Torn between the 2!

[Yaris Revenge]

So I've been shopping for cars online for MONTHS now (holy CRAP, has it been a YEAR?!?!), and I think I've narrowed it down to 2 models.

Most of you guys will think I'm nuts, but right now I'm pitting the Yaris liftback against the '08 Smart Fortwo. Crazy, isn't it?

My two main concerns are price and fuel economy, followed closely by fun and comfort. When you start comparing the two, it's an odd lineup of advantages.

Yaris Advantages:
1.) More room (a whole back seat, plus cargo area)
2.) More power (always important for the fun factor)
3.) More dealers available for servicing

Fortwo Advantages
1.) Nicer interior
2.) Better MPG
3.) More standard options
4.) Quite possibly safer (jury's still out on crash tests for the new gen)
5.) better handling

Price will be very close, once you outfit the Yaris with comparable options. Both also have the "what-the-hell-is-that" factor that I love (the Smart more so, of course).

So yeah, that's gonna' be a tough decision come 2008. It'll really come down to the test drives. I've been in a Yaris liftback w/ automatic, and didn't much care for it. I'll have to find a manual to try out, then find the Smarts when they get here.


~YR

[Vervepipes]

If the rear room is an issue, isnt there supposed to be a Forfour? Maybe they arent building it anymore?

Wow, I just went to thier UK website and they have 4 models total, in Canada we only get the Fortwo at the moment...

[Dragonacc]

I would not buy the Fortwo if you have to drive on the highway. The Yaris with 107 hp is not really suited for high speed (~80+) driving. The 70 hp Fortwo will be terrible IMO.

Smart is owned by MB, don't count on great reliability from it. The Europeans just don't build reliable cars.

Also, theres no way the Fortwo will be safer than a Yaris. I know everyone always shows that video of the Fortwo slamming into the concrete barrier. But where were the safety dummies? So what if the car wasn't crushed up, what kind of forces would the people inside experience? America is full of SUVs.

Lastly, the Fortwo is over-priced. 12k for the base and 14k for the better equipped version (Don't forget early dealer mark-ups). It's half a car, it only has a 3 cylinder and it still costs more than a Yaris...? The the extra money you spend will take a long time make up the difference in price with gas savings vs the Yaris.

*Rant off*

[jamal1984]

anyone know how much is the Fortwo cost? around $11,000 dollars?

[Dragonacc]

Originally Posted by jamal1984

anyone know how much is the Fortwo cost? around $11,000 dollars?

I read 12k base, 14k upscale, 17k convertible.

base doesn't have a radio btw

[jamal1984]

Originally Posted by Dragonacc

I read 12k base, 14k upscale, 17k convertible.

base doesn't have a radio btw

Man, that is kindda expensive.

14k Upscale and 17k Convertible. what is the different in options? or it's just cost more because of the convertible? are they both ABS Standard?

[Dragonacc]

Originally Posted by jamal1984

Man, that is kindda expensive.

14k Upscale and 17k Convertible. what is the different in options? or it's just cost more because of the convertible? are they both ABS Standard?

I don't know the different features for each model. The only thing I read was that the upscale adds a radio and "other convenience features". The convertible comes with the upscale features.

I imagine the added features are power locks and windows, keyless entry, and hopefully some other stuff for the extra $2k.

[Nutzoids]

All of them have ABS Standard... The reason why the "Pure" is 12k without a radio... OR an AC!

Keep that in mind too... NO AC!

By the time you buy an AC, Radio, and whatever else you want, you might as well just drop the extra dough and get the "Passion" at least you'll get the Panorama roof!

[Yaris Revenge]

ABS is just the beginning. Pretty much any vehicle option you can assign 3 letters to, the Fortwo has it (aside from GPS). I'd have to look them all up... may take some time, but I'll try to find them all.

As far as the highway speed issue, you must drive A LOT faster than I ever do. In my 14 years of driving, I've hit 80 mph maybe 3 times. The Smart has an electronically limited top speed of 90, for those who buy one and are utterly insane. Agreed though, they'll probably be a bit twitch at high speeds because of the short wheel base and hard suspension.

On the safety bit, there's also a video of the Fortwo with dummy hitting a Mercedes E-class in a frontal offset test. The Smart came out in better shape. I've always thought that a lot of this "crumple zone" impact absorption stuff was really geared more towards increasing the repair business, new sales, and cheaper construction than safety, but that's just me and my conspiracy theories.

Sans radio wouldn't phase me one bit. Stock radios belong in the trash anyway.

Again, if it was THAT overpriced, I wouldn't be comparing them. The mid-level Passion model will be right on target with a Yaris with power options, give or take ~$800. The Fortwo is estimated to get a combined average of 40 mpg, so that means all the highway travel I do would make it considerably higher.

Oh, and pay no attention to the UK site. They're WAY overdue for an update. Smart has discontinued every model but the Fortwo, and the pics they have there are of the previous gen bodystyle.

