Just an observation...

[Captain Slow]

I have no idea the automotive history of the vast majority of you here on the boards but I've noticed that I seem to be the only one amazed at how well the little 1NZFE responds to mods. I see many of you complain that the Yaris is slow and it makes me wonder why you purchased the car then? Necessity I suppose instead of choice.

Coming from owning things like a Trans Am, Supra turbo, 300ZX turbo, 280zx, Fiero V6, Mustang GT, BMW 325i, a plethora of Hondas, Lancer Ralliart, 2 Miatas, and all kinds of other cars that I've done some work to I was absolutely floored at how well the Yaris' little motor responds.

Upon purchasing the Yaris I had made up my mind that being an econo-box and made by Toyota that it wouldn't make any extra power with bolt-ons. After joining these forums and seeing gains like Garm's 13whp from I/H/E (so near 15hp at the flywheel) I was :eyebulge:

I had several 2.0L+ I4 motors in the past that wouldn't even break 10whp gains from those mods. Now with Garm's intake manifold, a 1ZZ throttle body, VVT-i controller and the other mods out there a gain of 20hp at the flywheel with bolt-ons seems totally realistic...let me tell you that that is a very significant number from a 106hp 1.5L engine. I can't think of another 1.5L out there that responds as well actually, especially not one that has a decent torque curve like the 1NZFE.



No real point to this post other than to say, "Quit complaining, many folks have spent way more money to make way less power out of a small 4 cylinder engine."

If you really want something more powerful just save that modding dough for a faster car, if you're like me, over 30 now, have a kid, drive 90% city miles and wanted a fun little car to toss around then you're in the right place.

[BEEF]

I feel you on a lot of those points. I am 33 and have a daughter and drive roughly 500 miles weekly.

I think a bigger gripe is no the bolt-ons themself or the power gains from them but the price of them. anyone that had a camaro or mustang is used to paying a very small amount for bolt-on performance. I have chocked it up to demand. many more people want to modify their mustangs than yarii out there. we are a small community and though that makes us unique, it also means we pay a premium price for certain things.

overall I am happy with the yaris. I would like it to be a rocket ship (via turbo or supercharger) but have come to the conclusion that other things are more important. I just bought a house (litreally last friday) and am getting married this summer. I have a child and my GF has a child so I will be family manning it up. I do have disposable income but would rather it go to the family than just me.

I am still having a hard time with ~$900 for an intake manifold. I guess that is my biggest gripe. there again, it is a one off part that was made just for this community.

[Captain Slow]

Same here, I decided it was time to stop playing with expensive sports cars and just get a tinker-toy I could play with on a budget. I'd always said that once I was married and had a kid I'd get an older Civic hatch or something to play with that wasn't too ridiculous. Compared to domestic things like Mustangs and Camaros, yes parts are expensive for the Yaris, but compared to stuff like BMWs they're not bad at all, trust me.

The intake manifold from MI is probably the only part that I see as a bit too expensive...but it's not their fault, they had to contract out a manufacturing company to make a unique part, so it's gonna be pricey.

All that said though I can spend a good deal less money per horsepower on the Yaris than just about any other 4cyl I've had because the bolt-ons actually do something more than just make it louder/stinkier.

[Golddeenoh]

yea, it isn't the grains, it is the cost that hold me back. granted I am only 26, back in school, married and throwing around the idea of children in the near future and as much as I want to take every dime i have that isn't going to bills to be put into my little car. I have the be reasonable and either save up the money to put into my daily driver or jut get another toy car to play with.

The joys of being responsible.

[Captain Slow]

hmm, I guess it's just my experience with high performance japanese and german cars but I find that I can easily do all of the bolt-ons I want for my little Yaris in the 2-3k range, considerably less than most cars I've had before actually.

[UberSilver]

I need to agree(to some extent), as I have no issues with the stock power of this little 2300lb car. I do get some amusement from folks buying this small low cost economy car, then whining about power output.

