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Old 12-11-2017, 05:05 PM   #1
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Oil Pan Drop

Dropped the pan today to check the condition of the oil pickup tube screen.
I think that the multiple short oil changes I did really helped to clean things up. Much of the varnish that was in the pan wiped away with a shop towel. I think the detergents in the oil are slowly loosening things up. The pick up screen, much like the oil control valve was very clean.

I put a new filter on and filled up with 1L of Pennzoil Ultra 0W40 and the remainder with SuperTech 5W20 synthetic. This will be my last short oil change before I resume normal oil change intervals with my stash of Quaker State 5W30 conventional.

Valve cover comes off next week and valve clearances checked.

Pan off...



Pick Up Tube Screen...



Pan...

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Old 12-12-2017, 10:44 AM   #2
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Unless you're willing to pull the cams and change buckets, there's no point in checking the valve clearances. And unless it's leaking I would leave well enough alone. If you pull the cover make sure you have a new gasket to put it back on, or it will leak after that.
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:49 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Bluevitz-rs View Post
Unless you're willing to pull the cams and change buckets, there's no point in checking the valve clearances. And unless it's leaking I would leave well enough alone. If you pull the cover make sure you have a new gasket to put it back on, or it will leak after that.
Thanks. I have a gasket arriving later this week.
I'm aware of what needs to be done for a valve adjustment, but would be concerned about messing with the timing. I would check the clearances and then make a decision as to whether or not to proceed. I want to learn about timing sets/maintenance/repair and have already watched a few videos. I have all the tools but am a bit apprehensive about 2 things: getting the timing right and getting a leak-free seal on the timing cover with the engine still in the car.

If I was to leave a slight valve tap - assuming that's what it is - will that be detrimental to my engine in the long run?
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:51 PM   #4
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Are you sure it's not just some piston slap? That's something common on every ageing engine.
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:53 PM   #5
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Because I've never hear a valve tic that goes away as the engine heats up.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:07 PM   #6
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Are you sure it's not just some piston slap? That's something common on every ageing engine.
I suppose that's possible. I hope it's not as if I confirmed that it is piston slap, it would bug me until it got fixed and that would be cost prohibitive.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:50 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06YarisRS View Post
Thanks. I have a gasket arriving later this week.
I'm aware of what needs to be done for a valve adjustment, but would be concerned about messing with the timing. I would check the clearances and then make a decision as to whether or not to proceed. I want to learn about timing sets/maintenance/repair and have already watched a few videos. I have all the tools but am a bit apprehensive about 2 things: getting the timing right and getting a leak-free seal on the timing cover with the engine still in the car.

If I was to leave a slight valve tap - assuming that's what it is - will that be detrimental to my engine in the long run?
Getting the Valve cover seal to seal while the block is in the car is no problem, as is pulling the cams. I replaced the head gasket (have to pull timing cover) on my '02 echo with the engine still in the car and it wasn't too bad.

Checking the valve clearance is a good way to get familiar with it but as blue stated it is futile unless you plan to actually change the buckets. Likely your valves are well within spec unless the car was oil starved.

Timing isn't too bad either if you have access to the pdf repair manual. There are marks on the chain and cam gears to aid in this.
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Old 12-12-2017, 08:05 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by tmontague View Post
Getting the Valve cover seal to seal while the block is in the car is no problem, as is pulling the cams. I replaced the head gasket (have to pull timing cover) on my '02 echo with the engine still in the car and it wasn't too bad.

Checking the valve clearance is a good way to get familiar with it but as blue stated it is futile unless you plan to actually change the buckets. Likely your valves are well within spec unless the car was oil starved.

Timing isn't too bad either if you have access to the pdf repair manual. There are marks on the chain and cam gears to aid in this.
Thanks! I'm really interested in taking the cover off and checking the clearances. After reading your description, I'm feeling a little more confident about doing the adjustment if it is needed. If the clearances do fall within spec, I will feel better that I have at least eliminated one more possibility. I have a Toyota service manual which covers the procedure in detail. Here is a snippet



It appears that the camshafts can be removed without removing the timing cover.

Lifters are available for a decent price at Toyota Parts Direct (Canada)

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Old 12-12-2017, 08:09 PM   #9
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Yes, camshaft removal is straightforward and can be done with the timing cover in place.

