First track day

[tmontague]

Completed my first open lapping day at my locals track (Toronto Motorsports Park, the same track that Youtube channel "Speed Academy" frequents when they test their builds. It's a 3km track with a lot of open runoffs so it's a great place to learn.

I was running 949 racing 6ul 15x7 +24 rims on BFGoodrich R1's (slicks)

I had a blast and the Vios ran flawlessly, not a single hiccup. Oil pressure was down to about 5psi at idle post cool down laps, and oil termps peaked around 250 degrees. The coolant only ever got to 208 degrees and that was at idle after the cool down laps (ambient temps were close to 90 degree). During lapping the coolant temps hovered around 190 degrees which is barely above normal driving temps.

Brakes showed no sign of fade and they still have pad left on them. The rear brakes seemed to have worn slightly as the e brake clicks an extra 2 or 3 times now when applied. I was doing 20-25min or so sessions (not including cool down) and the engine was consistently between 4k and 6.5k rpm. Never skipped a beat and puled like crazy the whole time.

This session really highlighted the short falls of my build so far. One main focus is the open differential. The inside front wheel was spinning like crazy if I applied anything above 50% throttle during cornering. An LSD is the next big thing to do on this car. The other area if the oem drivers seat. I was floating around inside the cabin the whole time. Once the LSD is installed it will be time to find me a racing seat that I can DD on. Need to keep my ass planted.

Surprisingly the suspension felt decent and the car had a tenancy to over steer. I only ended up spinning out once but 4 or 5 other times I was able to catch myself and keep it on the track. My current set up is stiffer rear dampers which results in the slight over steer but on KYB excel G front struts I was surprised that the car didn't seem to wallow or dip too much.

I'll be heading out in a few weeks again to work on giving it throttle when I start to over steer instead of only counter steering. This is way too much fun, I can see why people say you become addicted. Being able to push a car that I've built to the limit is an awesome feeling.

Some feedback i received from a few guys I met out at the track who tagged along in the passenger seat on some hot laps were: "wow this car is fast and pulls hard", "damn this car sounds nice" and "you really know how to handle this car" - all of them were new to the track so take that with a grain of salt.

[deng]

I'm glad your first time at the track was a positive one!

I'm surprised you went with R compounds from the get go! No wonder you were getting so much good feedback. :tongue: I suggest using less grippy tires. R compounds offer massive grip, but they will break loose at such a higher speed, that learning car control at that limit might be difficult/dangerous. A less grippy tire would break loose at a slower speed while being more predictable when doing so. Plus, I believe such grippy tires will hide a lot of driver error. Don't go throwing them away though lol might as well use them up and then replace with 200tw street tires. Less grip, but would last longer for more track day fun. :thumbup:

But, no matter what, it's all about that seat time. :)

I feel your pain, I'm stock 1nz, and I spin the inside wheel. LSD and a 4.3FD is going to be my next upgrade.

Looking forward to your next update! :thumbsup:

[tmontague]

There's no doubt the tires are above my skill range. The reason I went with them is a member was selling them with rims on this forum (LUXX) and it was too good a deal to pass up. The rubber is fairly worn so my plan was to use them until the chords show through and then swap them to something like an NT01 from Nitto. Which is a 100 instead of a 40 tread wear rating and should be a little better for my skill level.

I was the passenger in a '15 wrx with a new driver and i couldn't believe how well the awd made up foot poor lines and over cooked turns. Just give it throttle and the car pulls you to where you want to go.

I'm looking forward to improving my driving, but so far I'm hooked

[ern-diz]

The obligatory "no pics/video?!" comment.

Kidding aside, sounds like you had a blast.

Seriously though, no pics/vid?

:biggrin:

[tmontague]

Unfortunately due to the hustle and bustle of it being my first track day, I never really took many pics at all. Next time fire sure I'll take a handful of pictures, don't know if I'll have any video footage unfortunately.

The wife will be co ing with me next time so I'll get her to snap some shots as she has a pretty good camera.