As cars go, the Yaris has a lot to offer, and has a lot going for it, even at 106 hp.

I'd really like to see Toyota release a Yaris Sport with 160~200 hp, getting 36 mpg. And keep the weight under 2300lb.

As far as boltOn power go's, That's Toyota! They over build there engines. Every Toyota I've owned would make a bunch more power with little effort.

The only non Toyota engine I've ever owned that responded better to boltOn stuff, was a Mazda rotary.

[Golddeenoh]

yea my n/a list is totaled at close to 6k in total and since my wife is perfectly fine with me getting an old fox body to play with and that i can get one of those for 3-3.5k i might as well invest in that direction and retain my daily driver.

not to mention that even with those mods I would have to be putting 260hp to the wheels to be able to even keep up with some of the guys i know with n/a Hondas and despite the abilty of the 1NZ to take mods I don't see it making that much power with out forced induction.

[tooter]

You got me thinking about the cost per horsepower...
So I checked out all of the posted dyno charts and the best graph of a completely bone stock Yaris makes 91hp at the wheels on a DynoJet.

With only simple bolt on mods, no tuning, and regular 87 pump gas I ended up with 110 (110.73) at the wheels on a DynoJet.

So I added up the total cost:

$400 axleback exhaust
$209 exhaust header
$450 intake manifold
$125 throttle body
$200 intake and filter

The total comes to $1,384 for over 19 horsepower. So far I've recovered $150 from selling the stock intake manifold and stock exhaust that were replaced. So that brings the total down to $1,234.

Dividing $1,234 by 19 comes out to $65 per horsepower. I think that's pretty cheap power. :smile:

[suckerface]

FWIW, the cost on the Yaris parts isn't that bad. I found it a bit of a tough pill to swallow, but then I bought a MINI.

Those Cobb APs that Subaru uses, you know the ones that are around $3-400? Yeah, the MINI version is $900. Intake? Close to $300. Akrapovic DP and exhaust? $2700. Don't even get me started on suspension...

My pocket book misses the Yaris more than I do!

[4/20 NEVER FORGET]

I'm 33, no kids with no plans to ever have them. I bought the Yaris as a replacement for the Honda Civic hatchbacks I have had in the past as I didn't want a car that attracted attention or might get stolen. I couldn't bring myself to get a Honda Fit because of the SOHC engine, I thought the lighter weight and DOHC engine of the Yaris to be a better starting platform if I chose to modify it in the future.

I told myself I wouldn't modify it until I got it paid off and the warranty expired. I paid it off about a year ago and it rolled over 35k miles about the same time, I quickly put on a Tein suspension and started looking at what might be done about making it go faster. I was sad at the lack of aftermarket for this car, while understandable, the Civic/Fit is roughly in the same category as the Yaris, yet the aftermarket was huge. I've been pumped to see the progression of both tooter and MI in making manifolds for the car, but even after buying the MI manifold, the car is not a rocket ship. I know I will eventually have to buy another Honda as a weekend car and swap in a big engine to get the speed I want.

That said, this car, the way I've modified it so far, is an excellent commuter. It gets awesome gas mileage, attracts no attention, and is an absolute blast to drive. Win-win. I just wish the transmission was a little smoother. God I miss Honda transmissions.

I've still got some modifying left to do yet, but I told myself I would never go FI with this car. It's my commuter, the last thing I want is to mess with reliability and gas mileage. On the plus side, this car handles surprisingly well, probably better than my CRX when I had Koni Yellows with Ground Control springs and top-hats.

[tooter]

We use our Yaris in a similar manner as you do. And while I've been having lots of fun playing around with it, it's still our daily driver. So like you, I never do anything to decrease the reliability of the engine or reduce the gas mileage.:thumbsup:

[BEEF]

I would love to see a yaris with the scion tC motor in it. 2.5 liters and 180hp. that would be sweet. also, if toyota made it from the factory, it would be guaranteed to work and last a long time.

Most of the mods are within family for other vehicle manufacturers. I think it is just certain things that get me. I just can't see spending that kind of money on the intake manifold... I've thought about it hard.

