Bronsin Goes To The Toyota Dealer To See What Sup Wit Dat

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by nookandcrannycar

I'm sure there are enough differences to justify the price difference between your two cars, but some people don't think those differences are valuable. I can see where you would because you have kids. I rarely drive more than one other person around. Re driving with four people or more, I can see wanting the extra room. My aunt has a non-hybrid RX and we drove about 2,000 miles on a vacation with 2 other people. She had me do all the driving and it did make the trip more comfortable to have the room that vehicle affords the occupants.

That vacation was a rare time with more than two people in the car. My aunt and uncle used to have a Lexus ES sedan and an Acura TSX. They would always take the ES on their many long driving trips. It would fit enough clothes and golf equipment. Then they traded the Acura TSX in for the Lexus RX SUV. Now they always take the RX on their trips. Do 2 people need an RX to be comfortable on a trip...of course not...but it is what makes them comfortable.....and my aunt can bring more clothes.....and I remembered to use italics instead of caps.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by bronsin

There is a new Toyota mega dealer on Route 73 in Mount Laurel NJ. (the old one is a parts store now)

I went window shopping today and this is what I saw! (all models 2012. NO 2013)

Scion iQ. There were eight of them all identically priced. $16,000 bottom line every one.

There were mucho Prius (20?) models which ranged from $40,000 for the plug in model to $23,000 for the Prius C. There WAS a plug in for $33,000. There was something called the Model Two and the V which was confusing. There were three C's each $25,000. There was one C that was $23,000. There were lots of Model Twos and they were all $25,000.

There were a grandtotal of TWO Yari. Both were four door hatches with auto and they were both BOTTOM LINE $16,000 and change. One was black and one was silver. I guess that says everyting you need to know about which is the BEST model of them all. Too bad but they did not have the handicap special (extremely wide doors) 2 door models. They hopefully would have been less. I did not see any leftover Classic 2011s which I would have bought in an instant if they were two doors!

PS I think the 12s styling SUCKS especially the interior. Too busy. Center speedo and dual glove boxes for me! The exterior sucks too compared to the 11s but admiddedly not as bad as the interiors. (forgive me personal opinion here) HOWEVER if I were to choose from any of the above it would be the 2012 Yaris even if it means giving up my Yaris World do it yourself $10 cruise control.

Maybe the one I would buy if I desparately needed a car was a used 2009 four door hatch with auto RED because I dont drive much (<5000 miles a year) with 82,000 miles Toyota certified $11,000. It was beautiful.

But I will tell you a secret although I will NOT disclose its location. Theres a NEW Smart 2013 WITHOUT AC sitting on a lot for $13,000 BOTTOM LINE. It ios missing a left front hubcap but I would INSIST it be replaced. I am throughly SICK of driving an automatic (doesnt slow down when you take your foot off the gas). I have driven the Smart with it auto clutch five speed and it DOES slow down when you take your foot off the gas pedal.

So the Yaris is $7000 LESS than the cheapest Prius! And there are CHEAPER Yari! The iQ is the same price and you can put a LOT of stuff in a hatchabck Yaris!

The prices you are typing are way above the base MSRP for each level. Do all of these cars have Pac stickers (a DEALER affixed added final sticker than has added dealer markup as an item, worthless dealer added options that cost the dealer 1% of what they're charging, or both of these) or are the amounts you're quoting from the FACTORY sticker and the dealer just ordered each car with a lot of FACTORY OPTIONS? I'm not surprised that a dealership in that location would primarily order cars with lots of factory options or slap on a Pac sticker or both. They probably figure there are enough people from Moorestown and other like areas who don't care that much about what they pay for the car. The Prius C that I sat in at my local dealer was a Four, but it DID NOT have a Pac sticker and didn't have any factory options, so the MSRP was the same as on the Toyota website. The Prius C and the 'regular' or 'standard' Prius each have 4 models/levels -- the One, the Two, the Three, and the Four. The different (sharply I think) Prius V is essentially the 'Prius station wagon'. For some reason I thought you lived in the northern part of New Jersey, not the southern part. Much easier to drive around in the southern part, at least the last time I was there. When visiting Philadelphia, I stayed in Maple Shade and hung out at the Barnes and Noble in Mount Laurel. The outside of the '12 Yaris is growing on me, but the dash in our 2nd gen cars is SO much better.