My plan is to re wire my gauges before the next track day, currently a bunch of wrapped connectors are touching one another which is causing my gauges to was off or at least oil temp and pressure is slightly off. I'll be using insulated connected and re crimping them.

Anyone have a link to a good crimper? I'm using the one found in a wire stripping took but I don't feel it's all that great

Edit* just realized how old my avatar is...man that needs to be updated. Also I had no rubbing with my track wheel set up with ever since I rolled the rear fenders

[MugenRep]

Great post. I've yet to be able to cough up the $400 +/- that track days cost here at Watkins Glen, nor would it really matter as my car tops out at around 95mph with the smaller diameter tires. Love the feedback and info you provided on what we should expect and I never realized 200 rating tires would be preferable to R-compounds on a first track session experience. I can't wait to see your vids next time.

In the straights, did the 2zr swap show its prowess and ability to keep up with bigger/badder chassis & cars?

[ArmstrongRacing]

I love this.
This guy did his own swap in his driveway, and then went out to track it. well done sir, you are my hero.

[deng]

Throw up some pictures with the battle stance! 6ULs ftw!

[WeeYari]

Any plans to hit up Cayuga since it is significantly closer to you?

Sent from my Elite_5_5_Octa using Tapatalk

[tmontague]

Great post. I've yet to be able to cough up the $400 +/- that track days cost here at Watkins Glen, nor would it really matter as my car tops out at around 95mph with the smaller diameter tires. Love the feedback and info you provided on what we should expect and I never realized 200 rating tires would be preferable to R-compounds on a first track session experience. I can't wait to see your vids next time.

In the straights, did the 2zr swap show its prowess and ability to keep up with bigger/badder chassis & cars?

TMP is luckily the closest track to me and is one of the cheapest in the areas at $100 for an evening session and $180 for a full day. Canadian Tire Motorsports parks is a little further and has a much better road course with elevation changes but it is $400 a session. At this point TMP is more than adequate for improving my skill and it fits my current student budget lol.

This course only lets me get up to 150km/h right before slamming on the brakes and throwing it into a sharp right 90 degree corner. Some of the bigger v6 track builds were getting up to about 160km/h and maybe even 170 for the Viper ACR that was there (insane car). On the straights the only time I noticed cars pull away from me noticeably quick was the big v8's or crazy turbo v6 builds. An Mercedes AMG left me in the dust pretty quick lol. But cars like the mostly stock s2000 and other 4 bangers that were boosted didn't really pull away from me much. I noticed I would fall behind on the long tight corners as my front end would push and I couldn't get onto the throttle until I was travelling straight or else my inside tire would light up. I would expect the LSD to make a large difference in lap times. I'll be trying to time my laps next time so I have a bench mark.

The 2zr was kept in the 4-6.5k rpm ranger so when I floored it there was always more than enough power there. The problem is it is too much for an open diff. Once I get that outside tire some power it should help guide the car through the corner

I didn't feel that the suspension was holding the car back at all but it is possible that the Excel G'd on the front are not aggressive enough to match the Blues in the rear and this could be causing the front end plowing

I love this.
This guy did his own swap in his driveway, and then went out to track it. well done sir, you are my hero.

Thanks man, couldn't have done it without your guys info from your swaps. I've never wanted to build a car to be a garage queen or to just cruise around the street doing 2 second pulls to turn heads. I've always wanted to put my work to the test and to be honest it was a great feeling. Driving what you've built is simply awesome. Since it's my DD it isn't the cleanest car and it has it's dings and what not but it is a ton of fun on the track.

Throw up some pictures with the battle stance! 6ULs ftw!

next time I will, the stance is pretty aggressive and the slicks poke out quite a bit in the rear. The camber and fender roll in the rear helps it not rub.


only pic I have :iono: however, the guy shown in the pic was my passenger a few times and was taking video footage and pics with a super nice camera, I forgot to get his name or social media handles, I'll try and track it down

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/21617920_10155812871067743_8820656775909400818_n.j pg?oh=9a90fdc59f30010fcc56fc89010c478e&oe=5A51508E

[tmontague]

Any plans to hit up Cayuga since it is significantly closer to you?

