Well I got robbed...!

[GeneW]

Why exactly does the Subway owe you anything? Did they rob you?

You kept cool and didn't do anything dumb. Had you been armed they'd have either shot you or taken the piece since they got close enough to touch you. Otherwise you'd have blasted at them and would be ponying up money for a lawyer. Can't shoot folks for free. I carry sometimes and do not like the prospect of hurting anyone, just figure better them than me.

Gene

[cali yaris]

I think you could argue that you should be reimbursed for your meal, but that's about it.

[Kioshi]

Sorry to hear this happen to you and you gf and others at Subway....

Important thing is, you guys are safe.....life is more valuable than some x amount phone dude or money.

I usually leave my GPS tracker ON on my Samsung Omnia so it can be tracked anytime.....I'm glad you didnt have your Yaris keys on you....if someone takes that away from me, then.... or

[darthbauer]

So that blows but as Gene said, Subway did not rob you and they will not give you a dime. Sure their silent alarm thing did not work but they are probably not required by law to even have one so that's more or less out the door. I've been mugged before and lost about $40 bucks and this happened in a Target parking lot and Target security had the chance to stop the guy and did nothing.

Needles to say, im still out $40 bucks. If they got your ID I would get a gun like someone else said cause now these douche bags know where you live. Keep your doors and windows locked and stay safe.

[Nexus1155]

Can't shoot folks for free

Legally, you can shoot someone to kill if you or another civilians life is in imminent danger... it takes about 5 bullets to take someone down without a conflict i was taught by an officer

[darthbauer]

Originally Posted by Nexus1155

Legally, you can shoot someone to kill if you or another civilians life is in imminent danger... it takes about 5 bullets to take someone down without a conflict i was taught by an officer

Not so much here. You can and will probably get sued by the family of the jerk you shot. It sucks but its true. One of my old teachers got sued by a perp cause the jerk hurt himself on something in her house while in the middle of a B&E.

[MadMax]

God bless Texas and Castle Doctrine. If you are cleared by the Grand Jury (known as a 'no bill') for a clean shoot, you cannot be sued in civil court! Castle Doctrine also got rid of any obligation to retreat. If you are stupid enough to try and rob someone in Texas, there is a really good chance that you are gonna get shot!

Oh, and the beauty of it is, you shoot and kill one of the two robbers, and the other robber is charged with the murder! If a person commits a crime they take responsibility for all actions taken during the crime, to include those in self defense.

I am very happy to hear you and your girlfriend came through unscathed, but you never know how these things are going to turn out as the Luby's massacre in Killeen back in 1991 demonstrated. It was one of the survivors of that incident, Suzanna Hupp (who lost both of her parents) that drove the Texas Legislature to pass a shall-issue gun law, which requires that all qualifying applicants be issued a Concealed Handgun License. Hupp was later elected to the Texas House of Representatives in 1996.

We Texans owe a lot to Suzanna Hupp!

Cheers! M2

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by Nexus1155

Legally, you can shoot someone to kill if you or another civilians life is in imminent danger...

Laws vary by state, but in Texas you are allowed to employ lethal force for more reasons other than a person's life being in imminent danger...

PC §9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON. (a) A person
is justified in using deadly force against another:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under
Section 9.31;
(2) if a reasonable person in the actor's situation would not have
retreated; and
(3) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly
force is immediately necessary:
(A) to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use
of unlawful deadly force; or
(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated
kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault,
robbery, or aggravated robbery.

it takes about 5 bullets to take someone down without a conflict i was taught by an officer

That's bullshit! Shot placement is the most important aspect of self defense (caliber being second), and a well-placed single shot can and will stop an attacker. But you had better place that round exactly where you need it to be!

To ensure a high kill probability, we were always taught 'two to the chest, one to the head; we prefer them alive but we'll take them dead!'

[Nexus1155]

Well I mean yeah you can take someone down with a single headshot dont get me wrong but i mean if your just shootin into him 5 will drop him like a stone.

But so whoever said against the shooting because you would get sued.... are you friggen mad... would you rather have your life or your money... thats really greedy

[darthbauer]

Originally Posted by Nexus1155

Well I mean yeah you can take someone down with a single headshot dont get me wrong but i mean if your just shootin into him 5 will drop him like a stone.

But so whoever said against the shooting because you would get sued.... are you friggen mad... would you rather have your life or your money... thats really greedy

Greedy I am but that's a whole other story. If you read the rest of what I said then you will know why I said it. I would rather have my life than my money but if some guy is only taking my money and not killing people then I'm not going to shoot the guy. If you read the op then you should remember that they did not even have their guns out. I'm not going to kill a guy over the 8 bucks in my pocket. Last time I pulled a gun on someone was because the asshole was beating my then pregnant wife. He turned and ran and was picked up by the cops outside. Would you kill a guy over money? If he would have pulled on anyone then I would have shot the guy.

