Unique Smell from Air Going Through AC Blower

[EddieCabael]

Whoever has the same problem of mine and got solved or you haven't had an experience for the same problem with me --- but you have idea, please come out and please help get solve my problem:

Please do reply in English or Tagalog, although I used English Version here:

Problem Details and situation/scenario:


At the beginning of this year in late Feb-2013 I started to smell like burnt plastic or like metal to metal friction smell coming from my AC Blower.

I just ignored until June-2013. But I am not relaxed because I know there's already an accumulation of car air pollution with me.

When my Clutch Pedal was making noise I brought my car for maintenance and the company did repair my clutch telling they replaced the clutch disk with new one but they just made a machine works for the affected area of the Ply Wheel or whatever you may call it. After this the clutch noise was removed and made Big OK.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

Around August-2013 my AC Cooling system has a poor cooling and I brought my car to the company for checking and they replaced my AC Compressor.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

Around September-2013 my AC Cooling system has still a failure and that the smoke direct from the Panel (from AC Blower) is coming out but there is not enough cooling inside the car. I brought my car to the company for checking and they replaced my AC Freezer or Talaja as they call it. The car cooling now is excellent.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

I remembered I hit one big plastic, the one being used in wrapping big carton, and it wrapped my exhaust pipe, that time I cut some but most have remained wrapping my exhaust pipe, lately when I checked --- the plastic remains got melted and wrapped around my exhaust pipe and I brought to outside shop to remove the same. And the exhaust pipe was cleaned and that melted plastic around my exhaust pipe from rear side was completely removed.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

I checked my dashboard and opened all to see which one is not closing or opening whenever there is a switching from AC Blower recycling or not recycling. I found out all are in good order and all are functioning.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

I checked my AC Drainage system and found OK and nothing is blocked and that AC moisture water is going through that AC Drainage system or AC Moisture hose completely OK.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

I checked my AC blower air filter in front of passenger side and found empty but there's a slot for a purpose and I inquired from many and they said there must be filter in it and I bought new one and I fixed by myself through Internet Tutorial. And I was able to have it done. The Talaja is still new and being used in less than a month for now, so late providing for the AC Blower Air Filter is not a big deal.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.

What is left now on how to find the source of that smell nobody knows.

My Sedan Yaris 2010 Car was purchased on October-26-2010 and is no longer in warranty period after such long trouble shoot, the smell problem remains.

I found just today 06-Nov-2013, that my AC Valve is exposed, leaving spaces from left/right/top/bottom of the AC Valve --- which I am thinking maybe it will cause to suck the air and throw it to the car inside because of air pressure from the engine. If the pressure from the air engine while ON could not penetrate through the created surrounding spaces from the AC Valve because the blower is set to close or in recycling air setting (where it is taking air from inside the car only and rotating therein) and not the one if open (taking from front side air and throwing at the rear side).

But if there is such kind of smell in case the smell is coming from the accumulated hot air from the engine --- then the smell never stops and it will go through the car inside regardless of AC Blower setting whether recycling or not --- because of such surrounding spaces from the AC Valve.

I remember before, I was searching my AC Valve location and I cannot find because the AC Valve was concealed and covered --- only piping was exposed --- but now, the AC Valve itself is also exposed --- maybe some mechanic did forget to have it covered. Or maybe the AC Valve is by manufacturer's default is really exposed, this I don't know.

I went crazy thinking because of this unwanted smell is mostly occurring while the car moves from the it’s parking being parked of around 3 hours --- means while the car came from cool engine, when the smell is coming out, it’s not continues and the smell is gone but it is sometimes worst. When the car is in stop position but engine and AC are working, it never gives that smell.

While car is running, only two functions are smell suspects: From the Clutch and From the Brake --- but clutch and brake functions now are excellent.

But the problem is --- the smell still there.


And even also my back compartment is clean.


What is left now to find solution and get solve this unwanted smell going through my AC Blower in my front side and going into my lungs in almost more than half year now.

Thanks to all of you,

Edito Tizon Cabael (Eddie Cabael)

[CTScott]

Many here in the US have had a similar experience with a small from the AC system. I believe that there are two separate issues. The first and most common one is debris in the air getting into the air box (because the filter is not installed). It mixes with the condensate water and makes a musty swamp like odor.

The second issue is with the evaporator itself. The evaporator is the radiator for the air conditioning that is inside of the air box, under the dash. In the US Toyota posted a factory service bulletin for 2007-2008 Yaris where they would replace the evaporator if a persistent odor problem occurred.

I recently had the opportunity to completely disassemble the air conditioning system on a Yaris that I was parting out. This one did not have an odor problem, but I wanted to see how possible it would be to completely clean the evaporator with it still installed in the air box.

The car that I took apart did have a filter installed and I found no debris in the bottom of the air box. The evaporator did have a coating on it from the very tiny particles that would go through the filter. Putting my nose against it, it did have an odor, so I cleaned it well and the odor was gone. Unfortunately, since the evaporator is mounted high within the air box, it would not be possible to clean it this way while it is installed in the car. Using the specialty air conditioning cleaning sprays would not work either, as I found that significant water pressure was necessary (along with a cleansing solution) to remove the odor causing coating from the evaporator.

I believe that the problem is that the evaporator is made of raw aluminum and that the rough surface of the aluminum allows things to easily adhere to it. If one of my Yaris started to have this issue I would remove the evaporator, clean it thoroughly and then anodize it or at least in some way seal the surface of the aluminum.


