PETERPOOP's Turbo Build Thread. - Page 5 - Toyota Yaris Forums

PETERPOOP · 12-08-2010, 09:40 PM

Yup yup. Focus will now be put towards this Saturday's results.

PETERPOOP · 12-11-2010, 07:26 PM

Ok. Here we go...

WHP: 175.14 TQ: 175.38

Dyno sheet showing current whp/tq with turbo set up in green, and comparing it to old tune with the blitz s/c in blue:

So, this was done on 8lbs of boost. However, the 1zz fuel injectors were maxed out. I need bigger injectors. The tuner got the A/F to a little under 12 AFR. He wants it to be at 11.5 AFR. From that, he can richen up the AFR and maybe get a little more power from it. To sum it up, i'll be getting bigger fuel injectors. How big? Not sure yet, tuner is going to figure it out.

Also, the clutch slipped during the tuning session. Yes, I am still using the stock clutch. Yes, I will now be purchasing a new stage 2 clutch. Not sure which one yet. I might get it from the tuning shop, to give him business and in return, hopefully get a cheaper rate for the labor install. Yes, I will also be getting a LSD put in at the same time.

I will be getting rates from him on how much the clutch/lsd/labor will cost on monday (supposedly).

Probably won't have those installed and retuned until the end of the year, i'd think.

He only charged me $150 for the tuning and dyno usage today. I think he felt bad that I now need a new clutch and fuel injectors. lol. He's a super cool and nice guy though. Glad to be giving him business. :)

cali yaris · 12-11-2010, 07:55 PM

let me know if you want help with those parts, all in stock. Max power at 4700 rpm, haven't seen that before. nice torque!

Focus_Sh1ft · 12-11-2010, 08:45 PM

Nice numbers. You're lucky to have a nice tuner nearby.

What did you tune, just AFRs? You should see some nice additional numbers if you did timing since you're running meth.

Also, I'm kinda surprised by the injectors maxing. I've calced my 1NZs to be good for about 4500 RPMs at 8 psi of boost. It is what it is though

I'm in agreement with Garm as well. Max torque @ 4k-ish is just awesome. Zage chose a great turbo for our cars

PETERPOOP · 12-11-2010, 09:23 PM

Hey, you guys talking about the torque? If not, you might got it mixed up. Since the two dyno lines intersect each other, it's hard to tell which is which. The one that hits max power at 4500 rpm is the torque. It continues to dip down at 5500 RPM. The HP is the one that peaks at 5500 RPM.

The tuner did the timing also and IDK what else. Ya, he's a good guy. He tunes a lot of cars.

Yoda · 12-11-2010, 10:08 PM

You think you would be able to raise the boost to 10? I think the stock block should be able to handle it with a really good tune. Then again I haven't really researched our engine that much myself.

PETERPOOP · 12-11-2010, 10:45 PM

No clue, but I want a little longevity with my engine setup. I won't be doing that. Someone else can be the guinea pig.

Yoda · 12-11-2010, 10:52 PM

Lol you got me there

.When u get my tuning sorted out I will give it a test and see how long it last. Will be getting an additional block too and building that.

PETERPOOP · 12-11-2010, 10:58 PM

Well if you plan on doing a built motor in the future, you would be perfect for the test. ;)

I would think you could hit 200whp with 10lbs of boost. If not, it would be close, I think.

cali yaris · 12-12-2010, 12:06 AM

^ I think so too.

rob323 · 12-12-2010, 04:06 PM

The injectors could quite well be getting max'd out cause the fuel pressure system has no reference to manifold pressure in a stock (return-less) fuel system. If you can raise the fuel pressure as boost increases, it would give you substantial headroom in that side of things. The other problem is that the injectors may not be spraying optimally when having to fight against the boost pressure in the manifold.

Bluevitz-rs · 12-12-2010, 05:08 PM

I just thought of another problem you guys might be having with tunning... the stock fuel pump is a 2 speed unit. I forget exactly how it operates, but it goes something like, "low speed at idle and cruse" and "high speed under acceleration".

If someone has a repair manual, they should be able to confirm this. Because this could be causing the fuel pressure to jump around

cali yaris · 12-12-2010, 08:24 PM

Has anyone else had trouble with fuel pressure or the pump at low boost? Seems like everyone would, or no one would.

rob323 · 12-12-2010, 10:06 PM

But has anyone with a stock system monitored the fuel pressure while under boost? no point having 40 psi of fuel pressure at idle if the injectors are just dribbling fuel out when under boost even when at 100% duty cycle.

I don't know over there, but the one Aussie Yaris pump I have pulled out was about the same size as a D cell battery. The pump in the Echo is almost twice the size in comparison.

cali yaris · 12-13-2010, 10:09 AM

I had 100% stock fuel system at 8 psi. With larger injectors.

I still don't understand why only one person would experience the problem, nor did you explain that point, since you say injectors can't be his problem.

