LED Install Problem (Tails) - Page 2 - Toyota Yaris Forums

Betrivent · 10-22-2010, 02:48 PM

Okay, after checking all fuses I have come to the conclusion that it is very probably a relay. What doyou mean by Quadrant? Like FR, LR, FL, RL? (Front right etc.*)

CTScott · 10-22-2010, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betrivent

Okay, after checking all fuses I have come to the conclusion that it is very probably a relay. What doyou mean by Quadrant? Like FR, LR, FL, RL? (Front right etc.*)

Yes, by quadrants I mean FR, etc.

The only relay I could see getting damaged from what you have done is the flasher. It's pretty hard to damage a simple mechanical relay without first smoking a fuse.

Betrivent · 10-22-2010, 04:49 PM

Alrioght taking out the rear brake lights have yielded some interesting results:

Both rear lights are not in, all lights return to normal
One rear brake light is put in, all lights remain normal, but brake lights still do not apply
Both rear brake lights are in, stuff hits the fan- electrically speaking.

Is there a relay or fuse specifically dedicated to the brake lights I could have fried?

EDIT: Derp, the flasher. I thought that only controls the signals. Now my problem is getting the little sucker out, it's wedged in tight.

Eatoman · 10-22-2010, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTScott

The 7443 bulbs have 4 contacts. Make sure you didn't bend one of the socket contacts when you were switching back and forth.

The turn signals need the replacement flasher module or a load resistor because the standard flasher relies on the resistance of the bulb filament for its timing circuit.

The Yaris doesn't have dead bulb detection, so load resistors are not necessary for anything except the turns.

The stop/tail bulb has two filaments. If your replacement LEDs were not true 7443 bulb replacements, then they may have been jumping the stop light circuit over to the tail light circuit and hence causing the headlight indicator to illuminate (and the cluster to dim) when you stepped on the brake pedal.

Say wha?? This is all Greek to me dudes! LOL!

Betrivent · 10-22-2010, 04:59 PM

7443 is a type of bulb, a flasher module is a mechanical switch, if you will, powered by electricity to "activate" when current is applied, for instance if I apply the brakes, electricity will run through the module, and allow current from the battery to flow to the lights (this is simplified). LEDs require less power than incandescent bulbs, and therefor have less resistance to electric current. The car thinks that this is because a bulb is out and it flashes very rapidly at you when you attempt to signal. To fix this, with LED bulbs, you would need to add resistance to the line, or replace the module so that the car thinks that everything is as it should be.

EDIT: Alright CT, I took out the flasher module, and I turned the driving lights on, the rear brake lights came on, but not to brake capacity. They do not activate even when I have no driving lights on.. though upon reflection that doesn't determine where the problem is still.

EDIT2: Upon further troubleshooting, we have determined it is a relay. Though the problem is now, I don't know which relay on the instrument panel it is.

CTScott · 10-22-2010, 09:11 PM

The brake lights don't have a relay in their circuit, so for them, check the STOP fuse in under dash fuse panel.

Betrivent · 10-22-2010, 09:20 PM

I did, and all the fuses are fine. This is infinitely perplexing then. Howeber, I did check etimago's EWD and found that the stop signal goes through some sort of BOX, if you cancall it that, on the diagram, I just assumed that wasa relay

Betrivent · 10-22-2010, 09:22 PM

http://www.etimago.com/yaris/repairmanual/EWD.pdf

on page 143

CTScott · 10-22-2010, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betrivent

http://www.etimago.com/yaris/repairmanual/EWD.pdf

on page 143

No relay - That's just a junction connector.

CTScott · 10-22-2010, 09:27 PM

For the heck of it, replace the stop fuse. It might not be fully popped, but might be so thin that it's causing a wicked voltage drop.

Betrivent · 10-23-2010, 03:54 AM

I will try that tomorrow, I have a gut feeling it's something really simple like that too, but my middle stop light works? Like the one at the top of the hatch. Shouldn't it also fail if my fuse is blown/malfunctioning?

CTScott · 10-23-2010, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betrivent

I will try that tomorrow, I have a gut feeling it's something really simple like that too, but my middle stop light works? Like the one at the top of the hatch. Shouldn't it also fail if my fuse is blown/malfunctioning?

That would actually make sense, as the center light is LED, so it draws very little current in comparison to the bulbs.

Betrivent · 10-23-2010, 01:42 PM

Ahhh I see. I will check that right after I get some coffee.. zzzzzz

EDIT: Didn't get around to it today, will check tomorrow.

Betrivent · 10-24-2010, 08:15 PM

Alright, so update. I tried replacing the STOP fuse in the 9 position on the fuse panel under the dash, and no luck. I've been thinking, if when I plug in two LED bulbs, and one comes on, and when I plug in two incandescent bulbs, and NONE come on, could it be I've fried something that provides the two sockets with power? I can only think it's something near the front of the car, since I've examined all the electronics in the back of the car.

EDIT: So obviously it's got to be between the fuse and the lights, that there is a problem. Could i have partially burned the junction connector?

CTScott · 10-24-2010, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betrivent

Alright, so update. I tried replacing the STOP fuse in the 9 position on the fuse panel under the dash, and no luck. I've been thinking, if when I plug in two LED bulbs, and one comes on, and when I plug in two incandescent bulbs, and NONE come on, could it be I've fried something that provides the two sockets with power? I can only think it's something near the front of the car, since I've examined all the electronics in the back of the car.

