Engine mods - why bother?

[RallyYaris]

I have been interested in super/turbocharging a Yaris. However, I have read that the engine will not be able to handle any appreciable extra horsepower without internal mods. So why bother getting CAI, exhaust mods, etc. if it will only add up to about 5 hp increase? It seems it will cost a lot of money to get the Yaris into the 150 hp range.

I guess I need to decide whether or not I want fuel efficiency or power. I wish they would put a slightly larger engine that could handle a turbo. :cry:

[Idjiit]

Supercharging it up to around 130-140hp combined with chopping off a lot of weight (which would be pretty easy) should give you a pretty decent power-to-weight ratio. What sort of ratio were you looking for?

[RallyYaris]

140 hp would be great, but I would seriously worry about the reliability of the motor. Wouldn't you need to get stronger internals to keep up with the extra power?

[jcove]

140 hp would be great, but I would seriously worry about the reliability of the motor. Wouldn't you need to get stronger internals to keep up with the extra power?
Anything more and you would, but 140 should be fine from what I've been reading. Check out the thread on the Blitz.

[Sp33dY]

i KIND OF AGREE. Spend the cash on suspension if anything ..... if it cant go fast in a straight line, make it go fast in corners!

[birdy]

i think with this motor just get intake exhaust and header and be done with it and then get coilovers, sways and kick ass

[why?]

Any type of serious adding of power, like forced induction, will shorten engine life.

The choice is always between mpg or hp.

However, a new intake, a full exhaust system, lightened flywheel, etc, things that will free up hp by removing restrictions and weight should not shorten the life of the engine.

[AutoTech1]

Any type of serious adding of power, like forced induction, will shorten engine life.

The choice is always between mpg or hp.

However, a new intake, a full exhaust system, lightened flywheel, etc, things that will free up hp by removing restrictions and weight should not shorten the life of the engine.

You can about cut your engine life in half with forced induction... Maybe more. With the yaris, I wouldn't even think about forced induction, unless you have the money for internal upgrades.

I like the idea of less wieght. Less rotating mass on the crank. Decreasing wieght and rotating mass is about the best modification anyone can do for a car, and it is often over looked. It does not destroy the engine. If anything, getting lighter parts are just that. They are lighter, but weaker. You're better of breaking a flywheel than a few pistons or rods...

The yaris can be a very agile car if it's balanced the right way with modifications. In a car like this, I'd shave lbs, perform bolt ons and do whatever it takes to increase power without turbocharging/supercharging. I'd also correct the suspension and brakes. But I'd end up writing a good amt. There are many ways to gain power... Not only through forced induction or giggle juice (nitrous, alcohol, Co2 etc).

If I bought this car though, the best bet would probably be to machine the engine. Send it to a private shop. N/A modifications are always great. They are just costly as well. :-P I wish I could say more, but that's all I can think of off the top of my head, since it's only my first year of Auto Tech so I only know so much. :-)

But remember this. If you perform a good amount of N/A modifications, you may want to consider crossing over to Forced Induction afterwards... This gets crazy with explaining, but you have no clue how many ways you can get power from a car.

[Sp33dY]

If anything, getting lighter parts are just that. They are lighter, but weaker.

.....And it's only my first year of Auto Tech so I only know so much. :-)

Not necessarily true.
Keep studying .... you have a lot to learn .

[AutoTech1]

i KIND OF AGREE. Spend the cash on suspension if anything ..... if it cant go fast in a straight line, make it go fast in corners!

This car is good for that stuff too. Nice input. ;-)

[AutoTech1]

Not necessarily true.
Keep studying .... you have a lot to learn .

I'll place a bet saying lighter parts can be weaker. In most cases they are weaker... But where they are weaker, they are stronger somewhere else... Everything has it's advantages and disadvantages...

[Idjiit]

I'll place a bet saying lighter parts can be weaker. In most cases they are weaker... But where they are weaker, they are stronger somewhere else... Everything has it's advantages and disadvantages...

Of course lighter parts can be weaker. But usually aftermarket parts aren't. They're just made out of materials that are prohibitively expensive for a company like Toyota to put in a car that retails for $11,000. And of course some of these parts trade off performance for ultimate drivability.

[why?]

Lighter parts are not weaker. That would be stupid.

F1 parts are the lightest parts any vehicles use. They are also some of the strongest. F1 engines spin to 20,000 or so rpms.

It will cost more money, but it would be worth it. Every pound you can take out of a car means better gas mileage, handling, braking, acceleration, etc.

And the best thing is Yaris engines only make 106 hp. I bet it would be hard to find a part too weak to handle Yaris like power.

[AutoTech1]

Lighter parts are not weaker. That would be stupid.

F1 parts are the lightest parts any vehicles use. They are also some of the strongest. F1 engines spin to 20,000 or so rpms.

It will cost more money, but it would be worth it. Every pound you can take out of a car means better gas mileage, handling, braking, acceleration, etc.

And the best thing is Yaris engines only make 106 hp. I bet it would be hard to find a part too weak to handle Yaris like power.

Ok. Before you jump ahead, let me point out, which I might not have, that I did not say "All light parts are weaker." That statement would be completely false. When you are looking into many interior components within the block, and you are going in the direction of racing, you can't simply be paying more for parts when they are not any stronger. These parts will be stronger. And more often, they'll be forged over their stock counterparts proving your argument true. A lot of internal parts are built strong, because it's torque that deals a blow to anything in the block, which is why aftermarket parts are made stronger for the engine. And when you force more air into the engine, this increases torgue; that is, if you are adding the right amount of fuel to get the best stachiometric ratio for performance.

As for some other things, take a flywheel for example, it is not built in mind for as much of a strength purpose. It's basically to decrease rotating mass. And you may wonder why? Well, if you decrease rotational mass, you decrease resistance and you free up tiny amounts of horsepower. Consider this... You can rotate a crank from nascar with two fingers... Could you ever do that on a yaris or a stock car of any kind that is not dedicated to a race track? Probably not. Kind of like what N/A modifications aim to do. Now that's not to say, that they (flywheels) aren't stronger than stock counter parts. They most likely are. But these parts are made for lighter wieght purposes and you can still break them under a lot of stress/torque.

And take a drilled rotor for example, to prove me right. Drilled rotors do nothing for stopping purposes. They are drilled to reduce wieght. With these drilled holes, they make the rotor weaker... Which is why you have to ask yourself, why even bother getting drilled rotors for a street application? Many do it. Now that's not to say again, that they aren't stronger than stock components. Most often than not, they are... But they are still weak... And that's what I'm saying. Anything that aims for a lighter wieght purpose only, is going to be weak... "Torque fighting modifications" will be stronger though... But keep in mind, everything is only stronger to a certain point.

Which brings me to an interesting fact. Bolt grades. To get a point across, some bolts are built weaker on purpose. Take a lawn mower or a machine of comparible size with the same purpose. Let's say that your blade binds up. Some of these machines have weaker bolts connected to this blade, so that you break the bolt, and not the blades... In other words, break a small thing to protect a large investment. And for other applications you have stronger bolts... For the obvious fact that you don't want the bolts to break.

Any you're right. The Yaris can't break too many things yet with the torque it makes. It's not so much hp... But torque that kills an engine... I was talking about higher powered cars... But still, I wouldn't run forced induction on the Yaris, unless you consult a professional and get the right parts to rebuild an engine before doing so.

[AutoTech1]

Of course lighter parts can be weaker. But usually aftermarket parts aren't. They're just made out of materials that are prohibitively expensive for a company like Toyota to put in a car that retails for $11,000. And of course some of these parts trade off performance for ultimate drivability.

Or they trade off drivability for performance. Or they trade off reliability for performance... Or they trade off life for performance and so on and so fourth. I have to agree with you. And that's what I was trying to say. Not all lighter parts are weaker. But some are. And some can be... But it depends on how you look at it. I can say, they are stronger and be right, or I can say they are weaker and be right... Depends no how you look at it. Everything has it's weakness and it's strength...

[C2AUTOSPL]

Market rightnow is very small for the Yaris. We'll see what the future holds.

[YarisHatch]

Its all about power to weight. On a 2,200lbs car, 110whp is going to produce acceleration much differently than a 3,000lbs car. People get too caught up on dyno numbers that they loose sight of what car those numbers are on.

Also, when boosting any original n/a motor, its always best to upgrade the internals no matter what psi you plan to run on in terms of daily. Because in the end, you'd rather over-build the motor/tranny than underbuild. At least, thats the way i think.

[Snake]

if you want any real power on the yaris, just drop in a 2zz (1.8) motor from a celica or
a 2AZ-FE 2.4 from a scion tc, the stock yaris motor is not really good past 170 crank hp on boost without heavy internal block work

if you guys look into it, these swaps should really not be that difficult and they are inexpensive enough to find at a junkyard, plenty of aftermarket turbo kits for both motors with the celicas and tc's running around

[YarisHatch]

if you want any real power on the yaris, just drop in a 2zz (1.8) motor from a celica or
a 2AZ-FE 2.4 from a scion tc, the stock yaris motor is not really good past 170 crank hp on boost without heavy internal block work

if you guys look into it, these swaps should really not be that difficult and they are inexpensive enough to find at a junkyard, plenty of aftermarket turbo kits for both motors with the celicas and tc's running around

^Prime example of what i was saying earlier, its not about the numbers. And zpi has pushed 181whp on their 8psi turbo kit, they have been running it hard the past 8,000 miles without any trouble. Its possible to make decent numbers if thats what your after.