Below are pictures to explain it better and show why I don't think it can be properly cleaned while still installed:

This is what the air box looks line once removed from under the dash:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirboxFront_zpsb9199222.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirboxFront_zpsb9199222.jpg.html)

This is a side view showing where the blower connects to the air box at the bottom and you can see the condensate drain hose as well:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirBox-RightSide_zpsb561153d.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirBox-RightSide_zpsb561153d.jpg.html)


This is a view down into the air box from the top. You can see the fins of the evaporator though the output at the top:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirBox-InsidefromTop_zps6c79a10e.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/AirBox-InsidefromTop_zps6c79a10e.jpg.html)

The air box separates into a top and a bottom section. The top section contains the heater core (which is the radiator for the heat). It seems to stay clean, since all of the air has to flow through the evaporator before it gets to the heater core:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/HeaterCoreLocation_zps6da733a4.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/HeaterCoreLocation_zps6da733a4.jpg.html)

This is the heater core removed from the air box:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/HeaterCoreRemoved_zps0068b52b.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/HeaterCoreRemoved_zps0068b52b.jpg.html)

This is the bottom section of the air box. The evaporator fills the entire space. This picture was taken after I cleaned the evaporator. Before I cleaned it there was a brown layer completely coating it:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/EvaporatorExposed_zps7faf5fae.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/EvaporatorExposed_zps7faf5fae.jpg.html)

This is the bottom of the air box with the evaporator removed. The reason that I say that the evaporator can not really be properly cleaned while mounted is that the evaporator sits higher than the blower, so you would not be able to soak the evaporator without filling the blower. Even if you removed the blower and sprayed the evaporator from underneath you would not be able to get the entire bottom surface of the evaporator because of the steps at the bottom of the air box:
http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo163/ctscott329/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/EvaporatorRemoved_zpscbd04ef2.jpg (http://s372.photobucket.com/user/ctscott329/media/Yaris%20-%20AC%20Disassembly/EvaporatorRemoved_zpscbd04ef2.jpg.html)

[EddieCabael]

Thank you very much for your Detailed Illustrations CTScott.

When I brought my Car to the Company somewhere in first week of September-2013, the time that my car was still within the warranty period or before the warranty expired on 26-Oct-2013. It was my AC another complain (after they changed with new one my AC Air Compressor) for AC Poor Cooling again. This time, they did change my evaporator as shown in your picture above --- in my detailed problem details I mentioned it as Talaja (Arabic) and in someway Talaja means Freezer so I did mention also the Freezer from my Detailed Problems --- but it is exactly the same one as evaporator in your picture because one Company Mechanic representative showed to me that evaporator after they removed from the Air Box with almost 2/3 brown dirt coated in it. That Mechanic told me that they are replacing the evaporator itself with new one. If they replaced with new one, this will be by trust only because they showed me no more after that.

I was used to search for another reason of that unwanted smell because I presumed that the company executing the repair under warranty period will do that in the manner it is required --- but I have no hint if it was done up to the extent of cleaning the complete Air Box Assembly before putting the new evaporator. Because if the installation of the new evaporator was not done in the manner you have shown above, cleaning first the complete Air Box assembly before putting the new evaporator as replacement, then 99% chances the unwanted smell begins from there.

Now this becomes a real confusion from my side as the Yaris Car Owner being not as a Car Mechanic because my every move or decision needs the repair charges being the car is already out of warranty simply due to my current situation as having financial limitations. It seems further that I would be needing to trouble shoot the problem doing all along again what was considered or presumed already done just to trace the odor.

The following maybe my practical expensive remedies to trace and solve the AC Blower odor: (expensive because I need to bring to the outside shop not anymore to Car warranty)

1) Rework the AC System --- up to the extent of cleaning the inside/out of Air Box before installing evaporator. After this observe the car for at least 3 days to one week. If the odor is still there...

2) Rework for the Brake System --- check all the brake shoes and brake pads including the brake drums at the back and the brake disks at the front. After this observe the car for at least 3 days to one week. If the odor is still there...

3) Rework for the Gear Box Clutch System --- like clutch disk, pressure plate, and the release bearing etc. After this observe the car for at least 3 days to one week. If the odor is still there... replace the engine, or replace the car. Really I don't know what to do more.

The puzzle now is why make reworks? The Car is in very good running conditions: with full functions as to AC, Clutch, Brakes.

That reworks are only to search for that unwanted smell going through my AC Air Blower and accumulating into my LUNGS because of Driver's Breathing.

Thank so much for sharing your thoughts with me and to the world.

Edito Tizon Cabael (EddieCabael)

[CTScott]

At this point I would pull the top of the dash off to gain access to look into the airbox to see if the evaporator is coated again (that is much easier than trying to remove the entire air box). With the dash top off you can also clean out the ducts. If the evaporator was cleaned or replaced, the ducts may still be very dirty and may be the source of the odor.

Do you notice a difference with the smell if you switch between recirculate and outside air?

[EddieCabael]

Yes there is a difference. When it is switched to recirculate, that's when the smell problem comes while car is running only. I tried in stop position while the engine is working and AC is ON, the smell problem never comes.

If switched to outside air the unwanted smell is fading or unnoticeable.

I am using my car 4 times driving session in a day running an average of 100 kilometers during that day.

