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Old 02-08-2018, 08:06 PM   #1
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Toyota scaling back models?

Interesting article discussing Toyota's future plans.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...une-car-lineup

The beginning is not that surprising- they want to make more of the high dollar vehicles(i.e. TRD, big SUVs). However, it looks like we could be seeing some effect on our beloved Yaris! They specifically call out the Yaris, Corolla, and Prius as having too many models and wanting to trim the lineup. I'm not sure if that means no more Yaris iA or regular Yaris instead. I realize Toyota doesn't make a lot of money on these cars, but isn't the whole point of having entry-level vehicles to get folks into the brand and create loyalty?

Maybe they will let Mazda have the iA(it's really a Mazda anyways), badge it as a Mazda2 and let us keep the awesome little regular Yaris? I guess if you want choices with Toyota in the future you better be willing to pay up!
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Old 02-08-2018, 09:25 PM   #2
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This doesn't sound good for the Yaris hatchback; it's days are numbered.
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Old 02-09-2018, 12:41 AM   #3
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Yaris (hatchback) sales are too dismal to have a future in the US, and what they are selling is probably almost all rental/fleet vehicles. I doubt that the Toyota-made Yaris hatch will make it past the 2018-gen version in the US, before being canceled in late 2019 or 2020. If it does stick around by some miracle, I bet that the SE trim will be dropped (along with all manual shifters), since they are the slowest sellers of the lineup by far due to price (most potential Yaris customers are shopping for an inexpensive, reliable econobox) - plus the SE is in the same basic price range as a better-equipped iM, so why buy a Yaris SE, unless you just love the styling or are trying to avoid a CVT automatic at all cost.

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Old 02-09-2018, 07:45 AM   #4
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My guess is dropping the Yaris iA and all of the L trims for Corolla and Yaris. I'm thinking they're keeping the SE for both since that's the trim model that gives them the higher profit margins. I'm going to assume the Corolla LE Eco will be dropped and may drop the SE forcing people to go up to the XSE. And all 3-door Yaris trims will be dropped (VW did away with the 3-door GTI already). So basically 5-door LE and SE only for the Yaris is my guess, and the manual will probably still be offered (since manuals are big in other countries), but just like when I sold cars, rarely made for the US.

Back when I sold Toyotas, we sold more Yaris SE than L trims...however, that dealership barely sold any Yaris to begin with. With that said, right before I left, our regional rep did say that the Yaris did sell a lot more than expected.

The Prius line really needs to be trimmed back. I'm thinking the One will be axed along with the Two Eco and Three Touring trims. So just the Two, Three, Four, and Four Touring.

Toyota really needs to kill off the Prius v and Prius c now. The Rav4 hybrid doesn't get that much less mpg than the Prius v, and the Prius c gets worse mpg than the Prius LB and Camry hybrids (shoot, even the Camry hybrid LE gets the same mpg as the Prius LB now).
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Old 02-09-2018, 03:15 PM   #5
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I think they would keep the L model Yaris for rental/fleet sales. The SE model would be the one they would cut I would think. However, maybe they will kill off the stupid iA so that would be awesome.
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Old 02-09-2018, 09:51 PM   #6
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The iA/Mazda2 is selling at 2-3x the rate of the Yaris hatchback in the US, so I can only see Toyota canning the Yaris iA over the Yaris L/LE/SE hatchback if the Toyota/Mazda relationship weakens, Toyota's cut of the profits on the iA are too slim, or if the iA dings their quality ratings/perceptions as a company in some way.

I would love to see the entire Prius abomination lineup get the chopping block, but that isn't going to happen sadly. I would be much happier to see more hybrid versions of regular Toyota models (like the Yaris & iM hatch!) instead.

I would also love to see the horrible C-HR get killed off, but that isn't going to happen in our Crossover/SUV-loving society here in the US. It will make it to another design/refresh generation at the very least.

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Old 02-10-2018, 03:47 AM   #7
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Well, according to several Toyota techs I talked about they seemed happy about the thought of the iA disappearing... they all hate working on it and think it's garbage. Bad transmissions and electrical systems is what they've told me.
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Old 02-10-2018, 01:27 PM   #8
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iA? Bring over the handsome Yaris sedan... that sells very well in other markets.
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Old 02-10-2018, 04:51 PM   #9
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iA? Bring over the handsome Yaris sedan... that sells very well in other markets.
Looks better than the current US-spec Corolla, and certainly better than the horrible front fascia of the iA. I wonder how much it would cut into the lower-trim-level Corolla sales? Probably more than the iA does, because those that want authentic Toyota craftsmanship and actually know that the iA is a Mazda, probably opt for the Corolla instead (assuming they want a sedan instead of a regular Yaris hatchback).
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Old 02-10-2018, 04:56 PM   #10
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I'd enjoy that Yaris sedan. They must have used to sell a bunch of them in the 07-11 generation as most of the Yaris I see from that era are all sedans... and I see at least one pretty much every day.
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Old 02-10-2018, 06:44 PM   #11
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Interesting tidbit, but not surprising, especially with the economy turning around - seems most people I know are really buying trucks, SUVs, or maybe crossovers if in the market for something smaller. When I bought my Yaris the sales staff were pretty up front about the fact that they made a ton more off Tundra, 4Runner, Tacoma.. e.g. when I was negotiating he basically said if I was interested in the Tundra I'd been looking at in the showroom he could take $5000 off, but with the Yaris we were talking a few hundred; of course my wiggle room was limited in that I was asking for a 2018 mid-2017 and it was a special order because I wanted SE and 5MT..

