Prepparing a Yaris for FSP (Solo 2)

[Russelt3hPirate]

Is any one prepped (properly) for SCCA Solo2 Autox Class FSP?

My good friend is running his xA in FSP and doing very well.

Obviously there isn't much to be had with power, but Intake and Exhaust will help.

so I'm looking at the following

Wheels
R-comps
Springs
Struts (adjustable)
Strut Tower Bars
Anti Sway Bars

looking for Ideas, opinions, specific brands/parts ect.

I currently Autox a BSP Prepped STi, and my girlfried will be campaigning the yaris. :)

[eclip5e]

Are you sure you want to do FSP and not STS?

[Katana]

What's that event?

[Russelt3hPirate]

Are you sure you want to do FSP and not STS?

yes, after running V710s on my STi I refuse to autox on street rubber ever again.

and this is only locally, not national. I doubt the Yaris would be competitive nationally in FSP.

are you the eclip5e on Nasioc? if so I'm WRX8XB on nasioc ;)

[Russelt3hPirate]

What's that event?

Autox, here is a video of my friend autoxing his xA.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3095951279215993215 :headbang:

[Chris07LB]

Autox, here is a video of my friend autoxing his xA.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3095951279215993215 :headbang:

Damn that looks like some fun! :thumbup:

[Russelt3hPirate]

Damn that looks like some fun! :thumbup:

it's addiciting.

I can't wait to have the Yaris prepped for FSP and beating up on some Datsun 510s :)

[Chris07LB]

it's addiciting.

I can't wait to have the Yaris prepped for FSP and beating up on some Datsun 510s :)

Is there a way to find out where events are held in New Jersey?

[Russelt3hPirate]

I can ask some of the NJ subaru guys.

[kngrsll]

ill autox mine sometime. i havent decided on a set up yet, i think im gonna wait for koni to release something, but if not, ill probably just get the TRD shocks and springs, an intake and exaust, and some sticky street rubber and run STS for a bit. if i really get the bug again (i ran DSP in a 240, won the class and took second in 3 years) ill throw some sticky rubber on it and get some more mods. my heart is really in track racing so i'll probably stick to that mostly. they are two very different beasts but with a light set up, ill be able to run both comfortably, but probably not be too competitve in autox. you really need to hone a good set up to be fast, even if you have good skill.

[Russelt3hPirate]

I believe properly prepped the Yaris could do well in FSP.

I don't think it'd do very well in STS against the old Civic Hatchbacks.

[kngrsll]

yeah, your right, but im not gonna set this car up for a class like i did the 240. i probably will do what i listed before: springs, shocks, exhaust, and an intake. i may do a few other small things (brake pads and the like) but not much more. i would get a rear sway bar if someone makes it, and another set of wheels with some R compounds if i start tracking it. then, if i do go to an autox, ill run it in street prepared. man, a full tilt set up though would be preeetty sweet! i'd love to see someone do it! its all about your goals and how you are going to use your car. it's nice to do taht before buying anything so you dont waste your money. i want to keep the car very streetable, but push it toward the sporty side, lol. when i finish school, ill buy a sports car (or a kart) for my hardcore racing, but i just wanna keep this my daily driver. what is nice about setting up your car for an autox class is that it keeps the car fairly balanced and limits what you can buy so you don't blow your budget!

[kngrsll]

oh yea, i forgot, so your planning on fitting your car to the street prepared rule class then? i would look into a diff, that would help alot. i know cusco makes one and its available now. while your at it, you should change the clutch and flywheel while the tranny is off. as for suspension, cusco again makes some things, but id wait to see if koni is going to make anything for it. then get some wheels, R-compounds, and it'll be 3 wheeling all day, lol...

[Russelt3hPirate]

As much as I'm against planning before the car is in the driveway, I've already partially planned out the car.

I doubt the car will get a diff put in it until later in it's life.

The beauty of FSP is the restrictions, but I plan on keeping the stock steering wheel and seats simply b/c it is a daily driver and not a track car like my STi.

Of course Pads, rotors, lines, all the fun consumables will be upgraded.

I have a feeling there wont be alot of autox nuts in this camp but the few of us that will be, will be kicking some ass! :)

Not sure this will be prepped for anything but Autox, it's a little short on power for the track.

