2010 brake failure - unintended acceleration

[Flipper_1938]

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[Steveh27]

Thanks to all the posters. I did take it to the dealer & after a test drive he said it is the normal operation of the ABS on snow & ice. I've never had ABS before & it sure surprised me & scared me a bit. I didn't like it. It took more distance to stop than I would have without it, and it's noisy, and the brake pedal reaction is stiff. Felt like i had lost control of the car & it was in charge. Still unsure as to how much pressure to put on pedal when this happens. Sorry for the alarming OP title, but I was alarmed.

[Flipper_1938]

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[DebbyM46227]

Originally Posted by MaineYaris12

what all you need is a refresher course in driving

I have to agree with you. Sometimes the "problems" I read here about the Yaris kind of have me scratching my head in wonder, then I realize most Yaris drivers are rather young and maybe haven't had much experience in driving ANY car, much less a car with ABS and driving on snow & ice also.

I assumed anyone who has had a car since the mid-90's has driven one with ABS; my 1997 Cavalier I traded in on my Yaris also had ABS. I'm used to it - although I don't like ABS. I know when I drove my Cavalier the first time I put the brakes on in the rain the same time I hit a pothole the ABS kicked in and I thought WTF is that? - it was summer and I thought ABS would only kick in with winter driving.

I also think Toyota didn't have a true problem with the Camry's unintended acceleration. I think most of those Camry drivers & especially that one Prius driver was either ignorant or out to seek financial gain from Toyota.

Maybe you can blame the nanny Federal Government for putting ABS on cars? I'm not sure who mandated it, but I bet it was our Govt. Like I'm not smart enough to monitor tire pressure on my own and I have to put up with the stupid TPMS.

[markitect]

The roads here have been coated with ice for days. This is probably your first car with ABS, if you know how to drive properly you will feel like the ABS is a handicap in some situations. ABS has been proven to increase braking distance in low traction conditions.

[vector9mm]

If I remember, Consumer Reports bitched about the Yaris having optional ABS a few years back and it not being standard equipment. I thought at the time that it's better to have a choice. My 2008 came with ABS, but if there was a Yaris like mine without it for cheaper, I'd have bought it. ABS is one more thing to go wrong and get in the way in my book. I'm a minimalist.

[why?]

Originally Posted by vector9mm

If I remember, Consumer Reports bitched about the Yaris having optional ABS a few years back and it not being standard equipment. I thought at the time that it's better to have a choice. My 2008 came with ABS, but if there was a Yaris like mine without it for cheaper, I'd have bought it. ABS is one more thing to go wrong and get in the way in my book. I'm a minimalist.

that's a fact. I'll always hate abs. It might help in certain situations, but it can never possibly help as much as a well trained driver.

[Kal-El]

Originally Posted by Flipper_1938

That is exactly how my 2010 sedan acted in the snow a couple of days ago. I am liking my Yaris less and less. Toyota has gone to hell in a handbasket in my opinion. My 2001 Echo was a great car, much better than this POS.

What makes the Yaris a POS in your eyes? You've demonstrated in other posts that you understand what ABS does and yet you call it a POS because it's doing what it is designed to do. You're free to dislike ABS. I don't like it and clearly many others don't. It does seem to take longer to stop when sliding than if you had more control. It's not just the Yaris. ALL cars work the same way. They pulsate and scare you when you're in a slide.

Fact is, is that the Yaris is one of the top 5 most reliable cars on earth. Hardly a POS.

Originally Posted by Steveh27

Thanks to all the posters. I did take it to the dealer & after a test drive he said it is the normal operation of the ABS on snow & ice. I've never had ABS before & it sure surprised me & scared me a bit. I didn't like it. It took more distance to stop than I would have without it, and it's noisy, and the brake pedal reaction is stiff. Felt like i had lost control of the car & it was in charge. Still unsure as to how much pressure to put on pedal when this happens. Sorry for the alarming OP title, but I was alarmed.

Well, at least now you know how ABS works.

It is surprising that people are still just finding out about this. ABS has been on cars since the early 1970's. And commonplace since the '90's. The Yaris was probably the last car to make them standard and now everyone's complaining that it has them. Go figure.

[OTB]

from the discussion above, I would certainly claim cars have gotten WORSE in the past 10 years (ok, probably 30 years). The thing I love most about my '07 yaris is the things it doesn't have: (abs, tpms, power windows and mirrors, sunroof, traction control, etc.) Just more stupid $hit to deal with. Why the hell does a yaris come with traction control? Do mopeds come with traction control too nowadays?