I can tell that my car is giving unwanted smell every day for around more than 6 months up to present. But I cannot tell everyday and every driving session because there are times the car is running without such pollution. When the car is heavily used without switching off the engine and with AC being switched to ON, the more chances the car has no smell, maybe because the odor deposit is already thrown away from the place where it originated.

[EddieCabael]

In this URL, it will show how my post was displayed in Middle East Forum:

http://i.imgur.com/FTMQORi.png

It is written Moved: before the post title and on the columns as to viewer or replies it shows dash (-)

Is it to mean that my post is removed in the Forum? And therefore no any other replies it can generate?

[EddieCabael]

Yes my Friend, CTScott

Please tell me if my idea is correct. If I am near to arrive in pinpointing the cause of my problem "Unique Smell from Air Going Through AC Blower". Let us presume that the work in my Air Box regarding the Cooler was done accordingly as my AC Cooling now is excellent.

In the AC Cooling System inside the Air Box, there is that Cooler and the Heater. What if the Heater has a leak --- because when I had the poor cooling problem, they may have concentrated to work only on the Cooler --- disregarding whatever is the part for the Heater therein and what about if there is air leak on the part of the Heater, would there be chance of accumulating dirt in it because of moisture --- if the AC Blower is on, is there any chance the air blower sucks that one (being accumulated dirt) that will come from the heater? That will create such a bad smell?

In Saudi Arabia, there is extreme temperature both Cold and Hot but in Jeddah Saudi Arabia where I am now, no body is using Car Heater including me.

Just for the purpose of checking that smell, I made set my Car Heater ON and the first blow of air inside the car using car heater is similar to my problem in question although that problem of mine for the unwanted smell, when it comes --- is more suffocating --- maybe because --- if there is accumulated dirt on the part of the heater and stuck through the AC Air Blower there will be chances for more suffocating smell as exactly the smell in question?

Best regards,

Edito Tizon Cabael (EddieCabael)

[CTScott]

Yes my Friend, CTScott

Please tell me if my idea is correct. If I am near to arrive in pinpointing the cause of my problem "Unique Smell from Air Going Through AC Blower". Let us presume that the work in my Air Box regarding the Cooler was done accordingly as my AC Cooling now is excellent.

In the AC Cooling System inside the Air Box, there is that Cooler and the Heater. What if the Heater has a leak --- because when I had the poor cooling problem, they may have concentrated to work only on the Cooler --- disregarding whatever is the part for the Heater therein and what about if there is air leak on the part of the Heater, would there be chance of accumulating dirt in it because of moisture --- if the AC Blower is on, is there any chance the air blower sucks that one (being accumulated dirt) that will come from the heater? That will create such a bad smell?

In Saudi Arabia, there is extreme temperature both Cold and Hot but in Jeddah Saudi Arabia where I am now, no body is using Car Heater including me.

Just for the purpose of checking that smell, I made set my Car Heater ON and the first blow of air inside the car using car heater is similar to my problem in question although that problem of mine for the unwanted smell, when it comes --- is more suffocating --- maybe because --- if there is accumulated dirt on the part of the heater and stuck through the AC Air Blower there will be chances for more suffocating smell as exactly the smell in question?

Best regards,

Edito Tizon Cabael (EddieCabael)


It could be the heater core leaking. If it were leaking though when you park the car you would find that the puddle under the AC condensate drain would not be clear water, but rather would contain antifreeze.

[EddieCabael]

I am coming in a very narrow choices of decision making now that will avoid huge labor losses. I tried driving the car with the blower only and the AC is switched off.

And I found there's no more bad smell. Hence the bad smell comes only if the AC is in use or if the AC is working.

Only two choices now, it is either the bad smell comes from the Cooler or from the Heater.

My AC is still in excellent condition but I observed further after 5 minutes of Car Standby while the AC is working, the AC Gas Gauge is intact and not losing but the AC moisture expected to come out from the condensate AC Drain Hose in not coming down only very little moisture water from the tip of the AC Drain Hose is coming out.

Please note also that my radiator water in RED Color is reduced now to fall down into 2 inches from its original upper level in just 4800 kilo meter. Is this the fact that the heater is taking radiator water from the hose connected to the car engine? So that in the Heater gadget there will be a big chance of accumulating dirt? Or is the reduction by 2 inches down of the radiator water in 4800 kilometer is just normal? But the original quality of the radiator water according to company specification they tell it is long life? This is a contradiction.

The source of antifreeze element I believe is the radiator water, am I correct?



Thank you very much my friend for sharing me for what you know.

I really appreciate it very much.

Edito Tizon Cabael ( Eddie Cabael)

[CTScott]

Losing that much radiator fluid is not normal, but if the system was not fully purged of air, that could explain it. I would top it off and watch to see if it goes down again.

[EddieCabael]

From the Air Box facing inside the wall engine, there are two hoses connected into the car engine from the Heater System element maybe, I still did not see the actual scenario -- the two hoses are arranged in vertical position, we can simply identify the connections into upper hose connection and the lower hose connection. I noticed both are connected into the car engine --- are you referring that these connections be disabled? (Top it off?). If disabled, would it stop the function of the heating elements inside the Air Box? So that if there is a leak it will stop also as well as to observe if the radiator fluid would still be dropping down or not after disabling the active connections of the two hoses but must be I believe in appropriate way, done by a good Car Mechanic.