Your noise is likely piston slap, not a big issue and happens on a lot of high mileage engines
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Old 12-12-2017, 08:17 PM   #10
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Yes, camshaft removal is straightforward and can be done with the timing cover in place.

Your noise is likely piston slap, not a big issue and happens on a lot of high mileage engines
Ah, two of the same diagnoses. Piston slap seems to me like something that will get worse rather quickly. Is this not the case? Would just keeping up on frequent oil changes and driving easy keep my engine running for a good long time?

I can't say that I've ever owned a car with piston slap. At least I don't think I have. It sounds ominous.
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Old 12-12-2017, 09:46 PM   #11
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Just a symptom of excess clearance in the cylinder causing the cold piston skirt to slap the cylinder wall. Once warmed up the metals get larger and it goes away.

Cars can have it for well over 5 years and drive fine. You'll just have less compression when cold and increased blow by.

If you had it had you would have a much more urgent thread and you would likely be more concerned due to the loud noise. Drive the car as you normally would and enjoy it for many years to come
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Old 12-12-2017, 10:01 PM   #12
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Piston slap is such a common occurrence in old Chrysler 4 cylinders that I thought the noises were normal haha. And I ran the piss out of those old clunkers without an issue. So if that junk can do it, the Toyota should be a ok.
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Old 12-13-2017, 04:58 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Bluevitz-rs View Post
Because I've never hear a valve tic that goes away as the engine heats up.
VVTI engine valf overlap timing is variable so it can be possible tickling before engine heats up. variables: heat, rev, atmospheric pressure etc.
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Old 12-13-2017, 06:47 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmontague View Post
Just a symptom of excess clearance in the cylinder causing the cold piston skirt to slap the cylinder wall. Once warmed up the metals get larger and it goes away.

Cars can have it for well over 5 years and drive fine. You'll just have less compression when cold and increased blow by.

If you had it had you would have a much more urgent thread and you would likely be more concerned due to the loud noise. Drive the car as you normally would and enjoy it for many years to come
Thanks, tmontague! I feel better about it now. Since I've ordered the gasket, I'll probably still take the cover off and check the clearances. If, perchance, one or more are out of spec, I'll make a decision then. This will be a good learning opportunity for me as well as some of the kids in our autoshop.
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Old 12-13-2017, 06:51 AM   #15
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Piston slap is such a common occurrence in old Chrysler 4 cylinders that I thought the noises were normal haha. And I ran the piss out of those old clunkers without an issue. So if that junk can do it, the Toyota should be a ok.
Haha. An ex-girlfriend's sister had a K car. If I recall it sounded pretty 'ticky'. It was fairly abused, likely undermaintained and I once saw her husband carrying a trunk full of boulders for a rock wall he was building. The thing was basically dragging its butt on the ground. AFAIK, the car run for years after that though it looked and sounded pretty rough.
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Old 12-13-2017, 06:54 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedomage View Post
VVTI engine valf overlap timing is variable so it can be possible tickling before engine heats up. variables: heat, rev, atmospheric pressure etc.
Thanks freedomage!
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Old 12-13-2017, 09:50 AM   #17
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Piston slap is such a common occurrence in old Chrysler 4 cylinders that I thought the noises were normal haha. And I ran the piss out of those old clunkers without an issue. So if that junk can do it, the Toyota should be a ok.
I was told by a Chrysler service manager that the ticking noise on my 1986 Dodge Aries was worn wrist pins and they could run like that for years. I got over 150,000 miles a 1986 Dodge Aries and 1989 Dodge Shadow. That inline four was a great engine.
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Old 12-14-2017, 10:11 PM   #18
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I was told by a Chrysler service manager that the ticking noise on my 1986 Dodge Aries was worn wrist pins and they could run like that for years. I got over 150,000 miles a 1986 Dodge Aries and 1989 Dodge Shadow. That inline four was a great engine.
In terms of Chrysler engines, the way you describe these 4's, they remind me of the 3.3L in my Grand Caravan. I believe I had 380 000 km on mine when I sold it. It always worked beautifully and was smooth and quiet with the exception of a little timing chain rattle at operating temp idle (common on that engiine).
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