Stick vs automatic

[cali yaris]

Rent or borrow a car for one day with a manual, learn how (preferably with a friend who can coach you) to drive it, and then decide if it's worth the trouble.

It IS an extra effort to drive a manual, but some people like the addition control over the vehicle, and they also like the more direct connection to the car and to the road while driving.

[xnamerxx]

I'm in the drive a stick club but if you don't like driving a stick you'll likely never like driving a stick. The only auto yaris I've ever driven was a hateful experience to say the least but that's only because I can't stand low powered cars with autos.

When I bought my car in 08 there was only 8 in the whole of southern California that were stick and all of them were base models.

[XFACOR]

I thinks it's going to boil down to personal choice. You gotta drive it, so you may as well love it. what ever it is you choose.

Here is the one thing, if you like mods and ever intend on doing a power adder. Like a turbo or S/C you will have better luck with a MT than you will a AT. There is just more stuff available.

Good luck either way.

[MadMax]

But there is also the other argument that an auto allows you to concentrate more on traffic.

There's debates for both types of transmissions, but in the end you gotta try both and decide which works best for you. I am able to maintain a good pace in traffic with my auto and while steep hills are a challenge, it's to be expected in such a small-engined car. I honestly don't see how a manual transmission would be an advantage on a steep hill, if anything much like stop-and-go traffic, the auto would be preferable.

By the way, in competition offroading, more people are going with automatic transmissions due to advances. Same is true in high performance cars, the new autos shift faster than a manual. Those same developments mean the differences in gas mileage is nominal if any. I think the Yaris is rated the same or just 1 MPG off between the two transmissions.

Inasmuch as some folks hate to see it, it probably won't be long before the manual transmission will go the way of the rotary phone, VCRs, etc. Technology has surpassed any advantage they once had...

Cheers! M2

[xnamerxx]

Originally Posted by MadMax

But there is also the other argument that an auto allows you to concentrate more on traffic.

There's debates for both types of transmissions, but in the end you gotta try both and decide which works best for you. I am able to maintain a good pace in traffic with my auto and while steep hills are a challenge, it's to be expected in such a small-engined car. I honestly don't see how a manual transmission would be an advantage on a steep hill, if anything much like stop-and-go traffic, the auto would be preferable.

By the way, in competition offroading, more people are going with automatic transmissions due to advances. Same is true in high performance cars, the new autos shift faster than a manual. Those same developments mean the differences in gas mileage is nominal if any. I think the Yaris is rated the same or just 1 MPG off between the two transmissions.

Inasmuch as some folks hate to see it, it probably won't be long before the manual transmission will go the way of the rotary phone, VCRs, etc. Technology has surpassed any advantage they once had...

Cheers! M2

Those actually aren't automatics, while they can be programmed to shift automatically there design and construction are nothing like a automatic transmission. Plus there are tons of downsides to using sequential/DSG/SCG ect transmissions like they are quite expensive to design and even more expensive to engineer to work correctly plus there is increased maintenance and they also have a limited group of people who know how to work on them due to their complexity.

It took VW over 2 years of recalls to get their DSG working correctly Ford is having issues with the DSG thats being issued in the fiesta, the Single Clutch design in the Lambo has trouble at low speeds Ferrari couldn't get the design working in their road cars for over 6 years the sequential design that Aston used was known for being made of glass. Most racers will use a dog box or a sequential since they get rebuilt every so often anyway and high end racers(factory teams) can use whatever they want since their budgets are much higher.

The main reasons sticks are going to go away is that most people don't know how to drive sticks or don't like driving sticks and they don't sell. No point in making a product that no one wants to buy.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by MadMax

But there is also the other argument that an auto allows you to concentrate more on traffic.

There's debates for both types of transmissions, but in the end you gotta try both and decide which works best for you. I am able to maintain a good pace in traffic with my auto and while steep hills are a challenge, it's to be expected in such a small-engined car. I honestly don't see how a manual transmission would be an advantage on a steep hill, if anything much like stop-and-go traffic, the auto would be preferable.

