Tooter manifold / Corolla TB / DC Header / etc....

[1.5]

Wow at least he offers good customer service ^^

[Jason@SportsCar]

Originally Posted by 3cyltrbo

-Tooter Manifold
-Corolla Throttle Body
-Coolant Bypass (Throttle Body)
-65 Deg Thermostat
-DC sports header

And the end result is that it feels like I've LOST 10-15hp ?????????????? (instead of having gained 10hp which is what I was expecting)


I was expecting to awaken a monster
I was expecting more noise
I was expecting some added power in the top end



Instead …………..

It feels like I'm driving around with AirConditioning on (I don't even have AC) with 3 passengers in the car (when in fact I've actually taken a bunch of weight OUT of the car)

I'm at a total loss.



If this is the way its gonna drive, I'll switch it all back to stock.

I would ditch that thermostat, that is way to cold, no reason at all for that on a street car - much less in the great white north. The ECU is probably dumping fuel in there in an effort to get the temp to what it thinks is normal, rich does not make power.

[JustDidIt]

Originally Posted by tooter

Hey Will,

I have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. If you don't like the tooter, send it back to me and I'll refund your money, You'll only be out the return shipping cost. Then you can buy Garm's manifold if you think it will solve your problems.

Personally I think that something else is wrong, but that's not for me to figure out. So just send it back for an immediate full refund.

Greg

^^Awesome Customer Service!

But I wouldn't jump ship just yet, try some of the solutions offered. I'm no tuner but something is telling you that your not running optimal A/F ratio. Just swapping out the intake, I highly doubt, will solve your issues. I'd at least try the below solution:

Originally Posted by CTScott

Did you disconnect the battery after installing the throttle body to reset the fuel trims?

Did you per chance install each thing separately, where you could see the difference with each part?

If not, I would suggest reversing the process one by one, starting with reverting to the stock throttle body.

or

Originally Posted by Jason@SportsCar

I would ditch that thermostat, that is way to cold, no reason at all for that on a street car - much less in the great white north. The ECU is probably dumping fuel in there in an effort to get the temp to what it thinks is normal, rich does not make power.

Originally Posted by 1.5

...

thats where your loss is from... go with the MI/GE one

LOL... you must be some expert to come to that conclusion... so quickly. Sponsored much?

[47_MasoN_47]

Originally Posted by cali yaris

I think that was meant playfully, not as a real suggestion. At least I meant it that way.

lol yeah I was merely jesting. I mean, yeah you'd get power haha, but I know most people don't want to dump 33% of the cost of the car into a supercharger.

[1.5]

LOL... you must be some expert to come to that conclusion... so quickly. Sponsored much?[/QUOTE]


nah just a huge supporter.

[cali yaris]

^ He is not sponsored by us, if that was the implication.

[3cyltrbo]

Originally Posted by Jason@SportsCar

I would ditch that thermostat, that is way to cold, no reason at all for that on a street car - much less in the great white north. The ECU is probably dumping fuel in there in an effort to get the temp to what it thinks is normal, rich does not make power.

- Its never driven in the Winter

- Its only driven in summer (when our average temps are probably as high or higher (with humidex) than Sunny (dry) California and southern States.

- I've been keeping tabs on Intake Air Temp / Water Temp / Air-Fuel (among other things) and none of them have seemed wonky, but I'll go back and pay attention to the AF ratio while doing "pulls"

Will

[47_MasoN_47]

It gets 100+ with 60-80% humidity around here :P I sortof doubt it gets that hot up there.

I just use whatever thermostat came in the car and it works fine with boost and all the other junk I've got.

[3cyltrbo]

Originally Posted by cali yaris

Possible vacuum leak somewhere, maybe? Have you checked all the connections and listened for leaks?

You might try going back to a stock TB and see if that cleans it up at all. Our manifold accepts either throttle body, I'm not sure about the Tooter.

Remember, you've changed two or more things at once. It's best to change one thing at a time to see what the result is.

I have listened (my family calls me Miracle ears), and to the best of what I hear there weren't any leaks.

Of the areas where there could be a leak (below) they all seemed fine.

-Intake manifold to Head = check
-Throttle body to Intake manifold = check
-Intake piping = check
-Brake booster vacuum line = check (factory line)
-Evap system vacuum line = check (factory line)
-CrankCase vacuum line = check (exact specs as factory, only 1 inch longer)
-CrankCase fresh air line = check (breather)

-Exhaust Manifold to Head = Check
-Exhaust Manifold to downpipe = Check
-O2 sensor = check

I might start with just swapping back the OEM TB (Like many have suggested) and go from there................

[3cyltrbo]

Originally Posted by 47_MasoN_47

It gets 100+ with 60-80% humidity around here :P I sortof doubt it gets that hot up there.

not to go too far off topic.............

Its funny that people think of Canada as the land of Igloos.

here in Ottawa (capital of all Igloos) its currently 78 F which is unusually cool for this time of year.

All through July we were mostly in the 90's, with many days in the 100+ range.