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That's the track I was at, Toronto Motosports Park aka Cayuga (the town)

I'll be there in a couple weeks it looks like. We in the middle of a September heat wave with no rain and I want to take advantage of that...my slicks don't like cold

[WeeYari]

Oops, my mind registered Mosport for some reason.

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[ern-diz]

Since it's my DD it isn't the cleanest car and it has it's dings and what not...

Having seen Tom's car in person, I'll go out on a limb and say he's not worried about dings and what not. :laugh:

[tmontague]

Hahah no probably not, I'm realizing now that track cars do not make show cars for a reason

[ern-diz]

Hahah no probably not, I'm realizing now that track cars do not make show cars for a reason

Totally lol.

[ArmstrongRacing]

Having seen Tom's car in person, I'll go out on a limb and say he's not worried about dings and what not. :laugh:

:laughabove::thumbup:

You sir need to ride in this thing next month. Its one of the angriest cars Ive ever owned.

[deng]

Track cars are show cars. Doesn't work the other way. ;) Battle scars ftw.

I would say a ride along at Big Willow would be fun, but Willow Spring's track rules do not allow passengers unless it's a driving instructor in the vehicle. Parade laps allow passengers, but those are lame with a max speed of 40mph or something.

[ern-diz]

:laughabove::thumbup:

You sir need to ride in this thing next month. Its one of the angriest cars Ive ever owned.

Don't have to tell me twice; I'm in!

[tmontague]

So I headed out to TMP for the second time yesterday afternoon with my wife and a new driving technique that I wanted to try out.

I do have a couple poor quality videos and a bunch of pics my wife took, none are amazing but I'll post them up later tonight.

I used Harry's lap timer and finally started timing my laps. I don't have anything to compare my past lap times as I never timed any laps the first time at the track. My fastest lap was a 1:32:59 which is actually not too bad considering the set up of the car. To put it in perspective a 1:25 is considered a very fast lap for a fwd set up. Subjectively I felt that I was much much faster this time than last, probably about 8 seconds per lap faster.

The one new skill I learned and put to the test was utilising the throttle to control the car around corners instead of the brake. This lead me to be able to trail brake or quickly pull off the throttle to briefly unweight the rear. This cause over steer and kicked the rear around and better placed the car into the corner. I would then give it some throttle to control the over steer. I did this before but not using the throttle to stop the over steer so this lead me to having to do it at a much lower speed.

There is also a wide long turn (actually 2 90 degree corners close together which is treated as one) right before the long straight away. Previous to this I would trail brake in the corner and I would be severely limited in speed by the grip in the rear. Because my car is set up to be tail happy my speed was relatively slow as my rear end was so light and floaty. I forced myself to actually only touch the throttle around this corner and I found myself able to corner about 20km/h faster as the throttle was used the keep weight on the rear wheel so the car hooked up better around the whole corner. This one change made a world of a difference.

I also started braking later and harder into corners, it is hard to get comfortable with but I'm realizing how much more I can squeeze out of the brakes.

I started with a cold tire pressure of 32/29 fr/r and I think I finally found the sweet spot for these tires. Once warmed up they stopped sliding and pushing everywhere like last time and they appeared to wear much better with no melted rubber. They actually looked clean and smooth after each lap. I was pretty impressed with the amount of grip I was able to hook up. ambient temps were 18 degrees C so much cooler than last time.

I ended up doing about 63 laps (over 180km) and went through 3/4 of a tank of gas! I stayed on the track longer each session this time for approx 30 mins as it was too much fun once the rubber heated up.

By the end of the night on my last session I was playing tag with a twin turbo V6 Mercedes sedan (the driver normally tracks an RX-7. He would gap me slightly on the straights but in the corners I was faster. We ended up catching up with a Mustang and 2 boosted BMW coupes and I managed to stay with them for a bunch of laps. I actually was held up by them in the corners.