I am actually talking to you only as Car Owner not as a Car Mechanic with a little idea doing the car repair job itself but at least I have a little ability in analyzing the repair situation before I would talk to a Car Mechanic himself. Because I noticed regarding my car smell problem --- nobody is suggesting the specific solution out of all Car Mechanics I already have approached to --- which I am guessing why and what are their reasons: All of them are not telling the specific solution --- maybe because if they will tell "this thing" and the correct one is "that thing", the cost involve after works if done wrongly will come to their heads --- so that the situation now for me would dictate that the Car Mechanic will do the work only after I will tell the specific work to be carried by them etc: like maybe I will tell repair or replace parts in Engine Clutch System, maybe the smell is from there; or the break system or the Cooler/Heater inside the Air Box or whatever is the correct solution --- something that the Car Mechanics are silent as to which one is the solution to avoid cost blame afterwards when their repair ideas turn to be wrong. Those are my "Guess" why all Car Mechanics I already approached to --- seem to be no specific solution/s.

While I am discussing with you regarding my car smell problem of course you have suggestions and thank you very much for all of these, but the decision is still to be "Carried On" by me --- but you always have the logic.

Best regards my Friend CTScott
GOD BLESS YOU


Edito Tizon Cabael (Eddie Cabael)

[CTScott]

From the Air Box facing inside the wall engine, there are two hoses connected into the car engine from the Heater System element maybe, I still did not see the actual scenario -- the two hoses are arranged in vertical position, we can simply identify the connections into upper hose connection and the lower hose connection. I noticed both are connected into the car engine --- are you referring that these connections be disabled? (Top it off?). If disabled, would it stop the function of the heating elements inside the Air Box? So that if there is a leak it will stop also as well as to observe if the radiator fluid would still be dropping down or not after disabling the active connections of the two hoses but must be I believe in appropriate way, done by a good Car Mechanic.

I am actually talking to you only as Car Owner not as a Car Mechanic with a little idea doing the car repair job itself but at least I have a little ability in analyzing the repair situation before I would talk to a Car Mechanic himself. Because I noticed regarding my car smell problem --- nobody is suggesting the specific solution out of all Car Mechanics I already have approached to --- which I am guessing why and what are their reasons: All of them are not telling the specific solution --- maybe because if they will tell "this thing" and the correct one is "that thing", the cost involve after works if done wrongly will come to their heads --- so that the situation now for me would dictate that the Car Mechanic will do the work only after I will tell the specific work to be carried by them etc: like maybe I will tell repair or replace parts in Engine Clutch System, maybe the smell is from there; or the break system or the Cooler/Heater inside the Air Box or whatever is the correct solution --- something that the Car Mechanics are silent as to which one is the solution to avoid cost blame afterwards when their repair ideas turn to be wrong. Those are my "Guess" why all Car Mechanics I already approached to --- seem to be no specific solution/s.

While I am discussing with you regarding my car smell problem of course you have suggestions and thank you very much for all of these, but the decision is still to be "Carried On" by me --- but you always have the logic.

Best regards my Friend CTScott
GOD BLESS YOU


Edito Tizon Cabael (Eddie Cabael)



By "top it off" I mean to fill the coolant via the radiator cap. Once it is filled you should start the car (with the cap off) and let the car run until the engine gets warm enough for the thermostat to open. At that point watch for air bubbles. If you see bubbles then there is air in the system. Keep adding water if it goes down while the bubbles escape. Once the bubbles stop, put the cap on. After that check the level of the radiator fluid every couple of days to see if it goes down.

[EddieCabael]

At this point I am really concerned at solving my car bad smell because it is almost 1+ year that I am inhaling. In a series of complain that I reported and in every repair they made before, I expected the smell will vanish but to no avail.

The following are the works done that did not effected solving the problem:

1) AC Compressor --- Replaced
2) Engine Clutch disk --- Replace
3) Car Breaks --- Checked --- Status Excellent
4) Evaporator --- Replaced --- AC Excellent


Last two days problem tracing test --- Result = Bad smell comes During AC ON only but of course with blower ON too. During AC OFF and only Air Blower is ON
Result = No Bad Smell Problem

Now if I will disable the function from the two hoses connected from the car engine to the heater --- is there any side effects to any Censors? Because if I will repair the Heater it might be the complete assembly with a range cost of around $1600-$2000

I inquired with the company what is the cost involve if I will submit my car for Heater Leak Problem that is causing the bad smell if there is leak or whatever. I inquired from outside small workshops and said only some will be repaired from the Heater and will cost of around only $50. I have no details for all of it which one I would prefer.

If complete assembly, I know it will not effect to any censor as it will be done accordingly by an authorized one from the Toyota Company, but if from small shop outside, no guarantee for negative side effects --- but the problem is, I am financially drained making me difficult for that expensive approach of repair.

That is why for this time, I am just thinking to try disabling the hoses connected to the heater from the engine --- as the Heater function is not needed while using my car all the time. But if such disabling will negatively affect the censor like the engine censor for over heat or whatever is the function of any censor that might be affected from disabling the function of the Car Heater.

Best regards,


Eddie Cabael

[CTScott]

If the smell goes away with the blower on and the AC off it is not the heater core. In that case it has to be the actual AC evaporator. Do you have a receipt that lists the part number of the evaporator that they installed when they replaced it? The reason I ask is that they may not have installed one of the new ones that is supposed to not have the issue and rather installed another one of the older ones.

If you really wanted to bypass the heater core as a test. you would just need to follow the two rubber hoses that go to the firewall back to where they connect on the engine. You would then disconnect them from the engine and install a piece of hose between the two engine connections. Then you can blow the water out of the heater core hoses to empty the core.