[bronsin]

Originally Posted by nookandcrannycar

The prices you are typing are way above the base MSRP for each level. Do all of these cars have Pac stickers (a DEALER affixed added final sticker than has added dealer markup as an item, worthless dealer added options that cost the dealer 1% of what they're charging, or both of these) or are the amounts you're quoting from the FACTORY sticker and the dealer just ordered each car with a lot of FACTORY OPTIONS? I'm not surprised that a dealership in that location would primarily order cars with lots of factory options or slap on a Pac sticker or both. They probably figure there are enough people from Moorestown and other like areas who don't care that much about what they pay for the car. The Prius C that I sat in at my local dealer was a Four, but it DID NOT have a Pac sticker and didn't have any factory options, so the MSRP was the same as on the Toyota website. The Prius C and the 'regular' or 'standard' Prius each have 4 models/levels -- the One, the Two, the Three, and the Four. The different (sharply I think) Prius V is essentially the 'Prius station wagon'. For some reason I thought you lived in the northern part of New Jersey, not the southern part. Much easier to drive around in the southern part, at least the last time I was there. When visiting Philadelphia, I stayed in Maple Shade and hung out at the Barnes and Noble in Mount Laurel. The outside of the '12 Yaris is growing on me, but the dash in our 2nd gen cars is SO much better.

All I can do is relay what the stickers said. What price the dealer will agree to in another matter entirely. But if a cheaper price could be negotiated for a Prius it stands to reason one could also be had for a Yaris. Or iQ.

No these were NOT PAC stickers with dealer added extras.

If I am ever back there I will take pictures of the stickers so you can see for yourself.

Interesting that posters are claiming the Prius can be had for $20k when in reality the cheapest sticker I saw was $23K.

However for some strange reason a Yaris sticker is 16k but the posters claim you will pay THAT and not $13k.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by bronsin

All I can do is relay what the stickers said. What price the dealer will agree to in another matter entirely. But if a cheaper price could be negotiated for a Prius it stands to reason one could also be had for a Yaris. Or iQ.

No these were NOT PAC stickers with dealer added extras.

If I am ever back there I will take pictures of the stickers so you can see for yourself.

Interesting that posters are claiming the Prius can be had for $20k when in reality the cheapest sticker I saw was $23K.

However for some strange reason a Yaris sticker is 16k but the posters claim you will pay THAT and not $13k.

Sorry, just meant to emphasize, not shout, my bad. When I use all caps, it's just to draw visual attention so the words stick out...I never mean to shout. The other thought I was having while reading your thread starting post (but forgot to put in my previous reply...also my bad) is thinking that Holman might be a small inventory dealership that needs to have a higher return on investment per car, as opposed to a high volume dealer, to make the numbers work. I've noticed in multiple states that smaller dealerships tend to stock cars with more options and models as high up in the pecking order as the market will bear. I typed Mount Laurel, NJ in the Advanced Search on the Toyota website and 5 dealerships appear on the first page -- Holman Toyota in Mount Laurel and also Liberty Toyota, Toyota of Runnymeade, Champion Toyota, and Faulkner Toyota. According to the website of each dealer Holman in Mount Laurel has a new car inventory of 281, Liberty = 343, Toyota of Runnymeade = 153, Faulkner = 218, and Champion (in Philadelphia) is under 700. I usually go to either Gullo Toyota or Fred Haas Toyota World. Gullo's current new car inventory is 2,231 and Fred Haas Toyota World's current new car inventory is 3,322.

I bought my Yaris while on a trip. I searched about 400 dealerships within a 600 mile safe driving distance from Chicopee, MA (only about 600 safe miles left on my steering rack) and only found I think it was 11 manual trans 3-door Yari...and only 5 had the convenience group (so rear window defroster) and hand crank windows. Re my number one choice, the dealership lied re inventory (online) and the car was still on a boat. I drove to my second choice and purchased it. It didn't have a PAC sticker and it was the first car in my life I didn't try to score a deal on. They knew what they had.....they had moved it from another dealership within their group. It was an enjoyable experience. These top two choices were at dealerships that have current inventories of 211 and 134, so you can have a small dealership staffed with jerks, or you can have an enjoyable and more personal experience that is likely what a small store tries to pride itself on. I think small stores will also try to keep as close to the customer as possible because they are eager to keep that person in the fold for service.

[nookandcrannycar]

^^^^^ I've also noticed that some dealerships have pages/fields set up where you can submit an online offer on a new car listed in inventory.

[matti]

The dealer in my city has two Prius Cs on the lot and one is about $20,300, I believe (FWIW).

[bronsin]

Originally Posted by matti

The dealer in my city has two Prius Cs on the lot and one is about $20,300, I believe (FWIW).

Wow. Didnt see any Prius with a sticker like that.

Can you take a picture? You say you "believe" its $20K. I saw what I saw and am reporting just that.

I know when I was shopping for a car in 2000 I saw a Prius in the showroom that had a sticker of $27k. There was a $3000 premium added to that by the dealer so the price was actually $30k.

Since then I dont trust the dealer!