The driver of the Mercedes actually came over to speak with me and made a comment about me having a beast under the hood because of how fast the car was, he said he couldn't believe a Yaris was running with the group of cars and actually faster in the corners.

Listening to people who have years of racing experience has been a huge help. Its not always easy to do many of those things as your brain sends off warning signals but a car can be pushed much harder than your brain thinks. I finally got to experience how much control a driver has over the rotation of the car simply by using the pedals. This blew me away at how effective it was for allowing your car to go through corners fast and under control.

I got to experience how being smooth on the pedals makes for faster lapping. Many of the cars I was following weren't very smooth and I could see how uncontrolled the car was and how they were relying on the electronics of the car to help them from spinning out.

An LSD is a definite must for next season as I feel that my biggest loss was not being able give it much throttle during exiting a corner. I would try but I could only give light throttle or else the tire would spin. I also now realise how important coil overs will be for this car, my current set up isn't enough now that I am cornering faster. I'm thinking something with the same spring rates frotn and rear and adjustable dampers so they aren't too harsh for DDing

i found that this smoother driving lead to the tires not heating up/potentially over heating which lead to much smoother tire wear. I feel before I was very rough on the tires due to my poor driving skill.

i'll post pics up later tonight, I have a hilarious video of my wife's commentary during her very first hot lap after the tires warmed up. She found it easier to enjoy once she had been out for a few sessions but her first hot lap hat her cursing every second, it was hilarious.

FWIW Harry's lap timer is an excellent app and well worth the $10 IMO

[ArmstrongRacing]

Awesome dude. You are right about controling the car with the pedals, once you know how it reacts to certain inputs you can manipulate the car into controled slides.

Regarding the coilovers, they do help a lot in tuning but require regular inspection and corner balancing can be annoying. And at $1000 I would rather have the LSD

[deng]

The other guys weren't smooth because they were trying their hardest to get away from a Yaris. :thumbup:

[tmontague]

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22089902_10155841024942743_5272712079391737119_n.j pg?oh=bcc0c63e5506dd1eb93790e0fcbb7661&oe=5A49375A

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22049883_10155841026757743_7332493050028090815_n.j pg?oh=9baa235e403658d9cfb876ff869ab901&oe=5A4B1E54

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22046667_10155841025652743_6217189339684167376_n.j pg?oh=7cbef42a0efa1687796a36ef3189ea8b&oe=5A4D8C27

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22045822_10155841026152743_530175961264963600_n.jp g?oh=b5120ef478c70a711c5448632ebdd6e2&oe=5A50AC96

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22141099_10155841026677743_2970920870638414566_n.j pg?oh=f89627fc1c8e8b39ffd0a94e03bf2d41&oe=5A854742

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22046181_10155841025182743_6036777199745008648_n.j pg?oh=83fc66ca61f03600d268026ee813e4f4&oe=5A7D5753

<img src="https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22046917_10155841025572743_3408168392878960618_n.j pg?oh=f5c5509c25328b73471523b1d58e7099&amp;oe=5A4504D2" alt="Image may contain: 1 person, sitting"/>

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22045695_10155841025122743_8782685542493567013_n.j pg?oh=8a3f01c27b1bf8bfe0199ba5f699606d&oe=5A8691A8

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22154210_10155841023492743_2466912780358807965_n.j pg?oh=06db08bbf487c3539ade124a5576c509&oe=5A7E1F48

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22195619_10155848922087743_6352663631488690373_n.j pg?oh=82f1c1e16731d829fd9dd5b5247737c5&oe=5A4030CA

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22196325_10155848922247743_6753254463701377922_n.j pg?oh=156b788e8f3274a5fffcdd14e2693c24&oe=5A410C69

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22228526_10155848922412743_626910061360977572_n.jp g?oh=de492932fa2484f127f69d53a764bc5a&oe=5A45D803

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22046917_10155841025572743_3408168392878960618_n.j pg?oh=f5c5509c25328b73471523b1d58e7099&oe=5A4504D2

[tmontague]

Here is the video of my wife on her first hot lap, this is after about 4 warm up laps to get the tires up to temps. She went out with me for about 4 sessions after this and by the end was much more comfortable and actually really enjoyed herself.

