Toyota Yaris Forums - Ultimate Yaris Enthusiast Site
 

 


 
Go Back   Toyota Yaris Forums - Ultimate Yaris Enthusiast Site > Technical Forums > DIY / Maintenance / Service
  The Tire Rack

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-06-2020, 09:55 AM   #1
vasonline
 
Drives: Yaris 1.3 '08
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Belgium
Posts: 14
Checked valve clearance...got nasty suprise?!

Hi,

I have the 2008 Toyota Yaris, with the 1.3 2SZ-FE engine.
The first 5 years, maintenance was done at the dealer.
The last 5 years I did my maintance myself (oil change, filter, ...)
At 8000km / intervals (yearly)
Using the Toyota 5W30 oil.

Now at 90.000km a check of the valve clearance is recommended.

I pulled the valve cover, and measured the valve clearances.
Both in- and exhaust camshaft clearances where in specification.

But I got worried!
That intake camshaft lobes don't look very good to me!?
Actually the more I look to it, it looks awfull.

The exhaust camshaft looks fine.

When going over with my my fingernail, I can easily feel the 'pits' that are in there.

I have the valve cover still open.

Some toughts:
New intake cam and shims?
Just keep driving it this way?
Manufacturing defect? Oil problem? (hm? I always checked the dipstick regularly, and had no oil burning or a low oil level)


What should I do? / What would you do if it's was your car?

Attached are some pictures

Greetings!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN6684 (Middel).JPG (226.8 KB, 202 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6692 (Middel).JPG (227.1 KB, 199 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6693 (Middel).JPG (203.7 KB, 198 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6694 (Middel).JPG (191.0 KB, 198 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6695 (Middel).JPG (207.0 KB, 199 views)
vasonline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2020, 07:45 AM   #2
06YarisRS
 
Drives: 06 2ZR Turbo Yaris RS
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Beaver Harbour, New Brunswick, Canada
Posts: 2,347
That is interesting. It looks like corrosion, but that seems unlikely. You asked what a person would do if it were their car. I would probably have a machine shop look at it and see it they could determine the cause and/or profile the lobes with the cam in the car. Not sure if that's possible or not. I'd actually be wanting to see the bucket surfaces after being subjected to that roughness. So, I guess, again, if it were my car, I'd be pulling the cams. Not a nice job as the timing cover would have to come off. Also, the metal looks darkened by friction heat around the corroded area. I think the metal underneath the immediate surface is softer, so wear would probably accelerated in that condition. Did the engine every have any valve work/valve springs installed? Did the car ever lose oil pressure? My uneducated, gut feeling is either and incident of improper oiling or a casting defect in the cam. I can't see the car running well for an extended period of time. Again, if it were my car, I would have someone qualified inspect it. I suspect you're looking at a new cam and buckets, minimally.
__________________


2006 Yaris 5 Door RS 2ZR-FE (2011 Corolla 1.8L) Swapped, Automatic, T-28 Turbocharged (8 psi), HSD MonoPro Coilovers, DIY W/M Injection, custom 3" cold air intake, custom 2.5" exhaust, TRD rear sway bar, Penguin Garage 13mm spacers (rear), custom Civic front lip, full repaint, Android 6.0 7" touchscreen, Rockford Fosgate speakers, tweeters, NVX underseat subwoofer
https://www.instagram.com/2zr_turbo_yarisrs/

Last edited by 06YarisRS; 08-12-2020 at 08:21 AM.
06YarisRS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2020, 11:27 AM   #3
tmontague
 
tmontague's Avatar
 
Drives: '08 2zr swapped Vios M/T
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Caledonia Ont.
Posts: 2,887
That is strange, I agree with Adam that is appears to he corrosion and not wear from lack of lubrication. That is strange however.

I'd leave it as is and drive it until/if it creates problems. The 1nz is very venerable and chances are it doesn't care about the pitting.

Just run a good quality oil changed regularily from here on out
__________________
No one ever wants to give a Yaris the point by...
tmontague is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2020, 11:56 AM   #4
06YarisRS
 
Drives: 06 2ZR Turbo Yaris RS
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Beaver Harbour, New Brunswick, Canada
Posts: 2,347
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmontague View Post
That is strange, I agree with Adam that is appears to he corrosion and not wear from lack of lubrication. That is strange however.

