Ever had to get a front alignment on Yaris?

[RutherfordmanX]

Just curious how many folks have found the need to do a front end alignment on their Yaris. I am at 305,000 miles and have never had one done since I bought my 2008 new. No problems with uneven tire wear or anything. the only thing I can figure is the car is so light that maybe it is hard to mess it up. With the trucks and jeeps I have owned they were in need quite often.

[Kitt]

I've changed my shocks twice and after that, alignment has been required

[CrankyOldMan]

^this.

[CoryM]

Yarii are pretty gentle on tires/alignments in general. Your alignment should only change from:
-removing/installing parts
-impacts (potholes, curbs, idiots etc)
-suspension wear (bushings, joints, springs sagging etc).

If you avoid those things, your alignment should be good for a long time on a Yaris.
Cheers.

[why?]

Every time you install new tires you should get an alignment.

I installed coilovers, so I needed a few.

[Rigaud]

Every time you install new tires you should get an alignment.

I installed coilovers, so I needed a few.
LOL.....first time I hear this one. And no!!!

Cory pretty much made the points.

[bronsin]

I think the only thing you can adjust is toe in. :iono:

[why?]

LOL.....first time I hear this one. And no!!!

Cory pretty much made the points.

Really? lol must be because all the tire shops around here always do it for free anyways.

I think the only thing you can adjust is toe in. :iono:

Really? Still toe is important, but i thought you could adjust camber or caster too on a stock car.

[Rigaud]

In 33 years I have not ever gotten an alignment from changing tires.

I guess pit crews are doing it wrong on race tracks. And yes being properly aligned on a race car is even more important then for the street.

[why?]

In 33 years I have not ever gotten an alignment from changing tires.

I guess pit crews are doing it wrong on race tracks. And yes being properly aligned on a race car is even more important then for the street.

lol, kind of a different situation. You better believe they go through every wheel/tire set and make sure they are perfect.

Like I said, thought it was automatic, but could just be from local tire shops doing it automatically when you buy tires.

[Rigaud]

I switched from summer OEM size tires that came with my car about 2 years ago to winter thread. Did 20,000km in one winter on them then switched to summer semi slicks 205/45R16 I got used and evenly worn. Finished those off this summer and now on a new set of tires. No alignment yet and none of my tires wear uneven. Your wheels don't determine your alignment.

All I'm saying is I agree with Cory. Maybe they do it where you live but in general it's not required. Now if you lower your car yes you should get your alignment, camber, etc... verified. ;)

[bronsin]

Really? Still toe is important, but i thought you could adjust camber or caster too on a stock car.

I mean, on a Yaris. Caster and camber have no adjustment as far as I know on this car.

[Rigaud]

I mean, on a Yaris. Caster and camber have no adjustment as far as I know on this car.
Your right with stock set up no adjustments. Front you need to instal camber plates to make changes and rear it's washers or spacers.

[shepd]

Camber is adjustable by adjusting the bolts connecting the knuckle to the strut (Toyota themselves sell the eccentric bolts needed, just bought two a couple of weeks ago). Toe is adjustable by adjusting the tie rods (just replaced those too). I do not see an easy way to adjust caster.

So you can set camber and toe for certain on the front. The rear, being a trailing axle, probably has almost no adjustments.

[ern-diz]

Just had a shop align mine after lowering. He confirmed that stock, there is no rear adjustment and only toe in the front.

[shepd]

I'm not trying to be a pain, but the shop manual for the Yaris lists doing a camber alignment on page SP-5:

ADJUST CAMBER
NOTICE: Inspect the toe-in after the camber has been adjusted.
(a) Remove the front wheel.
(b) w/ ABS:
(1) Remove the bolt and separate the speed
sensor and flexible hose.
(c) Remove the 2 nuts on the lower side of the shock absorber.
HINT:
Keep the bolt from rotating while loosening and removing the nuts.
(d) Clean the installation surfaces of the shock absorber and steering knuckle.
(e) Provisionally install the 2 nuts (Step A).
(f) Fully push or pull the axle hub in the direction of the required adjustment (Step B).
(g) Tighten the 2 nuts.
Torque: 164 N*m (1,672 kgf*cm, 121 ft.*lbf)
HINT:
Keep the bolt from rotating while loosening and removing the nuts.
(h) w/ ABS:
(1) Install the flexible hose and speed sensor with the bolt.
Torque: 29 N*m (300 kgf*cm, 22 ft.*lbf)
NOTICE:
Install the flexible hose and speed sensor without twisting them.
(i) Install the front wheel.
Torque: 103 N*m (1,050 kgf*cm, 76 ft.*lbf)
(j) Check the camber. If the measured value is not within the specification, calculate the required adjustment amount using the formula below.
(Camber adjustment amount) = Center of specified range - Measured value
Check the combination of installed bolts. Select appropriate bolts from the table below to adjust the camber to within the specified range.
HINT:
Try to adjust the camber to the center of the specified range.

