Blitz Fuel/Timing Issue - Toyota Yaris Forums

KTS · 05-27-2015, 07:51 PM

Hello YarisWorld
I recently installed a Blitz Supercharger in my 2007 JDM Vitz RS and I am using an AEM EMS-4 for fuel control. I am allowing the stock ecu to control all other functions like timing, throttle, ac etc. I got the Blitz fuel controller but not the activation switch hence I decide to use the AEM EMS-4 management for fuel and activation.

Mods:
2azfe (330cc) injectors, 92ron fuel
Fidanza Flywheel, ACT sprung copper disc, TRD Pressure plate
AEM Wideband Gauge
AEM Coolant Sensor
AEM Map Sensor
AEM Water/Methanol Kit 50/50 mix set to activate at 0.5psi.

The Issue
While driving if I allow boost to build the afr reads 2 psi = mid 12's, 5 psi = low 12's and hits hits 10-11's at 7psi (btw two different boost gauges and the map sensor is seeing 9 psi at wot

) However if I am partial throttle (vacuum) then press to activate d s/c although the afr is still 10-11's I can hear a lot of detonation/ping during the transition into boost (vacuum to 5-7psi). The knock sensor reading in AEM confirms the detonation/ping.

The car sometime throws the code P0172: System Too Rick Bank 1.
Could this be the cause of the ecu not adjusting timing sufficiently?
Also the egr valve next to the s/c manifold was blanked off.

What advice can you guys advise/suggest/comment.
Thanks in advance

KTS · 05-27-2015, 08:17 PM

I am getting some security token error so I cannot upload pics. sorry guys.

CrankyOldMan · 05-27-2015, 08:26 PM

Do you mean the knob for setting the engagement point, or the box with the electronics for controlling the clutch? The switch is just a voltage divider--I posted a schematic of it a year or two ago.

The injectors may be too big, causing the rich condition, but that should negate detonation. Very strange.

CrankyOldMan · 05-27-2015, 08:44 PM

Perhaps not having the switch module is preventing the blitz from forcing the stock ecu from going into open loop during acceleration?

KTS · 05-27-2015, 10:44 PM

I have only the fuel controller with the 8/9 wires. I do not have the selector engagement switch nor the clutch relay box hence my decision to use the AEM EMS-4 for fuel and s/c activation.

I do get some hesitation when manifold pressure reaches 0 psig.

Is there some way for me to force the ecu into open loop to test?

Also I will confirm but when the car is cold I don't have this issue. It's only when the coolant temp approaches 80's then this problem occurs.

Thanks cranky.

KTS · 05-27-2015, 10:53 PM

Like disconnecting the OEM o2 sensor?

mario98c · 05-28-2015, 01:59 AM

^^Yes, if you disconnect the afr sensor(first O2 sensor) the ecu will go into open loop.

KTS · 05-28-2015, 05:57 AM

Is this a wise approach by disconnecting the afr sensor to trouble shoot the issue?

KTS · 05-29-2015, 06:21 AM

I disconnected the oem afr sensor. The car felt a lil lazy while driving but didn't hear any detonation during the transition into boost. On checking the AEM EMS-4 it showed some knock but not as much as before. I'll continue to monitor. I do a compression test and post the results.

CrankyOldMan · 05-29-2015, 08:43 AM

That makes sense then--one function of the blitz switch module is to force the ecu into open loop, which makes the injectors run rich. I'm not sure how you could make the ems do the same, since I don't know how you trigger the clutch on the blitz...

KTS · 05-30-2015, 06:20 AM

The AEM EMS-4 has 8 input/output triggers called GPIO's. I am using a GPIO set at 25% throttle (I have also been testing the activation at 2000rpm) to activate a relay to engage/disengage the s/c clutch.
The blitz switch module is the on/off/25/50/75 throttle switch?
Is there a specific wire on the ecu that needs a 12V or ground to put the ecu in open loop? If it is like this I can the properly use a GPIO to trigger open loop condition. Can you identify the wire?

CrankyOldMan · 05-30-2015, 11:36 AM

I'm looking at the Blitz wiring diagrams, but it's not very clear what each wire does. I would assume that CTScott has this info, but I'm going to try to sort it out myself since I may go this route in the future.