[kngrsll]

yeah, that certainly true... any track time will be strictly about maintaining momentum, lol! you know, it actually takes alot more skill to pilot a car around with low power b/c it forces you to really watch your braking points and apex's rather than using brute force to wring the car around. its fun though... Russell, look for a thread about tracking the yaris, there is a guy who has already done it. he had some r compounds, springs, and an exhaust, thats it. he did really well and took pics.

anyways, it sounds like your already on the right path... even if its not just an autox car, sticking to SP is nice for simply the restrictions of it. keep us updated on anything you do to the yaris and any racing that happens and ill do the same.

and give us some info on the STi!!

[Russelt3hPirate]

yeah, that certainly true... any track time will be strictly about maintaining momentum, lol! you know, it actually takes alot more skill to pilot a car around with low power b/c it forces you to really watch your braking points and apex's rather than using brute force to wring the car around. its fun though... Russell, look for a thread about tracking the yaris, there is a guy who has already done it. he had some r compounds, springs, and an exhaust, thats it. he did really well and took pics.

anyways, it sounds like your already on the right path... even if its not just an autox car, sticking to SP is nice for simply the restrictions of it. keep us updated on anything you do to the yaris and any racing that happens and ill do the same.

and give us some info on the STi!!


yea the brakes are useless! haha (on the yaris, as in there is no point in using them you're not going fast enough to out drive the R-comps :) ).

I'll start a thread in the gallery of my STi.

[eclip5e]

yes, after running V710s on my STi I refuse to autox on street rubber ever again.

and this is only locally, not national. I doubt the Yaris would be competitive nationally in FSP.

are you the eclip5e on Nasioc? if so I'm WRX8XB on nasioc ;)

that would be me!

[Russelt3hPirate]

that would be me!


haha, awesome! what are you doing here?

[eclip5e]

haha, awesome! what are you doing here?

Trying to convince Yaris drivers that the platform is a solid contender as a race platform in the <2.0l engine demographic.

[Russelt3hPirate]

Trying to convince Yaris drivers that the platform is a solid contender as a race platform in the <2.0l engine demographic.

sweet me too! too bad they aren't 5x114.3 or we could test some 17x10's and 275s :)

[eTiMaGo]

how in the world would 10" wheels fit on a yaris??? :biggrin: And with such a light car, would there be enough weight on the wheels to maintain a good grip?

[03Z33]

It's doable with some pulling of the fenders, or an overfender... but I'm not sure they are needed :laugh:

For autocross duty, I'd be all over a set of 13x9 Watanabes or Panasports with some sticky Avons or Hoosier A3S06's!

[eTiMaGo]

Hmm yeah with a wide body kit it could be physically done.

But what I am worried about is the downside of using really wide wheels? Isn't there a point at which the weight of the car is just not enough to ensure maximum grip on the tires?

[the_saint]

Depending on the offset you might not need a widebody kit. I have seen a 9" wide wheel on a stock fendered Yaris/Vitz.

[eclip5e]

Hmm yeah with a wide body kit it could be physically done.

But what I am worried about is the downside of using really wide wheels? Isn't there a point at which the weight of the car is just not enough to ensure maximum grip on the tires?

Any non-spec size wheel will accelerate the speed at which your wheel bearings are worn, especially non-spec offset.

As for power/weight ratios, this could be a problem, but more importantly, there is a point where adding wheel/tire width no longer adds to grip levels, and only adds weight.

[Russelt3hPirate]

i was joking about the 10" wheels.

contact patch doesn't increase with tire width or wheel width, it's dependent on vehicle weight.

lateral grip will increase b/c the contact patch is now "wider" but the contact patch area isn't larger.

I dont think it'd make much sense to have more than an 8" wheel but i'm pretty sure a 15x7 will do the car plenty justice :)

[the_saint]

I'm not trying to argue anything about "wider is better"...but wouldn't a wider tire=larger contact patch area? I mean from a purely mathematical stand point.