EDIT: So obviously it's got to be between the fuse and the lights, that there is a problem. Could i have partially burned the junction connector?

If it's not the fuse, then I would suspect something with the bulb sockets. Can you snap decent macro photos of the two sockets?

Betrivent · 10-25-2010, 05:00 AM

I will do my best. But I am skeptical that both have failed? Especially since when I switched LED bulbs to troubleshoot, one bulb always worked, regardless which socket it is in, and the other did not, also the original bulbs did not work at all again after I screwed up the first time.

CTScott · 10-25-2010, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betrivent

I will do my best. But I am skeptical that both have failed? Especially since when I switched LED bulbs to troubleshoot, one bulb always worked, regardless which socket it is in, and the other did not, also the original bulbs did not work at all again after I screwed up the first time.

Only one socket needs to be messed up to cause what you are seeing.

Betrivent · 10-25-2010, 01:08 PM

I will get you pictures, but it will have to be later since I do not have a garage to work in and need to wait until later when I have access to one.

10-22-2010, 04:59 PM	#23
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	7443 is a type of bulb, a flasher module is a mechanical switch, if you will, powered by electricity to "activate" when current is applied, for instance if I apply the brakes, electricity will run through the module, and allow current from the battery to flow to the lights (this is simplified). LEDs require less power than incandescent bulbs, and therefor have less resistance to electric current. The car thinks that this is because a bulb is out and it flashes very rapidly at you when you attempt to signal. To fix this, with LED bulbs, you would need to add resistance to the line, or replace the module so that the car thinks that everything is as it should be. EDIT: Alright CT, I took out the flasher module, and I turned the driving lights on, the rear brake lights came on, but not to brake capacity. They do not activate even when I have no driving lights on.. though upon reflection that doesn't determine where the problem is still. EDIT2: Upon further troubleshooting, we have determined it is a relay. Though the problem is now, I don't know which relay on the instrument panel it is. Last edited by Betrivent; 10-22-2010 at 08:09 PM.

10-23-2010, 01:42 PM	#31
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	Ahhh I see. I will check that right after I get some coffee.. zzzzzz EDIT: Didn't get around to it today, will check tomorrow. Last edited by Betrivent; 10-24-2010 at 03:03 AM.

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10-22-2010, 02:48 PM	#19
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	Okay, after checking all fuses I have come to the conclusion that it is very probably a relay. What doyou mean by Quadrant? Like FR, LR, FL, RL? (Front right etc.*)

10-22-2010, 04:49 PM	#21
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	Alrioght taking out the rear brake lights have yielded some interesting results: Both rear lights are not in, all lights return to normal One rear brake light is put in, all lights remain normal, but brake lights still do not apply Both rear brake lights are in, stuff hits the fan- electrically speaking. Is there a relay or fuse specifically dedicated to the brake lights I could have fried? EDIT: Derp, the flasher. I thought that only controls the signals. Now my problem is getting the little sucker out, it's wedged in tight.

10-22-2010, 09:11 PM	#24
CTScott ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 09 5dr LB, 2x 08 3dr LB Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: USA, CT Posts: 13,460	The brake lights don't have a relay in their circuit, so for them, check the STOP fuse in under dash fuse panel.

10-22-2010, 09:20 PM	#25
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	I did, and all the fuses are fine. This is infinitely perplexing then. Howeber, I did check etimago's EWD and found that the stop signal goes through some sort of BOX, if you cancall it that, on the diagram, I just assumed that wasa relay

10-22-2010, 09:22 PM	#26
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	http://www.etimago.com/yaris/repairmanual/EWD.pdf on page 143

10-22-2010, 09:27 PM	#28
CTScott ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 09 5dr LB, 2x 08 3dr LB Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: USA, CT Posts: 13,460	For the heck of it, replace the stop fuse. It might not be fully popped, but might be so thin that it's causing a wicked voltage drop.

10-23-2010, 03:54 AM	#29
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	I will try that tomorrow, I have a gut feeling it's something really simple like that too, but my middle stop light works? Like the one at the top of the hatch. Shouldn't it also fail if my fuse is blown/malfunctioning?

10-24-2010, 08:15 PM	#32
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	Alright, so update. I tried replacing the STOP fuse in the 9 position on the fuse panel under the dash, and no luck. I've been thinking, if when I plug in two LED bulbs, and one comes on, and when I plug in two incandescent bulbs, and NONE come on, could it be I've fried something that provides the two sockets with power? I can only think it's something near the front of the car, since I've examined all the electronics in the back of the car. EDIT: So obviously it's got to be between the fuse and the lights, that there is a problem. Could i have partially burned the junction connector?

10-25-2010, 05:00 AM	#34
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	I will do my best. But I am skeptical that both have failed? Especially since when I switched LED bulbs to troubleshoot, one bulb always worked, regardless which socket it is in, and the other did not, also the original bulbs did not work at all again after I screwed up the first time.

10-25-2010, 01:08 PM	#36
Betrivent Not quite a noob Drives: e46 325 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: edmonton Posts: 1,408	I will get you pictures, but it will have to be later since I do not have a garage to work in and need to wait until later when I have access to one.