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Old 05-05-2018, 08:33 PM   #1
tmontague
 
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Power Bleeder - Why you need this tool

My wife bought me a Motive Power bleeder for xmas last year and I finally got around to using it this morning. All I can say is where has it been all my life, probably one of the most useful automotive tools I have in my shed.



I wanted one simply because I bleed the brakes on my cards at least ever 2 years to stop the nipples from seizing which they do around the salt belt way too often. Since I also do track days I bleed the brakes on my Yaris a few times a year too. I used to have my wife push the pedal while I worked the bleeder (2 person method) and then I graduated to the one person method using a Gatorade bottle with and tube and some brake fluid in the bottom. Both methods worked fairly good but took way too long, especially if you were trying to flush through new fluid then it could take a while.

Their are various power bleeders on the market but the reason I wanted this one was because it worked by pressurising the master cylinder. I had a vacuum pump type bleeder that you use to pull vacuum on the bleed nipple, it never worked properly and always leaks no matter what method the internet said to try. Since the Yaris' slave cylinder also uses the same master cylinder as the brakes I was also able to bleed the clutch properly for once.

I previously had to do some prep to get the power bleeder to get a proper seal on the master cylinder. Since Toyota doesn't use a screw on cap on the master cylinder I purchased the power bleeder with a universal seal that you use a chain and wing nuts to secure it down on top of the master cylinder to ensure a tight seal. This works fine but the plastic and metal cowling above the cylinder block this cap from properly fitting on the cylinder.



With how much I bleed my brakes there was no way I was going to remove both cowlings every time I wanted to bleed my brakes. I opted to use an angle grinder on both cowlings to get the clearance I needed. I then painted the metal pieces and rolled them back to avoid rust and sharp parts.

The bleeder worked exactly how I imagined it would. I jacked the car up on 4 jack stands and I never even had to remove any wheels. i just attached a hose and an empty Gatorade bottle to catch the old fluid. 5 mins at each brake was more than enough time to get all the new fluid in the system. I use my vacuum hand pump to remove any old fluid from the m/c and added new fluid.

***I made an almost huge mistake when I went to bleed the slave cylinder. Learn from my mistakes and do not do what I did. ***

I planned on using a 4" C clamp to clamp the slave cylinder closed while I bled it to ensure no air could be trapped in it. I forgot that the 18psi that the power bleeder had on the system would cause it to blow the seal. As soon as I removed the bolts of the s/c to put the c clamp on it the slave cylinder blew the seal and leaked fluid everywhere. I immediately dropped the pressure and assessed the s/c. I ended up being able to put everything back together again and nothing was damaged and ti all hold fluids fine under pressure.











Two way to properly bleed the s/c with a power bleeder:

1. (the way I ended up doing it and the easier of the two) leave the s/c installed on the car andonce the bleed nipple is open and old fluid is coming out, use your hand and work the end of the shift fork back and forth so that it compresses the s/c shaft all the way into the s/c. This ensures any air trapped in their will escape.

2. Remove the s/c from the car BEFORE you pressurise the bleeder and clamp it completely compressed with a c clamp and make sure the c clamp is snug and not going to work loose. Then bleed the s/c by just opening the bleed nipple.

The psi I found to be perfect for the Yaris was 18-20, it says not to go above 20 and I found less than 18psi lead to a slower bleed. The brakes feel more firm and quicker to engage and the clutch feels like a different car. Much smoother pedal feel but at the same time more firm. This is something I'll be doing every month or so during track season. I used a DOT 3 high performance fluid from my local CT, it's nothing special but I've had no problems with it on track in the past so I don't feel the need to go to something expensive.



I would highly recommend this tool for anyone who regularly bleeds their brakes a lot or had multiple vehicles that they bleed brakes on and do a lot of brake jobs on. Saved me a lot of time and it isn't very expensive
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Old 05-06-2018, 12:54 AM   #2
white89gt
 
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That looks very handy. I got a new bleeder as well that works really nicely. I just bled mine with it, and also did my Ford Escape. This one requires the pedal to be pushed though....

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I bet the Motive bleeder would be REALLY handy on hydraulic clutches.
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Old 05-06-2018, 10:18 AM   #3
ex-x-fire
 
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If your on a really tight budget or just like making things, you can build one by using a garden sprayer and an old m/c cap plus some assorted hardware and tubing.
Those garden sprayers are also good for filling manual transmissions & differentials.
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Old 05-06-2018, 10:36 AM   #4
BennyLava
 
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I have wanted one for a long time. Do the brakes immediately start bleeding as soon as you start pumping the handle?
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Old 05-06-2018, 11:04 AM   #5
tmontague
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BennyLava View Post
I have wanted one for a long time. Do the brakes immediately start bleeding as soon as you start pumping the handle?
You fill the reservoir with brake fluid and hook it up to the m/c then pump it to 18-20psi. Then you just crack open a bleed nipple and fluid comes out right away. They don't bleed unless the bleed nipple is turned open. You can stay under the car then whole time and just do a wheel at a time. I added some more pumps/pressure after 2 wheels as the psi dropped by about 2 and in round below 18psi the bleeding slowed a bit so i pumped back to 20psi.