[Russelt3hPirate]

I'm not trying to argue anything about "wider is better"...but wouldn't a wider tire=larger contact patch area? I mean from a purely mathematical stand point.

nope, contact pacth area is dependent on weight

contact patch shape is dependent on wheel and tire width

[03Z33]

I'm just going by what I see at the higher levels of "cone dodging" (autocross). You normally see the faster cars running aggressive wide tires, with very sticky compounds (slicks or DOT R's like A3S06, etc..)

There is a balance you need to achieve between the wheel width, tire width, and weight of the car. Most times, a narrower stickier tire will yield superior results to a wider tire that isn't making good use of its full contact area (and additional weight). The best way to find these things out is to go out with a tire pyrometer or some chalk and try out different setups, pressures, etc...

[Russelt3hPirate]

Most times, a narrower stickier tire will yield superior results to a wider tire that isn't making good use of its full contact area (and additional weight).

now, i understand you like narrow tires ;)

anyway I know from personal experience that a 275 on an 8" wheel is faster around an autox couse than a 245 on an 8" wheel. (same rolling diameter too btw).

when limited by wheel size it is most beneficial to run the widest tire possible simply for the lateral grip

when limited by rubbing or fenders or anything else, it is beneficial to run the widest tire possible simply for the lateral grip

turn in and some response is sacrificed but the increase in lateral grip is worth it when you're looking at the times at the end of the day.

I plan on having a set of 15x7s for autox with some 225s, which is similar to what my buddy runs on his xA. Might actually just steal his wheels for a day. ;)

The Yaris will be a fun toy, i'm excited :)

[03Z33]

See, I totally agree with the above and have first hand experience to back it up. :smile:

I ran stock size 245/40/18 tires (Yokohama AVS Sport) on the stock 350Z wheels which are 18x8 for a few track events. Then I came up on some chep AVS Sports in 275/35/18 (almost same OD, just wider) and they looked pretty funny bulged out on a 8" rim but they worked suprisingly well! My tire guys hated having to mount these even more then some of my strethed tires :smile:

I should have my 16x8's mounted today or tomorrow, I'll report back on the fittment. I really think 13-15" would be best for autocross, anywhere form 7-9" wide should fit (depending on offset and tire size) and you may benefit from narrower to save some weight.

[Russelt3hPirate]

what wheels are you getting? offset?

[03Z33]

This set is just for looks :wink: 16x8 +15 rear and +25 front (deep dish)

[Russelt3hPirate]

This set is just for looks :wink: 16x8 +15 rear and +25 front (deep dish)

and 185s :(

is there a reason you're increasing your rear track greater than the front?

have you looked into the adverse effects of changing the vehicles scrub radius? especially on a FWD car.

my friend has some 15x7 +22mm Team Dynamics that we will be testing out.

[the_saint]

....is there a reason you're increasing your rear track greater than the rear?

have you looked into the adverse effects of changing the vehicles scrub radius? especially on a FWD car.

This set is just for looks :wink: 16x8 +15 rear and +25 front (deep dish)



one character

[Russelt3hPirate]

one character

??

[the_saint]

You need at least one character to make a new post...and quotes don't count.

[Russelt3hPirate]

You need at least one character to make a new post...and quotes don't count.

I was asking what point you were making.

I can read, I know what he said, i know what i said.

but what point are you trying to make?

[the_saint]

He clearly stated that he was doing it for looks. To which you reply with a question about why he want's to increase the rear track....wait a minute...you asked him why he wants to increase his rear track greater than the rear. What are you asking?

at any rate, he's doing it for looks. If he wants to run a 10" wheel with 0 offset, so be it. He's doing it for looks.
Not everybody wants to be a Johnny-go-go-speedracer.

[Russelt3hPirate]

He clearly stated that he was doing it for looks. To which you reply with a question about why he want's to increase the rear track....wait a minute...you asked him why he wants to increase his rear track greater than the rear. What are you asking?

at any rate, he's doing it for looks. If he wants to run a 10" wheel with 0 offset, so be it. He's doing it for looks.
Not everybody wants to be a Johnny-go-go-speedracer.


you sound hostile.

it was a simple question, who cares if it is just for looks, you still want it to drive straight, and i'm pretty sure he'll go full throttle from time to time, and take a couple corners above the posted reccomeneded speed.

and yes it was a typo on my part, I was asking why he was increase the rear track greater than he was increasing the front. I'll edit the original post, so not to confuse anyone further.

