Mpg-O-Matic : Chevy Spark E.V.

[Hershey]

Go to , http://www.mpgomatic.com/ . Less than $27,000 . Doesn't include tax breaks . So , should be well under $20,000 , depending on where you live . Nice lookin' outside and in .

[bronsin]

I could use an electric car because 95% of my driving involves trips of less than ten miles.

But I can only afford one vehicle and lets face it, there are going to be times when I have to drive hundreds of miles and an EV isnt capable of that. Id just be screwing myself over to buy an EV.

My question is: why do these cars have to cost so much? A Nissan EV is like $30,000+. The 2001 Prius I looked at when I bought my 2001 ECHO was $30,000. The ECHO bottom line tax included was $13,100. Thats $17,000 MORE for a car that gets maybe 10mpg more.

Now....if they could make an EV for ~$12,000 Id be so there! What would you get in an EV that cost $12,000? I bet theres a lot of things you could cut out that wouldnt be missed at all.

I think where I went wrong was not being a movie star. Then I could have the Prius and the EV and a Corvette and a diesel V8 Ford F250 pickup truck. And lots of hot women to have sex with! Yeah Im feeling its all my fault.

But until I figure out how to get all this stuff I will have to drive my Yaris and make the best of it!

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by bronsin

I could use an electric car because 95% of my driving involves trips of less than ten miles.

But I can only afford one vehicle and lets face it, there are going to be times when I have to drive hundreds of miles and an EV isnt capable of that. Id just be screwing myself over to buy an EV.

My question is: why do these cars have to cost so much? A Nissan EV is like $30,000+. The 2001 Prius I looked at when I bought my 2001 ECHO was $30,000. The ECHO bottom line tax included was $13,100. Thats $17,000 MORE for a car that gets maybe 10mpg more.

Now....if they could make an EV for ~$12,000 Id be so there! What would you get in an EV that cost $12,000? I bet theres a lot of things you could cut out that wouldnt be missed at all.

I think where I went wrong was not being a movie star. Then I could have the Prius and the EV and a Corvette and a diesel V8 Ford F250 pickup truck. And lots of hot women to have sex with! Yeah Im feeling its all my fault.

But until I figure out how to get all this stuff I will have to drive my Yaris and make the best of it!

Don't let your wife read this !

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by Hershey

Go to , http://www.mpgomatic.com/ . Less than $27,000 . Doesn't include tax breaks . So , should be well under $20,000 , depending on where you live . Nice lookin' outside and in .

Very interesting. Thanks for posting. As for his hope that more of such cars are sold to reduce our carbon footprint, a recent British study found that electric cars have a larger carbon footprint (than gasoline vehicles) until they pass 80,000 miles.

[Hamster]

A larger carbon footprint? Wow! Now that's interesting! What were the reasons given?

[bronsin]

Originally Posted by Hamster

A larger carbon footprint? Wow! Now that's interesting! What were the reasons given?

Google this:

.Bjorn Lomborg: Green Cars Have a Dirty Little Secret

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by Hamster

A larger carbon footprint? Wow! Now that's interesting! What were the reasons given?

One reason. The pollution from the factories that make the batteries. Link provided below.


http://theweek.com/article/index/216...he-environment

[Hershey]

Can't be any worse than the pollution left from drilling and the production of gasoline , diesel , etc. .

[Kal-El]

Not to mention that people think that electricity originates from a wall outlet. Um no, a majority of it comes from burning coal. I love how those that support electric conveniently forget about how electricity is generated and how dirty it is to manufacture these huge batteries.

[Thirty-Nine]

Originally Posted by Kal-El

Not to mention that people think that electricity originates from a wall outlet. Um no, a majority of it comes from burning coal. I love how those that support electric conveniently forget about how electricity is generated and how dirty it is to manufacture these huge batteries.

FWIW, I brought up the battery manufacturing point at dinner (Hershey was across the table from me). Chevy claims that even with the battery production, an EV still has a smaller carbon footprint than gas-powered vehicles.

Although, I do agree: If EV sales start to gain mainstream acceptance, one would have to assume we'd need more electricity.