[matti]

Sorry, I was mistaken. It's $20,964.

http://kolartoyota.com/Duluth-MN/For...e-Car/9687727/

[bronsin]

Hmmm. Im getting ~33 mpg with the Yaris and they CLAIM 53 mpg with the Prius. So that is 20 mpg advantage for the Prius NOT 10 or 12. So that means over 100k miles Yaris uses 3333 gallons of gas Prius uses <2000....

$7000 for Prius gas
$11,666 for Yaris gas

Yaris $16 k to buy

Prius 21k to buy

Breaks even after 100k miles....

Gas goes to $7 breaks even after 50k miles?

[bentjazz]

I like the appearance of the 2012 Yaris, myself. I really haven't seen the interior in person, but I like the aesthetics of the exterior, for sure. Be that as it may, I'll be driving my 2010 Yaris until it croaks.
I don't know how I feel about all these hybrids. The thing I really like about my Yaris is it's minimalist orientation, so I don't need luxury, nor do I want high end goodies. Basic transportation is all I need, combined with reliability and decent fuel economy. The Yaris is perfect for my needs. As such, I'd personally be very reticent about spending big bucks on a hybrid vehicle that will need battery replacement down the road. No thanks. But for those who do want hybrids and who do see their value, more power to you.....

[tk1971]

Originally Posted by bentjazz

I like the appearance of the 2012 Yaris, myself. I really haven't seen the interior in person, but I like the aesthetics of the exterior, for sure. Be that as it may, I'll be driving my 2010 Yaris until it croaks.
I don't know how I feel about all these hybrids. The thing I really like about my Yaris is it's minimalist orientation, so I don't need luxury, nor do I want high end goodies. Basic transportation is all I need, combined with reliability and decent fuel economy. The Yaris is perfect for my needs. As such, I'd personally be very reticent about spending big bucks on a hybrid vehicle that will need battery replacement down the road. No thanks. But for those who do want hybrids and who do see their value, more power to you.....

From the information you've given, the Yaris is a perfect fit for your needs.

You do realize that a well-maintained 2010 Yaris can last you 15 to 20 years depending on how many miles you drive?

Can you stand it THAT long w/o buying a new car? A lot can happen in 15 years.

I thought I'd be driving my 08 LB until my boys hit high school, then I'd teach each of them how to drive stick with it. But alas, I got stuck in really bad traffic (back to school traffic) and my hip gave out for a weekend (that's my excuse.. err, story anyway). Time to give up the clutch for a day-to-day commuter.

After driving it for a while, I find the Prius C very Yaris-like. Size, comfort, feel... all very comparable. Aside from the tail lights, I think they look fairly similar too.

Still, the Prius C has a digital speedometer and a nice TFT display with enough feedback to help the driver maintain efficient driving habits. It's very clever.

As for the battery, there are 1st Gen Prius' out there approaching 15 years and many hundreds of thousands of miles. There are even YouTube videos on how to track down individual bad cells on the battery pack for replacement. IMO, I think the technology is pretty well vetted now.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by tk1971

From the information you've given, the Yaris is a perfect fit for your needs.

You do realize that a well-maintained 2010 Yaris can last you 15 to 20 years depending on how many miles you drive?

Can you stand it THAT long w/o buying a new car? A lot can happen in 15 years.

I thought I'd be driving my 08 LB until my boys hit high school, then I'd teach each of them how to drive stick with it. But alas, I got stuck in really bad traffic (back to school traffic) and my hip gave out for a weekend (that's my excuse.. err, story anyway). Time to give up the clutch for a day-to-day commuter.

After driving it for a while, I find the Prius C very Yaris-like. Size, comfort, feel... all very comparable. Aside from the tail lights, I think they look fairly similar too.

Still, the Prius C has a digital speedometer and a nice TFT display with enough feedback to help the driver maintain efficient driving habits. It's very clever.

As for the battery, there are 1st Gen Prius' out there approaching 15 years and many hundreds of thousands of miles. There are even YouTube videos on how to track down individual bad cells on the battery pack for replacement. IMO, I think the technology is pretty well vetted now.

I didn't see this post until after posting my previous post. This post makes some of my previous post moot.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by tk1971

From the information you've given, the Yaris is a perfect fit for your needs.

You do realize that a well-maintained 2010 Yaris can last you 15 to 20 years depending on how many miles you drive?

Can you stand it THAT long w/o buying a new car? A lot can happen in 15 years.

I thought I'd be driving my 08 LB until my boys hit high school, then I'd teach each of them how to drive stick with it. But alas, I got stuck in really bad traffic (back to school traffic) and my hip gave out for a weekend (that's my excuse.. err, story anyway). Time to give up the clutch for a day-to-day commuter.