[EddieCabael]

When I submitted my car to company, they replaced the AC Evaporator as per what they have said only because they did not showed to me the new AC Evaporator intended for replacement. Instead, they showed me the Old AC Evaporator (full of dirt --- within 2 years and 7 months period of normally using the Car with AC) right after they have removed it and I saw the dashboard being removed all the way.

When they gave my Car --- there was a summary on the release paper that they have charges but invoiced to warranty in the amount of SAR2000 ($533) but there was no part number or anything showing what they have installed. Only Job description written as AC Evaporator replaced. I really don't know, only GOD knows if they have just cleaned the old one and have forgotten the dirtiness of the piping and surroundings being affected by the dirt if any --- to have it get cleaned also.

Just today I went to small shop and described my car bad smell problem in the manner I used to described to you, he also said it is not from the Heater.

He showed to me what is the smell coming from the removed old AC Evaporator found just around his small work shop.

From where the AC Piping is normally being installed at the tip of that OLD AC Evaporator found around in his small shop --- I tried to smell at the opening tip --- and that smell I found is similar to my car bad smell in question.

His recommended works are:

To remove the entire dashboard and afterwards to clean the unit of the existing AC Evaporator after detaching then reinstall and also clean all the surroundings by SAR500 ($133). What about the existing piping maybe it has also dirt from inside? Does the available AC piping needs to be cleaned first before attaching it again to the existing already cleaned AC Evaporator?

I told him that the AC Evaporator is well functioning so no need to buy for another one, maybe it needs cleaning only. And he said OK.


Best regards,


Eddie Cabael

[CTScott]

I understand what you mean with smelling a used one that is out of a vehicle. I really think that the problem is that the aluminum is too porous, so some of the freon actually leaks through the surface of the evaporator. That also could be why Toyota changed the evaporator. My red 2008 just started to have the smell this week and I really think I am going to pull out the evaporator, clean it, and then seal it with one of the coatings which is made for painting radiators.

[EddieCabael]

Still I did not started for any repair with my Car because I doubt if it is coming from the evaporator nor the heater. Regarding Freon leak it should have been showing on the glass Freon gauge for lose movement but such gauge is crystal clear and intact, no Freon bubbles at all and the cooling is excellent for around near two months now.

I also remember when the company told me that day, when they repaired my gearbox clutch. They have told me they replaced that clutch with a new clutch disk only leaving all the rests in a set to be not replaced because it was last day of the week and that the complete set of clutch if ordered will come at the beginning of the day the following week (I was thinking they were convincing me to bring the car and then bring back again the next week so I agreed the clutch is done like just for the time being). But when I came back for the Clutch they declared “It is done”. The clutch set other than the disc and release bearing, they have just made a skimming or machine grinding to make the surface evenly.

Before I went for that repair, my clutch was sounding like teeth gripping from each other whenever you make a foot press on it. Now after everything and having all these smell problem, I realized and went back my mind about clutch problem before. Now, the same sound is there and I compared the clutch press with so many other cars of the same model --- only mine is a “Hard-Clutch-Press” plus with that sound.

Now, I am thinking --- this is the one bringing that car bad smell --- because there is smell also when the clutch is not in use --- when I am just at stop position and Engine ON; Blower On; AC On --- there is no smell at all. It is only when the car moves with the “AC On” emphasis maybe because in here while AC is On, more engine power is needed and hence more use of clutch power enough to give that car bad smell when the Gearbox Clutch System is not repaired properly or incomplete repair as I remember.

I reported for the last time to the company again regarding that smell and they said no problem with my car functionality.

I still remember with what they have done with my Clutch.

If I am correct, the following parts make it one set for the gearbox clutch replacement system:

1) Clutch Disk
2) Pressure Clutch Plate
3) And the Release Bearing

I inquired from outside workshops that the proper repair must be done replacing all of the above 3 parts as against the Clutch Story above wherein they replaced only for the Clutch Disk. When the car company declares it’s done, it doesn’t mean they replaced it all. I believe much no, and only Clutch Disk has been replaced so that it will little stuck somewhere during clutch usage.
I cannot describe exactly what the smell all about is --- unless one could have it actually by him --- but it is really something like a smell from the friction between two metals suffocating or unwanted even if it will come very little. Or whatever is the similar unwanted smell from Old Oil that goes with hot object not the direct fire.

Can the Clutch problem be the possible as the source of smell?

I am really confused now because of financial limitation at all after having problem from my credit card also caused by my expensive old car repairs before I took my Yaris. Now the great deal is the car is smoothly moving OK but the smell is with me continuously inhaled.


Edito Tizon Cabael (Eddie Cabael)

[CTScott]

I doubt that the clutch is the source of the odor. If it were you could switch the setting from fresh air to recirculate and the smell would go away.

[EddieCabael]

While I am experiencing this occasional unwanted smell, I am always at “Recycling Air Setting” as my always normal usage. It is occasional in the sense that I am driving 4 sessions in a day but the smell comes not in every driving sessions but there is a guarantee that the smell comes every day. And ones it comes the smell fades and vanishes not in a minute without the need to set for a fresh air from outside. But this shortest period of time for inhaling the smell you will never want it.

According to company records when I verified at 8:45 A.M. KSA (GMT +3) Time 25-Nov-2013 today, their system shows what work have done with my clutch: Showing 3 parts were not done and only clutch cover and the sealant (release bearing) I asked what about the disk itself they said no because it is not on warranty coverage.