The 2az is crap. The internals are a joke on it, it would also cause the yaris to have a very uneven weight dist. with that much weight added to the front end. Also, the 2zz is a better n/a motor than a boost motor. Not to mention, the transmission on the 2zz is seriously weak. One mis-shift on a boosted motor and you will cause minor to significant damage. Its been proven in the past with celicas. While i'd love to see a 2zz in the yaris as well, that transmission is a no no. N/a, you can make some good power out of it if your willing to take the time, and money to invest naturally aspirated vs. throwing down a few thousand for some easy power.

Another thing you might want to realize when you talk motor swaps, the yaris engine bay is pretty small. Its smaller than the xb's, and a 1.8l can fit in the xb but without some adjustments to the firewall. Putting a 2.4l would be a huge project, can be done but wouldn't be easy. Also wouldn't be practical because with the weight added, it would handle like crap and can even be dangerous, especially in the rain.

[Snake]

this is why they have 2az's with internal race mods pushing 540+fwhp on scion tc's
lol
all the 2zz needs is a set of 9:1 comp ja pistons, and you can run all the boost you need
anything can be done, if you know what your doing
if I could push 600+hp out of a neon, im sure u guys can play a little bit with a yaris and actually get a little bit of power so leave all options open to play
just need some proper fuel management and tuning so you dont blow your shit up and some $ for a good setup

[YarisHatch]

this is why they have 2az's with internal race mods pushing 540+fwhp on scion tc's
lol
all the 2zz needs is a set of 9:1 comp ja pistons, and you can run all the boost you need
anything can be done, if you know what your doing
if I could push 600+hp out of a neon, im sure u guys can play a little bit with a yaris and actually get a little bit of power so leave all options open to play
just need some proper fuel management and tuning so you dont blow your shit up and some $ for a good setup

Yes, the 2az can produce numbers well but they have a ton of issues with boost early on boost life. Also, the motors you see that are 550whp+ are hardly counted as a 2az, infact jotechs 600whp tC doesn't even have a 2az in it. The most i've seen with an actual 2az is around 350whp, which yeah thats impressive but i've seen more than enough evidence of the 2az not worth it. Not to mention, i have personally seen the 2az broken down and the internals are pathetic. :eek:

And as i said before, all that extra weight on the front of the yaris would kill a daily. heh

[wlfpck]

i say just modify the xb turbo and strengthen the engine. It should hold up to 8psi? strengthen it a little and get it running at 14psi and u should be set. Of course... you could be very original and go like 34 psi. but don't blow up. :smile:

[fnkngrv]

Nothing against what everyone is attempting to suggest, but maybe you are all thinking too modern. Has anyone considered a 4e-fte yet? When you take a look at what that powerplant has done for the starlet/tercel/paseo, then when you really bounce the costs of using the current 1zz or even the powerplant out of a tC then how can they compare? There have been people that have been able to push 300 horse out of the 4e and have been very happy with how strong the whole setup is plus the times/numbers. You don't have to push 500+ horse to have a tight ride...that would be for someone that doesn't know how to work behind the wheel ;) Sure you have to pick up more parts, but I am willing to wager that you might be looking at 5k for a good solid setup with the newer options ya'all keep talking about. For that kind of flash you can do all you need with the 4e and prolly have a little left over. The biggest hurdle I would see is the front wheel drivetrain and the wire harness, but that can be achieved....just look what BYP has done for example with a 4e in a Tercel? Before someone says it I am fully aware that the 4e is a direct bolt-in on the 'cel...I have a 96, but this still must be abel to be done with some old fashioned ingenuity. Just some food for thought. Once I am done with my 66 Honda 305 motorcycle that is what my next project may be...:thumbup:

[weeze-dog]

Take the $4,000-$5,000 you are going to spend to TRY to get 130-140hp and buy a used V8 mustang or camaro with 300hp and be done with it. This is a 2nd gen ECHO ecnobox not a sports car. The only fast things on the road with 100hp are called m-o-t-o-r-c-y-c-l-e-s.....


Edit: seriously if you going to spend that $4-5K in mods just buy a mini cooper S instead of the yaris.

[Bates]

I just joined this forum. I bought a Yaris an hour ago, I still don't have.

Brake rotors are drilled to let the gas, produced by the heat in the pads, escape into the vented center section, otherwise the gas can produce an unwanted pressure in the wrong way, holding the pad from the rotor surface. Keep reading :wink:

I'm with weeze-dog, I bought this car cause my 89 5.0L sucks too much gas and has a tendency to break down. now I'm forced to make it into a track only car :biggrin:

[weeze-dog]

I had a 92 5.0 Mustang 5-speed in 2001-2003 as a fun car. I paid $4200 for it and it had a rebuilt motor, off road exhaust, and was already lowered. That thing was a beast, I loved that car. 350ft-lb of torque! Also had an ecno geo as the daily driver.
Got rid of the mustang cause I found the large amounts of HP causes you to do stupid things like drag racing, burnouts, and modding (HP is addicting).
I swear every honda with a fart can always wanted to race me. And like George Bush in a spelling bee, they didn't have a prayer :biggrin:

[hhcchen]

not yaris, but example of engine mod for little car...

engine mod (swap) for smart...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5292341112610385808&q=smart
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9072236535251471450&q=smart

[mikeukrainetz]

thats about the coolest thing ive ever seen...

[weeze-dog]

Pluuuuulllllleeeeeeaaaaaseeeee, 13.40 quarter mile in a Ferrari F430? He obviously can't drive, cause that is HORRIBLE. A stock late model camaro can do 12.90s with just an exhaust and a good driver. He bogged it off of the line bad.

For the record road and track got 11.7 in the quarter mile in their F430.

Link (http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=1747&page_number=2)

I believe they say every tenth of a second is one car length, he should have been 15 car lengths ahead easy. Guy in the smart better be glad he didn't wreck cause that thing was gutted so much it had the strength of an aluminum can.

You want to see impressive, watch the video of the turbo mini-van pulling a wheelie off of the line and beat a V8 transam. Now that was impressive. Too bad I can't find that old video anymore.

Edit: Ah Ha, here's one of the videos. This van runs a 12.65 in the quarter, better than the ferrari and smart car by almost a second. Now THIS is impressive.

Turbo Mini-Van (http://www.turbominivan.com/videos/ps_v_z28.rm)

[bullitt3570]

Hey....To all of those involved in this ongoing debate....I'll say a few things and ask a couple of others...Because I certainly don't have all the answers. First of all, any car with modern technology and manufacturing standards( especially from Toyota) Should be able to handle a modest boost. Do all the comments by supposed experts about the Yaris "internals" not remember the most tuned car in America is a lowly previous generation civic. Jackson Racing bolt on supercharger anyone? Now is there a loss of duribility/reliability from this? Invariably, but Toyota reputation for bullet proof drivetrains seems to exceed that of the more advanced (i.e. Vtech), yet slightly more delicate powerplants from Honda. Anyway...internals aside...How about a low boost supercharger, intake, exhaust, coilovers, and remaping the ecu when all is said and done. Risk yes...Reward definately. Anyone who says go by a new GTI with 200 hp is missing the point. There is conservatively 5 grand in this approach, but as I have learned from other such projects,,,None of which have blown up,,,,You can do it in steps and thats half the fun.:biggrin:

[mikeukrainetz]

I agree 100%. You can moderately boost the stock Yaris and will definitely holdup, not talking 6-8psi though. I dont understand this longevity idea though, why would stock cars have turbos and superchargers if the engines dont last? mind you they are designed at the onset for boost. Provided you drop the compression from 10 - 10.5 to at least 9 and with 3-6psi things should be great. I cant imagine at 150 thousand miles youll still be driving the car like you stole it so whats the big deal if theres some wear and tear at that point?
Ive built some hardcore NA chevy motors, mostly from the 70's and 80's so I have little to no experience in boost.
Has anyone here actually built an engine? or are most folks in the forum old enough to remember carbed engines or were you still in diapers when efi came out big in the eighties?

Still, at three grand for a turbo kit that at 3-6psi will only net you like 30-40hp on the Yaris seems like an expensive mod - makes the power to weight kick ass so maybe it evens itself out....

[weeze-dog]

I'm just arguing the the topic of the original poster:

"Engine mods - why bother?"


There are plenty of cheaper alternatives rather than modding the Yaris for power. The HP per $ spent would be horrible (aside from nitrous).
All you will end up with is a $20K not-quite-mini-cooper S worth a blue book of $12K (or less). Yeah its fun, but trust me, nothing sucks more then trying to sell a car for 50% of what you have in it. Cause banks only loan money on blue book, supercharger or not. And people don't like to buy modded cars, cause most likely they had the crap beat out of them. And the quality of work done is always suspect. I ALWAYS look for the stock cars.

Stick to minor suspension, appearence, and ICE mods. I think the money would be more well spent there. What's appealing about this car is that it gets great MPG and is cheap. A $20K yaris that gets 25MPG won't be too appealing come resale time.

That's my opinion, and YMMV.