After driving it for a while, I find the Prius C very Yaris-like. Size, comfort, feel... all very comparable. Aside from the tail lights, I think they look fairly similar too.

Still, the Prius C has a digital speedometer and a nice TFT display with enough feedback to help the driver maintain efficient driving habits. It's very clever.

As for the battery, there are 1st Gen Prius' out there approaching 15 years and many hundreds of thousands of miles. There are even YouTube videos on how to track down individual bad cells on the battery pack for replacement. IMO, I think the technology is pretty well vetted now.

.........feedback to help the driver maintain efficient driving habits....I like how you put that. If I replace my Yaris with a Prius C rather than another Yaris, it will be for that reason.

[edmscan]

Originally Posted by nookandcrannycar

.........feedback to help the driver maintain efficient driving habits....I like how you put that. If I replace my Yaris with a Prius C rather than another Yaris, it will be for that reason.

The "economy screens" as I call them in the Prius C are really pretty cool and give you probably way more information than you really need. In fact I kinda see it like my ScanGauge .. as I have to concentrate at looking at the road and not look at the ScanGauge (I know my bad .. ). But as a passenger .. they are really pretty neat.

The only thing on the Prius C I don't care too much for .. are the lights in the back, but I know why they did it. It is exactly like a Hyundai that I saw today .. the lights are up higher so that they are "in your face" much more than the lights would be if they were lower down and if it prevents accidents then they have done their job, no matter how ugly they may be.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by edmscan

The "economy screens" as I call them in the Prius C are really pretty cool and give you probably way more information than you really need. In fact I kinda see it like my ScanGauge .. as I have to concentrate at looking at the road and not look at the ScanGauge (I know my bad .. ). But as a passenger .. they are really pretty neat.

The only thing on the Prius C I don't care too much for .. are the lights in the back, but I know why they did it. It is exactly like a Hyundai that I saw today .. the lights are up higher so that they are "in your face" much more than the lights would be if they were lower down and if it prevents accidents then they have done their job, no matter how ugly they may be.

Which (do you think) overall (day in and day out) would be a combination of easiest to use and extracting the most re MPG increase ---- your ScanGauge'd Yaris (if it=an automatic to make it more like the Prius C) or an "economy screen'd" Prius C?

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by edmscan

The "economy screens" as I call them in the Prius C are really pretty cool and give you probably way more information than you really need. In fact I kinda see it like my ScanGauge .. as I have to concentrate at looking at the road and not look at the ScanGauge (I know my bad .. ). But as a passenger .. they are really pretty neat.

The only thing on the Prius C I don't care too much for .. are the lights in the back, but I know why they did it. It is exactly like a Hyundai that I saw today .. the lights are up higher so that they are "in your face" much more than the lights would be if they were lower down and if it prevents accidents then they have done their job, no matter how ugly they may be.

I've never seen the Prius C "economy screens" in practice on the road (in person). I've only seen the related videos the Hershey has posted links to.

[bentjazz]

tk,

I don't drive that much, actually. I've got around 13,000 miles on the Yaris now, and I've had it since Dec 2010. And yes, if it keeps going for 15-20 years, I'll keep driving it. I hope it lasts that long. I hope. I hate to spend money, and buying a car for me is a necessary evil. I really don't want to do it again for a long time. This was a big purchase for me.

Hey, I'm so glad you're liking your Prius C. I saw a white one on the road the other day, and I must say it's a very attractive car. I envy your gas mileage, that's for sure. I got 37.91mpg on my fill-up today, but would love to get what you're getting with your Prius C. As for the battery packs, hey, I could be wrong on that one. As long as I wouldn't have to replace the packs every so many years, or if I could do-it-myself and replace the packs, then I wouldn't hesitate in buying a hybrid.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by bentjazz

I like the appearance of the 2012 Yaris, myself. I really haven't seen the interior in person, but I like the aesthetics of the exterior, for sure. Be that as it may, I'll be driving my 2010 Yaris until it croaks.
I don't know how I feel about all these hybrids. The thing I really like about my Yaris is it's minimalist orientation, so I don't need luxury, nor do I want high end goodies. Basic transportation is all I need, combined with reliability and decent fuel economy. The Yaris is perfect for my needs. As such, I'd personally be very reticent about spending big bucks on a hybrid vehicle that will need battery replacement down the road. No thanks. But for those who do want hybrids and who do see their value, more power to you.....

My orientation re cars (and most other things -- houses, clothes, etc.) is minimalist like yours...but I do love gadgets...especially ones that INCREASE future value during use...and that 'driving for max MPG prompting' is enticing. I wish that feature and a hybrid engine and drivetrain could just magically appear in my current fairly spartan Yaris.