The slave cylinder is just as easy but use your hand to move the shaft in to get any potential trapped air.

Is highly recommend you get one, it makes full brake/clutch bleeds a joke and ensures no air is left in the system. My brake have never felt this firm nor has my clutch ever felt this smooth/firm. I've done bleeds before with the 1 and 2 person methods, but this was by far the best,

I'll be doing my wife's brakes soon so I'll report back how those feel
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Old 05-08-2018, 11:49 AM   #6
fredovvti
 
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I found this adapter for Toyotas and Lexus

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:19 AM   #7
atomic_hoji
 
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Read lots of good things about these but never known someone who's used it first hand. Good score under the tree for sure!

-- Adam
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:56 AM   #8
komichal
 
Drives: Yaris 2007 1.3 2SZFE 64kW
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This looks pretty cool, I had no idea that this exists. Thanks for the tip! I will definitely go for one.
I still do not understand your recommended way of bleeding the clutch SC but that is my bad. :)
One question though.... will this contraption work as well in case of filling up completely empty brake system? Plus I heard that if the brake fluid level drops below critical level in the reservoir then the air is sucked into brake power booster and cannot be flushed away with the traditional two-person technique. I even do not know whether it is true or not but definitely I do not want to experience this. :)
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Old 05-25-2018, 10:15 PM   #9
Herbicidal
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Nicely done!

Earlier this week I ordered and received this: https://www.speedibleed.com/vaf/prod...1045&option=18 I went with the Pro Kit that came with the handy case for storage. Hope to give it a try this weekend. I have 5 Toyota's in the family and they are all due for a brake fluid flush.
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Old 05-28-2018, 08:37 PM   #10
tmontague
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komichal View Post
This looks pretty cool, I had no idea that this exists. Thanks for the tip! I will definitely go for one.
I still do not understand your recommended way of bleeding the clutch SC but that is my bad. :)
One question though.... will this contraption work as well in case of filling up completely empty brake system? Plus I heard that if the brake fluid level drops below critical level in the reservoir then the air is sucked into brake power booster and cannot be flushed away with the traditional two-person technique. I even do not know whether it is true or not but definitely I do not want to experience this. :)
You bleed the SC the same as you would a brake caliper. You crack loose the bleed nipple until fresh fluid comes out.

*However* The SC has a pocket/chamber in it filled with fluid that is an area where air will sit and not bleed out if you just crack the bleeder and let fluid out. Tp close this chamber and push any fluid/air out all you have to do is reach down to the end of the clutch fork that the SC piston presses onto.

You can push on this part of the fork which pushed the SC piston back into itself. This closes that chamber and ensures no air can get trapped there. So in short, use your hand to compress the SC piston back into itself while the pressure bleeder is pushed old fluid out. Then release your hand from the sc and let the piston naturally extend out and then close the bleeder nipple.

The power bleeder will fill a completely empty system quickly and easily but what I think you are referring to is bench bleeding the MC. Once the MC has been run dry (or is new) it needs to be bench bled before it can be properly filled with fluid. The power bleeder won't be able to bench bleed a MC to my knowledge.
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Old 05-29-2018, 01:46 AM   #11
komichal
 
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Thanks a lot tmontague, now it is perfectly clear to me how to bleed the clutch. So I should be able to press the clutch slave cylinder piston by bare hand once the bleeding nipple is opened, right?

My clutch is quite stiff and some people recommended me to inspect the slave cylinder as it may be the culprit here (next in line is the change of clutch set which I would have to ask a service guy to do). But before changing the slave cylinder I need to inspect it as I suppose the lifespan should exceed the current 90,000 miles. So I am going to bleed it first to see if that helps (the brake fluid has been changed a year ago but whether the service guy did all the bleeding including clutch, I do not know...)
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Old 05-29-2018, 06:42 AM   #12
tmontague
 
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Yes, once the bleeder is cracked open you can fairly easily push the SC piston back into itself and hold it there.

Your SC is likely fine and just needs to be bled. Typically when a SC goes bad they will leak and/or not disengage the clutch properly. They are not a common wear part on the Yaris to my knowledge.

Some cars need constant bleeding, the Z06 corvette is no exception, track time on that car leads to constant bleeds as the fluid become dirty quickly and clutch feel degrades. The Yaris isn't as sensitive and the fluid typically doesn't become dirty but I find a SC bleed every few weeks of you're at the track it every year of you just DD will do a lot for clutch feel.
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