[mikeukrainetz]

I dont think most people looking to add boost or high dollar mods are thinking about resale at all. Yaris is just a great base to start from - most everyone can afford to buy one new and put parts on it. People wanting performance right out of the box typically cant afford it, especially those looking to do small mods. Everyone keeps refering to the Mini, that car in my area used is 35 grand. I would kill the poor guy at the bank loan dept. from laughing too hard trying to pick up a car like that. I paid 17 grand for my Yaris, bit of a difference there.
If you want to leave the car stock great, if you want to mod it, great. I think in a couple of years the Yaris will be something similar to civics, there will be more cars than people to drive them and every car will have the same tin can exhaust and spoiler.

[weeze-dog]

A new Mini S runs about $20K in the US, the regular mini is around $16K I think, before tax etc.

[fnkngrv]

I agree 100%. You can moderately boost the stock Yaris and will definitely holdup, not talking 6-8psi though. I dont understand this longevity idea though, why would stock cars have turbos and superchargers if the engines dont last?

To be honest it seems that the companies don't know what they are doing in general many times with turbos at least....case in point would be the leakage issues that dodge is experiencing with the SRT-4 2004-2005. Also subaru had some really bad luck in the 80s with the XT....I know that it is far from the 80s but those ones pop in the head quick. The people that I know that had/have those cars didn't drive stupid with them either and for example I know 3 peeps with SRT-4s that have between 15 and 25k with issues.

In reference to your other comment about being in diapers...I grew up in the eighties myself....I miss the old engines...that is why I have a big block 400 in my 60 Pontiac Bonne HD 2 door coupe:thumbup: I would take a yenko over rice any day....but I love my toyotas!

[mikeukrainetz]

Problem with cars nowadays is theyre mass produced to cust costs, dont have a large amount of r&d and are built cheap. New car models ten, fifteen years ago didnt change as drastically as they do now between model years, a keeping up with the jonses kind of situation.
(The chev small block was produced in its same form from 55 to sometime in the nineties.)
Blowing gaskets isnt really new to boosted engines nor to NA engines. Poor gasket quality and cast iron temperature in older engines, warpage and tolerances in newer engines. I had a 99 malibu which was notorious for intake gaskets....

I still prefer old to new, the Yaris is the first import Ive purchased and I love it. I own a 70 chevy pickup with a mild small block. Next month or two I will be getting a third gen camaro to build. Also have been looking for a 66 lincoln continental coupe or convertible.

Yenko is great if you have a hundred grand to blow on a rare muscle car.

My favorite car to this day is a 69 camaro rs/ss. (watch the power block on spike tv they are building a convertible from a new kit)

Anyway, I digress.

[fnkngrv]

good show man....good show

[weeze-dog]

I don't watch the power block that much anymore cause the cast has changed so much its just not the same.

Though I do like to watch Jessi Combs on extreme 4x4, she's a hottie.

[mikeukrainetz]

Yeah, whats up with trucks and the new roid monkey?

Jessi's fine... Courtney even better....

I like to watch horsepower and musclecar - like I said, love the muscle cars

[Bates]

nothin hotter than a chick who can fab your whole frame from scratch.:D

[TRD_Yaris]

First of all, the cross drilled holes in brake rotors aren't FOR reduced weight (though it's a nice byproduct, though more surface area contact from non-drilled/slotted rotors has certain advantages ,too) it is to allow gasses from the brake pad to vent AND less importantly to allow air to pass over the rotor more effectively instead of displacing the air around the complete rotor hat...this aids in cooling JUST a bit.

NEXT, i don't recommend running aftermarket performance parts on the yaris unless you're willing to lose fuel efficiency..unless i'm missing something about electronic throttle-by-wire somehow being different than regular fuel injected motors. The claim of an intake and exhaust helping gas mileage is absurd..if your engine can flow more air then your computer will inject more fuel in return. Plus, these cars are tuned throughout the torque band for a certain amont of back pressure, if you reduce this for a better "top end" then you will hurt your normal daily driving zone..anything under ~5000 rpms..

To answer your question, the only real POWER ADDITIVE mod i would consider doing is a shot of Nitrous Oxide...a good wet system would work GREAT off the computer controlled (and sensored) throttlebody..wouldn't even need a mechanical "Wide open Throttle" activator....
Nitrous can be turned on when you want, can be tuned or jetted for different shots..and has very few downsides if installed by someone with skillz.


Non-HP increasing mods would be:
1)Reduction of Parasitic power Loss (lighter flywheel, lighter wheels/tire combo, underdrive pulleys, Yaris already has electric radiator fan and power steering pump which really helps the 106 hp reach a bit closer to the ground :thumbup: )
2)Suspension and brakes (performance pads & larger diameter, cross drilled rotor setup like AEM big rotor kits)
3)reduction of weight (strip your interior, carbon fiber body parts, lexan windows)
4)aerodynamics (not really helpful until 80 mph++)

Doesn't increase power but:
1)Transmission - installing LImited Slip differential WOULD REALLY HELP PERFORMANCE!!! so would shorter gearing..which with the MULTITUDE of 1nZ engined cars out there..one has probably got a SPORTIER transmission setup that would help acceleration and keeping in the "power band"
2)High Pressure Radiator Cap, cooler thermostat, Oil Cooler, Radiator shrouds to direct airflow...many MANY things to FURTHER ensure your car will LIVE LONG even if you press it hard!!! these should be the first mods you do to the car if you're planning on adding power.

sorry if these lists are incomplete/disorganized.. i need sleep.

[TRD_Yaris]

First of all, the cross drilled holes in brake rotors aren't FOR reduced weight (though it's a nice byproduct, though more surface area contact from non-drilled/slotted rotors has certain advantages ,too) it is to allow gasses from the brake pad to vent AND less importantly to allow air to pass over the rotor more effectively instead of displacing the air around the complete rotor hat...this aids in cooling JUST a bit.

NEXT, i don't recommend running aftermarket performance parts on the yaris unless you're willing to lose fuel efficiency..unless i'm missing something about electronic throttle-by-wire somehow being different than regular fuel injected motors. The claim of an intake and exhaust helping gas mileage is absurd..if your engine can flow more air then your computer will inject more fuel in return. Plus, these cars are tuned throughout the torque band for a certain amont of back pressure, if you reduce this for a better "top end" then you will hurt your normal daily driving zone..anything under ~5000 rpms..

To answer your question, the only real POWER ADDITIVE mod i would consider doing is a shot of Nitrous Oxide...a good wet system would work GREAT off the computer controlled (and sensored) throttlebody..wouldn't even need a mechanical "Wide open Throttle" activator....
Nitrous can be turned on when you want, can be tuned or jetted for different shots..and has very few downsides if installed by someone with skillz.


Non-HP increasing mods would be:
1)Reduction of Parasitic power Loss (lighter flywheel, lighter wheels/tire combo, underdrive pulleys, Yaris already has electric radiator fan and power steering pump which really helps the 106 hp reach a bit closer to the ground :thumbup: )
2)Suspension and brakes (performance pads & larger diameter, cross drilled rotor setup like AEM big rotor kits)
3)reduction of weight (strip your interior, carbon fiber body parts, lexan windows)
4)aerodynamics (not really helpful until 80 mph++)

Doesn't increase power but:
1)Transmission - installing LImited Slip differential WOULD REALLY HELP PERFORMANCE!!! so would shorter gearing..which with the MULTITUDE of 1nZ engined cars out there..one has probably got a SPORTIER transmission setup that would help acceleration and keeping in the "power band"
2)High Pressure Radiator Cap, cooler thermostat, Oil Cooler, Radiator shrouds to direct airflow...many MANY things to FURTHER ensure your car will LIVE LONG even if you press it hard!!! these should be the first mods you do to the car if you're planning on adding power.

sorry if these lists are incomplete/disorganized.. i need sleep.




Hey....To all of those involved in this ongoing debate....I'll say a few things and ask a couple of others...Because I certainly don't have all the answers. First of all, any car with modern technology and manufacturing standards( especially from Toyota) Should be able to handle a modest boost. Do all the comments by supposed experts about the Yaris "internals" not remember the most tuned car in America is a lowly previous generation civic. Jackson Racing bolt on supercharger anyone? Now is there a loss of duribility/reliability from this? Invariably, but Toyota reputation for bullet proof drivetrains seems to exceed that of the more advanced (i.e. Vtech), yet slightly more delicate powerplants from Honda. Anyway...internals aside...How about a low boost supercharger, intake, exhaust, coilovers, and remaping the ecu when all is said and done. Risk yes...Reward definately. Anyone who says go by a new GTI with 200 hp is missing the point. There is conservatively 5 grand in this approach, but as I have learned from other such projects,,,None of which have blown up,,,,You can do it in steps and thats half the fun.:biggrin:
yes, there is a MAJOR LOSS in durability/longevity in ANY honda setup w/ boost :thumbdown: the rods in a d16z are pretty brittle, and only about 250 whp can be safely boosted off of an Integra LS block (b18a,b18b,b18b1)..300 if you like hand grenading trannies :thumbdown:
Plus, weight of internals was a big deal in the 1NZ-FE motor..this was not such a major deal on the Integra engines in which ROD limitations are easily over-run. I think you will have to consider the metal, manufacturing process (cast,vacuum cast,forged,etc), and coating AS WELL as the design of the rod itself (H-beam, I-beam, etc.etc.etc.).
I wouldn't be so sure about getting more than 180hp TO THE wheels before EITHER breaking a rod OR detonating due to the higher-than-ideal compression/design of the pistons..

