses the springs, not the position of the axle beam...

[fmicle]

I was going to replace my rear brake lines today, so I had the wheels off and noticed this. I don't know if it has anything to do with this suspension mod, since I'd think this is rather affected by the length of the springs, more than the axle geometry, but I might be wrong. Anyway, it's probably good to keep this in mind. I suspect this happened only a few weeks ago when I took a longer trip with 4 adults in the car, since the damage is not too bad. You may just want to check this from time to time when you happen to be under there.

On the positive side, I saw absolutely no contact with the gas tank and just a very tiny tiny contact point on the exhaust pipe :wink:

Right hand side:
http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p5g8xbJzIFJN_rCzr0r6KFxzVXKrLc7wsdhyHBuKu1TFGJZa er2LprZQ4aiGbtxBulpfwBrHq8FaHVIn81Utjig/IMG_1440.JPG

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pj5_9Z-vMdStiaRf7ff2ws5hXM7ZyR3xySatwRmugJJy1YgJHjTBJMt4Q ygdrvnupv4ymoT4GftgC2wgpaiu23A/IMG_1442.JPG

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pdJ7mErGZ-M6qXc7MlOorZhPNwt0H4WvwCqNMyzDurrmnz85ZhlmoJzFprJ4 _cSy-qT-0psisTjshrid2qTCllw/IMG_1443.JPG

Left hand side:
http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pWhR5eKrc2TZd7QXP2hBsgRC30dCmjf85rVJXlfbpbeTBGkV eagR8VTEtScyemCT21tn5H1oEpwbkXv2BU_ukFQ/IMG_1444.JPG

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1psYmjnNR4r5fCCv4NoELjXxwBhvYm4LHOqjNhGHRIWfAHEUY 8Hk9WKXZh578HpyjrOCasTiYGIZGvnJjOFTaLTQ/IMG_1446.JPG

[detroiter]

I never noticed that under there, which line is that?

[Loren]

Brake line!

Doesn't look like enough contact to be a problem, especially if it only happens with 4 people in the car, but it warrants further attention. I'll give my car a close look next time I'm under there. (it's in the stock axle configuration with lowering springs... but it's not super-low, and the springs are really stiff, so I suspect I won't see any rubbing on mine)

[fmicle]

^ What springs do you have Loren? I have the Progress, I think they have a 1.4" drop, both front and back.

I was thinking about gluing some rubber piece, like a bump stop or something to the frame, to prevent the axle from traveling all the way, what do you think, could that work?

[Loren]

I have non-standard springs that were never intended to be on a Yaris. :) Leftovers from my Miata.

Yeah, some sort of bump stop would help. There should be a factory bump stop. Usually fitted around the shaft of the shock. You might check to see if yours are still there and that they weren't cut during the spring install. In any case, you could replace them with a longer bump stop. Progress makes a variety of them, but I don't have any more detail than that.

[fmicle]

Well, I did the install myself and if I remember correctly, the rear bump stops were not too long to begin with. I still cut a little bit, I'd say maybe one third of the original length. Here are the leftover pieces:

http://cqr1dw.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p2FEezVxtW5624FM9AQ5ak6RO2GnshdwsWnCHQndBhZSGvOU-jVox9wz8vN4yQaqCPk7BtEW3So-OebGjd42qfBbOHulBLFw4/IMG_0973.jpg

These might have just enough thickness to prevent that little bit of scraping and rubbing of the line on the frame. I could probably glue them back on if only I could find them... I think I kept them though... :)

[docB]

Anyone see how the car reacts under extreme braking before and after with this modification? Does the anti-lock kick in more?

[ozmdd]

No change in braking response that I can detect, and I have done several track day and autox's, so I've tested under pretty drastic braking. :smile:

I don't have ABS, so can't help you there.

[Maitre_Te_Te]

My rear suspension mod progress!!!! :)

[Lil Abner]

BUMP!

Has anyone had any long-term experience with this? The thread seemed to have died off before any long-term experience was given.

[cali yaris]

No problems here, been a year now I think?

If you ever did have a problem you can put it back.

[Lil Abner]

Cool, thanks! Just wanted to get some more feedback before I try it.