I think also it is what you want the mods to do and why you are getting them. I got a resonator back mandrel bent 2" exhaust with glass packed muffler for less than the axle backs out there. it makes more power, costs less, and doesn't draw too much attention. I am not into flash and that is a big reason some people go for certain mods.

[mazilla]

I bought mine for 2500 and thought there would never be an aftermarket for the little commuter car...I don't even want to do the math on what I've spent.

[cali yaris]

I would love to see a yaris with the scion tC motor in it. 2.5 liters and 180hp. that would be sweet.

A Zage kit will net you 160-170 whp and not add much weight, nor require any frame modifications or custom fabrication. Way cheaper, just as reliable. Not to mention the transmission nightmare with the tC motor.

If you're gonna do a swap, make at least 800 hp with it. :thumbsup:

[Captain Slow]

Yeah, I really don't have a problem with the $ per hp cost of modifying this little car. Sure there are less cheap eBay versions of stuff around but still lots of good quality parts.

Take into account the fact that the 1990 Mazda Miata made 115hp and weighed around 2100lbs...that puts the Yaris (especially modified) solidly into Miata quickness territory. I owned 2 Miatas and neither were 'fast" but they certainly surprised a lot of people too.

Power to weight ratios mean a hell of a lot in the real world. Below 1:21 means 1 horsepower for every 21 pounds of weight.

Yaris (unmodified) 1:21
Yaris (I/H/E) 1:17.9
Miata (1.6L) 1:18.3
Honda Fit (2013) 1:21.3
Mazda 2 (2012) 1:23.1
Nissan Versa 1:21.6
1996 Civic hb 1:21.2
1998 Mustang v6 1:20.4
1992 240sx 1:17.7

Take a long look at that list, the Yaris has one of the best power to weight ratios of any recent hatchback (other than special models like Civic Si, etc...) even when in stock form. Very impressive.

Imagine with some lightweight wheels and pulleys, remove the rear seats and spare tire, intake, exhaust, header, MI manifold, 1ZZ tb and a free flowing midpipe...I think the Yaris could easily hit 1:15 or 1:16.

[BEEF]

Garm,

I honestly wouldn't do either. I was late on the trigger with that Blitz for $1300 just a few days ago (still kicking myself for that one). I just think it would be nice to have a power option for the yaris. even the 1.8 liter in the yaris. there is a guy on here from south africa that has one. that would be awesome.

all,

A friend of mine once said that when it comes to making power, everyone goes for the low hanging fruit but if you want more and more you have to pay more and more. that really struck me. eventually all the relatively cheap and easy bolt-ons have been done and you either have to be happy where you are or spend some money to get to that next level. (sucks to be at that point)

[Captain Slow]

Exactly, which is kinda why I'm glad I'm not going FI...it'll just start an addiction again. I promised myself when I got the Yaris that I'd only modify it enough to make it a little faster and still a comfy daily driver.

[cali yaris]

A 1.8L swap would be fairly easy and a pretty nice bump. The Yaris TS comes with that, so mounts would not be hard to source, and you could mate it to the 6-speed. Nice.

[Captain Slow]

Likely when these cars are a little older and you can find a used 1.8L a little easier it will be a more popular mod. For now I'm plenty impressed with the bolt-ons. Just can't wait to see a dyno showing the new MI manifold along with some other mods.

[why?]

you make me want to get my car on a scale and then go dyno it.

I can't use the power and handling ability my car has now. I'm just not the type to drive 3 hours for an event full of people i don't know to spend who knows how much to autocross or get on a drag strip.

The Yaris is just so dirt cheap to do everything. My Viggin was $1000 to do anything with. The wheels were a mandatory swap because they were garbage. If you full throttled the thing on take off it would go sideways, not forward. And don't start with mods. And then the price for 93 octane gas and 29 mpg at best.

