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Old 12-23-2017, 02:45 PM   #73
tmontague's Avatar
Drives: '08 2zr swapped Vios M/T
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Hamilton Ont.
Posts: 1,846
LSD and Trans update

I've been able to drive my car in the snow quite a bit in the past month or so and I feel like it's been enough to give a good quality update on my experience. Keep in mind this is my first time driving a car with an LSD.

I have 4 winter tires (more of an ice tire) that are relatively new as well. There seem to be two camps on line in regards to driving an LSD in snow: 1. It will help increase traction by giving you a true 2wd car instead of the realistic 1wd that open diffs give you once they slip. 2. They actually make snow/ice driving worse.

To me #1 always seemed to make more sense. In this case I'm talking about a clutch type lsd, a torsen type will not do a whole lot when your one tire is free wheeling with no traction. A clutch type lsd will lock up regardless if one wheel is free spinning.

After a month of driving in snow the only time I can see an LSD being dangerous is under hard acceleration on slick conditions. This still entirely depends on driver input, so not actually the fault of the LSD but rather the driver. If one decides to give too much throttle during cornering in icy conditions then since the axles are locked causing both tires to spin you will under steer much much more than with an open diff. This is due to both tires losing traction and not just one. This leaves you with zero traction on the front which leads you to under steer. This is easily controlled by not giving too much throttle on corners or by backing off the throttle if you start to slide and you will regain control.

In deep snow or slippery conditions the grip has improved drastically. Instead of hearing the right wheel spin up and the car barely inch forward, I now notice much less wheel spin and the car pulls forward consistently. Not like an awd obviously but it is more consistent in the progress forward.

Performance wise (as best as I can with snow tires on) torque steer is essentially zero. I can go WOT (now with much less wheel spin) and the car doesn't pull left or right. The steering wheel under throttle actually has a tendency to want to self correct back to neutral, quite powerfully actually.

Overall the car feel more planted, firm and in control, even in snow.

As for the bad:

I still have a transmission clunk that seems to happen on left turns when giving a decent amount of throttle. This does not sound or feel like axle bind, that problem was fixed with swapping in Tercel axle. It sounds exactly like the transmission hitting the subframe. This is likely due to the LSD putting extra torque out from the transmission to both wheel leading to different forces on the mounts causing excess movement.

My plan to remedy this is to get a dogbone mount machined from solid aluminum which should severely limit movement.

Overall I'm really pleased with the LSD, it really transforms the car into more of a purpose built "sports car". My gas mileage is now at about 7.1L/100km up from 6.3L/100km when I originally put the 2zr in Lfwiw it was at 5.8L/100 km with my 1nz). That said I am also on winter gas and snow tires so realistically I am probably sitting at 6.7L/100km with the 4.3 FD. The only time the LSD makes a lot of noise is when the trans fluid is still cold. Once it heats up the LSD is very quiet.
I like to drive a slow car fast...
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Old 12-23-2017, 03:10 PM   #74
Data doesn't lie
ArmstrongRacing's Avatar
Drives: That Scrappy 2zrVios
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 501
I'm happy to hear the trans is proving its worth, and that you understand (and have shared) how to properly use the throttle. haha

I still dont know why your car continues to make clunking noises when mine did not. I still have a silent drivetrain even after swapping to the 6 speed. I need to buy another LSD at some point, maybe Ill try a torsion this time so I can compare
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Old 12-23-2017, 04:33 PM   #75
tmontague's Avatar
Drives: '08 2zr swapped Vios M/T
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Hamilton Ont.
Posts: 1,846
I have no idea either, Toyota was obviously aware of the potential as they made the xd left side axle slightly shorter but I can't explain why you never seemed to have the issue. My car was never in an accident that I'm aware of and there is no evidence to ever say it was.

The noise/banging I'm hearing now is simply the war of the trans hitting the subframe. My only guess is I prematurely wore out my fluid filled passenger side mount from moving the engine up and down with it still connected when removing my trans twice. However the doggone mostly is the only mount controlling that engine movement and mine is fully poly filled.

I'm hoping the solid billet doggone will fix the issue, if not it isn't that bad and shouldn't be an issue on the track. Problem is the xd is such a rare car that there is little to no aftermarket for it other than show parts.

As for the torsen lsd, I've never used one but I was originally conceded about dding a clutch type based on online comments. After having daily'd it for the past little while, it is no issue at all. Most comments online is the same comment regurgitated, very few people spoke from experience.

If costs were equal, I'd go clutch type every time. Never have to worry about lifting a wheel or having minimal grip on the inside causing it to act like an open. Yes, eventually the clutches will need to be replaced but according to many users online the cusco 1 way lsd last a darn long time. Not many draw backs of you like to hear your car and feel everything. If you want oem comfort and silence than torsen is a great compromise.

I've been very please this far
I like to drive a slow car fast...
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