Admittedly our Winters are colder, but our summers are the 60deg F that people imagine they might be.

[Jason@SportsCar]

You would be surprised at how a thermostat can put a car out of whack... This past weekend I helped my neighbor install a thermostat in his work van. It failed emissions, when he got the ECU scanned by a GM tech it was stuck in open loop mode, and would not get above 150f - which is about the temp of that unit you put it. In his case when he had the radiator replaced a few months back some knuckle head cut the core out of the thermostat (no idea why, could have been stuck), we put a new stock one in and now it passes smog.

I run a cooler unit, because we run a 30-40 min race and spin over 7000rpm, but I have complete control of my fuel via my AEM ecu.

On a road going car with a stock ECU you have done nothing but fatten up the mixture. No upside.

[tooter]

Originally Posted by 1.5

Wow at least he offers good customer service ^^

I do whatever satisfies the customer.
It's no problem for me to simply bead blast it again and sell it to someone else. I know that there's nothing wrong with the manifold because I've been running a tooter for over a year and 6,000 miles and it works great.

Jason mentioned the low temp thermostat, and I agree. I'd try removing that first because my guess is that it's screwing up the ECU which stays in "choke" rich mixture mode constantly waiting for the engine to warm up.

[Viperoni]

Every few years or so, we get a day where we hit 120f with humidex, but that's rare.
Usually we'll get 5-10 days of 110f temps with humidex every summer.
3 weeks ago or so we had 5 days straight of 113f with humidity, it was nasty outside.


OP, as for the issue at hand, the main question is, when did the problem actually start happening? Or did you do all the mods at the same time?

[3cyltrbo]

Originally Posted by Jason@SportsCar

You would be surprised at how a thermostat can put a car out of whack... This past weekend I helped my neighbor install a thermostat in his work van. It failed emissions, when he got the ECU scanned by a GM tech it was stuck in open loop mode, and would not get above 150f - which is about the temp of that unit you put it. In his case when he had the radiator replaced a few months back some knuckle head cut the core out of the thermostat (no idea why, could have been stuck), we put a new stock one in and now it passes smog.

I run a cooler unit, because we run a 30-40 min race and spin over 7000rpm, but I have complete control of my fuel via my AEM ecu.

On a road going car with a stock ECU you have done nothing but fatten up the mixture. No upside.

Its an easy enough swap (the thermostat) except for having to replace the leaked coolant - so I think I'll try swapping it back.

That and the TB swap are the easiest.

When I get some time this weekend I'll first try the TB and then the Thermostat.

Will

[3cyltrbo]

Originally Posted by Viperoni

Every few years or so, we get a day where we hit 120f with humidex, but that's rare.
Usually we'll get 5-10 days of 110f temps with humidex every summer.
3 weeks ago or so we had 5 days straight of 113f with humidity, it was nasty outside. ?

+1

Originally Posted by Viperoni

OP, as for the issue at hand, the main question is, when did the problem actually start happening? Or did you do all the mods at the same time?

I'm generally a pretty positive and optimistic dude when it comes to mods and the stuff that I read on the internets (YarisWorld etc..) (ie: "the web") so I honestly didn't expect any problem at all with any of the mods and hence I installed everything at once (header / Intake / TB / T stat / Silicone hoses etc...)

In actuality here were the problems I encountered:

-ARP exhaust manifold/head studs wouldn't install in the two outer locations (where the factory studs were (so right now for the DC Header I'm running the inner 3 head studs from ARP and the outer two head studs are factory)

-The Red Silicone rad hose from the head to the rad cap housing,..... doesn't fit the housing (its too big around) ( I notice in other peoples install pics they aren't running that hose and it makes sense why)

-The DC Sports header debacle with the O2 sensor bung being too close to one of the downpipe bolts

-The "Odyssey" battery (Sears Diehard Platinum) although a "standard" 35 size is actually marginally taller than the factory battery and therefore is a VERY tight squeeze for both the factory battery bracket and clearance to the Ultra Racing strut brace.

-I also had to fabricate my own Crankcase vacuum line because the Intake manifold side wouldn't fit the Tooter nipple(too small) (although the nipple for the EVAP vacuum and the Brake booster, both fit perfectly)

then of course I also forgot to re-connect the wiper motor so I had to tear the cowl off a second time to re-connect the plug.

Will

[CTScott]

Originally Posted by 3cyltrbo

Its an easy enough swap (the thermostat) except for having to replace the leaked coolant - so I think I'll try swapping it back.

That and the TB swap are the easiest.

When I get some time this weekend I'll first try the TB and then the Thermostat.

Will

Based on Jason's expertise, I would do the thermostat first. As a quick and dirty test today, drive it and see if the green coolant light goes off. If it stays on and green, then you are in "cold start" mode. If it goes out, then the thermostat is likely not the issue.

[cali yaris]

-ARP exhaust manifold/head studs wouldn't install in the two outer locations

Why not?

[47_MasoN_47]

That cold mode does a lot of weird things to the motor. I made a video a while back about how my boost behaves differently when the engine is cold.