[mrbond]

Wow, I can't believe I've never seen this before!
I just did this yesterday - took me an hour and a half. Removing the bolts and raising the rear suspension beam was the easy part, as long as the springs were removed and the struts were unbolted from the shock tower. The hard and annoying part was getting the bolt to line up in its new hole.
Impression: the car feels more squat during acceleration, and there's less body pitch noticeable during acceleration. In the corners, the handling is much more predictable and assuring. If any of you have lowered your cars, do this! It's free (the best kind of mod), and it makes a noticeable difference.

[Lil Abner]

Yeah, but a word of caution, I'm lowered on DF210's, and I'm having issues with hitting in the rear. The brackets that hold the brake lines are hitting the frame on small bumps. I already cut the welds off and moved the brackets, but I'm still hitting on something on larger bumps. Next week I'll put it back on my lift and see what else needs to be moved.

[mrbond]

You're still using stock shocks though, correct? I have the tokico blues and DF210's, and I haven't had any issue with the torsion bar or anything attached to it hitting the frame. This mod is probably best suited for those with upgraded shocks, but it'll work either way.

[Lil Abner]

Yeah, stock shocks. But for some reason the rear of my car is also sitting lower than other DF210 installs. I also live in Michigan, were the roads are very un-friendly.

[mrbond]

If they're anything like Chicago roads, I sympathize.

[Lil Abner]

Yeah, they are like Chicago roads. Not as bad as the ones I had to deal with in Detroit.

[mazilla]

Yeah, stock shocks. But for some reason the rear of my car is also sitting lower than other DF210 installs. I also live in Michigan, were the roads are very un-friendly.

I was having your same problem last week after doing this mod. How many miles on your stock shocks? My rears were dead, so I bought a new set off Ebay(33.00 each) and the problem is gone. I has three people in the car the other day, no rubbing. Of course tires/wheels/etc are a factor...

[Lil Abner]

The car has about 43,000 miles on it. I've only had the springs on for maybe 5,000 miles. I'd hope the rear shocks aren't dead that quick!!!

[mazilla]

The car has about 43,000 miles on it. I've only had the springs on for maybe 5,000 miles. I'd hope the rear shocks aren't dead that quick!!!

Easiet way to tell is just to pull one and test it out, takes about 15 minutes and it may solve your problem. I had no way of knowing how many miles were on my shocks, but I imagine it was much more than 40ish.

(I have df210's as well)

[TickleTimeTim]

so i wanna try this in the next week, running tigertecs and stock shocks. good or bad idea?

[why?]

try it and see what happens, it sounds like it isn't that hard to undo if you don't like the result. I'd suggest grabbing aftermarket shocks though too.

[Autocross72]

Tomorrow I am moving the Opel GT to the shed so I can have room in the garage to install the coil-oversvon my Yaris. While I am at it I am going to relocate the axle to the upper pivot point. I am going to look at detouring the brake lines so they don't hit/rub on the frame. I'll also check to make sure the exhaust is out of the way. Thanks for all the tips in this forum

What I am really wondering is what the effect of raising the roll center is, which was brought up by DocB a few posts up. He didn't really explain what the effect is, or if it is a good or bad thing in the case of am lowered Yaris.

[Lil Abner]

Actually, it's not the roll center that is changed. The roll center only applies to an independent suspension like we have in the front of the car. Talking to some suspension guys, they said it helps bring the rear specs back to factory, as well as the squatting characteristics during acceleration and braking.

I'm not having a problem with my exhaust, but I'm hearing something else hitting back there still. I haven't had time to put it back on the lift to see. I'm pretty sure the exhaust is clear of everything. The brake line brackets will probably need to be moved. I just cut the welds off, and rotated the bracket towards the inside of the car, then re-welded. You could also use some big band clamps. I'll be waiting to see what you come up with if you find other things that might hit!

[Autocross72]

I have the springs and shocks removed and the axle in the upper mounts. I used a floor jack to raise the axle as high as I could without letting the jack hit the fuel pump. The bracket for the brake lines is pretty close to the frame. Maybe that is what is hitting for some people. I took a bunch of pictures, but apparently I can't upload them from my iPad. I'll send them from my computer tomorrow.

I took the advice and cut the beakers off the top of the axle and welded them to the side of the axle. Now there is muCh more clearance.

