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Old 11-18-2018, 08:11 AM   #1
06YarisRS
 
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Axle Play at Transmission...Seeking Opinions

This question is in regard to my 2008 LS. I'm getting an unsettling 'throbbing' or vibration at speeds over, say 40 - 50 km/h, more obvious at higher speeds and it gets worse on dips in the road on the highway under moderate to heavy loads and especially when climbing hills. The more torque on the drivetrain, the more rough the vibration becomes. If I let off on the throttle, the vibration stops. I've checked all wheel balances, supsension components etc. Other than the movement at the transmission, the axles seem fine, with no sloppiness or play whatsoever. There is no clicking from the joints while turning. I have no ATF leaking, so the seal is good, but could there be an issue with the ouput shaft? Or could this just be a bad axle?


Can you please check out my video and let me know if what you see seems like excessive play? Obviously, there should be play in and out as the axle has to slide in and out on the spline, but it's the up and down movement that has me concerned. I'm going to put my '06 Yaris up on the hoist and see if it has similar play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5tQxjL9hb4

And

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsVejP4XY78

Thanks.
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Last edited by 06YarisRS; 11-18-2018 at 08:38 AM.
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Old 11-18-2018, 12:56 PM   #2
tmontague
 
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FWIW I have roughly the same amount of play in both my axles, oem passenger side and aftermarket driver side. The said I don't have a vibration from the drivetrain.

I originally went to return the aftermarket axle due to this play since there was 1 month left in the warranty but when I received the new one it had more play and the outer joint was super stiff. I ended up just keeping the original aftemarket axle.

My Vibe's axles seem to have zero play what so ever but this can also be due to the axles being compressed or lengthened depending in the position of the suspension and other factors. Case in point, my oem axle originally showed no play but a day later when rechecking it, it had the same amount if play as my aftermarket one.

Play in the inner joint is not a good thing and there really shouldn't be any, but some play where the inner shaft enter the transaxle is from my experience normal. If there was no play built in between the splined inner shaft and the transaxle then you would virtually never get the axle in or out due to tight tolerances.

Determining if the inner joint has play or just the splined inner shaft is the tough part. A new axle might solve your vibration but its tough to say without swapping one in. I would assume that the vibration would improve under throttle only because it would cause the axle and joints to be compressed together leading to less play.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:00 PM   #3
06YarisRS
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmontague View Post
FWIW I have roughly the same amount of play in both my axles, oem passenger side and aftermarket driver side. The said I don't have a vibration from the drivetrain.

I originally went to return the aftermarket axle due to this play since there was 1 month left in the warranty but when I received the new one it had more play and the outer joint was super stiff. I ended up just keeping the original aftemarket axle.

My Vibe's axles seem to have zero play what so ever but this can also be due to the axles being compressed or lengthened depending in the position of the suspension and other factors. Case in point, my oem axle originally showed no play but a day later when rechecking it, it had the same amount if play as my aftermarket one.

Play in the inner joint is not a good thing and there really shouldn't be any, but some play where the inner shaft enter the transaxle is from my experience normal. If there was no play built in between the splined inner shaft and the transaxle then you would virtually never get the axle in or out due to tight tolerances.

Determining if the inner joint has play or just the splined inner shaft is the tough part. A new axle might solve your vibration but its tough to say without swapping one in. I would assume that the vibration would improve under throttle only because it would cause the axle and joints to be compressed together leading to less play.
Thanks Trevor. Yes, it's a little perplexing, especially with the vibration increasing on bumps. Though when the back squats down on a bump, I suppose it would temporarily increase torque on the axles. I might add that it's also worse with the kids and hockey gear in the back. If I take the car out myself, it often doesn't make the vibration, unless I find myself a good dip in the highway. So, I'm not 100% sure if it's axle related or suspension. If the car is loaded up (well, my kids are pretty light) and I'm driving up a long hill, the vibration will be consistent regardles of how much load I put on the engine. It definitely has something with center of gravity shifted to the rear of the car. If I'm going up a hill while it's vibrating, and I quickly shift to neutral, the vibration goes away. I'm also hoping it has nothing to do with the transmission or clutches. The problem is evident only in higher gears, 3rd or 4th, and speeds probably over 50 km/h.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:21 PM   #4
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2008 LE

Could it be possible you are not just experiencing the harmonic hum or throbbing that manifests itself in this car? Many have questioned this weird phenomenon over the years. That's all I can offer up without actually being in the car myself.

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Old 11-18-2018, 03:13 PM   #5
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2008 LE

Could it be possible you are not just experiencing the harmonic hum or throbbing that manifests itself in this car? Many have questioned this weird phenomenon over the years. That's all I can offer up without actually being in the car myself.

Sent from my EML-L09 using Tapatalk
WeeYari, are you pulling my leg? Or, is there something that actually develops for which no reason has been identified.


Oh yeah, My car is an LE, as you pointed out, not an LS.
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:18 PM   #6
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I was out this afternoon and I have identified a partially damaged training arm bushing (driver's side). I could pull pieces of it out, but the central section through which the bolt goes, seems fully intact. Personally, I can't see how this would cause a consistent vibration, but maybe it could. If it was related to that, I would expect the vibration to stop once the car stopped moving up and down.
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:30 PM   #7
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If it is worse when load is transferred to the rear and you have a worn/crumbling bushing then that is the likely culprit.

Those bushings are the only thing holding all of the rear of the suspension to the car (with the exception of the rear shocks which are not supportive). If a bushing is worn this can cause vibration/noise to resonate into the cabin such as the simple noise and vibration that comes from a tire/wheel turning on the road.

I'd inspect that bushing further.

My car makes all sorts of noises and pops ever since it started to become a track car. I always inspect underneath it and make sure everything is sound. As long as it all checks out then I let it go. Seems to work well this way.
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Old 11-18-2018, 04:01 PM   #8
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I'd inspect that bushing further.

I'll do one better, man. I will order one. It needs replacing anyway. Maybe this will be the cure! Thanks.
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:45 AM   #9
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FWD driveline vibration usually shows up 40-50kph while accelerating. Usually would describe it as a vibration in your right foot or similar. The axle play you filmed is probably not the issue. It's normal to have some movement, but what is not normal is pure radial play. So if you were to grab the axle with both hands at the innermost part and push up it shouldn't move, but it will swivel like you showed. Chances are if the seals aren't leaking, it's fine. So basically you are looking at: worn or tight axles, worn diff bearings, or axle misalignment (Eg. from lowered/lifted springs). My money is on a worn axle.
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Old 11-20-2018, 03:48 AM   #10
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I should mention that it's probably a worn inner joint on the cv axle.
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Old 11-20-2018, 06:46 AM   #11
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I should mention that it's probably a worn inner joint on the cv axle.
Thanks Cory! When I was initially looking at it, I did grab it by the axle shaft and the inboard CV joint and try to wiggle it. There did not appear to be any movement. I'll get the car up on the hoist in the next day or two and see if there is any slop on either of inner joints - passenger and driver sides.
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