I figured most of you would find it amusing when a lay person experiences their first hot lap.

https://youtu.be/yA5Rb-s-LhM

[tmontague]

Awesome dude. You are right about controlingredients the car with the pedals, once you know how it reacts to certain inputs you can manipulate the car into controled slides.

Regarding the coilovers, they do help a lot in tuning but require regular inspection and corner balancing can be annoying. And at $1000 I would rather have the LSD

an LSD is without a doubt the next thing I will be purchasing for the car, it sounds like ti's the best bang for my buck at this point.

I'll likely just go with Megan coil overs down the road, I can't justify over a grand USD for a car that isn't my full out track rat. I don't really need all the bells and whistles that a >$1k set of coil overs gets you. I just need a much stiffer spring set up and compression adjustment so I can make them very stiff for the track and moderate for DDing.

I was chatting with Barber who tracked on the Megans as well as DD them and he was pretty content with them. As of now I'm on 4k/3k f/r set up with oem dampening in the front and Tokiko HP in the rear. I love how it makes the car tail happy and want to keep with the stiffer front than rear set up.

[WeeYari]

I figured most of you would find it amusing when a lay person experiences their first hot lap.


Hilarious! If I watched that with my eyes closed I'd swear it was porn. Much like a TV commercial we have which promotes described video for the visually impaired.


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[ern-diz]

Here is the video of my wife on her first hot lap, this is after about 4 warm up laps to get the tires up to temps. She went out with me for about 4 sessions after this and by the end was much more comfortable and actually really enjoyed herself.

I figured most of you would find it amusing when a lay person experiences their first hot lap.

https://youtu.be/yA5Rb-s-LhM

Ha! That was great; thanks for sharing.

[DiCaprio]

Video shows that you don't need a Ferrari to scare the womens :D

[ArmstrongRacing]

Video shows that you don't need a Ferrari to scare the womens :D

OR the men......

Wait until you are comfortable with the car to slide the rear around in the turns, that's when it gets you heart pumping for real

[bri62]

tmontague, are you going to TMP in spring 2018? I would love to go but it would have to be a week day.

[tmontague]

Yup, I go on Fridays open track day from 4pm to sundown, $70+tax a week ahead purchased online or $100 cash all in day of.

My plan is to get their every second Friday starting mid to Kate April. Fridays are the days I went last year and its a much quieter session than the weekend ones and much cheaper. IMO 4 hours is more than enough I don't need a full day.

Shoot me a PM if you're interested in joining in. No one I know is interested so I always head out solo. Its nice to have someone to shoot the shit with when in the paddocks resting and to chase around the track

[thebarber]

Ugh, i went sideways at about 100kph in my yaris at the first of those 90* turns, lol

Good times.

[tmontague]

^yup cold tires on that first corner can give you a surprise!

[thebarber]

That dip mid corner and the big rsb was enough to send me sideways!

[bri62]

What brake pads are you all using for track days and do you take them off when DD?
Carbotech XP8?

[tmontague]

Hawk hps. Keep them on all the time, they don't squeak and handle track temps good and are priced well.

Your abs will kick in a lot when you first swap to them as they grab more

[ern-diz]

Nice.

What's ABS again?

:biggrin:

[Ronnie V]

I would like to come out as well. Since taking back my white 3dr from my wife it has turned into quite the track toy.

Let me know when you guys are going, I bought a 10 pack of evening sessions on sale for my wife and I. She comes out and drives her BRZ. Good Fun!

I'm looking forward to 2nd Winter ending.........

[tmontague]

A 10 pack of evening sessions?! Let me know where you found that deal. I'm interested in that for sure.