[mikeukrainetz]

First of all, the cross drilled holes in brake rotors aren't FOR reduced weight (though it's a nice byproduct, though more surface area contact from non-drilled/slotted rotors has certain advantages ,too) it is to allow gasses from the brake pad to vent AND less importantly to allow air to pass over the rotor more effectively instead of displacing the air around the complete rotor hat...this aids in cooling JUST a bit.

NEXT, i don't recommend running aftermarket performance parts on the yaris unless you're willing to lose fuel efficiency..unless i'm missing something about electronic throttle-by-wire somehow being different than regular fuel injected motors. The claim of an intake and exhaust helping gas mileage is absurd..if your engine can flow more air then your computer will inject more fuel in return. Plus, these cars are tuned throughout the torque band for a certain amont of back pressure, if you reduce this for a better "top end" then you will hurt your normal daily driving zone..anything under ~5000 rpms..

To answer your question, the only real POWER ADDITIVE mod i would consider doing is a shot of Nitrous Oxide...a good wet system would work GREAT off the computer controlled (and sensored) throttlebody..wouldn't even need a mechanical "Wide open Throttle" activator....
Nitrous can be turned on when you want, can be tuned or jetted for different shots..and has very few downsides if installed by someone with skillz.


Non-HP increasing mods would be:
1)Reduction of Parasitic power Loss (lighter flywheel, lighter wheels/tire combo, underdrive pulleys, Yaris already has electric radiator fan and power steering pump which really helps the 106 hp reach a bit closer to the ground :thumbup: )
2)Suspension and brakes (performance pads & larger diameter, cross drilled rotor setup like AEM big rotor kits)
3)reduction of weight (strip your interior, carbon fiber body parts, lexan windows)
4)aerodynamics (not really helpful until 80 mph++)

Doesn't increase power but:
1)Transmission - installing LImited Slip differential WOULD REALLY HELP PERFORMANCE!!! so would shorter gearing..which with the MULTITUDE of 1nZ engined cars out there..one has probably got a SPORTIER transmission setup that would help acceleration and keeping in the "power band"
2)High Pressure Radiator Cap, cooler thermostat, Oil Cooler, Radiator shrouds to direct airflow...many MANY things to FURTHER ensure your car will LIVE LONG even if you press it hard!!! these should be the first mods you do to the car if you're planning on adding power.

sorry if these lists are incomplete/disorganized.. i need sleep.

The only thing I have to say about cross drilled rotors is buy quality - I have had terrible rotors and great rotors. Larger cars will benefit more from crossed drilled than smaller, they extended the life of my pads and rotors three fold.

There is a benefit to exhaust and intake 'improvements' - this may be hard to quantify with cheap aftermarket parts but with flow improvements, read 'less turbulence', there will be a definite benefit. Im not talking buying a three inch exhaust and a race header to develop 'more' flow. Obviously this will burn more fuel.

Obviously these engines are tuned to backpressure but usually any engine can benefit from a reduction in back pressure in the exhaust system - this isnt a two stroke.

You recommend a nitrous system instead of a boosted system - personally I find nitrous a huge waste of time unless you drag race. If thats the case more often than not youll have someone with more money than brains running a 150 shot and melt themselves down.
Its assinign to assume the stock engine will not accept boost without seriously detrimental effects and long term longevity. Again, this is a function of stupidity not internals. These engines are built to extreme tolerances to the point of being almost termed balanced and blueprinted. In moderation any engine can accept boost, there wouldnt be kits to add turbos and superchargers if this wasnt the case. Any 'idiot' willing to push 15psi into a stock engine deserves an engine rebuid. There are alot more facts involved in these small displacement engines than simply bolting on a turbo. Im sure its possible to adjust the valve timing to reduce compression, engine timing, etc etc. Simply saying it cant / or shouldnt be done is ridiculous, personal opinion and accepting the possibilities something may go wrong are more appropriate.

As far as the other non HP upgrades they are all great ideas.

If you run the gammut with mods from boost to weight savings youll have yourself a very sporty 60 grand Yaris.

ANY performance upgrade short of lightening will undoubtedly increase fuel consumption - If you arent willing to accept this then why mod to begin with?

[heylookitsjames]

"...buy cross-drilled for looks, slotted to wear your pads out faster, and normal to race with..."

-Rhys Millen at question and answer forum at D1GP, Fontana.


and mods that decrease rotating weight to gain performance decrease the amount of work the engine is doing, there by increasing gas milage... things like lightweight wheels, knife-edged cranks, lightweight flywheels (if they don't mess with the idle too much).

[mikeukrainetz]

"...buy cross-drilled for looks, slotted to wear your pads out faster, and normal to race with..."

-Rhys Millen at question and answer forum at D1GP, Fontana.


and mods that decrease rotating weight to gain performance decrease the amount of work the engine is doing, there by increasing gas milage... things like lightweight wheels, knife-edged cranks, lightweight flywheels (if they don't mess with the idle too much).


The rotors I used went on my 99 malibu - the car is fairly large with severly under designed brakes in the front. I dont use the brakes that much, rely on gearing or coasting instead and that car went through a set of pads every three months. Bought the rotors and matching pads and didnt change them again.

I know lightening components makes a huge difference on big engines. Worked on tons of chev v8's that prove that point 100%. Can there be a drastic difference on these engines? How much can these parts weigh in or affect such a small engine, low gross weight vehicle?

[heylookitsjames]

I know lightening components makes a huge difference on big engines. Worked on tons of chev v8's that prove that point 100%. Can there be a drastic difference on these engines? How much can these parts weigh in or affect such a small engine, low gross weight vehicle?

I would assume that if you were to replace the flywheel and get some really lightweight wheels like regamaster or magnesium watanabes, you would feel a much more drastic difference than if you put the TRD muffler and cold air intake on. The car wouldn't be loud, and to some I'm sure that would be a drawback since it doesn't "sound fast", but it would be much more pleasurable to drive and probably dyno better.

[mikeukrainetz]

I suppose thats true.

I look at it three ways

1)replace stock parts with lightweight units and gain acceleration and overall performance.

2)replace parts with HP producing parts to offset stock weight or aftermarket parts (eg. stock steel wheels / aftermarket larger dia wheels)

3)replace both stock parts with lighter parts and add aftermarket HP producing parts.

I still think that unless your losing 10lbs a corner, 40-50lbs interior etc etc you wont gain much.
They say a hundred pound drop is worth a tenth in the quarter - hard to imagine where you could shave a hundred or more pounds in the yaris.

Plus I still need my backseat so a flywheel which gains me 10lbs over stock and maybe a 200rpm the only difference Ill see is the 300 less in my bank account.

[mikeukrainetz]

for invaluable engine information visit

http://www.hotrodders.com

most pertains to domestics but any questions can be asked or answered.

[heylookitsjames]

I suppose thats true.

I look at it three ways

1)replace stock parts with lightweight units and gain acceleration and overall performance.

2)replace parts with HP producing parts to offset stock weight or aftermarket parts (eg. stock steel wheels / aftermarket larger dia wheels)

3)replace both stock parts with lighter parts and add aftermarket HP producing parts.

I still think that unless your losing 10lbs a corner, 40-50lbs interior etc etc you wont gain much.
They say a hundred pound drop is worth a tenth in the quarter - hard to imagine where you could shave a hundred or more pounds in the yaris.

Plus I still need my backseat so a flywheel which gains me 10lbs over stock and maybe a 200rpm the only difference Ill see is the 300 less in my bank account.

I'm not talking about the overall loss of weight of the car affecting performance... who cares about that, carbon hoods are for ricers...
I'm talking about the loss of ratational weight through the drive system. This is 100 fold more important than gutting your interior. You will feel the difference between a 17 lb wheel and a 7lb wheel, and you will feel the difference between a 15lb flywheel and 7lb flywheel. This is weight that the engine no longer has to fight to turn over.

[Bates]

James is right, it'll rev way quicker, meaning you go faster.

But James, I've never heard a 4cyl sound fast, unless it had boost and I could hear a whistle. But maybe thats just me...

[mikeukrainetz]

Maybe im just completely missing the boat on this but we are talking about a Yaris right? The 106 hp econobox? I would spend money on all those lightweight parts, flywheel etc if maybe this was a s2000 or rx7 with three times the HP. Those of you who actually race might notice a diff. like I said, I have only noticed a difference in larger displacement engines because thats all Ive built.

[yariman]

If you want to pick up some extra performance cheap, stick to the basics. Let it breathe, free flowing intake and exhaust. Lower gearing, the cheapest way is with smaller diameter wheel/tire combo, if you are planning on replacing your stock wheels. Lighter flywheel if you can do it cheap.

[TRD_Yaris]

Check out Turbo magazines current issue..the Blitz Vitz with Blitz Compressor System (Supercharger), Blitz Nur-Spec C-Ti Exhaust, and Blitz Radiator Cap (REMEMBER WHAT I SAID EARLIER IN THIS POST..first Thing to do if you're gonna make power is the RADIATOR CAP!!!)
JUST THESE MODS take the DYNOED horsepower/torque from 106.9 hp/102.0 lb/ft TO 148.0 hp (@ 6100 rpm) and 149.0 lb/ft torque (@3400!!!!)

3400 RPM = FULL TORQUE of 149 lb/ft!!!!!!!!!!:bow:

BEST OF ALL, the "CLUTCH SYSTEM" of the supercharger allows you to set it between "HIGH, MEDIUM, LOW, or NO BOOST!!!!! a SUPERCHARGER you can turn off!!!!