I'm of the shared opinion that I'd love to be rid of the Prius; nice as a Toyota introduction for the hybrid (ok, I never liked it, and I wanted Toyota to go eco-diesel), but the Synergy drive is used all over the different models, and as noted is actually better - I'm also tired of being told model Yaris looks like a shorter Prius.. The iA is a sedan and a Mazda, sooo... still confused about why Toyota took that path instead of using the existing sedan (Vios)??

For models, I'm with Kaotic Lazagna, it feels like (up here in out market anyway) Toyota is way behind in base models - drum brakes work fine, but dear god the principle of still using archaic technology! (I really don't get along with drum brakes, always a fight, it's a personal bias.. lol). The margin has got to be so small too. I point squarely at you lot down South for the demise of so many good hatchbacks! Why do you hate them so?! Sedans, blech! Unfortunately for the hatchback the numbers aren't good given the 2017 sales review SubCompact Culture posted. Sales wise we love the hatches up here, but because we're so closely related to the USDM if it dies down there, it usually dies up here; demise of the WRX hatchback was hard to swallow.

Curious to see what will happen.. I feel like dropping the most basic models was VWs first move in scaling up the brand, hopefully Toyota doesn't follow that path too closely and finds a nice middle ground. Just please leave the hatchback alone!

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Old 02-10-2018, 08:41 PM   #12
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Give us a decent Auris (Corolla iM) with the 6-speed automatic transmission.
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Old 02-10-2018, 09:06 PM   #13
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Looks better than the current US-spec Corolla...
The Corolla looks so much better in other markets:
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Old 02-10-2018, 11:01 PM   #14
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Fun teasing aside... Have to admit the styling on that Auris is nicer than the current Corolla iM. Having driven the iM w/ a CVT I can say it's awful. A 6AT would be a better choice for those who like the automatics, but probably doesn't meet the target fuel economy numbers, so CVT like so many manufacturers. Only CVT I didn't mind was the Subaru.. felt like a regular auto.

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Old 02-10-2018, 11:23 PM   #15
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Only CVT I didn't mind was the Subaru.. felt like a regular auto.

-- Adam
Yes, when I test drove the 2018 Subaru Impreza with CVT, I was pleasantly surprised; never would have guessed it was a CVT. However, Subaru forums are rife with stories of complete CVT failure. That changed my mind about considering a Subaru for my next hatchback.

Honda's CVT is absolutely pathetic. Toyota's isn't much better. But, when I test drove the Nissan Rogue Sport with CVT, it was actually a good experience.
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Old 02-12-2018, 07:21 PM   #16
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I'm keeping my little Yarrie until she won't gon anymore. Why do they have to have such big cars? Why can't they keep at least one line of small cars? I put so much stuff in my car at times, I surprise that back seat are still working. I meant anything that has a "hatch" is really another form of the station wagon and I treat mine like a station wagon,, by carrying boxes (15), treadmill twice, recliner, more boxes and bicycle before getting the carrier that fits over the back. I like that I sit up high in my small car, because one of these days, I'm going to be the little old lady that can bearly see thru the steering wheel. LOL!! I like Toyota. I'm driving a Camry while I am waiting for Yarrie to get checked out today. It is nice, but it is bigger than my Yarrie. I drove a different type of one time from a rental place and didn't like it. My Yarrie reminded of my Pinto I use to have.
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Old 02-12-2018, 08:31 PM   #17
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Yes, when I test drove the 2018 Subaru Impreza with CVT, I was pleasantly surprised; never would have guessed it was a CVT. However, Subaru forums are rife with stories of complete CVT failure. That changed my mind about considering a Subaru for my next hatchback.

Honda's CVT is absolutely pathetic. Toyota's isn't much better. But, when I test drove the Nissan Rogue Sport with CVT, it was actually a good experience.
I hear the Nissan CVT is basically a 100,000 mile unit. I actually have seen one autopsied out of a Nissan Rogue that failed and it looks like its a cost cutting design. Metal fatigue causing a failure of the one piston, loss of hydraulic pressure and the metal belt inside the unit to snap. CVT's are an abomination, the only thing worse is these twin clutch DSG abominations like Ford and VW are selling these days in some vehicles.

I've driven a 2017 Honda Jazz which has the 1.4 and the CVT. It was a nice enough car. I have never driven something so sluggish and pathetic in my life. I've driven a CVT 2006 Jazz which used the ZF CVT (before Honda made their own) and that was ok. The acceleration was gentle but it was easy to get it to move if you had too. The new Jazz its almost impossible to get it to move unless you stick the peddle to the floor which still gives delayed response or use the shift paddles to force it into a preset lower ratio. I have only driven a 5 speed manual 2003 Jazz and the 1.4 engine didn't seem to lack although I think that engine was Euro 4 emissions not Euro 6 like the latest one.

Not heard much about Toyota CVT's. I've driven a Toyota Avensis 1.8 (2ZR) and it seemed quite responsive although that would be a Euro 5 emissions car so the newer ones could be shit. My favourite was my managers 1.8 6 speed Avensis. Only thing that bugs me about that car is the dumb electric handbrake instead of the normal old fashioned handbrake.
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Old 02-12-2018, 08:40 PM   #18
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This doesn't sound good for the Yaris hatchback; it's days are numbered.
They are fairly popular here in Europe and aren't the ones sold in the US made in France as well? The Yaris never sold as a saloon over here. That is the Avensis in the Euro market.

I'd be a little more suspect about the Corolla. They changed the name to the "Auris" here a few years ago for some reason. Its a slightly larger hatchback than the Yaris but I bet its very different to build when VAG just builds loads of different sized budget compacts on the A platform like the Polo, Golf, Seat Leon, Skoda Octavia and lower Audi A series models are basically a Golf on a slightly different body/trim.
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