I'd leave it as is and drive it until/if it creates problems. The 1nz is very venerable and chances are it doesn't care about the pitting.

Just run a good quality oil changed regularily from here on out
The valve train might live a long life in that condition and who knows how long it's been like that. I read some info on spalling and galling of camshafts. EDIT: having trouble with a link. Will post when I sort it out.
__________________


2006 Yaris 5 Door RS 2ZR-FE (2011 Corolla 1.8L) Swapped, Automatic, T-28 Turbocharged (8 psi), HSD MonoPro Coilovers, DIY W/M Injection, custom 3" cold air intake, custom 2.5" exhaust, TRD rear sway bar, Penguin Garage 13mm spacers (rear), custom Civic front lip, full repaint, Android 6.0 7" touchscreen, Rockford Fosgate speakers, tweeters, NVX underseat subwoofer
https://www.instagram.com/2zr_turbo_yarisrs/
06YarisRS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2020, 12:32 AM   #5
komichal
 
Drives: Yaris 2007 1.3 2SZFE 64kW
Join Date: May 2012
Location: CZ
Posts: 214
I have the same engine in my 07 Yaris. Now I am quite curious how my intake camshaft lobes look. (175.000km)
It might be good for comparison.

I can do the important maintenance myself (I have changed oil, plugs, oxygen sensors, throttle body cleaning, brake rotors, shocks... that kind of stuff) but I have never tried to dig deeper inside any engine.
Is it difficult to get to the camshafts in this engine? Or is it just a matter of removing the airbox, unscrewing a few bolts and you are there? No danger of damaging something that would render the car immobile?

If I can get there I would take a picture for reference.
komichal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2020, 10:23 AM   #6
tmontague
 
tmontague's Avatar
 
Drives: '08 2zr swapped Vios M/T
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Caledonia Ont.
Posts: 2,887
Quote:
Originally Posted by komichal View Post
I have the same engine in my 07 Yaris. Now I am quite curious how my intake camshaft lobes look. (175.000km)
It might be good for comparison.

I can do the important maintenance myself (I have changed oil, plugs, oxygen sensors, throttle body cleaning, brake rotors, shocks... that kind of stuff) but I have never tried to dig deeper inside any engine.
Is it difficult to get to the camshafts in this engine? Or is it just a matter of removing the airbox, unscrewing a few bolts and you are there? No danger of damaging something that would render the car immobile?

If I can get there I would take a picture for reference.
Just google any inline 4 valve cover removal and it will give you a good idea what is involved. It's nothing too crazy but more tuen your typical easy DIY job.

I have seen a handful of 1jz and other japanese 4 bangers with the sake bucket and shim set up and I have never seen this issue before. This makes this all the more strange as it is putting and not typical score marks from valve train wear
__________________
No one ever wants to give a Yaris the point by...
tmontague is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2020, 03:03 PM   #7
remcafee
 
Drives: 2007 Toyota Yaris 3 door
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Arizona
Posts: 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by vasonline View Post
Hi,

I have the 2008 Toyota Yaris, with the 1.3 2SZ-FE engine.
The first 5 years, maintenance was done at the dealer.
The last 5 years I did my maintance myself (oil change, filter, ...)
At 8000km / intervals (yearly)
Using the Toyota 5W30 oil.

Now at 90.000km a check of the valve clearance is recommended.

I pulled the valve cover, and measured the valve clearances.
Both in- and exhaust camshaft clearances where in specification.

But I got worried!
That intake camshaft lobes don't look very good to me!?
Actually the more I look to it, it looks awfull.

The exhaust camshaft looks fine.

When going over with my my fingernail, I can easily feel the 'pits' that are in there.

I have the valve cover still open.

Some toughts:
New intake cam and shims?
Just keep driving it this way?
Manufacturing defect? Oil problem? (hm? I always checked the dipstick regularly, and had no oil burning or a low oil level)


What should I do? / What would you do if it's was your car?

Attached are some pictures

Greetings!
well, it looks like the cams started to flat spot a little bit, this can happen by having extended idling, lower oil preasure during idling will over a long period of time start to flat spot the cam lobes, a good example of this are police cars and ambulances that have engines running all day long, its quite common, another reason this can happen is from dirty oil itself, but for the most part you should be ok unless it runs poorly then you might need to get either a used recycle engine, or hace the cylinder head rebuilt, but you also gotta question the condition of the block so best idea is to replace whole engine, but like i said if it runs ok and doesnt have any issues just dont worry about it
remcafee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2020, 04:22 PM   #8
vasonline
 
Drives: Yaris 1.3 '08
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Belgium
Posts: 14
Hi!