I'll keep you posted when I head out next, looking like it will be late April for an early season shakedown

[Ronnie V]

I bought the 10 pack when they went on sale for Christmas thinking that this was a rare opportunity. $690 for 10 evening sessions.......good deal.

Then 2 weeks later they had a New years sale, same deal.

Then a few week ago they had the same deal for Valentines day.......so long story short they seem to be doing these "deals" quite often.

Next time I get an email about another sale I will post here right away. In fact, I would just call the track and tell them you want the 10 track day deal, I am sure they will be more than happy to take your money. :)

[tmontague]

Hmm, good know. Although the sessions are $70 if you book them a week in advance so I don't see the savings there.

I typically pay $100 the day of so I can see if its raining or not. But since I have uhp daily tires now I'll probably go rain or shine and just avoid the slicks if it's wet

[Ronnie V]

I was under the assumption that if we bought the 10 pack deal we could call the day before to register. That's how I am going to do it anyways.........so I get the pre-book price but I can wait to see what the weather is going to be like.

[tmontague]

I see, ya that makes sense then and ends up being a decent deal.

Hopefully we can all meet out there soon for some fun lapping. It's looking like late April or early May when I'll be out there

[bri62]

I have some questions about TMP. Can I buy gas there? Do they serve lunch with the day lapping (10 to 5)? I just received my 2018 Yaris and it is a 5 speed. It is my first manual transmission in 25 years and the track day will be good practice.

[Ronnie V]

Fuel is available on weekends I think. Your best bet is just going into town to the Pioneer.....less than 10 minutes away from the track. If you fill up on the way in it should last pretty much all day I would think.

There is a snack bar. Hotdogs, Fries, burgers, Ice Cream treats.........

I would say you're good to go except maybe some decent brake fluid. My Echo at TMP is a blast.

Have Fun. :)

[tmontague]

I typically fill up about 50km from the track and after an evening 4.5 hr session (typically about 150km) I pull in my driveway with around a quarter tank or little less.

I wouldn't use TMP's gas unless you need race fuel, it won't be cheap. I also typically just bring my own food, I'm picky though so if you like snack bar food then it is always open in the evenings and I'm sure it would be on weekends

[giusepi]

I typically fill up about 50km from the track and after an evening 4.5 hr session (typically about 150km) I pull in my driveway with around a quarter tank or little less.

I wouldn't use TMP's gas unless you need race fuel, it won't be cheap. I also typically just bring my own food, I'm picky though so if you like snack bar food then it is always open in the evenings and I'm sure it would be on weekendsI always try to fill up at my tracks here in California. The owners of these small tracks are often on the verge of going out of business and any little bit helps. So support your tracks by buying gas and food and whatever else you can there!

When a track disappears, its usually impossible to get them back.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

[tmontague]

I always try to fill up at my tracks here in California. The owners of these small tracks are often on the verge of going out of business and any little bit helps. So support your tracks by buying gas and food and whatever else you can there!

When a track disappears, its usually impossible to get them back.

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agreed. My point about the gas being pricey is that paying for race gas in a stock yaris will cost much much more and won't have any benefit as the octane rating is much higher than the engine needs. I don't believe TMP sells 87 octane, I think just race fuel.

As for the food, I'm particular about what I eat so snack bar food doesn't typically fit that bill but I understand the sentiment of supporting a local track. They are not large money makers in most cases I just support them with going there for frequent track days:smile:

[ArmstrongRacing]

I always try to fill up at my tracks here in California. The owners of these small tracks are often on the verge of going out of business and any little bit helps. So support your tracks by buying gas and food and whatever else you can there!

When a track disappears, its usually impossible to get them back.

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I agree here. I fill up off-site but if I need more I'll use 98 or whatever the lowest is. I also buy a bunch of food and swag.....because who can have too many motorsport shirts, stickers, or beanies LOL

[bri62]

Well you answered my questions. Thanks! It figures that racing fuel is racing fuel. I can't wait to meet up with you, your car is quite a track car with all the mods you have done. I am expecting tour of the track in it. :]