I'm a huge car fan, and it breaks my heart to see what the manufacturers offer nowadays (most likely due to their majority market.)

What if....we were actually responsible for controlling our vehicle or inspecting our own vehicle for safe operation? No, instead, we'll just make a sensor for that, then the sensor will fail, then.....

[DebbyM46227]

Originally Posted by OTB

What if....we were actually responsible for controlling our vehicle or inspecting our own vehicle for safe operation? No, instead, we'll just make a sensor for that, then the sensor will fail, then.....

I agree with you, and I think for the most part we have the Federal Government to blame for most of it. They think we can't take care of things ourselves.

[Flipper_1938]

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[Zaphod]

Originally Posted by Flipper_1938

My 2000 Ford SuperDuty does have ABS. ...but it takes actually sliding the tires to activate ABS. I can deal with that.

On the truck, it feels like a safety feature, not a safety hazard.

That's funny, I used to have a 98 RAM 1500 and the ABS on that thing was downright scary. It felt like it waited to long and then it was almost too late and I just wanted it out of the way. But that could have just been a 1st impression, I wasn't used to driving that sled yet.

I guess it's what you're used to really, I always felt like a had a lot more control in the Wrangler without ABS than the truck with, but then 4WD compression braking can be impressive, especially 4 low on really bad ice. Every move is proactive because it has to be.

ABS on the Yaris is alright. It's happened twice and I cringe when I feel it because I know I made a mistake ... kind of like letting the clutch out too early and grinding a gear. I've stayed in it just to see and it actually does seem to stop just pretty quick. The 1st time I just let off and found the sweet spot outside of the ABS and the 2nd time I just mashed the pedal and rode it out just to see and it really seemed to stop just as fast.

By the way, is that flatbead in your avatar 49 Chevy?

[Flipper_1938]

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[Zaphod]

Originally Posted by Flipper_1938

It is a 48 (on a 1991 S-10 chassis).

At least I wasn't too far off

That's a nice looking truck, I've always liked the body style on those trucks, the simplicity and clean lines.

One of these days I'll push some pictures of my 94 sporty and 53 F250 up to the "garage".

[MUSKOKA800]

When unfamiliar with ABS the drivers first reaction to the buzzing pedal is to lift your foot. This of course results in no braking. Find a snow covered parking lot and become familiar with that ABS sensation in a controlled environment. Learn your car before the next stop light or worse, an emergency situation.

Good Luck!

[Zaphod]

With well practiced compression/engine braking up front and cable/emergency braking to the rear, not only can you bypass the ABS system, but you have complete control to manually balance the front to rear ratio yourself.

Something that I would definitely suggest practicing well before implementing in an emergency situation, but it's a tool to anyone with a manual transmission. I've always felt that everyone should be able to stop their cars smoothly from any speed with the cable and compression braking anyway.

The cable brake is after all your emergency brake, and if you can balance it with good engine braking at the front of the car consistently, you're far more prepared for an unfortunate master cylinder failure, brake line leak or whatever else could happen to your hydraulic braking system regardless of road conditions.

[xnamerxx]

Originally Posted by Flipper_1938

My 2000 Ford SuperDuty does have ABS. ...but it takes actually sliding the tires to activate ABS. I can deal with that.

On the truck, it feels like a safety feature, not a safety hazard. When ABS is activated, the Ford still feels like you have 80% braking capability. This Yaris, it feels like you lose 80% of the braking capability.

That statement to me screams you don't understand vehicle dynamic with weight.

Your 2000 superduty probably weighs somewhere in the nature of ~5000 lbs with wider tires 250+/55-16+ with much larger brakes because of the extra girth of the vehicle.
The yaris is a light car its weight is probably half or less then the total weight of the truck that you drive. My yaris doesn't have abs because I chose not to buy one with ABS. But being a light car the way it behaves when you stomp on the brake pedal is to lock up the brakes like any car would but as it doesn't have the weight forcing the wheels to keep moving the brakes will lock rather easily. With the brakes locking rather easily the ABS will do its job and keep that from happening but it feels like the car isn't slowing down when it is.

I have a Mustang that has many miles of track time on it and I can tell you the ABS is very easy to bypass if you know how to modulate the brakes correctly. It took owning several cars without ABS to learn how to do this correctly because with ABS its a very hard skill to learn.
I guess its just me but I liked owning cars with nothing to save me, Ive never learned more about my cars then when I started to lose control or lost complete control of them.

Sometimes its knowing where the edge is that will keep you from getting close to it.

[Flipper_1938]

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