There is a conflict here: The good work requires one set replacement --- but their warranty coverage requires to not to include the consumable disk, so the possible effect will not match up the 100% precision of effectiveness so that it may stuck somewhere within the gearbox clutch system, so that also the clutch press will be more harder compared to other Yaris cars of the same model.

Their problem in the first place is --- they should implement the good work that requires 3 parts in a set in one gearbox opening for its clutch repair working and not just some of it. Although I remember it was for the time being-like that day when I took the car knowing what they did as described in my previous story.

From the AC System, as I used to tell no problem at all except if there are stains from the surround parts or places where they have repaired for it before.

I have no more idea than to risk money again maybe with the following:
To start where the company record shows of incomplete works and it is the Gearbox Clutch --- this of course again will be to my risk burden that I don’t have other good options for now.

Thank you very much my friend for your knowledge support.

Eddie Cabael

[EddieCabael]

Just now I drive other yaris, forward and reverse observing the Clutch behavior. The clutch is very very light and no sound at all as against my car.

[EddieCabael]

At this point I would pull the top of the dash off to gain access to look into the airbox to see if the evaporator is coated again (that is much easier than trying to remove the entire air box). With the dash top off you can also clean out the ducts. If the evaporator was cleaned or replaced, the ducts may still be very dirty and may be the source of the odor.

Do you notice a difference with the smell if you switch between recirculate and outside air?

I am considering your point as quoted.

Can you also please elaborate a reply from one of my Fans in FanBox Website as quoted below --- because I am not familiar with what he said as "Manifold Gaskets":

Larry Young --- North Carolina, United States

Anytime you get anything on the exhaust you will get a smell. First I would check for oil leaks around the manifold gaskets as it could be dripping on the exhaust. Check all your hoses that have air running through them and make sure they don't have any cracks or holes in them. Let me know what you find.

[CTScott]

I am considering your point as quoted.

Can you also please elaborate a reply from one of my Fans in FanBox Website as quoted below --- because I am not familiar with what he said as "Manifold Gaskets":

Larry Young --- North Carolina, United States

Anytime you get anything on the exhaust you will get a smell. First I would check for oil leaks around the manifold gaskets as it could be dripping on the exhaust. Check all your hoses that have air running through them and make sure they don't have any cracks or holes in them. Let me know what you find.

He is talking about the gasket between the back of the engine and the exhaust manifold (which is the metal part at the back that brings the four exhaust ports down into the one exhaust pipe).

You can certainly check all of that, as one easy way to do so is to get the car hot and open the hood and sniff around. If an exhaust leak is the cause you should smell the same smell much stronger under the hood.

[EddieCabael]

Keep in mind that my Car or your Car is not talking whatever has been done unlike Doctor’s Patient --- so that in times of confusion as to which or where to start doing repair works again --- you will need to know and understand the details of the circumstances and surroundings for which you can squeeze a point and eventually make the exact solution to my or your problem.

On November-27-2013, I was continuously collecting various information and tactics in the attempt to corner points for a solution to my Car Bad Smell Problem Going through My Car AC Blower.

I went to many "Outside-Small-Car-Repair-Workshop-Vendors" and found only all ideas without the exact findings as to where be the root for that car smell problem of mine.

The following are my observations:

Nobody tends to pinpoint where is the source of the problem, maybe because of the nature that the situation is puzzle due to the facts that all nearest possible sources of the car bad smell problem have already been repaired or replaced.

While I am narrating to the Mechanics the exact history and performance of my car --- the doubts to pinpointing the exact solution for my car problems become more complicated.

Why? Breaks are intact, gearbox clutch is good, AC Compressor is just replaced with new one, AC Evaporator is just replaced with new one also and the AC Cooling System is excellent.

But the smell is still there coming from the AC Air Blower.

While my Car was under the warranty period, it went through the processes of needed repairs with the company before Oct-26-2013.

That means the presumption is: the needed repairs were executed by an Authorized Mechanic isn't it? So that you become more confused where is the problem?

OK. Why nobody tends to pinpoint for solution? Because if you are a Mechanic and you are also in puzzle as it is likely possible with this situation, you will tend to not tell the root cause of car smell problem because if you tell "this one", and later turned it's from "that one" then you are responsible as a Mechanic.

All Mechanics while in confusion, they tend to wait only from the car owner to signal which one you would like to start with working first.

Are you going to begin searching from?
Car Gearbox Clutch?
Car Breaks?
Car Drive Belt?
Car Engine Oil Leaks?
Smell from inside Car Only?
Car AC Compressor?
Car AC Evaporator?
It seems nothing left mentioning the sources of the Car Bad Smell except to replace the Car Engine.

Here's how it got solve in "My Way".

Observations from the Authorized Mechanic of the Car Company

Sir to whom it may concern:

He told me what has been done with my Car AC Cooling System: He said, the AC Compressor was replaced, the AC Evaporator has a leak and for that it was replaced with new one.

Yes and after that, my AC Cooling system becomes excellent but the problem is the car bad smell is still there.

Somewhere first week of November-2013, I went back to him for the last time because of my thinking that my car is no longer of warranty period --- I told him for the same car bad smell problem. He said that my car has really no problem especially with the car functionality=excellent.

Last week of November-2013, I called him on mobile with my intention of catching any focal point where I can have the start to get my problem solve.