[bronsin]

Originally Posted by Thirty-Nine

Although, I do agree: If EV sales start to gain mainstream acceptance, one would have to assume we'd need more electricity.

Right! That power would probably come from burning more coal...not to mention that we would have to drasticially increase the number of plants producing eletricity!

This at a time when my power utility is encouraging me to cut back on electric use by installing energy saving lightbulbs!

Obviously the people who want us to buy electric cars have not thought this thing out beforehand!

[Golddeenoh]

wind, solar, nuclear, and water turbine, that is how we will continue making power, but yes to make power we have to do something that at some point in time it will involve carbon and someone's foot print.

[Kal-El]

Originally Posted by bronsin

Right! That power would probably come from burning more coal...not to mention that we would have to drasticially increase the number of plants producing eletricity!

This at a time when my power utility is encouraging me to cut back on electric use by installing energy saving lightbulbs!

Obviously the people who want us to buy electric cars have not thought this thing out beforehand!

Great point. Our government has banned incandescent light bulbs because of their higher electricity use over fluorescent. Instead of allowing people to make their own purchase decision. Light quality is an important consideration for many people that can only be fulfilled with incandescent but now we don't have the choice to spend more on electricity if we want.

But to your main point, they want us to cut back everywhere we can on electricity while at the same time are pushing impractical expensive electric cars that will consume more electricity to charge than perhaps to power a whole home. This push includes giving $7,500 tax credits to willing buyers. My tax dollars going to people who can afford $30-40K cars. Nice! While there's people paying for these credits who are barely scraping by. Gotta love it.

Originally Posted by Golddeenoh

wind, solar, nuclear, and water turbine, that is how we will continue making power, but yes to make power we have to do something that at some point in time it will involve carbon and someone's foot print.

Wind, solar, and water turbines, ect. create a relative miniscule amount of electricity to what we need, unfortunately. If we put as many electric cars on the road as they're hoping, there's no way around needing more power plants - coal and nuclear. Nuclear has great merits but comes with obvious risks and people don't want to be anywhere around them.



Hey, I wish I could love the idea of electrics. I really do. But there's just way too many drawbacks.

- Too expensive ... They need a 50% price drop - when will that happen?
Imagine spending $28,000 for the micro Spark EV? You kidding me?
- Range! 100 miles, if you're lucky? May be OK for daily commute, but your freedom is limited. I go way further all the time. So now I need one real car, and an electric. No problem
- Not as clean as they're made out to be. They are essentially coal powered cars carrying around toxic batteries. A regular Yaris is more environmentally friendly.

[Hershey]

I'm aware of coal for electricity . There are areas where coal is burned and has an health impact on those living nearby . PA. is one of these . Seen the report a few years ago on Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel . The air quality was so poor that schools couldn't let children play outside . Many had / have respiratory problems . There are always pros and cons . I believe electric cars don't have engine oil . So , that would be another plus . Second , many vehicles leak oil ( engine , tranny , etc. ) that makes its way to nearby streams , brooks , springs , etc.. Includes the '08 sedan that leaked oil until 20.000 miles . No longer does since the repair . We use energy saving appliances and lighting . Try to do our part . Recycle as well . We know of relatives and people who say why bother , because many others don't . When G.B. Jr. and D.C. took office they dropped the filtration of coal plants and remains the same . Hydrogen then ?

[bronsin]

Originally Posted by Kal-El

Wind, solar, and water turbines, ect. create a relative miniscule amount of electricity to what we need, unfortunately. .

Not only that, wind turbines cant replace existing fossil/nuclear power plants. You still need machines capable of meeting the demand at any given moment. Wind power is only generated when the winds blow. Wind power doesnt replace conventional plants.

Heres an interesting thing that was done near where I used to live at Gilboa NY. There is a large resevoir there at the base of a 500 foot mountain of limestone. They built a huge lake on top of the mountain connected to the body of water below by tunnels bored in the rock. In the tunnels are electric pumps which at night (when excess power is availible) pump water from the resevoir to to the lake and fill it. During the day (when power is needed) the water runs back into the resevoir running the pumps as generators producing eletricity when needed during the day.

Its a form of poor mans hydro. Its cheaper and (some of) the savings are passed on to consumers.