[the_saint]

Nope, no hostility.

I guess my point out of the whole deal is that it sounds like it's purely asthetical and he probably is not concerened with performance.

[Russelt3hPirate]

Nope, no hostility.

I guess my point out of the whole deal is that it sounds like it's purely asthetical and he probably is not concerened with performance.

even aesthetically pleasing mods shouldn't have adverse effects. at least IMHO.

[kngrsll]

even aesthetically pleasing mods shouldn't have adverse effects. at least IMHO.

i agree with that. anyone see the sport compact car article with the two 350Z's on the cover? one was done by a guy with track events in mind and the other was a w00t street racer guy and had all the name brand bling on his. well the thought out sorted track car just destroyed the other.

[03Z33]

i agree with that. anyone see the sport compact car article with the two 350Z's on the cover? one was done by a guy with track events in mind and the other was a w00t street racer guy and had all the name brand bling on his. well the thought out sorted track car just destroyed the other.

I never read the article, but I was at the track that day and those cars where both crap! I know the owner of the "FI" car which also happened to have crap aligment, 400 lbs. of stero stuff, and crap tires IIRC. Those guys are the most useless magazine writers, and I can only imagine how crappy that article reads. We where at Horse Thief that day (right above the streets course) and we had 4 Z's at the event (including mine). My Z is mostly my track toy at this point, I rarely drive it on the street, but I still like to run stylish wheels, which includes running wheels with negative offset, huge lips and stretched tires. I haven't found any downsides to running these on the car so far, I'm sure the wheel bearings may wear early, but I change those once a year anyway as preventative maintenance. I actually really like the feel of the wider track, it gives the car a lot more stability.


Regarding your autocross setup, I wouldn't recommend the 15x7 +22's they'll stick out too far and you won't be able to run a decent sized tire. You want to try and stay in the +30 or higher offset range if you plan to run a 205 or wider tire without major rubbing. My track wheels right now are 15x7 +35 and they fit nice and flush with 195/55/15 Bridgestone RE55S (r-compounds) this tire is know to run wide, and I also increased my front camber to max (-2 deg) by purchasing the thinnest camber bolts from Toyota (12.4mm vs. 15mm stock) for both mounting holes, and set the strut to max neg. camber on both sides. Toe is set at 0.

I have more than 5 sets of wheels for the Yaris already, I like trying out different setups, and the style wheels are just that, for style. The look I'm after is a deep dish, and to achieve that it's necessary to go with a lower offset. I didn't want to compromise the front too much, so I stayed with a somewhat conservative offset and ~3" lip. On the rear I'll have almost 4" lip and peformance shouldn't be adversely affected noticably, but I'll make sure to give my honest oppinion if I find out otherwise.

[kngrsll]

i think im going to get a set of 16x7's and run a 205/50/16 azenis on it. ill pick up a set of 15's with R compounds for track when i start going. at least there are alot of choices when it comes to that size tire.

[Russelt3hPirate]

the only reason i have no issue trying the +22mm's is they will be free to use/borrow for a test run.

last thing i would do is buy wheels w/o testing something as a gauge.

[Russelt3hPirate]

well, drove home the new yaris yesterday.

tests fits should start soon, prepping shortly there after.

anyone know of seatbrackets for the yaris/vitz?

[the_saint]

anyone know of seatbrackets for the yaris/vitz?
TRD brackets (http://trdparts.jp/english/parts_seat.html)Don't know where to get them, but at least it gives a part#

[Russelt3hPirate]

I'll have no issue sourcing JDM Toyota parts, thank you for the part #!!

now just to find out if recaros will bolt to them :)

[platypus]

I'll have no issue sourcing JDM Toyota parts, thank you for the part #!!

now just to find out if recaros will bolt to them :)

keep us posted. better/stickier tires and better seating are the two mods high on my list.

[Black Yaris]

not to ruin everyones fun, but why is everyone runny such skinny tires? 185, 195, 205? I went up to a 225-50-15 with no problems 15x7 +38 wheel, this thing corners like a go-kart

[03Z33]

Bride also have a part number for the NCP91 Vitz/Yaris, sorry I don't have it available but you can order it from most Japan dealers or Tees USA the Bride importer can bring it in for you. Most of the Bride brackets will fit Recaro buckets also.