I'm in "Communicado" with the guys at Blitz that did this Vitz and hopefully mine will be the first USDM Supercharged Yaris...and then i can return to the tracks and compare times :burnrubber:


To answer the debate on "good intake and exhaust will only increase power, not sacrafice low end for top end": I agree. A really good tested, mandrel bent exhaust could alleviate any "loss" in low/mid end that is a GIVEN on most system, BUT THESE ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN..maybe non existent for many cars out there. Especially when you're doing other mods that weren't taken into account when "X company" designed your exhaust system (i.e. Ram intake vs. Cold Air intake, Headers vs. stock exhaust manifold, cooler plugs, many things that aren't "mentioned" by the original testers)

but i still hold that any engine modifications on finely tuned (for gas mileage and performance) computer controlled engines will hurt your gas mileage.
If you can turn off the Blitz supercharger like they state, i'm all on it...though i'm still watching their project close..i'm figuring the VERY small fuel injectors will quickly hit 100% duty cycle before the rods get close to snapping.
Maybe an on/off wet shot of NOS with an on/off supercharger would be the best setup. I'd get an exhaust setup for that and "sacrafice" a few mpg..it'd be worth it :w00t:








oh, and you could have your exhaust manifold "ceramic coated" which causes it to retain heat inside the piping more. This decreases underhood temperatures and ALSO keeps exhaust gases hotter,which keeps it moving faster and evacuating the exhaust ports quicker (translation: 4 cylinder torque)
JetHot.com does this coating REGULARLY for perforamance cars, i've had a few Turbo manifolds done and it is very helpful. Or you can do it yourself by buying the correct paint and spraying it with a really cheap airbrush ($10 or less from walmart).

later.

[heylookitsjames]

Maybe im just completely missing the boat on this but we are talking about a Yaris right? The 106 hp econobox? I would spend money on all those lightweight parts, flywheel etc if maybe this was a s2000 or rx7 with three times the HP. Those of you who actually race might notice a diff. like I said, I have only noticed a difference in larger displacement engines because thats all Ive built.

Actually, the smaller and lighter the motor, the bigger the benefits you will get from lightening up the driveline. True, it is exceptionally important on the cars you listed because of their extremely high RPM nature, but small motors reap a huge benefit as well.

I'm not discounting the benefits of increasing the flow of the motor either, as this will most definitely help with power. But I agree with TRD_Yaris in that it WILL affect gas milage.

[TRD_Yaris]

yeah, but the REAL question is HOW much will it affect AND is it ACCEPTABLE for your driving needs/wants. It may only decrease your mileage by 1-2 mpg at most, but give you much better performance. Or, it may cost you 3++ mpg and give you hardly noticeable performance. the only way to truely find out is to drive it for a few thousand miles and then install the parts and note the difference in gas mileage and power difference.

[mikeukrainetz]

I have owned more than my fair share of low mpg cars and trucks - my 70 pickup only gets 10mpg at the best of times but I only drive it a couple times a month if that. I only fill the Yaris twice a month depending on how much driving I do but Id be willing to lose 3+ mpg with huge performance benefits. I just cant justify the cost (at least at this point). I have also been torn between trying to find compromise between the extremes of both ends of performance / looks.

I like larger wheels but obviously thatll cost me but would also like to boost the engine.

I tried to contact blitz about their system but got no response. Sending email is pretty crappy way of trying anyhow. Is the system your talking about the same one for the scion? its 4g USD however...

[rstb88]

personally i would increase intake and exhaust minimaly and port and polish the head for better breathing, cooler plugs, thermastat, also a tranny cooler. and that would be it other than suspension. and led lights all around

[rstb88]

oh and a pulley system to reduce drag.

[bulldogs2k]

i like the sound of a supercharger that can turn off! but for 4g I would probably save the money for somthing else, or wait for a used one :) although, a boosted yaris is such a sleeper....

[Snake]

wow, I've never read so much misinformation in my life
(many people on this bored have no clue what they are talking about, sorry to say be careful what you guys read)
you guys argue over stupid things
if someone wants to get more power out of their car, then by all means let them
"to each his own"

if you guys want to learn about modifying your yaris motor, I would read the Scion xB and xA forums, www.scionlife.com there are a lot of write ups on turbo setups and NA setups, considering they have the same drivetrains (US Models), you can steal some of their ideas and parts
just use the search function they have

from my experience with the yaris so far, if you plan on modifying the car at all, please lower it, I've been on three wheels too many times already this car needs to be lowered for safety reasons, its not safe at high speeds at the stock riding height and get some wider tires (minimum 205)(any speed over 90mph)

try to do as much weight reduction as possible, the weight reduction will actually help more than the engine modding because you cannot get much power out of the 1.5 motor without forced induction and its not really worth opening up that motor to get a few more ponies out of it with internal modifications unless you plan on doing a turbo or S/C setup
(considering the costs involved)

In my honest opinion, from what I've been reading up on the MR2 forums, because that is the project I am currently working on, it may actually be better to see if you can possibly fit in a 2zz-ge (celica GTS, Toyota Matrix XRS, Pontiac VIBE GT, Lotuse Elise) motor into the yaris
it is a very lightweight aluminum motor and the stock power configuration alone is more than enough to get the yaris to really move without hurting it too much in the weight department, since this motor is manufactured by yamaha, then it it is a very high comp setup and will run beautifully as an NA setup and they have a lot of turbo options as well
(if it can get a lotus elise to run low 13's stock, I think it is more than enough for a yaris to get moving)

Instead of spending 4k on a turbo setup for the 1.5 liter and manage to get 150-160 hp at the crank, the 2zz will get you 180 at the crank stock for a fraction of the cost and it will bolt right up to our 5 spd transmission
If I didnt want the good mpg for a commuter car that I use the yaris for, I would do it with the 2zz swap. But then again I already have a fast fwd car, no need for another.

Sorry I havent been reading much about this car because I decided not to make a project out of it after buying my spyder but the yaris has a lot of potential, its lightweight and very agile so with a little more added power you have a quick little rocket with a good driver

so use it for whatever you like, to go back and forth from work at 40 mpg, or a little track car, everyone is different
just dont tell someone that they cant make it into what they want to make it
it is a cheap blank canvas, all it needs is a little creativity and engineering to make it into someones pride and joy

so keep up the modding and I hope to see some nice yaris's cruising around the states very soon

[soros151]

wow, I've never read so much misinformation in my life
(many people on this bored have no clue what they are talking about, sorry to say be careful what you guys read)
you guys argue over stupid things
if someone wants to get more power out of their car, then by all means let them
"to each his own"

if you guys want to learn about modifying your yaris motor, I would read the Scion xB and xA forums, www.scionlife.com there are a lot of write ups on turbo setups and NA setups, considering they have the same drivetrains (US Models), you can steal some of their ideas and parts
just use the search function they have

from my experience with the yaris so far, if you plan on modifying the car at all, please lower it, I've been on three wheels too many times already this car needs to be lowered for safety reasons, its not safe at high speeds at the stock riding height and get some wider tires (minimum 205)(any speed over 90mph)

try to do as much weight reduction as possible, the weight reduction will actually help more than the engine modding because you cannot get much power out of the 1.5 motor without forced induction and its not really worth opening up that motor to get a few more ponies out of it with internal modifications unless you plan on doing a turbo or S/C setup
(considering the costs involved)

In my honest opinion, from what I've been reading up on the MR2 forums, because that is the project I am currently working on, it may actually be better to see if you can possibly fit in a 2zz-ge (celica GTS, Toyota Matrix XRS, Pontiac VIBE GT, Lotuse Elise) motor into the yaris
it is a very lightweight aluminum motor and the stock power configuration alone is more than enough to get the yaris to really move without hurting it too much in the weight department, since this motor is manufactured by yamaha, then it it is a very high comp setup and will run beautifully as an NA setup and they have a lot of turbo options as well
(if it can get a lotus elise to run low 13's stock, I think it is more than enough for a yaris to get moving)

Instead of spending 4k on a turbo setup for the 1.5 liter and manage to get 150-160 hp at the crank, the 2zz will get you 180 at the crank stock for a fraction of the cost and it will bolt right up to our 5 spd transmission
If I didnt want the good mpg for a commuter car that I use the yaris for, I would do it with the 2zz swap. But then again I already have a fast fwd car, no need for another.

Sorry I havent been reading much about this car because I decided not to make a project out of it after buying my spyder but the yaris has a lot of potential, its lightweight and very agile so with a little more added power you have a quick little rocket with a good driver

so use it for whatever you like, to go back and forth from work at 40 mpg, or a little track car, everyone is different
just dont tell someone that they cant make it into what they want to make it
it is a cheap blank canvas, all it needs is a little creativity and engineering to make it into someones pride and joy

so keep up the modding and I hope to see some nice yaris's cruising around the states very soon

I have another post here asking for a swap opinion of a 2ZZ. Are u saying that the Yaris 5spd tranny can be mounted easily to the 2ZZ? :eyebulge:

[soros151]

bump on the Q?

[Snake]

tranny should bolt right up, but dont take my word for it, I havent done it yet
the tranny codes match from a 1zz and the 1zz trannies have been known to work on the 2zz engines, hopefully somebody else will verify if my statement is true or not...

[ChinoCharles]

Hmm... engine mods, why bother.

Why?