By the way, in competition offroading, more people are going with automatic transmissions due to advances. Same is true in high performance cars, the new autos shift faster than a manual. Those same developments mean the differences in gas mileage is nominal if any. I think the Yaris is rated the same or just 1 MPG off between the two transmissions.

Inasmuch as some folks hate to see it, it probably won't be long before the manual transmission will go the way of the rotary phone, VCRs, etc. Technology has surpassed any advantage they once had...

Cheers! M2

....Yes, an automatic ALLOWS FOR MORE concentration on the road, but it also ALLOWS FOR LESS concentration and, unfortunately (in the U.S. at least) LESS is usually the result.

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by nookandcrannycar

....Yes, an automatic ALLOWS FOR MORE concentration on the road, but it also ALLOWS FOR LESS concentration and, unfortunately (in the U.S. at least) LESS is usually the result.

Well, most people in Houston drive like idiots anyway, no matter what kind of transmission they got!

But your correlation makes no sense. It allows for both more and less?!?

Bad drivers in the US have nothing to do with the transmission people have in their cars...

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by MadMax

Well, most people in Houston drive like idiots anyway, no matter what kind of transmission they got!

But your correlation makes no sense. It allows for both more and less?!?

Bad drivers in the US have nothing to do with the transmission people have in their cars...

My correlation makes perfect sense. Having an automatic transmission (and especially leaving it in Drive) allows you to dismiss having to 'concentrate on/think about' shifting. What you do with that shift of focus is up to you. Some people might concentrate more on the road/driving/their relation to other cars on the road. On the other hand, other people might feel that it frees them up to text/talk on their cell phone/talk to the person in the passenger seat more intently/eat/drink/shave/put make-up on/read, etc.

If a college student lives with his or her parents and has a SAHM or SAHD with traditional SAH duties, then he or she CAN study more than a student away at college because he or she doesn't have to do laundry/plan and execute meals, etc, but that doesn't mean the student WILL study more (to illustrate my point I'm assuming both examples have the same access to group study).

When it comes to Houston drivers, until earlier this year I probably had my head buried a bit in the sand. People are amazingly courteous in parking lots and on two lane residential streets, but on the freeways, feeder roads, and parkways there are more selfish and dangerous drivers than I used to like to admit. I spent most of the month of April this year all over Florida. I've driven in all of the 'Lower 48' U.S. states and in D.C. (45 of them + D.C. in my Yaris and 30 or so of them before I had my Yaris) and South Florida has the worst drivers in the U.S. on many different levels (IMHO)...far worse than Southern California (and I lived in Southern California for 6 1/2 years). Since returning from that trip to Florida in April, I'm more aware of the bad drivers here in the Houston Metro. I'd love to be able to instantly morph into a LEO whenever I see one of these drivers just to be able to pull them over to see gender and age. I'd bet most of them are male and under age 25.

'Bad drivers in the U.S. have nothing to do with the transmission people have in their cars'....I'd say bad DRIVING has LITTLE to do with the transmission people have in their cars. IMHO if a driver can drive a manual transmission car well, they have the POTENTIAL to become a better driver than someone who can't master a manual...BUT that doesn't mean they WILL DEVELOP that potential skill.

I think bad driving occurs in the U.S. primarily for two reasons: 1. Intent (MANY PEOPLE JUST DON'T CARE ABOUT TRULY BEING GOOD DRIVERS) and 2. Required minimum skill level (it is TOO EASY to get a non commercial DL in the U.S).

[xnamerxx]

....Yes, an automatic ALLOWS FOR MORE concentration on the road, but it also ALLOWS FOR LESS concentration and, unfortunately (in the U.S. at least) LESS is usually the result.

Originally Posted by nookandcrannycar

My correlation makes perfect sense. Having an automatic transmission (and especially leaving it in Drive) allows you to dismiss having to 'concentrate on/think about' shifting. What you do with that shift of focus is up to you. Some people might concentrate more on the road/driving/their relation to other cars on the road. On the other hand, other people might feel that it frees them up to text/talk on their cell phone/talk to the person in the passenger seat more intently/eat/drink/shave/put make-up on/read, etc.

