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Old 08-09-2009, 02:44 PM   #19
jambo101
 
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With todays overhead cam engines what exactly do you adjust?,if the cam is opening the valve wouldnt the cam ultimately wear down causing the valve to not open as much as when it was new, and wouldnt a whole new cam shaft be needed to remedy the situation.,
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Old 08-09-2009, 10:27 PM   #20
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It the simplest sense, as the valvetrain wears you increase the shim thickness to reduce the size of the clearance between the valve and the lifter. It looks like on the Yaris the lifter is replaced when the clearance is out of specification.

Last edited by bikeshox; 08-09-2009 at 10:43 PM.
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Old 08-09-2009, 10:34 PM   #21
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Heard a good story this weekend from a friend of mine that formerly worked in a shop. One of his co-workers was adjusting the valves on a Geo Storm. Unfortunately the tech adjusting the Storm did not have the correct shim so he found the next size thicker and sanded it down by hand to achieve the correct clearance.

So the short answer to my question is that no one has checked and adjusted the valve clearance.
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Old 08-09-2009, 11:09 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Dog View Post
Run it til it drops and DIY plug and play a salvage engine for less than the cost of a skilled factory valve adjustment?
You know where to find a good salvage engine for less than 282$CAD ???

Quote:
Unfortunately the tech adjusting the Storm did not have the correct shim so he found the next size thicker and sanded it down by hand to achieve the correct clearance.
Good grief!! Sanded it down? What an idiot. Those parts are case hardened, which means that he could have sanded down into the soft metal beneath the hardened case. That one would wear extremely fast. This reminds me why I like to do my own work. At least I KNOW what I'm ignorant about.
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Old 08-09-2009, 11:59 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Reddog99 View Post
Good grief!! Sanded it down? What an idiot. Those parts are case hardened... That one would wear extremely fast. This reminds me why I like to do my own work. At least I KNOW what I'm ignorant about.
We had a good laugh at that one. That and that it was a Geo Storm.
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Old 08-10-2009, 08:30 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Dog View Post
Run it til it drops and DIY plug and play a salvage engine for less than the cost of a skilled factory valve adjustment?
Yeah, run it till it drops, use the right oil, and change it on a regular basis, and I doubt too many here will ever have to worry about valve adjustments...unless they just want to spend big money to have a tech LISTEN/"check" the valves. I wonder how many of these "checks" actually turn into lifter replacements ??.....
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Old 08-10-2009, 08:59 AM   #25
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Interesting aside- this set up is called bucket tappets and they were designed by FIAT in the 1960's. My first 1970s era VW rabbit had them. It required 2 specialized tools to adjust the tappets- a depressor to get at the discs and a removal and insert tool to get the discs out and reinsert new ones with the proper clearances. The big problem is the expensive set of discs with a variety of thicknesses you need to be able to do the work in a garage. I used to take two days to do it on my VW- one day to measure the clearances and remove the discs with bad clearances- and the next day to trudge down to the dealer to buy the individual discs (the VW dealers parts department always had every size disc in those days)i n the sizes needed to get the clearances corrected. Then they had to be reinserted. There never was any need to remove the overhead camshaft on the FIATS and VWs to do this service and I doubt there is now for our Toyotas - unless you lack the correct tools.

Come to think of it there was a third and fourth tool you needed to do it right- a micrometer- to measure the discs thickness of the removed disc because the embossed # would almost always be rubbed off by the camlobes and of cause a set of feeler gauges to test the clearances.

My guess is the this set up really doesn't require maintenance nowadays- it is a much more stable setup than the screw down adjusters from the old days (reflected in the fact that the proceedure went from every 3K miles to every 20K miles even then) and with modern metallurgy the parts just don't wear out like they used to. Also what wear does happen is often offset by carbon deposits on the valves which tend to close off the distances as the wear increases the distances thus pretty much ending up a wash.

I frankly doubt that many dealers even invest in the giant trays of discs needed to actually do this job- but knowing modern dealers they'd be most pleased to charge you for the service they literally can't even perform.

Only old guys like me (62) would know all this junk!

:-)

Last edited by Lewis; 08-10-2009 at 01:56 PM.
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Old 08-10-2009, 09:29 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Dog View Post
Run it til it drops and DIY plug and play a salvage engine for less than the cost of a skilled factory valve adjustment?
maybe that something i should have done when i had to put a salvage motor in my 07. its not hard. But the valve adjustment would be much easier.
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Old 08-10-2009, 11:23 PM   #27
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Quote:
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Interesting aside- ......... I frankly doubt that many dealers even invest in the giant trays of discs needed to actually do this job- but knowing modern dealers they'd be most pleased to charge you for the service they literally can't even perform.
Lewis, the valve setup in the Yaris is a bit different than you think. This engine doesn't use the replaceable shims. It uses replaceable lifters. If you need to adjust the clearance, the entire lifter needs to be changed, which is why the cams have to be removed to perform the operation. The advantage is that there are no shims to spit out if the valves float, but it's a real PITA to adjust. Fortunately, the wear rate is quite low.
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Old 08-11-2009, 06:45 AM   #28
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well Reddogg- just another reason not to ever do the adjustment!

you're right- my technical knowledge is aging as fast as it's container.

:-)
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Old 08-12-2009, 07:24 PM   #29
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Interesting that a post like this came up, myself I was just talking to the Stealership about my noise lifters and they said that I need to have the adjustments done! My car is only at 43,000 km's and it has been maintained from the dealership since new.

Im going to get a quote on the repair this week hopefully once I get my "goodies" removed from my engine bay. I think its b.s since its not even covered under the engine warranty.
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Old 08-13-2009, 12:16 AM   #30
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That's because valve adjustments (for mechanical lifters) are a normal maintenance item and not covered by warranty on any car that I'm aware of. It's like tire rotation or wiper replacement - not covered by the warranty.

You might get a second opinion by a different dealer. The noise you hear may be something else.
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