how far can the stock block go?

[chancellor6869]

ok i have inherited a few turbochargers and fmic's and other goodies....im curious on how far if anyone has pushed the stock block and heads on a turbo build. im looking for about upper 200's like atleast 250. thanks.

[CrankyOldMan]

Anything over 8 psi is considered a death sentence for stock head/connecting rods. Take a look at the builds by MicroImage and Fnkngrv. They've both pushed the block over 200, but it's going to take a LOT of work to get there. The good news for you is that you already have the FMIC and snails, so you're up a few grand already.

[fnkngrv]

stock block itself can handle 250 just fine. the pistons and rods will need to be upgraded though. there has been plenty of information about this shared here. if you want 250 then you are looking at at least 15psi of boost and a lot of other supporting mods to get there for the most part. You won't get there for example without a return fuel setup. I pretty much tapped out the max flow you can do with the stock fuel system at around 190 on pump gas and that required a modified stock FPR.

[ilikerice]

Read throught this thread before any other questions

http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32747

[chancellor6869]

thanks guys, ive got alot of info on what this motor can so physically.....i have been thinking maybe i should just do a honda swap, maybe a b18 with forged pistons and a nice set of eagle rods. i have a couple friends who have swapped the rods and pistons out and running a t3/4 turbo setup and making some major hp....one of them being in the 500's.
i think trying to push this motor or build it to only reach 200-300 hp isnt worth money when i can do it cheaper on a honda motor and make alot more power.

[WeeYari]

Originally Posted by chancellor6869

maybe i should just do a honda swap

Sure you could do a nice build, but actually getting it in would run ya some serious $$.

If it was easy/cheap we'd have a whole mess of Honda powered Yarii on the planet. We don't.

[why?]

Seriously, a honda swap? Yea that's the first engine I think of for power....

A honda engine is going to cost just as much as the Yaris engine. If you want cheap, go with a Ford or Chevy small block V8. It still is not cheap, but it will be a hell of a lot less than swapping for a honda.

[chancellor6869]

Originally Posted by why?

Seriously, a honda swap? Yea that's the first engine I think of for power....

A honda engine is going to cost just as much as the Yaris engine. If you want cheap, go with a Ford or Chevy small block V8. It still is not cheap, but it will be a hell of a lot less than swapping for a honda.

honda has one of the best motors out there, they are well built and easy to get parts for. there is no way im fitting a small block in my engine bay. not without cutting away the fire wall and totally redesigning the whole car. if i wanted to go with a v8 build id take out my 386 that is in my Cadillac and put in my bmw 318. i love my yaris and would drive it even if i had a high horsepower car. ive had a early dodge ram with a built 440 with a 3200 stall that made close to 550whp and its no where as fun as my yaris lol. slow cars that weigh nothing are a blast to drive.

[ilikerice]

First, what is your goal? Are you talking drag racing, full track, street racing (hope not), autocross, or just because you can?

Second, you are talking about doing a complete engine swap from another manufaturer that runs off a completely different platform and you are saying it would be cheaper to build a B18 over a 1NZ? You do realize that unless your a master welder and I would hope a damn good engineer, you will still be paying out the ass for materials.

Go through some of the basics that will need to be adjusted
motor mounts obviousy.
Wire harness of course but then you gotta run a separate ecu for the B18 because the yaris has all the dash electricals integrated into that, Unless you just go standalone and get rid of all the bells and whistles.
Shifter cables gotta go because the B18 uses links and the 1nz uses cables, will have to modify a way for that to work.
Axles to the hub assembly, you can either get some axles custom made which isn't cheap, or find some way to get a honda double wishbone suspension engineered under the front fenders.
You will still have to do some cutting around the subframe to get that transmission to fit, if a 4agze motor needed trimming of the subframe, I am sure the bigger B18 transmission will need some.
Now that the motor is in.. you want it to get to 500whp... even if its cheaper to build a B motor than a 1nz, it's still not cheap.

I would love a swapped motor in my yaris. It looks like the 2zr is the best chance for it to work with minimal fabrication. Just a few wires needed to move around. yet your only looking at a 30whp gain from that. 1zz may be a better choice. Lots of aftermarket parts for that motor also.

Basically, 300whp is more than enough fun a yaris needs. That can be easily achieved on a 1nz and probably cheaper than any swapped build you put into it. Trying to keep 300 whp on the ground on any fwd car is touch.. let alone 500..

I'm not saying its impossible, google yaris k20a. It's been done.

If you want a small K car like ours and want a honda motor in it. Trade it in for a Fit. Hasport makes a K-series mount kit for them..

Just my opinion

[chancellor6869]

Originally Posted by ilikerice

First, what is your goal? Are you talking drag racing, full track, street racing (hope not), autocross, or just because you can?

Second, you are talking about doing a complete engine swap from another manufaturer that runs off a completely different platform and you are saying it would be cheaper to build a B18 over a 1NZ? You do realize that unless your a master welder and I would hope a damn good engineer, you will still be paying out the ass for materials.

