6x9 speakers in front doors

[dawin2122]

Hi guys maybe somebody tell me if is posible put a 6x9 in front doors i know need mod but maybe sounds better than the 6.5 or i am in mistake all rec. is welcome thanks

[TOLMACH]

Short answer: you'd better get decent 6.5 ones (2 way or three way component speakers).

Normally 6*9 belong to the rear deck (will not play same low in the doors .. the door as an enclosure being too small for them)

[dawin2122]

Originally Posted by TOLMACH

Short answer: you'd better get decent 6.5 ones (2 way or three way component speakers).

Normally 6*9 belong to the rear deck (will not play same low in the doors .. the door as an enclosure being too small for them)

thanks tolmach apreciate the reply

[daf62757]

I just had some 7 inch speakers put in my front and back doors. The place that did the install said they didn't even have to use an adapter to put them in.

[sqcomp]

I have the Hybrid Audio L6SE in my doors. It does require an adaptor to mount properly.

I'd agree with tolm regarding the use of a good 6.5" speaker over the 6x9.

[RedRide]

As a long time audiophile.....
I will just add that a good full range speaker is better than a mediocre 2 or 3way speaker any day.

Also, a tweeter such as might be used in 2-3 way speaker is almost useless in the doors of the Yaris as it's positioned too low to transmit the directional highs (to your ears) it is ment to reproduce.


BTW........Actually, most stock speakers in today's cars are fairly good. However, a car is one of the worst acustical enviourments around, so trully great and expensive speakers in a car is often a waste. Personaly, I save all the money for high end audio hardware for home equipment

[TOLMACH]

Originally Posted by RedRide

As a long time audiophile.....
I will just add that a good full range speaker is better than a mediocre 2 or 3way speaker any day.

Also, a tweeter such as might be used in 2-3 way speaker is almost useless in the doors of the Yaris as it's positioned too low to transmit the directional highs (to your ears) it is ment to reproduce.


BTW........Actually, most stock speakers in today's cars are fairly good. However, a car is one of the worst acustical enviourments around, so trully great and expensive speakers in a car is often a waste. Personaly, I save all the money for high end audio hardware for home equipment

I agree to some of the things you say.. and strongly agree on that some of the OEM speakers are good

Stock front door woofers (actually full-ranges) in my 3D HB are awesome compared to some cheap aftermarket stuff

[RedRide]

Yeah, it's amazing how much audio garbage is sold and considered good by today's consumers.

Many people just want/ get overpowering bass and they think they got a great sys.

[sqcomp]

Originally Posted by RedRide

Also, a tweeter such as might be used in 2-3 way speaker is almost useless in the doors of the Yaris as it's positioned too low to transmit the directional highs (to your ears) it is ment to reproduce.

^This relates to head related transfer function, group delay, and sound localization. You also have level and intesity differences to take into effect.

IIRC, above 15kHz to 20kHz a person's ears can very accurately discern the location of sound. This stands to reason why you see a lot of the OEM systems these days having a tweeter mounted in the a-pillars. It assists in raising the soundstage without too much, if any, equalization or time alignment.

There's a nice little graph that has been posted up, either by myself or Derick, that shows one the frequency breakdown illustrated on a graph. This is fundamental for learning your sound descriptors and ranges...as a matter of fact, here you go:



This is a really neat graph to work with.

Take note of what Derick and I are doing with our Yaris systems. See where we place our speakers and ask questions. Derick is learning big time as am I. I may have a few more contacts into the mobile audio world than the normal person and am happy (most of the time) to give advice. I'm trying to get Derick into IASCA competition on the NE. After my resounding siccess on the IASCA circuit out here in the NW, I absolutley know our cars can sound off with world championship potential.

Pay attention to what we do. Let us spend our money, it'll help you avoid some of our mistakes. One word of advice...BE PATIENT! Don't go out and blow your wad, have something go wrong, and then quit. Great sound is a learning process. You're not going to get the same sound as a million dollar sound room in your Yaris...you can get close though. That takes time, some money, and *ahem* patience.

[sqcomp]

Originally Posted by RedRide

Many people just want/ get overpowering bass and they think they got a great sys.

^ x 10000000000

These are the same people who sit in a real SQ car and thier jaws drop. "This is the cleanest sounding $hit I've ever heard!" is the usual response...

[RedRide]

^ ^ ^
When I tell people I want/have a flat resopnse in my home system, the answer is often somthing like "why do you want a flat sounding system"?
They haven't a clue.

[sqcomp]

My first though when I read the word "flat" is that you're not using any EQ.

"Flat" can be bad or good depending on your definition of the word in this circumstance.

Do you mean natural or transparent? Flat is a mixed bag. That could mean not exciting to some.