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by Nexus1155

Legally, you can shoot someone to kill if you or another civilians life is in imminent danger... it takes about 5 bullets to take someone down without a conflict i was taught by an officer

Even a Coroner's Inquest is pricey. Last I heard about $10,000 in legal fees.

Shooting someone beats getting shot yourself but that's about the only good of it.

Gene

[Yarold n Kumar]

Even if your iPhone didn't hAve gps tracking activated, lAw enforcement should be able to triAngulate the position of your phone using the cell towers and the phone's signal. The da's office should be able to get a warrant to access this information in real time. The tech pinpoints location down to a couple feet. You should also be able to apply for some kind of restitution because you were the victim of a crime. Contact your local district attorney's office (criminal prosecutor) and ask for help. A private lawyer will not have as much sway as the gov lawyer who is paid to work with the police.

[Yarold n Kumar]

Oops. Florida employs "state attorneys".

[Nexus1155]

No i read the OP fully, but I am saying hypothetically if they did pull out guns and were potential killers

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by darthbauer

Greedy I am but that's a whole other story. If you read the rest of what I said then you will know why I said it. I would rather have my life than my money but if some guy is only taking my money and not killing people then I'm not going to shoot the guy. If you read the op then you should remember that they did not even have their guns out. I'm not going to kill a guy over the 8 bucks in my pocket. Last time I pulled a gun on someone was because the asshole was beating my then pregnant wife. He turned and ran and was picked up by the cops outside. Would you kill a guy over money? If he would have pulled on anyone then I would have shot the guy.

Armed robbery is considered lethal force, so you don't have to wait for someone to start shooting to defend yourself. At that point, it may be too late.

If I had the opportunity to do so, would I shoot and kill a guy who was robbing me at gunpoint ? Hell yes! You never know what is going on in that person's mind, and they may actually kill you for those eight bucks (it's happened for lesss), so you had better make a move before they do!

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by MadMax

Armed robbery is considered lethal force, so you don't have to wait for someone to start shooting to defend yourself. At that point, it may be too late.

If I had the opportunity to do so, would I shoot and kill a guy who was robbing me at gunpoint ? Hell yes! You never know what is going on in that person's mind, and they may actually kill you for those eight bucks (it's happened for lesss), so you had better make a move before they do!

They might shoot you to "eliminate witnesses", because they're sociopaths who don't care if you live or die, or because they want to see you plead for your life before they take it from you. You may look like their least favorite school teacher, school yard bully or they want "payback" for something that has nothing to do with you.

Pointing a weapon at someone is serious business. People who do is casually or recklessly need their attitudes adjusted, preferably so that they learn but if not, better them than you.

Gene

[toad]

Originally Posted by MadMax

Armed robbery is considered lethal force, so you don't have to wait for someone to start shooting to defend yourself. At that point, it may be too late.

If I had the opportunity to do so, would I shoot and kill a guy who was robbing me at gunpoint ? Hell yes! You never know what is going on in that person's mind, and they may actually kill you for those eight bucks (it's happened for lesss), so you had better make a move before they do!

as a gun-owner you have a responsibility to the other people around you also. yes, if you feel your life is in jeopardy, by all means, defend yourself. however, in this particular incident there were other patrons in an enclosed area(i'm assuming this subway restaurant is like all others i've been in) and i feel that gun or no-gun the op did the right thing - stay calm and don't do anything rash. the robbers had weapons, but did not have them pulled. yes, things could have gotten worse, but a gunfight in a small place with other people could be even worse. don't call me some 'bleading-heart liberal', i sell guns for a living(rifles and shotguns, no pistols) and am a firm believer in the right to bear arms. i just want to state that carrying a weapon is a right, but with that right comes MUCH responsibility. bottom line, nobody got hurt and that's all that matters!

[MadMax]

I never said there was an automatic requirement to shoot the robbers, I was simply pointing out that anytime an armed robbery is committed, you have a legal right to defend yourself using lethal force.

This was a lucky incident, as GeneW pointed out you don't what the robbers are thinking and even though they didn't have their weapons pulled it doesn't mean they didn't intend to use them later. And in Texas the display of a weapon to cause alarm is considered enough justification to use lethal force in defense.

Lastly, please don't think I have any desire or intention to kill someone, that couldn't be farther from the truth. But as a responsible gun owner I know what my rights are, and I have had more than sufficient training both in my 25 years in the military and in the civilian world to know when it is safe to shoot. It the threat is there, and I determine I have to defend myself, my family or others, I will not hesitate to act.