Go through some of the basics that will need to be adjusted
motor mounts obviousy.
Wire harness of course but then you gotta run a separate ecu for the B18 because the yaris has all the dash electricals integrated into that, Unless you just go standalone and get rid of all the bells and whistles.
Shifter cables gotta go because the B18 uses links and the 1nz uses cables, will have to modify a way for that to work.
Axles to the hub assembly, you can either get some axles custom made which isn't cheap, or find some way to get a honda double wishbone suspension engineered under the front fenders.
You will still have to do some cutting around the subframe to get that transmission to fit, if a 4agze motor needed trimming of the subframe, I am sure the bigger B18 transmission will need some.
Now that the motor is in.. you want it to get to 500whp... even if its cheaper to build a B motor than a 1nz, it's still not cheap.

I would love a swapped motor in my yaris. It looks like the 2zr is the best chance for it to work with minimal fabrication. Just a few wires needed to move around. yet your only looking at a 30whp gain from that. 1zz may be a better choice. Lots of aftermarket parts for that motor also.

Basically, 300whp is more than enough fun a yaris needs. That can be easily achieved on a 1nz and probably cheaper than any swapped build you put into it. Trying to keep 300 whp on the ground on any fwd car is touch.. let alone 500..

I'm not saying its impossible, google yaris k20a. It's been done.

If you want a small K car like ours and want a honda motor in it. Trade it in for a Fit. Hasport makes a K-series mount kit for them..

Just my opinion

im not looking for 500whp. im looking for build a nice car to show off at my local meets and car shows to promote my shop. i dont expect it to be cheap as i know being a car enthusiast it takes money to make it a hobby lol....ill be happy with 250-300hp cause the yaris itself isnt fast but if driven right its quick. the reason why i lean more towards the honda swap is because there are alot more honda resources in the dfw area and my buddy own a local shop and specializes in hondas...so if i run into trouble tuning or setup i could call him up. everybody is throwing around parts for hondas stupid cheap around here. guys selling fully built k20 or b18 motors for 500 dollars.....and i honestly think it would be cool to see a honda motor under the hood, just like you see in some of the mini coopers.

[fnkngrv]

even running 170-190 the Yaris is very fun and can perform just fine. when I ran that I could still impress a lot of folks and I got over 33mpg mixed driving. at those numbers you don't have to have a built bottom end either. I would strongly suggest for simplicity that you go that route first and see how you like it. if you want more you have the turbo equipment already and can upgrade internals, fuel system, etc. I think the biggest issue is that you quite honestly can't make a determination on what you want by numbers unless you have been in a supercharged or turbo'ed Yaris. You can't base your decision off of other platforms you have been in. I have been in turbo'ed civics, srt4, focus, and even a turbo dodge colt as well as dodge omni. They are all different in how they perform and feel. Throwing a number out there could give the wrong impression that all you do care about then is numbers which may or may not be the case. Traditionally Yaris owner here is close to cultish so we share in the joys, pains, and opinions on the platform. Where are you located out of curiosity? As for seeing a honda mill in a Yaris is has been done already a few times. I think the biggest problem you are going to run into with folks here is that every few months someone comes in and asks these same questions which have been diacussed a tremendous amount. At this point your best option is to do a search here and read through it all. I can tell you that if you are considering and do a swap from another manufacturer everyone would love to have you share your experience as that hasn't been something shared in our community. The honda swaps I have seen have been from others and little to no information has been shared. I don't know if it is the secretive nature that I have seen inherent with honda guys or what, but we tend to be a more open. I personally feel if someone is talking about racing for example a teue judge is how you perform and not the car.

[ilikerice]

every few months someone comes in and asks these same questions which have been diacussed a tremendous amount

I.E. swaps from different manufatures. There is a sticky in the "performance" threads titled "Yaris Motor Swaps: please read before posting".

Also what Fnkngrv is saying about people not sharing their builds is really quite dissapointing. In the microimageonline.com threads, people have been very open about thier motor swaps, 4agze and the 2zrfe. Both successful swaps and both have extensive build threads on the pain and frustrations that come along with them. I have only seen pictures of other swaps, but nothing about how it was done or what was and wasn't compatable. Even a couple people have tried to contact those and they never respond back or give vague answers about the shop did all the work.

Like he said, when ever I see a thread about an engine swap and how it could be done because that person has connections, experience, or time to do it, I just shrug my shoulders and will believe it when I see it.

you are looking for 250whp which can be done easily for under 5k, turbo kit, engine management, gauges, some beefier rods and lower comp pistons if you do it yourself which you say you can. I don't see how this is cheaper than just swapping a B series motor into a yaris.