2200 FREEKIN POUNDS!!!!! Thats why.

[soros151]

Hmm... engine mods, why bother.

Why?

2200 FREEKIN POUNDS!!!!! Thats why.

I get you don't worry, thats why the Yaris is one of the choices
of tuning. :evil: So we can :burnrubber:

[TRD_Yaris]

um..why use 1zz transmission when the 2ZZ 6 speed bolts up, but VERY CUSTOM, PROTOTYPE MOTOR MOUNTS will not be released for awhile. Don't worry people, as soon as I steal the T Sport and remove the motor mounts and wiring harnesses for mass production WE ARE IN BUSINESS :laugh:

[Chaad32]

A 6 speed Yaris.....hmm....I'm in.

[soros151]

There seems to be an issue with taking a curb with the weight of the 2ZZ, but maybe I'm over reacting, nothing that can't be cured with a set of coilovers and some swaybars.

[weaponrcamry]

why would you want a 6 speed in the yaris anyway? And even if you swap the 2zz into the yaris, you would have a decent a mount of fabrication. Plus the angle of the motor woulnd't look good either.
If you want a turbo setup, where would it go? But under the car where the x-haust is. Hmm another $5000 of custom work?

I mean its a great idea, but, their are better options. Rebuild the engine, turbo it, or swap in the cheaper 1zz-fe. Many, many aftermarket support. Probably half the cost of the 2zz swap, unless you know what your doing or you have about $10,000-$15,000K to spare. I mean if you want to be like a honda with a k20a into a hatch with the 6 speed LOL. But you gotta think, just because someone done the swap overseas or so, would it be able to pass the vision check of the emissions, what if you get pulled over? You should probably should wait within a year or so until you have proof of the swap and it is legal to do so. But otherwise a waste of money. :thumbdown:

[heylookitsjames]

As long as the 2ZZ-GE was manufactured the same year or newer than the yaris, and USDM, it could be legally swapped in. I think that limits it to the corolla XRS motor.

[soros151]

why would you want a 6 speed in the yaris anyway? And even if you swap the 2zz into the yaris, you would have a decent a mount of fabrication. Plus the angle of the motor woulnd't look good either.
If you want a turbo setup, where would it go? But under the car where the x-haust is. Hmm another $5000 of custom work?

I mean its a great idea, but, their are better options. Rebuild the engine, turbo it, or swap in the cheaper 1zz-fe. Many, many aftermarket support. Probably half the cost of the 2zz swap, unless you know what your doing or you have about $10,000-$15,000K to spare. I mean if you want to be like a honda with a k20a into a hatch with the 6 speed LOL. But you gotta think, just because someone done the swap overseas or so, would it be able to pass the vision check of the emissions, what if you get pulled over? You should probably should wait within a year or so until you have proof of the swap and it is legal to do so. But otherwise a waste of money. :thumbdown:

Just to get with a turbo kit with the 1NZ would be more than the cost of the 2ZZ. Of course you would have a big amount of fabrication, thats why it is called a project. The angle of the motor wouldn't look good?
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f192/soros151/activa20yaris030ew.jpg
Does that look bad to you?
I don't need a turbo for a Yaris with a 2ZZ, it already would do 13.4 with just the swap, add a complete combo of Intake, Custom header and a complete exhaust and you could see some gains there. And about the legality of the swap the last one who talk about it was right, you only need a motor of the same year or futher up.

[weaponrcamry]

No it doesnt look that bad, decent swap I would say :). I am a going to do this project within a year or so, I am currently discussing this with one of my friends that work at a local performance shop. But anyway, Turboing the 1nz-fe will cost more than a 2zz swap? I dont think so. More custom work = more $$$ especially a good engine to find and to add the tranny?. Like I said with all that money you can just rebuild the internals or just dump a 1zz in it. Alot of aftermarket support for that engine, since it's in the mr-s. But if you have the money, and time go for it.

[soros151]

Okay, still it would have more sense to work on a 2ZZ than in a 1NZ, cause the 2ZZ has more power potential with less money in the long run. All the money you would use to squeeze any oz. of hp from the 1NZ would be better off just to get a very GOOD N/A motor into this chassis. It may not a be a complete Yaris in our hearts but it would beat the crap out of almost anything. A next serious step once you get this motor, would be to stiffen the chassis a bit more and use good suspension parts to go up to par with the 2ZZ. :smile:

[bulldogs2k]

that would be a fun ride^^^

[heylookitsjames]

damn, that's pretty clean. Any info on that swap? looks like it's in Europe...

[soros151]

Tried to look for more info, but the company who did it in the UK, closed... so no website no nothing. :(

[TRD_Yaris]

why would you want a 6 speed in the yaris anyway? And even if you swap the 2zz into the yaris, you would have a decent a mount of fabrication. Plus the angle of the motor woulnd't look good either.
If you want a turbo setup, where would it go? But under the car where the x-haust is. Hmm another $5000 of custom work?

I mean its a great idea, but, their are better options. Rebuild the engine, turbo it, or swap in the cheaper 1zz-fe. Many, many aftermarket support. Probably half the cost of the 2zz swap, unless you know what your doing or you have about $10,000-$15,000K to spare. I mean if you want to be like a honda with a k20a into a hatch with the 6 speed LOL. But you gotta think, just because someone done the swap overseas or so, would it be able to pass the vision check of the emissions, what if you get pulled over? You should probably should wait within a year or so until you have proof of the swap and it is legal to do so. But otherwise a waste of money. :thumbdown:


Umm..why would i want a 6 speed :eek: umm..i can think of 1 reasonl..that extra gear, which means that you can have EVEN SHORTER gearing and still have a 6th gear for highway driving (basically, it's taken AWAY the one disadvantage of a short-geared 5 speed). Also, 2ZZGE 6speed trannies (USUALLY) have LSDifferential, so you'd save money in a 2ZZGE swap as opposed to "SOUPING" up the 1NZFE's scrawny 5 speed with Open Differential. Last I checked, Nismo 1.5 way units are $650 +++$500 to install!!
As far as fabrication, that won't be an issue if the YARIS T SPORT becomes an official production car. Then it will be as simple as getting a Toyota OEM part NUMBER and ordering them sumbitches from Carson Toyota (who can IMPORT ANYTHING JDM,TOYOTA OEM OR NOT).

1ZZFE?? if you're gonna spend the money on "ZZ" series motor mounts..why get a 133 hp motor for $1700 (engine/5speed) when you could spend an extra $1000 and have a 180hp+ performance engine/6 speed/ LSDifferential???!?!Last i checked (when I helped with 2ZZGE into MR2 Spyder which had stock 1ZZFE FF setup), a 2ZZGE full swap costs right at $2700 from VERY RELIABLE JDM importers. The power band for 11.5:1 Natural Aspiration is amazing in a car that weighs less than a ton!!

Or, you could go with a custom turbo kit, hopefully HASS will build a kit for 'em..though it won't happen without an online "petition" to prove that their would be a market for Yaris Turbo kits (basically, im-farking-possible.)

Or, you could import a JDM 1NZFTE clip and do a proper Turbo swap..though most people would opt to do a turbo kit on the stock motor due to the INTIMIDATION OF PULLING A MOTOR (=wussies)!! Which means you'll likely go the "easy" route and just purchase all the "bolt on" turbo parts from the 1NZFE just to make it fit without regards to things like upgraded fuel injectors, oil pumps and coolers, etc. that will keep the engine running for more than 1000 miles...

Expensive is the tuner scene. I don't think anyone here has sat down and really put together REALISTIC costs of full end race kits. And to be honest, i don't have any more concern than simple curiosity of doing something new. They told me i couldn't get a SUPRA TWIN TURBO setup into my Lexus, but that doesn't mean it was hard MUCH LESS cost effective. The EXPENSIVE ENGINE SWAPS are the one's that people buy in BULK, like the INTEGRA engines (for civics), SR20DET (JDM Nissan Turbo engine for USDM 240SXs). The 2ZZGE and 1NZFTE don't have any real demand market, meaning you could POTENTIALLY snag them FOR CHEAP!!

but, it's not fair to say that it would cost $5000 in fabrication. Only rich kids pay people to do their custom fabrication R&D. I will pay someone to do VERY SKILLED LABOR, but only after i measure and plan everything out. I've got 2 Nissan S13's sitting in my driveway with SR20DET engine swaps, I didn't spend more than $2100 on either, and I've had offers upwards of $6000 for each. Doing the mental work and research is 80% of the time you will spend tuning!! If not, you're just a poser in the scene. Just like those rich guys who go to car shows in Lamborghinis, Ferraris, etc. and can't tell you more about the car than what's in the sales brochure!!!! Spending cash is NOT what the scene is about...


oh, as far as a K20A with 6 speed transmission from 2005+ JDM Honda Integra Type R into a Civic goes, don't knock it until you try it. Currently it's the FASTEST CAR SCCA and NASA have ever scene (referring to the yellow EG civic that's owning everything in it's path). And, you COULD fully assemble one for less than $7000 (including car) if you are patient and resourceful (on ebay, craigslist, etc.etc.etc.etc.etc.). The K20A is about $6000 for the full swap, and thankfully motor mounts/wiring harnesses have become pretty cheap now that many companies have started making them. At first, Hasport was charging well over $1000 just for the motor mounts. but then again, they put A LOT of R&D into those M.Mounts, so it was justified. Now, you can pick up a set for about $300. go figure.