I asked him about their company SOP specifically in the installation of AC Evaporator, if it is including the general cleaning before fixing. He said yes it's an SOP to clean before fixing.

Take a look on this --- if he saw by his eyes that the cleaning works has been carried out, he should have told me these things during our conversation to the effect that it has been actually cleaned.

The car stayed with the car company for around 3 days. If it included such required cleaning, he should have noticed this and tell this to me not just as SOP.

He failed to have a clear answer.

This is a lead point that you can work back the work that has already been done by them. Take note: it is a lead only.

When you are solving any Car Problem without the concrete ideas as to where to start exactly as needed, you have to begin from the nearest possible reason or root cause of the problem and must be with lowest cost involved.

In my case, I began changing the drive belt. At least you will have a good feel knowing your car has new belt now. Also maybe that smell problem is there. After I changed it, nothing affected on solving my car smell problem. I jumped my mind to proceed cleaning the Evaporator even I know that the car company is the one who made the recent repair because of the previous one I mentioned for the lead point.

Before doing so, I established a confirmation ideas (idea with S means not just one) to avoid further wastage of money. How I did it? I made it sure that my inside car has no Bad Smell at all for one and a half days running without AC turning On and only AC Blower being set to On. If the answer is No Car Bad Smell during this trial then this is one of the confirmation ideas.

Would you like to proceed now to open the entire dashboard and everything to take out the Car AC Evaporator at the bottom place of the dashboard to have it cleaned? This is involving cost of around SAR1000 ($266.66). In my point of view, it matters big and I will not proceed yet. I made it sure that my "AC Recycling Air" Open and Close functions are 100% effective; being the preferred one if it is closing completely and effective --- when I will set that AC Recycling Air button into “close setting”. Meaning it must not receive any air from outside totally --- to pinpoint that the Car Bad Smell Problem is only coming from the Car AC Evaporator, no need thinking from other far air point of entry inside the car.

In that instance, I made a spray of Car Air Freshener 1/4 of its content next to the AC Evaporator which is the AC Valve connected to it, plus this is very near to the AC Blower. This was executed through other person and I was inside my car with my Engine On, AC On and of course with the AC Blower On in addition to all car doors are closed.

If you didn't get the smell of “Car Air Freshener” in 3 to 5 minutes after spray, then your "AC Recycling Air" being set to closed is really functioning well and is taking no air from outside, to make a reason that maybe it is taking the smell from any troubled gearbox clutch. In my case, there was no smell at all coming from that “Car Air Freshener” sprayed on the AC Valve by another person. If I was wrong, it did not get my attention that I smelled the smell of “Car Air Freshener”.

Here is the summary of the lead and confirmation ideas:
1) Lead that the car Air box Plastic Case for the AC Evaporator and Heater was not actually cleaned or if cleaned not accordingly as required.
2) Confirming idea that the car is not bringing air from outside.
3) Confirming idea that the Car Bad Smell is only coming from the AC Evaporator brought about by the AC Blower even though the car has its latest repair history from an authorized company car mechanic.
4) Confirming idea that if I have a troubled gearbox clutch, its clutch smell is also not coming inside my car through the AC Blower.

From all of the above, I decided to let it go and have my AC Air box or whatever you call it --- the one holding the AC Evaporator and Heater be cleaned very well and also the Evaporator and Heater units individually cleaned.

What I found?

I found the Car Bad Smell I was taking in through my Lungs for more than a year now --- that smell was at the bottom of the AC Air box where the Evaporator is seated (this is the dirt remains from the old Evaporator the company has just removed recently and replaced with new one, and also a slight car bad smell contamination into the new Evaporator the company has just recently installed. There is no bad smell found on the Heater Core.

My Car Bad Smell Going through Car AC Blower Problem is now solved --- and the Car Bad Smell is gone while riding. Now it’s 4 days running free of bad smell from 30-Nov-2013. I know it will no more come again after doing needed cleaning thoroughly.

To anyone concerned --- when you read this Blog Post point by point --- This will enhance more on your perspective in the implementation of "Car-Repair-SOP" for Customer's Satisfaction for the benefit of both parties:
The Car Company and Customers as a whole.




Thanks GOD.


Thank you to all of you



Edito Tizon Cabael (Eddie Cabael)

[CTScott]

If your car does not have a filter installed in the slot behind the glove box, make sure you install one to hopefully prevent this from happening again.

[EddieCabael]

Yes I already installed one. Imagine, nearly 3 years I don't have that filter just because it is only optional and there is no part number in it as what they have explained before --- when I asked them there is a blank slot for a purpose why there was no filter installed. For this I felt embarrassed and I immediately installed one last week of Oct-2013.

I feel very weak now because it seems the smell is still there but it is reduced far behind to a very slight smell now because of the fact that I am the one also who helped in cleaning together with the Car-Electrician/Mechanic. I put my car under the peak of the day sunlight with 4 doors open as well as the back compartment and I cleaned thoroughly all the 4 original rubber floor mats. And it becomes even like a new one now smelling like hair conditioner. But there is still like a smell before but very slight smell. We already have cleaned the evaporator and the heater core including the entire Air box very very well, I can no more tell for the highest quality of cleaning for it.

Is my clutch doing the problem? There is a tooth-bite-like-sound upon pressing the clutch pedal as I described before but how this comes when my recycling air is effectively functioning. Aside from this, I really don't know, no more really.