I hope I get proven wrong. I really do. I would love to see it and the progress that is made, but I wont hold my breathe. Too many time has this been a fart in the wind

[malibuguy]

Wow

[chancellor6869]

Originally Posted by fnkngrv

even running 170-190 the Yaris is very fun and can perform just fine. when I ran that I could still impress a lot of folks and I got over 33mpg mixed driving. at those numbers you don't have to have a built bottom end either. I would strongly suggest for simplicity that you go that route first and see how you like it. if you want more you have the turbo equipment already and can upgrade internals, fuel system, etc. I think the biggest issue is that you quite honestly can't make a determination on what you want by numbers unless you have been in a supercharged or turbo'ed Yaris. You can't base your decision off of other platforms you have been in. I have been in turbo'ed civics, srt4, focus, and even a turbo dodge colt as well as dodge omni. They are all different in how they perform and feel. Throwing a number out there could give the wrong impression that all you do care about then is numbers which may or may not be the case. Traditionally Yaris owner here is close to cultish so we share in the joys, pains, and opinions on the platform. Where are you located out of curiosity? As for seeing a honda mill in a Yaris is has been done already a few times. I think the biggest problem you are going to run into with folks here is that every few months someone comes in and asks these same questions which have been diacussed a tremendous amount. At this point your best option is to do a search here and read through it all. I can tell you that if you are considering and do a swap from another manufacturer everyone would love to have you share your experience as that hasn't been something shared in our community. The honda swaps I have seen have been from others and little to no information has been shared. I don't know if it is the secretive nature that I have seen inherent with honda guys or what, but we tend to be a more open. I personally feel if someone is talking about racing for example a teue judge is how you perform and not the car.

i live in grand praire texas but my shop is in fort worth. about a 35 minute drive from eachother. ya i understand what you are saying. cause i already love the spunky and quick feeling a yaris gives. i just gotta figure out if my selection of turbos i received are small enough. they are pretty big and i think if using a stock engine it wont build boost. thats another reason why i have considered a engine build or swap.

[chancellor6869]

Originally Posted by ilikerice

I.E. swaps from different manufatures. There is a sticky in the "performance" threads titled "Yaris Motor Swaps: please read before posting".

Also what Fnkngrv is saying about people not sharing their builds is really quite dissapointing. In the microimageonline.com threads, people have been very open about thier motor swaps, 4agze and the 2zrfe. Both successful swaps and both have extensive build threads on the pain and frustrations that come along with them. I have only seen pictures of other swaps, but nothing about how it was done or what was and wasn't compatable. Even a couple people have tried to contact those and they never respond back or give vague answers about the shop did all the work.

Like he said, when ever I see a thread about an engine swap and how it could be done because that person has connections, experience, or time to do it, I just shrug my shoulders and will believe it when I see it.

you are looking for 250whp which can be done easily for under 5k, turbo kit, engine management, gauges, some beefier rods and lower comp pistons if you do it yourself which you say you can. I don't see how this is cheaper than just swapping a B series motor into a yaris.

I hope I get proven wrong. I really do. I would love to see it and the progress that is made, but I wont hold my breathe. Too many time has this been a fart in the wind

i totally agree and understand with what you are saying. i just got to make up my mind on what exactly i wanna do with my car. im going to do a little more research and do some pricing and compare the two together and let you guys know.....but just a heads up for you guys im going to be putting a thread up soon with a video about me wrapping and my car and also im going to be doing a weekly/daily vlog on youtube for the yaris community....or just people who are curious about whats going on.

[WeeYari]

^ excellent. Stick to your word please.


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[chancellor6869]

Originally Posted by WeeYari

^ excellent. Stick to your word please.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

i promise brother.

[ilikerice]

Originally Posted by chancellor6869

i totally agree and understand with what you are saying. i just got to make up my mind on what exactly i wanna do with my car. im going to do a little more research and do some pricing and compare the two together and let you guys know.....but just a heads up for you guys im going to be putting a thread up soon with a video about me wrapping and my car and also im going to be doing a weekly/daily vlog on youtube for the yaris community....or just people who are curious about whats going on.

Cool. Post a link to the youtube channel and I will definitly subcribe to it.

Reading back through my posts, I can see that it could have been a bit aggressive. I do apoligize if I offended you.

I also have dreamed to do an engine swap. Money plays the biggest role for me though. I enjoy rebuilding motors and I hardly ever get back what I put into them. It's just a hobby, and hobbies turn into money pits and are rarely turned into a profit. If I ever come across a good donor from a xD or something with a 2zz, 1zz, or 2zr. I will definitly make a thread on that.

I used to own a few CRX's before my Yaris. It was nice to have parts always available so cheap as they were. I did my motor swap back in 2004 with a b20. Mounts, linkage and harness was more expensive from hasport than my motor at the time. Honda aftermarket vendors makes it very easy with thier chassis from civics, preludes, CRV, Integra's, RSX to swap motors around non stop cheaper than any other manufaturer. It makes it twice as expensive with other manufacturers like Toyota because they demand just isn't there like it is with Honda's.

Boost, the replacement for displacement... right?