$7000 for a vehicle that WILL OWN nearly everything short of Hayabusas/ZX-14s on the streets WHILE MAINTAINING STOCK HONDA RELIABILITY. Or would it be better to spend $35000 on an STi because it requires no custom work....but i digress...

[soros151]

I agree with you on EVERYTHING. You could easily see a car that does mid 13's all night long and costed you a Max of let's say $20,000 or on the other hand buy and EVO and pay $35,000 just to own from factory, which for me is a little dull and boring.

[weaponrcamry]

Yea it would be good to swap the 6-speed during highway use but not at a drag strip or so. Why? Because you wont even see 6th gear. Most people will be in 4th or 5th. Also, most people would be on a budget, so the 1zz would be the most choice. and the most reliabilty. The 2zz would be a hell of a all motor, but not worth turboing. Those engines are known to blow up especially if you over rev them. I know most people will over rev to see how high the rpm's go, and dam sure they wont go over 10,000 rpm with reliability. The 2zz is not a honda engine... and doesnt have the reliablity to go that high. One other thing if you turbo the 2zz it will be at a mild boost . While the 1zz will handle MORE BOOST. Also on the matrix xrs, and the corolla xrs toyota lowered their redline so they wont blow the FuDge up.. Anyway the 1zz is alot stronger than the 2zz. The 1zz has been around longer that 2zz. And can handle more boost than the 2zz in stock form. More torque for the 1zz than 2zz also. Bottom line 2zz-for freeway/highway driving and 1zz-for drag strip racing. :?????????????? As a know fact that has been used for years, more money more problems............ And you will burn :flame:

[Drummerdawgmr-s]

the 2zz's make no tq... the stock 2zz dont make any more tq than the 1zz does which is a downside in my eyes...i know were messing with high reving small motors but i would still like a decent balance....the 1zz has been boosted to 15 psi (around 350hp) before it actually blew and that on a completely stock motor plus hass turbo kit....and the stock hass stg 2 kit that boost 8 psi at 266rwhp/240tq...they have a kit for the 2zz mr-s but i dont remember the specs on it...i belive just testing/maxing it out it was like 350 hp and like 230 tq which is still alot but i like a better balance than that which the 1zz gives

[weaponrcamry]

More boost-more power 1zz
Less boost less power-2zz.

Im not trying to diss the 2zz or nothing but, they arent good for turboing in my opinion. There are better of as all motors.
Also looking on the toysport site the 2zz had alot of problems. "Bent valves from miss shifts", so you dont want to do that, but of course everyone miss shifts in a while.
But the 1zz, would be a better component for turboing especially when you are talking about a less reving engine and aren't worried about detination, and at the same time you still have the reliability of an average car. I havent seen many turboed 2zz's around. But more 1zz turbo cars. It would be good to run a 2zz with low boost, but better when you have more boost with the 1zz. :)

Read and learn :O
http://www.toysport.com/Technical%20Information/2ZZ-GE_tech_notes.htm

[soros151]

So we agree that an All Motor 2ZZ Yaris package will own the strip doing mid 13's. :P

[RoninMax]

I dont know about the The 2zz since my friend is trying to put on to his 2000Echo. (the original swap is made in Hong Kong to fight the Mugen Fit (K20 in the Honda Fit) But if you want a 6 Speed on a Echo to maid to 1NZFE, I did drove one. I think every one know the Yaris/Echo is using C150 series tran. My friend using the C160 6 speed from a AE111 internal maid on the C150 tran with LSD. when I drive his 6 speed Echo, The car is response faster and Yes, I can use all the 6 gears even on the street. It is much closer ratio since the gear ratio is for a 1.6 4AGE instead of The C60 for the 1.8 2zz (6 speed for celica ZZ231). if you want the 6 speed Yaris while using 1NZFE, I think this is the only solution in the real live. Maybe when my friend get done on his 2zz echo, I can post some of the info in this forum.

[bulldogs2k]

k20 fit!!!! that should be fun. they k20 should make up for its mini van looks.
A

[TRD_Yaris]

I agree with you on EVERYTHING. You could easily see a car that does mid 13's all night long and costed you a Max of let's say $20,000 or on the other hand buy and EVO and pay $35,000 just to own from factory, which for me is a little dull and boring.

actually, a CRX with stock K20A and KPRO tuning ran an 11.3 FOR IT's FIRST RACE!!! and this is a BONE STOCK MOTOR!!! it is capable of sub-10's with more R&D and a few tweaks to the K20A. Pac Man's white/black EF ownz.

[TRD_Yaris]

I dont know about the The 2zz since my friend is trying to put on to his 2000Echo. (the original swap is made in Hong Kong to fight the Mugen Fit (K20 in the Honda Fit) But if you want a 6 Speed on a Echo to maid to 1NZFE, I did drove one. I think every one know the Yaris/Echo is using C150 series tran. My friend using the C160 6 speed from a AE111 internal maid on the C150 tran with LSD. when I drive his 6 speed Echo, The car is response faster and Yes, I can use all the 6 gears even on the street. It is much closer ratio since the gear ratio is for a 1.6 4AGE instead of The C60 for the 1.8 2zz (6 speed for celica ZZ231). if you want the 6 speed Yaris while using 1NZFE, I think this is the only solution in the real live. Maybe when my friend get done on his 2zz echo, I can post some of the info in this forum.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

and, just because you're not going to "GET" to use the 6th gear on the 1/4 mile doesn't mean it's worthless. How about high speed racing, like turbo launching on the highway?? How about a dual purpose street/strip car where you ACTUALLY want to get good gas mileage when driving to the track?
And, like Ronin states above, there is a certain amount of "swappability" between the different engines/trannies. Why not a turbo 1ZZFE with 6 speed and LSD from 2ZZGE setup ?

[soros151]

I dont know about the The 2zz since my friend is trying to put on to his 2000Echo. (the original swap is made in Hong Kong to fight the Mugen Fit (K20 in the Honda Fit) But if you want a 6 Speed on a Echo to maid to 1NZFE, I did drove one. I think every one know the Yaris/Echo is using C150 series tran. My friend using the C160 6 speed from a AE111 internal maid on the C150 tran with LSD. when I drive his 6 speed Echo, The car is response faster and Yes, I can use all the 6 gears even on the street. It is much closer ratio since the gear ratio is for a 1.6 4AGE instead of The C60 for the 1.8 2zz (6 speed for celica ZZ231). if you want the 6 speed Yaris while using 1NZFE, I think this is the only solution in the real live. Maybe when my friend get done on his 2zz echo, I can post some of the info in this forum.

Pleaaase post some info on this. Very interested.

[flow-vitz]

yo guys,
i just got a ncp91 few months back. Had some job done on it. trd full exhaust and header, trd cluch and flywheel,c-one pulley,trd suspension,trd quick shift, trd wheels, tm work spark firing system, hks plugs and hks intake system.thinking of a charger but not sure which one.

[soros151]

Sounds good, looks to me like 23whp increasement, or at least in that range.

[mikeukrainetz]

I know zilch about import engines and swaps (This is the first import ive owned - muscle cars have been more my style) but im assuming the same would apply as old school big blocks etc.

If you spend all that dough to get the Yaris to run 13s and can take on stock imports / domestics of a higher caliber wouldnt you eventually do the same with say the Subaru WRX or Sti? to run with bigger boys? I mean if your going to mod anyway, and chances are most of you on these sites are going to no matter what ride they have. Eventually your Subaru (or whatever) is running tight with a Vette. Seems youll always be trying to one-up no matter what you got...

That being said I cant aford to buy a 50grand subaru so dropping some cash into a small car to make it that quick would be awsome. That has been the formula for my 70 chev pickup and my former Camaro, build a big block for cheap and kill anything else at the lights.

[why?]

Its about embarissing others more than anything. Taking a Yaris and making it faster than cars twice as expensive.

[soros151]

Its about embarissing others more than anything. Taking a Yaris and making it faster than cars twice as expensive.

That's exactly what I mean! :thumbup: Take on the big boys with the little guns!

[captainzerocool]

Any type of serious adding of power, like forced induction, will shorten engine life.

The choice is always between mpg or hp.

However, a new intake, a full exhaust system, lightened flywheel, etc, things that will free up hp by removing restrictions and weight should not shorten the life of the engine.

Those mods will EXTEND the life of a well maintained engine as well as add more power.

[soros151]

Not to bash, but if more stress is put on the motor it will wear out faster, thats a physics law. Put enough stress on a piece and it will eventually break, even if it takes a while.

[bulldogs2k]

i say wait for a turbo. Till then we can find out where/how to beef up the internals and prep for the change. My friend with a turbo s2k colored his intercooler black for the sleeper affect. If I had to go boost with the yaris/s2k, i would probably do the same.

[ChinoCharles]

i say wait for a turbo. Till then we can find out where/how to beef up the internals and prep for the change.

Agreed

[bulldogs2k]

Agreed

damn right!!!:thumbup: :burnrubber:

all we have to do is wait. :cool:

I can use the down time to explain "why" we need boost to my gf.

[Kr0n1k]

http://www.stratisautosport.gr/en/products/car.php?id=43#STAGE%20I%20TURBO%20(1NZ-FE,2NZ-FE)

Although made for the same motor, I dunno what would fit in the new Yaris. However, an HKS kit would be nice. That, and some forged internals.

[soros151]

WOW, nice web!