OK, I still have to observe my car --- maybe the smell will eventually vanish. Now there is a smell but I can no more classify as bad smell like before + knowing how we already removed the dirt from Air box and all its components.

Regarding clutch: there was a click sound before and after that I just came to know when my car is like clutch hard press after long time. There is no clutch cable I noticed. If it is through with "clutch-oil-cylinder-control" with series to "break-oil-cylinder-control", how to know if the one for clutch is damaged. Not the gear box clutch itself because the car is running very well. But I could believe this is just another issue and not regarding the smell.

I am going to observe 3 to 4 more days for my car from now-03-Dec-2013 and I will tell you later after this if the smell is totally gone or not.

[EddieCabael]

I am thinking now that I will not go apart from working on the AC Cooling System.

We cleaned only the physical evaporator and the heater core. What about the whole system itself? I remember my friend his name is Cris 6 years ago --- but I have no more contact with him. He is an Auto Electrician. Prior to putting the required Freon by himself for his own car; I saw another new thing to me and when I asked him if it was for what? He told me it is regarding FLASHING WORK before fixing the final Freon requirement. In what my friend have done about flashing --- we did not do this work for my car last week. The whole of my car bad smell before, now it's just like 1/4 of the smell being left.

I already cleaned my entire car outside and inside. I already kept my car under the heat of the sun 4.5 hours in day light for already 3 days with all the doors open.

But a little smell is still there --- although no more suffocating much as compared before.

I am trying to convince myself that this is due to not doing the “FLASHING WORK” as what my friend did as described above.

What do you think is the proper execution for this FLASHING WORK as far as my car is concerned?

Thank you CTScott for your support


Edito Tizon Cabael ( Eddie Cabael )

[CTScott]

I am thinking now that I will not go apart from working on the AC Cooling System.

We cleaned only the physical evaporator and the heater core. What about the whole system itself? I remember my friend his name is Cris 6 years ago --- but I have no more contact with him. He is an Auto Electrician. Prior to putting the required Freon by himself for his own car; I saw another new thing to me and when I asked him if it was for what? He told me it is regarding FLASHING WORK before fixing the final Freon requirement. In what my friend have done about flashing --- we did not do this work for my car last week. The whole of my car bad smell before, now it's just like 1/4 of the smell being left.

I already cleaned my entire car outside and inside. I already kept my car under the heat of the sun 4.5 hours in day light for already 3 days with all the doors open.

But a little smell is still there --- although no more suffocating much as compared before.

I am trying to convince myself that this is due to not doing the “FLASHING WORK” as what my friend did as described above.

What do you think is the proper execution for this FLASHING WORK as far as my car is concerned?

Thank you CTScott for your support


Edito Tizon Cabael ( Eddie Cabael )

I am not sure what the "Flashing Work" is. It is very difficult to get smells out of the interior if a car. The best way is to remove and completely wash the carpet and all cloth surfaces.

[EddieCabael]

There are Circulatory System Functions in the CAR AC Conditioning:

The Closed one and the Open one:

The Closed one --- is where the AC Freon and oil are moving inside the Closed Circulatory System (CCS) that's within the AC Piping System that moves to and pro from AC Compressor to its piping revolving through the AC Radiator or Condenser. If the inside of the CCS is having a Junk Smell, this has nothing to do with the CAR AC bad smell problem if that system has no Leak and in my case I confirmed there's no leakage because one month ago the Freon is still intact up to now which appearing on the Freon Gauge as well as the cooling status of the car is excellent as of now.

In the Open Circulatory System (OCS) --- is where the air is flowing from the CAR AC Blower going through the Dashboard Panel with the Air Outlet after the air is passing by from the AC Evaporator (freezer) that gives the cold air for the entire car. One month ago I already cleaned the complete assembly of Air Box containing the Evaporator (freezer) and the Heater as well as the CAR AC Blower. All of that were already cleaned thoroughly including the Air Box itself.

The existence of slight balance of CAR Bad Smell might be due to slight bad smell contamination from unforeseen surroundings that will eventually vanish through the air after time as long as the CCS has no leak.

This morning 16-Jan-2014. I used my car for straight 3 hours and only in this driving session I smelled all fresh air and no more bad smell.

Hopefully the CAR BAD SMELL is no more.


Thank you CTScott for your support



Edito Tizon Cabael ( Eddie Cabael )
http://eddiecabael.swaultimate.com

[alishagreen]

Could be an IRCM issue. Might be your freon is in low and you can't add freon if compressor is not working. Hence, check out your compressor and evaporator properly. It would be worth running into your local air con specialist from ac repair west palm beach (http://www.amtekair.com/ac-service-repair/) to have it checked out. Usually repair is reasonably priced, unless you need manufacturers original parts.

[spookybathtub]

Scott, does the entire AC unit need to be removed to access the evaporator? That would mean draining the refrigerant.

I'd like to take a look at my evaporator, to see if it needs cleaning. I already know how to remove the upper and lower instrument panels, but I don't want to pay a bunch of money to have the refrigerant drained and refilled just for this.

[CTScott]

Scott, does the entire AC unit need to be removed to access the evaporator? That would mean draining the refrigerant.

I'd like to take a look at my evaporator, to see if it needs cleaning. I already know how to remove the upper and lower instrument panels, but I don't want to pay a bunch of money to have the refrigerant drained and refilled just for this.

It kind of does. If you remove the dash top and the AC ducts for the center vents you can get a look down into the airbox, but you really just have a window to the evaporator without being able to get to all of it.