The JDM TRD brackets for the JDM TRD-Recaros will probably only fit the narrowest of bucket seats. The link above is only for a bottom mount which only works with the reclineable TRD sport seat.

Here's a link to the TRD buckets:

http://trdparts.jp/parts_trd-recaro.html

VERY PIMP!!! to bad my fat ass will never fit them :(

[spkrman]

yep, I have yet to find a racing seat i'm 100% comfy in.

[platypus]

as a total lardass, I can wholly recommend the Sparco Evo3 (which you can get from Subesports). Now what brackets would make it work in a yaris...

[Russelt3hPirate]

since the sparco evo3 is a sidemount you'd just need a base and then a set of side mounts that work.

I'll be looking into the bride stuff too.

[platypus]

not to ruin everyones fun, but why is everyone runny such skinny tires? 185, 195, 205? I went up to a 225-50-15 with no problems 15x7 +38 wheel, this thing corners like a go-kart

you put 225's on a 7" rim? Do you run low pressures to get the tread to lie flat on the track? It seems to me (being the veteran bench racer that I am) that a 225 is a bit wide to put on a 7" rim unless you're going for a bit of roundness in the tread (which can help with a more progressive breakaway).

[Th3 Hatch]

Drew runs a 275 on an 8" wheel for autox on the STi.

now that I've got russell it's time to start prepping for FSP.

suspension, wheels, another set of wheels w/ r-comps, and seats.

[Russelt3hPirate]

we test fit the 15x7 +23mm and 205/55 15s from my buddies xA last night.

got some photos, it pokes just a little too much for my taste.

although with some more camber it might be ok.

I love how the yaris has ZERO fender lip!

once we get the car on it's suspension then we'll be test fitting again and ordering up some street wheels for Russell :D

[Go4th]

:thumbup:

[Russelt3hPirate]

the car is lowerd, and we're going to test fit the 15s again.

we've decided on street wheels but the wait is about to start to get them :)

[FlintArrow]

Whats with the current trend of taking the factory offset and dividing it by 2?

A Yaris with ET22 wheels will only corner better if the result allows for a 10+ inch wide wheel and extremely wide tires. If your running 205-225's there is no need for a wheel wider than 8" and for that you definitely dont need a wheel pushed out to the fenders. All that much offset is going to do is wear out CV's, lose drivetrain power, make it handle quirky, and probably bang up your fenders. You might win some low-rider contests though.

At slow speeds wheels with improper offsets and funky alignment settings may make a vehicle feel likes it cornering better but it may just be a sensation. There is quite alot of engineering that goes into factory suspension settings despite the "wider is better" slogan coined by Pontiac (since when have you seen a Pontiac Grand Am murder a slalom?).

A Yaris in FSP would be very fun. You would have a blast at local matches but at nationals I doubt the 1nz and solid beam rear are going to win many trophies. Still, while its fun to be competitive it is not a necessity. I have had some of the most fun sliding around turning slow times than pulling fast times in my 2000 MR-S.

Sorry to sound like a party-pooper :frown: . I say auto-x the wheels off it! Get us some video footage while your there. :thumbsup:

Its just nice to hear of couples racing and having fun together.

[KS SOLO]

I drove in the 2004 SCCA SOLO Nationals in FSP, we had some mechanical issues and did not do well that year. (yes i am blaming the car ;) ) I was the tire warmer in an 87 Renault GTA. I think the Yaris could do well, but that level of cars are really prepped. My guess is that locally you would do well in H Stock against the Mini's, or STS if you want to add springs, etc. Ordering my car tomorrow and getting the TRD shocks and springs, sway bar, etc and will probably solo in STS locally.

[NepsGD3]

Is any one prepped (properly) for SCCA Solo2 Autox Class FSP?

My good friend is running his xA in FSP and doing very well.

Obviously there isn't much to be had with power, but Intake and Exhaust will help.

so I'm looking at the following

Wheels
R-comps
Springs
Struts (adjustable)
Strut Tower Bars
Anti Sway Bars

looking for Ideas, opinions, specific brands/parts ect.