SP-7 shows the bolts to use for various camber settings. It is adjustable from -1.5 to +1.5 degrees.

Maybe I should bring the service manual with me when I get my alignment done. :) I only know that it's adjustable because when I called to buy new bolts the parts guy at Toyota asked me what camber range I wanted. Since I just wanted to bolt the thing back together, I didn't care (I figure the guy doing the alignment will get to put in the correct bolts instead). But now I'm wondering if they'll actually bother... :(

[Ben_]

Yaris has camber and toe adjustments. Caster is affected by both of those. The biggest symptom of bad alignment is tire wear so if it's not broke don't fix it

[CoryM]

I probably average 2-3 alignments per day, and have done hundreds (thousands?) of alignments. Toe is the main angle to worry about for tire wear. Typically it will wear out the inside edge of the tire (only about 1"). This is why it is adjustable on virtually every vehicle. Shops will suggest to check your alignment with every tire change, and the toe is often out. Where alignments become a very wise idea is when that $100 will save you more than $100 in tire wear. Around here the average set of 4 tires is around $1000 so it usually pays off to have your alignment done. On a Yaris with cheap tires, and generally being gentle on tires, it is less critical. And less likely to be cost effective. On a Yaris I would wait until there has been an impact, parts installed, or evidence of toe wear seen.

Front camber is adjustable. Typically you buy a $20 camber bolt to do it. This allows you to change camber by +/- 1.5° usually. Camber rarely causes tire wear before the customer complains about other symptoms. If it does, it's usually from having too little negative camber, causing the tires to roll over in corners. Tip: anytime you loosen the two strut-to-knuckle bolts, push in on the knuckle when tightening to gain as much negative camber as possible. Most people need more negative camber than the fuel-efficient engineers design in.

Rear camber and toe are not adjustable, and the available shims to do so are poorly designed. I wouldn't run them in my car (or any of my customers).

Cheers.

[Ben_]

^^^ this

[ern-diz]

Front camber is adjustable. Typically you buy a $20 camber bolt to do it...

Which is why I said, stock there is no adjustment.

Side note, I found a shop one city over from me that only does alignments and charged me just $40. I was stoked.

[shepd]

*All* Yarises have camber bolts. There are no part numbers for non-camber bolts (I asked when I was buying bolts because I had no idea what to get). All bolts holding the knuckle to the strut have a range of degrees that you can set the camber to, top and bottom.

You don't need to buy bolts unless you want major adjustments. Minor adjustments can be made without changing any parts. You just turn the bolt. That's it.

Equally, if you wanted to ridiculously adjust the toe of the car (Why? Well, I'll answer that with why would you want camber adjusted more than a tiny bit?), you'd need to figure out a way to extend the inner tie rods, so based on the idea that major adjustments that require buying stuff aren't adjustments at all, toe wouldn't count either.

I've attached the actual diagrams of what the bolts mean for camber. Who knows, it might come in handy for someone someday...

[ern-diz]

Interesting...

[Ben_]

Just ordered the 15004 for max camber. They are $6 each from the dealer not bad

[Rigaud]

So ou need to change OEM bolts with different ones for different camber!!! Right?

[RutherfordmanX]

Thanks for the info everyone. I guess so far with the miles I have I am doing well. The roads here in North Carolina are pretty good compared to most states. We pay for it though with one of the highest gas taxes. The ole Yar car is tougher than it looks. I have nailed a large Raccoon and a few hefty chunks of interstate rubber with only cosmetic damage. She is still going strong clocking the 180 mile a day trip. I would buy another but with this one being "field" tested I am not sure the new one will be as good.

[CoryM]

So ou need to change OEM bolts with different ones for different camber!!! Right?

Yes. The OE way of doing it is replacing with smaller bolts to give you more room to adjust the camber. The Aftermarket way is to replace one with a cam-bolt, which allows to you adjust easier. Either way can get you close to -3° camber, which is more than most need (I run -2.8° to try and compensate for stock spring).

Even with the factory sized bolts you can get a little adjustment out of the camber. Usually it's enough to even out the camber so that the customer won't have a lead, but not enough for performance.

Anytime you change camber you need to set the toe or your tires will suffer. Small camber changes usually = large toe changes.

Cheers.

[bronsin]

200k miles on 2000 ECHO no alignment, tires wearing just fine.

50kmiles on 2001 ECHO, no alignment, ditto

153k miles MB 240d 1979, no alignment, ditto

150k miles 1992 Saturn, ditto, ditto.

150k miles 1992 Honda Accord, ditto, ditto.

99k miles 1980 Subaru Hatchback, ditto, ditto.

75k miles 1986 Toyota Tacoma, ditto, ditto.

41k miles 2009 Yaris hatchback 3 accidents, ditto ditto.

Either Im very lucky or theres a lot of unnecessary aligning going on! :biggrin:

[Ben_]

For a daily driver non performance use I would think the factory holds are plenty fine. But if you don't have excessive tire wear don't bother with an allignmen