~YR

[Nutzoids]

Originally Posted by Yaris Revenge

Smart has discontinued every model but the Fortwo

~YR

NO......

You have no idea how badly I wanted the Smart Roadster

Fucking ass monkeys!

[Yaris Revenge]

Amen, Nutz!

Okay, here we go with the safety gadgets:

Dual front and side airbags
ESP - electronic stability program
ABS - anti-lock brake system
EBD - electronic brake force distribution (for steering in emergencies)
CBC - cornering brake control
BAS - brake assist (applies full brake power when it detects emergency braking)

plus all the passive safety features like the tridion frame, crumple zones (albeit tiny ones!), break away engine, collapsible steering coloumn, etc.

And that's on EVERY model, even the base.

Oh, and the Passion come with paddle shifters on the wheel.

Nutz, you'll be pleased to know that Project Kimber has purchased everything related to the Smart Roadster, and plan to reintroduce it themselves, though probably with a bit of restyling. (http://www.projectkimber.com/)
~YR

[Dragonacc]

I used to drive 80 mph as my normal cruising speed on the highway, I don't anymore - small cars really don't like going that fast.

As far as mileage is concerned I get 40mpg with my Yaris with a 40/60 mix of highway/city.

Best thing to do would be to test drive both and then really evaluate what your needs are. Pick the one that fits your needs better. My personal opinion is that the Fortwo is over-hyped.

I guess you've considered the Fit, Versa, and Accent too huh?

[Yaris Revenge]

Yeah, I dig the Accent also (and my wife's Tuscon is great), but I kinda want better mileage. Not totally out of the running... I like the Accent interior much more than the Yaris.

The Fit is so ass-ugly I can't talk myself into even considering it (not to mention overpriced).

The Versa is a bit homely as well, and looks almost as big as the car I drive now.

~YR

[ChinoCharles]

The Fourtwo is not a car that belongs here. We have things like semi trucks... I don't know if they don't have semis in Europe, but I'll bet there aren't many idiots driving next to them in Fourtwos.

I feel scared enough on the freeway in my Yaris. The thought of someone hitting me and me losing the ass end makes me want to puke... lose the rear of a Yaris at 70 MPH and you'll be lucky to escape alive. Try it in a Fourtwo and... wow. I don't even know why they're bringing it here to be honest. Reminds me of the Segway... seems revolutionary at first sight, until you realize its totally impractical and WAY overpriced for what you can do with it.

Fourtwos are for people who already have real cars to drive and don't mind spending 15 grand on a novelty item, or people that live in sprawling urban metropolises that might want to turn a 45 minute walk into a 5 or 10 minute 25 MPH drive.

My advice... buy a real car.

[Yaris Revenge]

Originally Posted by ChinoCharles

The Fourtwo is not a car that belongs here. We have things like semi trucks... I don't know if they don't have semis in Europe, but I'll bet there aren't many idiots driving next to them in Fourtwos.

I feel scared enough on the freeway in my Yaris. The thought of someone hitting me and me losing the ass end makes me want to puke... lose the rear of a Yaris at 70 MPH and you'll be lucky to escape alive. Try it in a Fourtwo and... wow. I don't even know why they're bringing it here to be honest. Reminds me of the Segway... seems revolutionary at first sight, until you realize its totally impractical and WAY overpriced for what you can do with it.

Fourtwos are for people who already have real cars to drive and don't mind spending 15 grand on a novelty item, or people that live in sprawling urban metropolises that might want to turn a 45 minute walk into a 5 or 10 minute 25 MPH drive.

My advice... buy a real car.

Well, there's already a Hyundai Tuscon and a Chevy Z71 extended cab in the family, so I think I've got the "real car" category covered.

I'm just looking for a small commuter now to replace my aging Vibe (probably have 150k miles by '08), which really has twice the amount of space I ever need.

Concerning the "totally impractical and WAY overpriced for what you can do with it", I'm looking at the same price as a Yaris, and all I'm really losing is a back seat...? If I truly needed back seats, I wouldn't even be looking at a Yaris.

~SM

[ChinoCharles]

In that case the Smart might work for you, but realize you're spending a whole lot of money for the novelty aspect of the car... kind of like how Yaris owners who got their cars almost a year ago likely spent a small premium to get a car that was hard-to-find at the time. It sounds like you're well-off enough for this to not really matter.

Another factor to consider... are you still going to have the Smart in 10 years or is it something to tide you over for now, and if you don't plan on keeping it forever what is the resale going to be like on a car like that? I'd bet the Yaris or something comparable will hold its value much more than a Fourtwo.

You could always just bite the bullet and get a motorcycle.

[Yaris Revenge]

Ha, I failed to mention my '06 Buell Lightning, didn't I?
Motorcycle: check.

Yeah, I've been enamored with the Fortwo since it came out in 1998, so I don't see me getting bored with it down the road. If I went off the deep end and bought the convertible, it would probably be my last car (right up to the point it became a bug in that Mack's grille).

~YR

[Dragonacc]

How do you like the Buell? I keep wanting to go test ride a xb12r