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Old 11-24-2009, 10:09 AM   #55
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I didn't mean to come off as the feeling of being ignored, I was meaning that I did read all of the previous posts and pages, I just didn't fully get it what the end result is supposed to be like and what the pros/cons would be to moving it. My apologies
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Old 11-24-2009, 11:46 AM   #56
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The final word on this discussion will have to wait until someone does some before and after alignment checking.

My speculation is that it simply improves the toe curve on a lowered Yaris, letting the rear suspension work more like it would at stock height. It's not gonna give you "toe out", just "less toe in".

Now... here's a question for those who have done it. (I'm freakin' lazy, could be months before I get around to it) Is there enough slop in those pivot bolts that the alignment of the rear axle becomes an issue? Can you end up "dog-tracking" due to the rear axle assembly not pointing straight along the centerline of the car? Or are they tight enough that it's not a concern? (probably another question that it will take an alignment rack to answer accurately)
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Last edited by Loren; 11-24-2009 at 12:48 PM. Reason: added the word "not" that was left out
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:21 PM   #57
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I should take my car to one of those "free alignment checks" like firestone and wheel works. And see how it looks afterwards.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:34 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YarisSedan View Post
I should take my car to one of those "free alignment checks" like firestone and wheel works. And see how it looks afterwards.
Let us know what they say. I just did this last weekend and I'm curious too.
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Old 11-24-2009, 02:32 PM   #59
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I just lowered my yaris a little while ago and I still havent gotten around to adressing the toe and camber alignments yet. I was gunna just shim the rears but I think this in combo with the shims might be a better solution.

here's my basic explanation on what this mod would change(see pictures attached)

I think that on a stock height car, this mod isnt needed.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg StockHeight.jpg (44.4 KB, 588 views)
File Type: jpg LoweredHeight.jpg (42.4 KB, 584 views)
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Old 11-24-2009, 02:53 PM   #60
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So if i go back to my technical schooling days it looks like that mod changes the caster. But caster dosnt really make much difference unless it is on the steering tires.
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Old 11-24-2009, 03:02 PM   #61
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The way the rear axle assembly is designed, it also changes toe. (caster is irrelevant, as the rear wheels don't steer)

At stock height, the car has a certain amount of toe-in. As the axle rotates up (when the suspension compresses... or when the car is lowered) on its pivot point, the angle goes more inward.

If you lower the car and DON'T move the pivot point, you have more static toe-out than stock, which isn't good for turning. (great for going straight)

Moving to the higher pivot point on a lowered car should bring the toe back closer to factory spec.
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Old 11-24-2009, 03:05 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loren View Post
The way the rear axle assembly is designed, it also changes toe. (caster is irrelevant, as the rear wheels don't steer)

At stock height, the car has a certain amount of toe-in. As the axle rotates up (when the suspension compresses... or when the car is lowered) on its pivot point, the angle goes more inward.

If you lower the car and DON'T move the pivot point, you have more static toe-out than stock, which isn't good for turning. (great for going straight)

Moving to the higher pivot point on a lowered car should bring the toe back closer to factory spec.
Ahhhhh i 100 percent got you now. Explains why every reponse is only feeling a difference on turns. So pretty much a cheap and easy way to correct the toe without involving use of shims on lowered vehicles. I am curiouse why toyota did not mention to do this with the instructions that come with the TRD springs it seems like a no brainer.
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Old 11-24-2009, 03:12 PM   #63
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my uber simple drawing don't really show the effect on the toe and camber very well but this mod does effect both.As the caster angle changes toe turns into camber and vise-versa. If there were absolutlely no stock Toe or Camber than it wouldnt matter, but that isnt the case.
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Old 11-24-2009, 04:49 PM   #64
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Awesome discovery. I have had mad rubbing issues on the rear since installing the PG rear hub spacers because of how much toe in there is. Hopefully doing this mod will compensate enough to clear a lot of it up.
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Old 11-24-2009, 06:59 PM   #65
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I did mine on a rack today and it was a real PAIN in the ass to get the back side of the bushing lined up. Ended up having to disconect the shocks so i could get the torsion beam to move a bit to get it to finally lined up. Took me with a flashlight and another guy with a pry bar prying on the end of the bushing to get the bolt hole to line up.

After test drive i notice you have this feeling like the car is more leveled or like the rear end is sitting lower now. Also going over bumps i started to hear this clank clank sound. Turns out the torsion bar sits higher up now i guess because of the angle. So its banging against my megan tie bar. I am going to see if i can get a file and file it down. If not looks like i may have to remove it. So for those who have that rear little bar by the gas tank that seems like it has no use at all make sure you remove it first before you do this mod.
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:20 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loren View Post

Now... here's a question for those who have done it. (I'm freakin' lazy, could be months before I get around to it) Is there enough slop in those pivot bolts that the alignment of the rear axle becomes an issue? Can you end up "dog-tracking" due to the rear axle assembly not pointing straight along the centerline of the car? Or are they tight enough that it's not a concern? (probably another question that it will take an alignment rack to answer accurately)
There is very minimal space in there I doubt you would make your car dog-track. The metal on the inside of the bushings where the bolt goes throught is fairly tight in the slot. I would have put this on the alignment rack up at work but our rear heads don't calibrate so I wouldn't be able to tell you
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:28 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilredrocket View Post
There is very minimal space in there I doubt you would make your car dog-track. The metal on the inside of the bushings where the bolt goes throught is fairly tight in the slot. I would have put this on the alignment rack up at work but our rear heads don't calibrate so I wouldn't be able to tell you
Sounds like the alignment heads at my old shop. Good old "set the toe and let it go" Tell your owner to get a laser system. No more comping heads again.
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Old 11-25-2009, 10:50 AM   #68
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Hmm i can almost swear the rear of my car sits lower now. The fender gap is the same but the rear of the car is lower. Its as if the car has 15s in the front and 17 inch rims in the back. And then i swapped out the 15s back in the back. Before and after. It looks like i lowered the car about a inch more looking strait on from the back. I dont think its some placebo effect either looking strait on it does look lower. But looking from the side from the wheel and fender it looks the same. If someone is planning on doing this mod please take a tape measure and measure from fender to ground and rear bumper to ground before and after please.
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:27 PM   #69
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from these that you write, the axle going down but the height is the same.

maybe that is...
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:34 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YarisSedan View Post
Hmm i can almost swear the rear of my car sits lower now. The fender gap is the same but the rear of the car is lower. Its as if the car has 15s in the front and 17 inch rims in the back. And then i swapped out the 15s back in the back. Before and after. It looks like i lowered the car about a inch more looking strait on from the back. I dont think its some placebo effect either looking strait on it does look lower. But looking from the side from the wheel and fender it looks the same. If someone is planning on doing this mod please take a tape measure and measure from fender to ground and rear bumper to ground before and after please.
that doesnt seem unreasonable... the spring sits slightly fore of the center of the wheel. if you change the pitch of the beam, you can raise or lower the spring perch as well. personally, i would think it would make it sit a little higher as the perch is tilted slightly higher.
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:35 PM   #71
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oh, we need a sticky on this topic btw
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Old 11-25-2009, 06:48 PM   #72
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Now that I look back at it as Loren stated it should help lessen the amount of toe out. My only concern is with that part of the axle postioned up higher wouldn't it make the wheel go back towards the rear of the car more when it is flexing. My problem is my tire is rubbing in this area.

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