[importfantasy]

hi everyone. just a heads up I did this little trick on my 07 LB lowered on df210s and everything worked out fine. I just bought a new 2010 LB, lowered it and went to change the pivot point but ran into a problem. removed the bolt, moved the bushing up to 2nd hole, put bolt back in but IT WOULDNT THREAD! after further inspection the inner hole has nothing to thread into, just a hole. maybe they removed this on the 2010+ I dont know. my car is USDM spec 3 door. something to keep in mind for you brand new yari owners

[marcus]

this is interesting......

[Lil Abner]

hi everyone. just a heads up I did this little trick on my 07 LB lowered on df210s and everything worked out fine. I just bought a new 2010 LB, lowered it and went to change the pivot point but ran into a problem. removed the bolt, moved the bushing up to 2nd hole, put bolt back in but IT WOULDNT THREAD! after further inspection the inner hole has nothing to thread into, just a hole. maybe they removed this on the 2010+ I dont know. my car is USDM spec 3 door. something to keep in mind for you brand new yari owners

Hmm. My 2009 had thread, but it was slightly rusty. An impact wrench got mine in. Are you 100% positive there are no threads? Did you try putting the bolt in there without the suspension in the way?

[Autocross72]

I still haven't had time to put the rear shocks and springs in, so today I decided to push the rear axle up by hand until it hit something. Guess what it hit! The gas tank!!!! For some reason there part of the tank flares out at the top right over the axle. That is the part that the axle hits. Here is a picture of the scuff mark the axle made on the tank just by me pushing it up by hand.

[Lil Abner]

What part of the axle hit that? The beam that connects both sides? I'm hoping to get mine on the lift tomorrow to see what I'm hitting...

[Autocross72]

Here is a picture of the empty spring perches when the axle is touching the gas tank. The tape measure shows 6 inches, so if your springs and shocks can allow your axle to compress this far, you NEED bump stops!

[Autocross72]

Here is what the wheels/tires look like when the axle is touching the gas tank. These are 17" wheels with 205/50 tires. It looks sweet, but, something tells me that driving with the rear axle hitting the gas tank could be hazardous to your health!

My car is a 2008 3 door by the way

[Lil Abner]

The tank hits with the wheels only that far up?? Hmm. My rear tires are that "tucked" just sitting in the garage...

[Autocross72]

Yes, it was the beam that spans the middle. I looked carefully around the ends, and everything looked clear there.

[Lil Abner]

Well, I guess I'll do what you did in the photos with mine and see what's what. I'll try to post photos tomorrow night.

[Autocross72]

Cool! I'll be interested to see what you find.

[derickveliz2]

Subscribed!

[importfantasy]

Hmm. My 2009 had thread, but it was slightly rusty. An impact wrench got mine in. Are you 100% positive there are no threads? Did you try putting the bolt in there without the suspension in the way?

yes there are no threads. this is a pic of the inner hole.

[Lil Abner]

yes there are no threads. this is a pic of the inner hole.

That's strange there is no thread in there!! Must have been part of cost cutting.

[Lil Abner]

I also see marks where mine is hitting the gas tank. I put green tape over the marks for the pictures so it's easy to see where they are.
http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=642&pictureid=4283

http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=642&pictureid=4284

Passenger Side:
http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=642&pictureid=4285

Driver Side:
http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=642&pictureid=4286

This is the lowest point for me. I measured 11.25" center of wheel to the fender.
http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=642&pictureid=4287

My problem is, my rear sits at 12.5" So that 1.25" of travel seems easy for me to hit. I might have to install some bump stops...

[Autocross72]

Last night I was looking around and found that summitracing.com has several styles of cheap bump stops available. With just a bit of fabrication, the should work fine. My first priority, though, is to get my coil-overs installed so I can get the car back on t he road though. My Dodge 2500 cummins is beast, but is a bit expensive to use as a daily driver!

[Jason@SportsCar]

http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm6.jpg
http://www.jasonlabar.com/yarisforums/arm8.jpg


This does not look good to me... Moving the front of the axle up puts the lower rear spring perch at a bad angle. You now have a lot of side loading on the spring. :frown:

On top of that the axle hits the gas tank? :eek:

Either of the first two would stop me from doing this mod... But the bigger reason not to (for me) is there are almost no SCCA classes (until you get up to Mod - no, not Steet Mod - I'm talking full tube-frame Mod classes) that allow suspension pick up points to be moved. If you want to change the toe, install the shims. :iono:

[Autocross72]

For me the SCCA rules don't really matter since I have a Street Mod2 1972 240Z (thus the username/email). I'm just trying to make my daily driver fun to drive.