I currently Autox a BSP Prepped STi, and my girlfried will be campaigning the yaris. :)

hey what color is your freinds XA...is it the white one with bronze rims...i have talked to a guy at the Equipe Rapide events that runs a XA in FSP ( most likley the same guy)...he looks real good out there

[Russelt3hPirate]

yeah he's good.

He's on the boards here.

a little update on the car.

we've got SilkRoad Coils and some 15x7 RE30s.

now we just need to see how russell does at the autox :)

[anonymous user]

I've been giving this some thought, currently driving a subaru in Street modified.
My main deterrent in FSP with the yaris is POWER. I don't know if the intake manifold is legal in that class if it ever makes production. Also, my region has two people running in FSP. An accord and a BMW. Both cars (well both drivers) are fast as hell. To be competetive with them i think requires some more power. I don't think handling is this cars downfall as much as it's lack of torque or horsepower.

[HTM Yaris]

The Yaris does lack power . A helical LSD in a Yaris would make it a giant killer .

Here are both of my Yari at the Autox

http://s208.photobucket.com/albums/bb133/HTMyaris/?action=view&current=MyMovie1-2.flv

http://s208.photobucket.com/albums/bb133/HTMyaris/?action=view&current=YarisIX.flv

[anonymous user]

The Yaris does lack power . A helical LSD in a Yaris would make it a giant killer .

Here are both of my Yari at the Autox

http://s208.photobucket.com/albums/bb133/HTMyaris/?action=view&current=MyMovie1-2.flv

http://s208.photobucket.com/albums/bb133/HTMyaris/?action=view&current=YarisIX.flv

Excellent! Do you mind if i PM you so as not to derail the O.P. thread?

[HTM Yaris]

I don't mind if you PM me .....

[WolfWings]

Yeah, I was working towards prepping my Yaris for FSP, decided not to bother though it was a blast the few times I went and did it. Enough low-end torque to avoid shifting in and out of 2nd constantly will save your transmission if you can afford to build that route.

[mojoyaris]

I haven't been able to read the whole forum, but if you run the V710's or wider Hoosiers on 13 x 8's you'll get better gearing in the car and lighter rims. My Lenso's are under 9lbs each and Second gear is much better than running on 15's. It helps with the tighter 2nd gear turns.

I ran at the Porsche Club event last weekend and had a blast on old V710's (rubber was a bit hard), but it did relatively well PCA March 30 event (http://members.shaw.ca/rsandor/2009_march_29th_pca_toptimes.txt)
Alot of cars at this event ran R-comps. Especially the Miata's. Normally it's just Porsches and a few other cars, but this was kinda like an invitational for the various groups in our region. A friendly contest of the clubs of sorts.

A clip of the Yaris at the event with some morning runs, ebrake fun, spinouts and the last run of the day which was my best time for 8th out of 50 drivers (note: one guy drove two cars which didn't count).
Yaris at PCA event (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrP715X96WE)

[ozmdd]

Threadjacking, I know, but tell your buddy in the xA that he'd probably improve his times if he turned off his radio, quit talking to his passenger and kept both hands on the wheel (never hand-over-hand or 1-hand). Some very basic AutoX stuff, and focus is everything in AutoX. Cheers!

[anonymous user]

I haven't been able to read the whole forum, but if you run the V710's or wider Hoosiers on 13 x 8's you'll get better gearing in the car and lighter rims. My Lenso's are under 9lbs each and Second gear is much better than running on 15's. It helps with the tighter 2nd gear turns.

I ran at the Porsche Club event last weekend and had a blast on old V710's (rubber was a bit hard), but it did relatively well PCA March 30 event (http://members.shaw.ca/rsandor/2009_march_29th_pca_toptimes.txt)
Alot of cars at this event ran R-comps. Especially the Miata's. Normally it's just Porsches and a few other cars, but this was kinda like an invitational for the various groups in our region. A friendly contest of the clubs of sorts.

A clip of the Yaris at the event with some morning runs, ebrake fun, spinouts and the last run of the day which was my best time for 8th out of 50 drivers (note: one guy drove two cars which didn't count).
Yaris at PCA event (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrP715X96WE)

Nice results. There are a lot of chinese where you live, eh?

[mojoyaris]

Yes there are a few Chinese and Asians in the Vancouver area.