Your experience is helpful -- Just quoting a pressure number doesn't help me understand.

Quote:

Like Rob said before me, not one person here is monitoring fuel pressure.

I am now, but I don't think that's what you guys meant.

Focus_Sh1ft · 12-13-2010, 01:50 PM

I really think it's the fuel pump as well, but I can't offer any explanation as to why. Wouldn't all the blitz people experience similar problems?

The injectors maxing out just doesn't make sense though. 1ZZ should easily cover 8 psi of boost...

What's the life expectancy on a fuel pump? Maybe Peter's is on its last legs?

cali yaris · 12-13-2010, 02:50 PM

It's not that difficult to upgrade to a Walbro 255. Can you do that without a return line?

The stock fuel pump is the size of a "D" cell battery, LOL. I posted a pic somewhere of it!

rob323 · 12-13-2010, 04:20 PM

It's a catch 22, if you put even a small walbro in, you would overrun the capacity for the fpr and the return system and end up with a much higher base pressure, good for when on boost but crap for idling and cruising.

Someone with more smarts than me probably could come up with some sort of voltage controller which references to boost pressure and lowers the voltage to the pump at idle and cruise and just ramps it up when positive manifold pressure is detected (or maybe reference it to an air flow reading, anything over and above max NA airflow makes it send more voltage to the fuel pump. That sort of setup might get around to having to fabricate a proper return setup, and if you are going to go to that extent, then you may as well block off the factory return and put in a rising rate regulator and set it up properly.

Has anyone flowed their injectors at varying pressures to see at what pressure they start to atomise the fuel properly? This minimum pressure should be kept in mind when working out your fuel pressure requirements and the amount of boost that you are going to run.

12-11-2010, 07:55 PM	#75
cali yaris ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007 Location: Canoga Park, CA Posts: 14,857	let me know if you want help with those parts, all in stock. Max power at 4700 rpm, haven't seen that before. nice torque! __________________ Micro Image forums, online store and shop are now closed. It was a great eight year run, but it was time to focus on other things. I'm still selling parts on eBay under micro*image seller ID and customers can still make requests for anything specific.

12-11-2010, 08:45 PM	#76
Focus_Sh1ft Drives: 08 Yaris Turbo; 06 tC Turbo Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: New Jersey Posts: 875	Nice numbers. You're lucky to have a nice tuner nearby. What did you tune, just AFRs? You should see some nice additional numbers if you did timing since you're running meth. Also, I'm kinda surprised by the injectors maxing. I've calced my 1NZs to be good for about 4500 RPMs at 8 psi of boost. It is what it is though I'm in agreement with Garm as well. Max torque @ 4k-ish is just awesome. Zage chose a great turbo for our cars Last edited by Focus_Sh1ft; 12-11-2010 at 09:21 PM.

12-11-2010, 10:52 PM	#80
Yoda Drives: 2008 Black Sedan Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: FL Posts: 966	Lol you got me there.When u get my tuning sorted out I will give it a test and see how long it last. Will be getting an additional block too and building that.

12-12-2010, 12:06 AM	#82
cali yaris ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007 Location: Canoga Park, CA Posts: 14,857	^ I think so too. __________________ Micro Image forums, online store and shop are now closed. It was a great eight year run, but it was time to focus on other things. I'm still selling parts on eBay under micro*image seller ID and customers can still make requests for anything specific.

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12-08-2010, 09:40 PM	#73
PETERPOOP View User's Garage Drives: 08 white liftback Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oahu Posts: 3,674	Yup yup. Focus will now be put towards this Saturday's results.

12-11-2010, 07:26 PM	#74
PETERPOOP View User's Garage Drives: 08 white liftback Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oahu Posts: 3,674	Ok. Here we go... WHP: 175.14 TQ: 175.38 Dyno sheet showing current whp/tq with turbo set up in green, and comparing it to old tune with the blitz s/c in blue: So, this was done on 8lbs of boost. However, the 1zz fuel injectors were maxed out. I need bigger injectors. The tuner got the A/F to a little under 12 AFR. He wants it to be at 11.5 AFR. From that, he can richen up the AFR and maybe get a little more power from it. To sum it up, i'll be getting bigger fuel injectors. How big? Not sure yet, tuner is going to figure it out. Also, the clutch slipped during the tuning session. Yes, I am still using the stock clutch. Yes, I will now be purchasing a new stage 2 clutch. Not sure which one yet. I might get it from the tuning shop, to give him business and in return, hopefully get a cheaper rate for the labor install. Yes, I will also be getting a LSD put in at the same time. I will be getting rates from him on how much the clutch/lsd/labor will cost on monday (supposedly). Probably won't have those installed and retuned until the end of the year, i'd think. He only charged me $150 for the tuning and dyno usage today. I think he felt bad that I now need a new clutch and fuel injectors. lol. He's a super cool and nice guy though. Glad to be giving him business. :)

12-11-2010, 09:23 PM	#77
PETERPOOP View User's Garage Drives: 08 white liftback Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oahu Posts: 3,674	Hey, you guys talking about the torque? If not, you might got it mixed up. Since the two dyno lines intersect each other, it's hard to tell which is which. The one that hits max power at 4500 rpm is the torque. It continues to dip down at 5500 RPM. The HP is the one that peaks at 5500 RPM. The tuner did the timing also and IDK what else. Ya, he's a good guy. He tunes a lot of cars.