[Katana]

Well this guy lives next to me in Greece!Haha!!!

[fnkngrv]

http://www.stratisautosport.gr/en/products/car.php?id=43#STAGE%20I%20TURBO%20(1NZ-FE,2NZ-FE)

Although made for the same motor, I dunno what would fit in the new Yaris. However, an HKS kit would be nice. That, and some forged internals.


If you notice one of the options they give is the 4E-FTE which I believe that I had mentioned earlier...I wonder how much is involved....the Echo and Yaris didn't share the same motor mounts with the Starlet and Tercel for example did they???

[OxyG3nE]

i want my yaris to get 150 200 hp. not much even if it cost me 10k i will be able to say i am one of the guy who have a yaris turbo in canada lol

[Kr0n1k]

150hp is most likely pretty obtainable with a turbo kit, seems as though the Blitz SC kits have put down 141whp on a dyno a couple of times on xA's/xB's on ScionLife, I would think with out the parastic losses of turning a compressor, a turbo kit such as the Greddy kit for the 1NZFE should easily put down 150whp. What hasn't really been disscused anywhere, is porting and polishing the head, or any type of valve work.

[soros151]

Here you go, info on port and polish on the 1NZ-FE... :wink:

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=67782&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0

[RossP]

Guys unfortunately we seem to be forgetting that these turbo kits etc that are available for the Scion Xb/MK1 Yaris/Vitz are designed to work in bigger engine spaces (lets admit the new Yaris doesn't have the most room under the bonnet). So these kits will fit, but will need a lot of modifications to fit the new Yaris properly. as for the 4e-fte sawp, can't say i see it happening in the new yaris

[OxyG3nE]

soros151.. without puttinga turbo its possible to get like 24hp ? like in the post u puted

[soros151]

Not enough room!? Dude, open your hood again and check. There is a LOTTT of room there. I think there has been enough arguments about space. I think that if there is space for a 2ZZ, there is enough room for a turbo kit.

[soros151]

I actually read the whole thing for the 1NZ, but it was a long time ago. Sorry if I don't remember all the details, but I think that he eventually even lose some power when they did something to the stock intake manifold. They actually make some good points on the 1NZ.

[RoninMax]

I think the biggest problem is the camshaft. There is no one out there to make aftermarket performance camshaft. You can put a ITB on the 1NZFE but the stock camshaft is so low lift than the ITB set up is usless. I am always a NA guy. On the other hand, the Blitz supercharger is a pretty good piece since you can choose to start you supercharge in OFF, LOW, MID, HIGH. So if you dont want to use the supercharger, you can just turn it off.
Unlike the Greddy one, They are always on.

[ChinoCharles]

While we are on the topic of N/A, what do you guys think are realistic numbers for a done up N/A Yaris? We're talking pistons, rods, cams, ITB's, everything. I always had more respect for people that tuned their cars without the use of FI. However, I don't think the 1NZFE is potent enough to put up any kind of numbers without FI. What do you all think?

[heylookitsjames]

I think it really depends on how much money you want to put in it... look at the much more primitive 4AGE... look at how much power the Forumla Atlantic version makes... I'm sure the 1NZFE could be built to have similar numbers to that, but it'd be mostly useless on the street. I assume you could get near what the greddy charger gives and still have it be streetable.

[riceboy]

but why sink so much money into this car?? having a nice looking customized car w/ some pep is one thing.. but putting anything more than 10g's is getting kind of out there...

[SimmZ]

I must admit I don't read all reply to that threat. Just by reading the initial question, I think it doesn't make sens. "Yaris" and "performance" in the same phrase doesn't make sense. "Yaris" and "cheap car", or "fuel economic", or "reliable cheap car" is more credible.

I don't buy an Echo for performance, I buy it because it was cheap and the fuel economy is awesome. It was very reliable too.

[eTiMaGo]

As far as I know the engine should be able to handle a good amount of power from a turbo. Here in Thailand there is another car called the Soluna Vios, basically a mini sedan, which also comes in a factory turbo version, but the engine is the same as the Yaris, and does 143HP. Here's abit of info:

http://paultan.org/archives/2005/11/26/toyota-vios-turbo/

So in theory it may be possible to transplant that engine into a yaris :D

[ChinoCharles]

Interesting...

[w1ngzer0]

i think with this motor just get intake exhaust and header and be done with it and then get coilovers, sways and kick ass

Don't forget engine management :thumbup:

[ItsMyDaily]

probably be cheaper to just swap in the 2zz, or even maybe a k20 motor to get good power. It is very doable, and you'll be making more power then the car could ever make NA, or with a turbo by just adding a stock motor swap. The recent super street had a honda fit on the cover with a k20 making around 240whp!!!

[sam07yaris]

K20 swap with exact engine mounts to a 2z yaris engine? Are pigs flying or what?lol

[soros151]

K20 swap with exact engine mounts to a 2z yaris engine? Are pigs flying or what?lol

VERY TRUE!! :iono:

[ItsMyDaily]

K20 swap with exact engine mounts to a 2z yaris engine? Are pigs flying or what?lol

What does your statement mean exactly I don't get it??:iono:

K20 swap would probably be the best upgrade as far as swaps go. So what if your going with a Honda engine. Probably will need to get Custom Mounts, but the car will be a beast. Considering it weigh it lot less then the rsx also.

[ChinoCharles]

Eww, Toyota with Honda engine. Stay true to your manufacturer, kiddies.

[ItsMyDaily]

Eww, Toyota with Honda engine. Stay true to your manufacturer, kiddies.

Honestly though if your looking for is performence out of the Yaris then who cares what you put into it.

[ChinoCharles]

If you're looking for severe performance out of a Yaris, you should have bought a Fit.

[ItsMyDaily]

If you're looking for severe performance out of a Yaris, you should have bought a Fit.

I agree! That is why I didn't buy the Fit :wink:

[soros151]

I really would enjoy a more toyota way, since the car u are using is a toyota. Cause if you are going with the engine of another brand greater problems will arise as plugs and electronic signals from other components. We are talking here, I think of a DD Yaris with 2ZZ swap, which I think is more..."in the line".

[Violin]

Has anyone read about the Mazdaspeed 3?

Nearly 300 HP in a Yaris would be insane... no?

[w1ngzer0]

whats the stock exhaust pipe width on the yaris?

[MWill517]

Has anyone read about the Mazdaspeed 3?

Nearly 300 HP in a Yaris would be insane... no?
Was on the Mazda site today checking it out. Daydreaming of that power in the Yaris. That would be Sweet! But, I think I prefer the great mpg over performance for my daily ride. For a weekend ride would be awesome!

[soros151]

If you like to see good performance and huge great MPG, see the article in the HCI magazine called 50MPG. A turbo Sprint with 50MPG and very good amount of performance power. AWSOME!

[bulldogs2k]

damn....all these new cars are making my S2000 feel dated when it comes to performance. :( All these econo box's are now hitting 300s with ease!

[ChinoCharles]

I wouldn't say ease, haha. You'd need a miracle (or about 20k) to throw 300 hp in a Yaris!

[Katana]

It's a Yaris guys, not a Mitsubishi Evolution IX.

The chassis cannot handle that power and no driver could drive it.

[bulldogs2k]

I agree with that! As light as the yarii is, you wouldn't need much to get it moving. I would be happy to get 140 hp, thats more than enough to get it moving. With that being said, I wouldn't want to sacrifice MPG for performance. Tuff call!

[Notthy[Yaris/S]07]

if you looked for speed you bought a EVO MR not a Yaris

[soros151]

someties u have to do with what u got. Maybe he doesn't have the money for an EVO, like me. :thumbdown:

[Notthy[Yaris/S]07]

someties u have to do with what u got. Maybe he doesn't have the money for an EVO, like me. :thumbdown:


lol in this case buy a yaris ahahah

creo que te conosco tu estas en SE Chapter PR?

[soros151]

07;42419']lol in this case buy a yaris ahahah

creo que te conosco tu estas en SE Chapter PR?

Yep, qn eres? Yo soy Eddie, representante publico de Mayaguez. :thumbup:

[punch]

someties u have to do with what u got. Maybe he doesn't have the money for an EVO, like me. :thumbdown:

also i'm sure the insurance on the evo is a tad higher then the yaris

[soros151]

also i'm sure the insurance on the evo is a tad higher then the yaris

OUCH! :laugh:

[YarisPR]

Yep, qn eres? Yo soy Eddie, representante publico de Mayaguez. :thumbup:

De MayaWest!?!?! eso esss jajaja soy d maya tambn :thumbsup:

[soros151]

Qn eres? Pa ver si nos conocemos? :D Yo me reuno con el club Scion Evolution en el Town de Maya, los miercoles a las 8:45-9:00 para alante.

[Black Yaris]

English por favor

[soros151]

Just saying That we have seen each other here in the Island.

[graywolf_14]

Ok basicly if you are looking for minimal gains go with the usual cai,exhaust,header,cam(if or when they make one),lightened pullys, plugs&wires and maby a ground kit. But if you are looking for some more you might try getting your head ported and polished to match your header and get your intake ported. Course I dont know about these cars but my talon and my old festiva it helped to rewire the fuel pump with larger wire. Oh and I know there are some companese that do custom computer work so you could get ur computer remaped. But I dont really think it would be hard to get 120hp n/a. But it beeing a light car your going to get the most out of the suspension and brakes but more hp never a bad thing.