More to the point, they cost $13 grand brand new. Most cars, even used, that we would want would be more, so mods still don't break the bank compared to buying a BRZ, a used TT Supra, or basically any sporty vehicle.

How many cars can you say you bought brand new, and including all maintenance and mods has still cost less than $20 grand in this day and age?

and honda's are overrated, even with the decades of tech they have had to put into mods. And even then, with so called turned key engine swaps, they are not cheap at all.

[UberSilver]

So me and my Yaris come in at 2500lb. So all I need is 250hp to get a nice 1:10 ratio:biggrin: If I had no concern about mpg, a rotary out of a RX8 would do it.

But I do like the near 40 mpg I get, so I'll leave it alone. Plus my bike is 1:3.5 with me on it:cool:. And thats my extreme fun ride.:drool:


Yeah, I really don't have a problem with the $ per hp cost of modifying this little car. Sure there are less cheap eBay versions of stuff around but still lots of good quality parts.

Take into account the fact that the 1990 Mazda Miata made 115hp and weighed around 2100lbs...that puts the Yaris (especially modified) solidly into Miata quickness territory. I owned 2 Miatas and neither were 'fast" but they certainly surprised a lot of people too.

Power to weight ratios mean a hell of a lot in the real world. Below 1:21 means 1 horsepower for every 21 pounds of weight.

Yaris (unmodified) 1:21
Yaris (I/H/E) 1:17.9
Miata (1.6L) 1:18.3
Honda Fit (2013) 1:21.3
Mazda 2 (2012) 1:23.1
Nissan Versa 1:21.6
1996 Civic hb 1:21.2
1998 Mustang v6 1:20.4
1992 240sx 1:17.7

Take a long look at that list, the Yaris has one of the best power to weight ratios of any recent hatchback (other than special models like Civic Si, etc...) even when in stock form. Very impressive.

Imagine with some lightweight wheels and pulleys, remove the rear seats and spare tire, intake, exhaust, header, MI manifold, 1ZZ tb and a free flowing midpipe...I think the Yaris could easily hit 1:15 or 1:16.

[tooter]

But I do like the near 40 mpg I get, so I'll leave it alone. Plus my bike is 1:3.5 with me on it:cool:. And thats my extreme fun ride.:drool:

Wow...:eek: what bike do you ride?
My 400 is a pitiful 1:12.5! :laugh:

[cali yaris]

Is it whp to weight? 1:5.6

Or do you count bhp? 1:5.0

:laugh:

[mr_miles]

So me and my Yaris come in at 2500lb. So all I need is 250hp to get a nice 1:10 ratio:biggrin: If I had no concern about mpg, a rotary out of a RX8 would do it.

But I do like the near 40 mpg I get, so I'll leave it alone. Plus my bike is 1:3.5 with me on it:cool:. And thats my extreme fun ride.:drool:

Oh god don't get the renesis. Lol Mazda destroyed rotaries with that engine, in my opinion. they do fly pretty good when they're totally stripped and let free - but for less money you can get a 20b from a cosmo, which = lots more power :)

my yar comes in at 2100 pounds without me, yayyyyy. need more power to balance it out!

[Captain Slow]

I always measure everything in flywheel horsepower. Why? Because if I'm comparing it to a new car using the manufacturer's specs they're always listed that way. I want to know how much the MOTOR makes, not what gets to the ground. You always have to assume a 10-20% drivetrain loss on any vehicle.

As for the comment on Hondas, the 1980s and 1990s Hondas were good, massive horsepower (albeit shitty torque numbers) from very small I4 engines. After the year 2000 though most Hondas are shit, they turned into granny cars that are difficult to mod. Not only that but the build quality has gone down significantly. I disliked Toyotas from the 90s (except for Supra obviously) but in the last 4-5 years they've gotten much sportier.

[BEEF]

I think the biggest thing for me (on hondas) are they have gotten very fat.

I think most car companies have done that though. gone are the days of the 1800lb car. I would love to have a new car that was 1600lbs.

side note: first car was a 3 cylinder geo metro (1650lbs)