12-11-2010, 10:08 PM	#78
Yoda Drives: 2008 Black Sedan Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: FL Posts: 966	You think you would be able to raise the boost to 10? I think the stock block should be able to handle it with a really good tune. Then again I haven't really researched our engine that much myself.

12-11-2010, 10:45 PM	#79
PETERPOOP View User's Garage Drives: 08 white liftback Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oahu Posts: 3,674	No clue, but I want a little longevity with my engine setup. I won't be doing that. Someone else can be the guinea pig.

12-11-2010, 10:58 PM	#81
PETERPOOP View User's Garage Drives: 08 white liftback Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oahu Posts: 3,674	Well if you plan on doing a built motor in the future, you would be perfect for the test. ;) I would think you could hit 200whp with 10lbs of boost. If not, it would be close, I think.

12-12-2010, 04:06 PM	#83
rob323 Don't drive it, RALLY it! Drives: 1999 echo PRC rally car Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Joyner, Brisbane Posts: 321	The injectors could quite well be getting max'd out cause the fuel pressure system has no reference to manifold pressure in a stock (return-less) fuel system. If you can raise the fuel pressure as boost increases, it would give you substantial headroom in that side of things. The other problem is that the injectors may not be spraying optimally when having to fight against the boost pressure in the manifold.

12-12-2010, 05:08 PM	#84
Bluevitz-rs 1NZ-6spd View User's Garage Drives: '05 6-Spd Vitz RS Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Oshawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,967	I just thought of another problem you guys might be having with tunning... the stock fuel pump is a 2 speed unit. I forget exactly how it operates, but it goes something like, "low speed at idle and cruse" and "high speed under acceleration". If someone has a repair manual, they should be able to confirm this. Because this could be causing the fuel pressure to jump around

12-12-2010, 08:24 PM	#85
cali yaris ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007 Location: Canoga Park, CA Posts: 14,857	Has anyone else had trouble with fuel pressure or the pump at low boost? Seems like everyone would, or no one would.

12-12-2010, 10:06 PM	#86
rob323 Don't drive it, RALLY it! Drives: 1999 echo PRC rally car Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Joyner, Brisbane Posts: 321	But has anyone with a stock system monitored the fuel pressure while under boost? no point having 40 psi of fuel pressure at idle if the injectors are just dribbling fuel out when under boost even when at 100% duty cycle. I don't know over there, but the one Aussie Yaris pump I have pulled out was about the same size as a D cell battery. The pump in the Echo is almost twice the size in comparison.

12-13-2010, 01:50 PM	#88
Focus_Sh1ft Drives: 08 Yaris Turbo; 06 tC Turbo Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: New Jersey Posts: 875	I really think it's the fuel pump as well, but I can't offer any explanation as to why. Wouldn't all the blitz people experience similar problems? The injectors maxing out just doesn't make sense though. 1ZZ should easily cover 8 psi of boost... What's the life expectancy on a fuel pump? Maybe Peter's is on its last legs?

12-13-2010, 02:50 PM	#89
cali yaris ULTIMATE View User's Garage Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007 Location: Canoga Park, CA Posts: 14,857	It's not that difficult to upgrade to a Walbro 255. Can you do that without a return line? The stock fuel pump is the size of a "D" cell battery, LOL. I posted a pic somewhere of it!

12-13-2010, 04:20 PM	#90
rob323 Don't drive it, RALLY it! Drives: 1999 echo PRC rally car Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Joyner, Brisbane Posts: 321	It's a catch 22, if you put even a small walbro in, you would overrun the capacity for the fpr and the return system and end up with a much higher base pressure, good for when on boost but crap for idling and cruising. Someone with more smarts than me probably could come up with some sort of voltage controller which references to boost pressure and lowers the voltage to the pump at idle and cruise and just ramps it up when positive manifold pressure is detected (or maybe reference it to an air flow reading, anything over and above max NA airflow makes it send more voltage to the fuel pump. That sort of setup might get around to having to fabricate a proper return setup, and if you are going to go to that extent, then you may as well block off the factory return and put in a rising rate regulator and set it up properly. Has anyone flowed their injectors at varying pressures to see at what pressure they start to atomise the fuel properly? This minimum pressure should be kept in mind when working out your fuel pressure requirements and the amount of boost that you are going to run.