another brake question

[swidd]

Just quickly....

With 69,000 miles on a 5-speed 2007 HB, I just had some brake service done; I wanted to replace the pads and rear shoes to improve what I perceive as decaying brake effectiveness; the pedal goes lower, and stopping power is way less than when new. It is soft, rather than strong.

The mechanic shop did an inspection and determined the pads and shoes, and the disc and drum, are all good to stay, no replacement needed, they say they can't measure any amount of wear on them. They did find that the shoes in the rear drum is too far from the drum (said it barely touches), so they adjusted it, and driving home, the braking power was improved, but the pedal is still soft and low. Also, they put new brake fluid in, by my request.

They suggest I begin to apply the parking brake/e-brake frequently to engage a self-adjustment mechanism. I was wondering if they have this correctly, as Google says the rear drums will self-adjust by braking while in reverse. I don't use the e-brake, but I do apply the brakes while backing up slowly - with no good results, as evidenced by the above.

So, do I have to have higher reverse speed when doing the self-adjust reverse braking? Or is it in fact the e-brake that performs self-adjustment? Or does it just not work, and I should put some new shoes/pads in there by myself or through another shop?

How long does the pads/shoes last for careful drivers anyway?

[Lucas13]

Did they bleed the system? If air goes in the lines you have that jelly feel on the pedal, when rear shoes are adjusted and brake fluid is replaced properly the pedal should feel pretty stiff, unless the master cylinder is bad but I don’t think is your case.

[RedRide]

It does soud like there might be air in the lines somewhere.

The rear brakes are adjusted when backing up to a certian extent.
However, it is general practice to adjust them manually on ocasions and when replaceing them as the self adjusters are a help but, you can't rely on them totally.

[swidd]

They said they would replace brake fluid, and the receipt says 'drained and replaced brake fluid DOT-3'. As they are acutely aware of my complaint with the brakes, I would assume they did it the proper way (they are a very reputable and honorable shop). It cost $150 for cleaning and adjusting rear drums and brake fluid flush + tire rotation.

[RedRide]

Originally Posted by swidd

They said they would replace brake fluid, and the receipt says 'drained and replaced brake fluid DOT-3'. As they are acutely aware of my complaint with the brakes, I would assume they did it the proper way (they are a very reputable and honorable shop). It cost $150 for cleaning and adjusting rear drums and brake fluid flush.

Yeah...... "Brake cleaning" is a "catch all" term the really means they are going to charge you for doing basically nothing.
Fact is, the brakes are not sealed and its completley natural for them to be dirty for the most part.
All the shop probablly did was blow it out with an air hose.

Consider this: They never tell you the front brakes need cleaning. This is because you can see them.
However, you can't see the rear drums so, they BS the customer into thinking they need cleaning.

It is stiil possible the shop left an air bubble in the line somewhere no matter how good the shop is. It can happen to the best.

[swidd]

Originally Posted by RedRide

It is stiil possible the shop left an air bubble in the line somewhere no matter how good the shop is. It can happen to the best.

Well the brakes are a little better now than before the $150. I wouldn't know how to replace brake fluid anyway, and at 3 years/68,000 miles, why not. Money well spent anyway (its payday, and I spent it on my favorite thing to spend money on: the yaris!! :)

I still think it would be better to replace the brake pads though. What else would cause the pedal to have long travel (2-2.5") before giving some real stopping power?

[Lucas13]

Originally Posted by swidd

Well the brakes are a little better now than before the $150. I wouldn't know how to replace brake fluid anyway, and at 3 years/68,000 miles, why not. Money well spent anyway (its payday, and I spent it on my favorite thing to spend money on: the yaris!! :)

I still think it would be better to replace the brake pads though. What else would cause the pedal to have long travel (2-2.5") before giving some real stopping power?

The other cause will be a master cylinder that is not holding enough pressure but in a car with only three years it’s almost impossible, air in the system is the main cause for a mushy brake feel. Some mechanics use one men bleeding tool and if the guy is not careful enough air can go in very easy just in one second, just one little bubble can become hundred little bubbles and make the brakes ineffective.
The other thing you should try is pulling normal the e-brake and count how many clicks it’s doing until stops, normally is two clicks when just adjusted, if it does more than three it needs more adjustment, the other way to check the rear brake is by removing the wheel and making sure that the drum doesn’t spin like crazy when you turn it, it should do about ½ turn when just adjusted.

[bankrobber]

I have noticed a little fade on my brake pedal. Usually after I am stopped and brake applied after a few seconds it will drop just a little bit. I have a good firm brake slowing down so I dont think any problems with it. I just adjusted my parking brake and sprayed brake cleaner on rear shoes and drum had a lot of dust. I have 90,000 on my 07 and still have a lot of life left in the pads and shoes. I did a lot of interstate miles though.

[ddongbap]

Originally Posted by RedRide

Yeah...... "Brake cleaning" is a "catch all" term the really means they are going to charge you for doing basically nothing.
Fact is, the brakes are not sealed and its completley natural for them to be dirty for the most part.
All the shop probablly did was blow it out with an air hose.

Consider this: They never tell you the front brakes need cleaning. This is because you can see them.
However, you can't see the rear drums so, they BS the customer into thinking they need cleaning.

It is stiil possible the shop left an air bubble in the line somewhere no matter how good the shop is. It can happen to the best.

The rears are enclosed.

[swidd]

I've been reversing and braking hard..

Parking brake takes about 4 clicks to be tight. I can do 5 clicks with very strong force.

[Yaris Hilton]

That's good.