Thanks you all for the replies!

I did the following.

- I pulled the camshaft from the car, using the procedure in the service manual. (never done before, but it went well)
- I ordered a second hand camshaft in good condition from a local junk yard.

- Temporarly installed the new cam.
- Measured the 'new' clearances.
- Some values were off (out of spec)
- Have bought a micrometer to measure the shims. (never waste the opportunity to buy a good tool?)
- I Calculated the new shims 'Number' using the table in the service manual

So, my next step is: order the rest of the new shims.
I'm not shure If old sim + 2nd hand cam is a good combination.
Might replace them all?

The bearings of the intake camshaft are quite Ok.

Some pictures attached of my progress!
- Picture of the old shims. Most had some wear (measured thickness with micrometer)
- Last picture shows the new second hand camshaft I bought

@komichal:
Just checking is not too difficult:

It goes like this: (still fresh in my head)

Disconnect battery power.
Disconnect mass airflow sensor (left of airbox).
Disconnect throttle connector (right of airbox).
Unbolt and remove airbox.
Remove the ignition coils (leave the spark plugs in).
Unbolt valve cover. (don't forget to remove the two clamps that hold the wiring harness to the valve cover - you can leave the wiring harness alone).
Don't forget to unbolt the two bolts in the middle of the valve cover (I put a piece of carton the standoffs, I do not want to puncture my eyes in them)

Note: They do want you to add two dabs of silicon sealant where the chain cover (left side) attaches on the main valve block.

@yarisRS06
Good question.
It was not serviced at the valves before. From just running the engine/driving the car, you could not tell.
It behaved like: good fuel economy, no oil consuption, no strange noises to me.

@remcafee
Good idea's
8000 km/year is not much.Also quite a bit of short trips. Might explain the lubrication of the valve lobes is not ideal on a cold start?
(they are the last part it would seem that the oil reaches)
That combined with some city driving, lower rpm's?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN6697 (Large).jpg (215.6 KB, 135 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6698 (Large).jpg (237.4 KB, 133 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6700 (Large).jpg (174.6 KB, 133 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6702 (Large).jpg (165.2 KB, 132 views)

Last edited by vasonline; 08-13-2020 at 05:05 PM.
vasonline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2020, 07:48 PM   #9
NYC-SE
 
NYC-SE's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 Yaris SE
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,022
After seeing more of the engine, and it appearing in good shape, I'm leaning towards a manufacturing defect during production of that camshaft. If the problem was low oil pressure it would show elsewhere. Ditto all other possible causes. The only other possibility is if the oil passage leading to that particular camshaft was clogged. Again unlikely as engine looks clean.

You made the right move in replacing it.
NYC-SE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2020, 12:16 AM   #10
komichal
 
Drives: Yaris 2007 1.3 2SZFE 64kW
Join Date: May 2012
Location: CZ
Posts: 214
@vasoline @tmontague
Thank you guys for your comments. I watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBJXmBJHlZc , it seems quite clear. Not sure if I will go for it though, as I can see on the video there is some extra red sealant/gunk added oll over the lid edges; is it a must-do or is there some sort of reusable factory gasket there?
komichal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2020, 04:05 PM   #11
vasonline
 
Drives: Yaris 1.3 '08
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Belgium
Posts: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by komichal View Post
@vasoline @tmontague
Thank you guys for your comments. I watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBJXmBJHlZc , it seems quite clear. Not sure if I will go for it though, as I can see on the video there is some extra red sealant/gunk added oll over the lid edges; is it a must-do or is there some sort of reusable factory gasket there?
Hi,

There is no red sealant on mine (2SZ-FE) engine. It is indeed a rubber gasket.
No mention of a replacement in the manual. If my repair goes well I'll re-use that gasket.

The new sims are ordered. Hopefully the arrive next week.
Attached is the shim replacement table for the intake cam of the 2SZ-FE engine.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Shim intake.JPG (126.9 KB, 119 views)
vasonline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2020, 04:05 PM   #12
vasonline
 
Drives: Yaris 1.3 '08
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Belgium
Posts: 14
Update

Hi!