It doesn't really make sense when you look at it from a logical standpoint.

During the creation of the Interstates or as there known here freeways they went with a laser straight roads to increase efficiency but a side effect of straight roads are that drivers become bored driving roads that don't require concentration and it increases the likelyhood of drivers falling asleep which increases the accident and death rate.
An automatic transmission requires less concentration and skill which increases the likelihood of the driver becoming distracted which increases the likelihood of an accident.
There are many articles out there which correlate this so i'll let Google be your friend.

[caineroad]

This is not a sport car, hence i chose automatic. It's designed to zip around town and gets good fuel economy. I never regret ever so slightly with an auto.

However if I have a 370z or whatever sports car, I will pick manual.

[ljming99]

Originally Posted by caineroad

This is not a sport car, hence i chose automatic. It's designed to zip around town and gets good fuel economy. I never regret ever so slightly with an auto.

However if I have a 370z or whatever sports car, I will pick manual.

I'm sorry but i have to disagree with the good fuel economy part, i recently have a chance to talk to a owner of a automatic yaris (while i drive a manual).

Cruising rpm of the engine in the manual is much higher than the automatic (at 100km/h - automatic is revving around 2000+ ish where my manual at 5th gear is doing 3000rpm)

I do alot of start-stop traffic and i have better mileage compared to an automatic.

Even my previous ride, an Aveo 1.4 AT was getting worse mileage compared to a optra which was a 1.6 M or even a Aveo 1.4 M.

For smaller engines, i would prefer a manual...its even more zippy


side note - a Nissan 370z gearbox can Rev-match at gear changes so whether a manual or an automatic - not much difference =P

[WeeYari]

Originally Posted by ljming99

Cruising rpm of the engine in the manual is much higher than the automatic (at 100km/h - automatic is revving around 2000+ ish where my manual at 5th gear is doing 3000rpm)

I don't know what is going on in Singapore, but my A/T is spinning ~2800 rpm at 100 kph.

[jpmck03]

Originally Posted by WeeYari

I don't know what is going on in Singapore, but my A/T is spinning ~2800 rpm at 100 kph.

Same here in America with my M/T. ~2700-2800 rpm at about 100 kph (~62 mph). Sounds like the engine is running at about the same speed when highway cruising regardless of transmission type.

[Lux]

As others have said, performance is not a criterion for these cars.

The dealbreaker for me in choosing the manual gearbox was maintenance. Don't know about anybody else here, but I fix my own geartrain; servicing a manual transaxle versus an automatic transmission are two dramatically different affairs. For instance, I'd rather repair my first-gear trust washer and synchro instead of doing a valvebody gasket job. I've done both and it's an obvious preference.

All vehicles that I've owned were three-pedal, so it was a natural choice, especially when slushboxes have the stupidest shift logic conceivable, as well as their annoying ECU self-learning bollocks.

[Profotoiam]

if i hadnt bought my yaris for every day driving 2000 miles a week i woulda went with stick vroom vroom

auto stills got some power thought

[cali yaris]

OP never posted again....

It's still a good topic.

[RedRide]

......Inasmuch as some folks hate to see it, it probably won't be long before the manual transmission will go the way of the rotary phone, VCRs, etc. Technology has surpassed any advantage they once had...

They said the same thing about vinyl records but they refuse to die.

Personally, I don't see a death of manual any time soon. As long as there's a maket for something, there wiil be someone to sell it to you . Most manuals for the major manufacturers are trouble free and can live on for a long time with minor mods if neeeded.

Manuals add to the diving experience for many and it would be conterproductive to discontinue them unless most all maufactures did so in unison.
What I do see happening is that fewer models will be available with a manual saviing them for the sportier models.

BTW, when I got my Yaris , I ask what mnaual Yaris' they had on the lot. They said they had trouble locating one saying most wiil not drive a manual. I countered saying that I refuse to drive an automatic. They then found one on the lot in seconds!
I suspect that the manuals were scarce and in demand and they just wanted con me into buying an auto .
I then use their own words to lower the price aditionally reminding them that they said that about everyone wants an auto.

[mazilla]

Manual isn't going away, ever.