[RedRide]

Originally Posted by sqcomp

My first though when I read the word "flat" is that you're not using any EQ.

"Flat" can be bad or good depending on your definition of the word in this circumstance.

Do you mean natural or transparent? Flat is a mixed bag. That could mean not exciting to some.

No, I presenly have a vintage 7 band Technics stereo EQ. Personally, I have found when you have more than about 7 bands per channel you drive youself crazy trying to find a setting you like in a home enviourment for all program sources.

I use '"flat" in the classic, correct way..... the way it's supposed to be used.... to denote accurate freq response.
People can can change the meaning of "flat" in ther own minds due to ingnorance on the subject but the correct, classic meaning remains.
If something sounds natural and transparent, it means the freq response is realitively flat.


Yes, I'm aware that any setting can change with volume.

[sqcomp]

This is where I need clarification from you...

Flat response is a terrible sound. It sounds like you're talking through a can. I'm speaking of a flattened response as on an RTA. I know it sounds terrible, I've put my car on a totally flat response; it was a razor flat response within 1 dB. That is a car though, I'd be willing to bet if one ran white noise through the RTA on a room, it wouldn't be flat in it's response. Moreso than the car though!

Now, correct or not in the definition, flat depends on the person's interperetation.

[RedRide]

Flat respose measured how?
With a db meter, etc?
Let's not forget we all hear with our ears and what our ears perceive is all that counts.
If you system sounds terrible, you have it EQed all wrong!
We are evidently not at al on the same page here!
A flat response means simply that a sys repreduces sound as close as possible to the program souce.

BTW, you have nicely illustraded my point that many today are no longer are aware of what a "flat" respose means and that it's even desireable.
There was a time not that long ago when a "flat respose" was the "holy grail" of audio..... even among non audiophiles.
Now we get nonsensical terms like speakers that "hit hard", speakers that "put out watts", "sound stage" and other meaningless BS.

When was the last time you heard meaningful audio terms like "dynamic range" or "damping factor"?


BTW, flat resone in a car? It's an exercise in futility due to the horrible acoustical environment and the many changing variables...... not to mention road noise etc.
Unless you you are building a dedicated sound show car it's a waste of money IMO for a DD and one should save their money for a great sounding home sys.

[sqcomp]

Mmm...we are on the same page actually.

A "flat response" based off a flat RTA reading in a car demonstrates that the nasty acoustical environment can be tamed. Nothing more.



^flat response...measurably. The 40 Hz and below measurement can be improved dramatically. I tend to lean towards this vehicle not having a big bore woofer or a non sealed/higher tuned ported enclosure that unloads below 40 Hz...or a combination of both perhaps.

We agree, we just don't know it yet. I completely agree that if your system sounds bad there is something wrong, whether that be EQ'ing, time alignment, axial response, or what have you.

Yeah...speakers don't "put out Watts". That's a funny one! Like you said, totally nonsensical. When someone says, "it hits hard" I have to qualify that with what kind of speakers we're discussing and in what context. Hitting hard means a fast attack and decay to me initially. Sound stage however, I use quite a lot. The audio picture as it were is presented (or should be) presented to your brain through your ears like a stage in front of you given whatever boudaries you're working with. I believe I use dynamic range and damping factor quite a lot as well. Transient response and damping factor are important key phrases for me that go a long with attack and decay. Ambiance, imaging, spectral balance, staging, tonality...all very important phrases for me.

For a system to playback true to the source, I'd call that tonally accurate and properly staged.

Now, here is a point where we differ. IMHO, a sound car isn't a waste of money because I damnwell know that if I can make a car sound spectacular, I can make a room sound great without half the effort. Car audio is much more of a challenge in my book. I'm taking the more difficult path as a challenge before walking the "easy path" as it were.

[xbr3akd0wnx]

Originally Posted by sqcomp

Now, here is a point where we differ. IMHO, a sound car isn't a waste of money because I damnwell know that if I can make a car sound spectacular, I can make a room sound great without half the effort. Car audio is much more of a challenge in my book. I'm taking the more difficult path as a challenge before walking the "easy path" as it were.

Amen.

[RedRide]

Shure you can make a car sound great using a given volume but, open a window, go down the the road ( road noise) , add a passenger, etc or just tun up the volume and it all for nothing as you drastically change the cars acustics since it's such a small confined enviourment.

Yes, I tried in the past in different vehicles and spent too much money trying but, I finally came to my senses and just turn on the stock sys and wait until I get home for Great sound.

BTW, before I retire from this (circular) thread I will just repeat.... Any sort of meter is absolutly worthless when EQing for a flat responce and your ears must be the sole "instrument" used, othewise, WTF is the point?