I do agree that the springs seem to have an awful lot of side load, which doesn't seem good.

I don't think raising the pivot point is the CAUSE of the axle hitting the gas tank. That would be due to ride height & supnsion travel. The axle would still hit the gas tank if the lower pivot is used if the ridevheight is too low, or the suspension compresses too much.

[Lil Abner]

Well, the stock suspension already puts the spring perch at a bad angle. Moving the axle position up just puts it back to factory.

But yeah, the downside seems that it's hitting the gas tank. With the the axle in the stock position, it will NOT hit the gas tank. It only hits due to the axle being higher. The spot it hits on the gas tank isn't the side of the tank, but the TOP flange.

[dobbiedoo]

What about adding a 3rd hole between the 2 stock holes?

[miketejero]

This has got to be the most "eye-opening" thread I've read so far. I'll look under my car about this. Thanks guys.

[YarisSedan]

So I work at a new shop now that has a hunter laser alignment machine and put my car on it and checked the spec for the rear alignment after doing this mod. Surprisingly all my rear specs for caster camber and toe were all within green and very close to perfect. Its been awile since I had an alignment and my mods in the back are trd springs swaybar and this rear mod. So apparently shifting it does correct alignment issues from lowering the car.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

So I work at a new shop now that has a hunter laser alignment machine and put my car on it and checked the spec for the rear alignment after doing this mod. Surprisingly all my rear specs for caster camber and toe were all within green and very close to perfect. Its been awile since I had an alignment and my mods in the back are trd springs swaybar and this rear mod. So apparently shifting it does correct alignment issues from lowering the car.

Does the rear axle hit your rear lower tie bar? I want to re-try this "mod", but I'm pretty low on S.Tech's, and I don't want the axle hitting my rear lower tie bar.

[marcus]

Should be more worried hitting your gas tank... So I've heard.

[YarisSedan]

Ive taken my rear lower tie bar few days after doing this mod due to it hitting it on bumps.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Should be more worried hitting your gas tank... So I've heard.

hahaha, yeah, I was just wondering if it was touching/hitting the tie bar, since it was, then for sure it would be hitting the gas tank. Looks like I won't be re-trying this "mod" again.

[YarisSedan]

Ive only hit my gas tank maybe twice and only on a really huge bump with the car really loaded when i had my factory shocks. Once switching to tokikos i havent had issues since.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Ive only hit my gas tank maybe twice and only on a really huge bump with the car really loaded when i had my factory shocks. Once switching to tokikos i havent had issues since.

Are you on the Blues or Reds? Also, I'm lower than you and only on TRD shocks, so it's not as dampened as yours =\

[my2sense]

Sorry to revive a 10 month old thread but I just got a Yaris LB with M2 lowering springs and am interested to see if anyone can provide any long-term update on this mod.

1) Any solution to the rubbing talked about in this thread?
2) Are you using aftermarket struts/shocks?

Thanks

[Lil Abner]

I've been running this mod for over a year with well over 40,000 miles of Michigan roads. I have stock shocks and DF210 springs. The rear springs have rubber inserts to stiffen the back up. The inserts fixed the rubbing of the suspension member on the fuel tank. Also, when I took the car in for an alignment, there were no changes that needed to be made.

[Autocross72]

I moved mine back to the stock holes until I could get some bump stops. Then I started autocrossing the car and I really like how the car handles as is, so I decided to leave it. It enters the corners very predictably and if I trail brake int the corner I can get the rear to rotate for me. When the rear rotates, it is so controlled and predictable that I didn't want to take the chance of messing that up. By the way I have a 2008 3door LB with Megan Racing coil-overs, UltraRacing rear brace, and A rear swaybar that I think is 22 mm. For racing I turn the rear dampers all the wy up.

[why?]

so for those who have had problems, are your running a full interior or have you removed any rear interior pieces?

[Autocross72]

I am running stock interior, including spare tire.

[yaris 2sz]

i think that the upper holes are for the 4wd version

[sheekeebut]

Wait, what? AWD? Which country?