Here is my update as of 19/8/2020:

- The new shims have arrived. (calculated beforehand)
- I installed camshaft with new shims (added some oil to the new parts)
- Measured valve clearance, with all the new parts = Ok in specification.

- Returned camshaft to correct timing mark.

- Returned crankshaft to cut-out mark. (needs to at 90 degrees past cut-out mark if you want to rotate the cam(s) without the chain installed. This is for non-interference with the pistons)

- Installed the chain, aligned the timing marks on the camshafts with
the crankshaft.
- Camshaft timing mark correct position is: center, when crankshaft posistion @ cut out.

I have rotated the crankshaft a few times, and the timing marks keeps
aliging nicely with the camshaft's cut-out marks.

What do you think?
Anything forgotten?
Ready to go?

Tormorrow I will try to finish the job (installing valva cover, air filter)

Also Is it O.k. if I post these snippets from the service manual?
If not allowed, I'll remove them


ps: will re-install spark plugs, this was to remove the compression and make rotating the crankshaft easy.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN6703 (Large).jpg (189.9 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6704 (Large).jpg (187.4 KB, 97 views)
File Type: jpg Crankshaft align.JPG (37.0 KB, 98 views)
vasonline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2020, 03:58 PM   #13
vasonline
 
Drives: Yaris 1.3 '08
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Belgium
Posts: 14
Update 3

Today, I assembled everything.

I can report that the car is fixed.

She started right up.
No strange noises.
Went out for a 20 minutes drive, and everything went OK.

Maybe I should also change the oil after driving a bit?
I am not sure how you 'break in' a second hand camshaft, with new valve shims.

Greetings & thanks!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN6709 (Large).jpg (159.9 KB, 83 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN6713 (Large).jpg (188.2 KB, 82 views)
File Type: jpg cylinder head.JPG (83.4 KB, 83 views)
vasonline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2020, 04:17 PM   #14
komichal
 
Drives: Yaris 2007 1.3 2SZFE 64kW
Join Date: May 2012
Location: CZ
Posts: 214
Thank you for all the screens! Maybe one day I will find the courage to get that lid away and check everything myself... :)
komichal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2021, 07:50 AM   #15
Rich_UK
 
Drives: Yaris mk1 & Yaris mk2
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 12
Thanks for all that info greatly appreciated, and good job!

I have a 08 Yaris 130k miles, engine sounds rattly "tappy" compared to my rav which is very quite, if they were adjustable id dive it but removing the the cams and being off the road several days etc maybe its more trouble than just leaving it noisy i'm sure it will continue to run OK :\

Maybe oneday!! Then ill have peace and quite!
Rich_UK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2021, 08:22 AM   #16
tmontague
 
tmontague's Avatar
 
Drives: '08 2zr swapped Vios M/T
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Caledonia Ont.
Posts: 2,887
Well done!

I think those cams had a manufacturing defect - hence why only one of your cams were damaged.

Likely an issues with the case hardening outer layer on the cams.

As a side, I am pretty sure you can pull the cams without removing the timing cover, you just need to remove the tensioner and all the cam caps. Then you can manipulate your camshaft and cam gear assembly out from under the chain.

At least I was able to do this in my 2zr last week when I installed my MWT stage 1 cams.
__________________
No one ever wants to give a Yaris the point by...
tmontague is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2021, 05:18 PM   #17
Rich_UK
 
Drives: Yaris mk1 & Yaris mk2
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 12
NOTE: In the Haynes workshop manual I have for the mk1 it does actually say this is all part of the inspection when checking the clearances "look out for pitting, scoring, overheating, galling, flaking away of harden surface and ovality of each lobe of the cams" and if sufficiently poor then replace the cam
Rich_UK is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
VVT-i Oil Control Valve 06YarisRS DIY / Maintenance / Service 13 12-21-2017 10:00 PM
valve clearance specs tmontague DIY / Maintenance / Service 8 03-21-2015 08:02 AM
NEED ENGINE CHECK LIGHT CODE LIST Attitude Forced Induction Forum 12 04-11-2011 06:38 PM
Valve clearance britishbikes DIY / Maintenance / Service 0 07-18-2010 09:46 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:58 AM.




YarisWorld
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.