CTScott · 05-30-2015, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrankyOldMan

That makes sense then--one function of the blitz switch module is to force the ecu into open loop, which makes the injectors run rich. I'm not sure how you could make the ems do the same, since I don't know how you trigger the clutch on the blitz...

The blitz fuel controller is just a very primitive fuel adjusting device. It simply looks at the MAF signal for the amount of air flowing in and holds the injectors open longer in proportion (and with targeting a lower AFR when the clutch is engaged). It by no means has control of open or closed loop. That is a very controlled process that the ECM does itself and to override it you have to basically put the system in a fault condition (which the Blitz does not do).

This is also why over time you start running leaner with just the Blitz fuel controller. In its closed loop mode the ECM sees that the AFR is lower than it wants it to be and it constantly fights the Blitz controller with trying to trim off the extra fuel. Resetting the short term fuel trims regularly (by pulling the battery cable for a couple of minutes) will help a bit and doing a full reset of the long term trims (by doing a full reset of the ECM with TechStream) will help even more.

KTS · 05-31-2015, 12:28 AM

Thanks CTScott and Cranky. I wouldn't be driving the car for a few days. I will wire the coils into the AEM EMS-4 and have an attempt at tuning fuel and ignition. Of this doesn't work ill use the blitz fuel controller and use an autometer rpm activation switch and the 1zz injectors.

Thanks again guys.

KTS · 07-12-2015, 08:06 PM

Update:

Wired up the coils to the aem ems-4 so now I have fuel and ignition control. I also installed reinstalled 1zz throttle body as the car was idling at 1500rpm with the 1nzfe throttle body. I adjusted the 1zz throttle body idle screw and got the and the car is idling at 700rpm.

Issue:

There is excessive noise in in the cam and crank signal going to the aem ems-4. Trouble shooting at the moment using resistors to attempt to filter out the noise.

CrankyOldMan · 07-12-2015, 08:08 PM

Do you have access to a scope that can do frequency analysis? If you know the specific frequencies or range, I could probably help you design a filter.

Sent from my XT1031 using Tapatalk

KTS · 07-12-2015, 08:21 PM

No easy access to an oscilloscope but I can arrange to use one from a school lab. I ill pm you if I get access to it, thank you. The other day we were able to achieve the filtering: reverse the polarity of the cam sensor wires and use a 1k ohm resistor across the cam sensor wires. I reproduced this this weekend but haven't tested it yet as there was too much rain. I will be able to test this later in the week when I return home.

KTS · 07-25-2015, 09:54 PM

We are not having success using the AEM EMS-4 Standalone ECU therefore how will I go about using the 8 wire blitz fuel controller without the activation switch and relay?

This is what I have gathered so far....
1Pink: C20-81 (IGF)
2Red: [4] A21-28 (ign switch)
3Yellow: [5] C20-107 (inj#2)
4Orange: [6] C20-108 (inj#1)
5Green: [9] activation box
6Black: [10] C20-44 (battery -)
7Blue:C20-105 (inj#4)
8White: C20-106 (inj#3)

I know there is a 9th wire? where does it connect?
I am correct in saying that the 8 wire fuel controller does not connect to the MAF sensor?

05-28-2015, 01:59 AM	#7
mario98c Drives: Toyota Yaris Sedan 09 STD Join Date: May 2009 Location: Puerto Rico Posts: 1,227	^^Yes, if you disconnect the afr sensor(first O2 sensor) the ecu will go into open loop. __________________

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05-27-2015, 07:51 PM	#1
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	Blitz Fuel/Timing Issue Hello YarisWorld I recently installed a Blitz Supercharger in my 2007 JDM Vitz RS and I am using an AEM EMS-4 for fuel control. I am allowing the stock ecu to control all other functions like timing, throttle, ac etc. I got the Blitz fuel controller but not the activation switch hence I decide to use the AEM EMS-4 management for fuel and activation. Mods: 2azfe (330cc) injectors, 92ron fuel Fidanza Flywheel, ACT sprung copper disc, TRD Pressure plate AEM Wideband Gauge AEM Coolant Sensor AEM Map Sensor AEM Water/Methanol Kit 50/50 mix set to activate at 0.5psi. The Issue While driving if I allow boost to build the afr reads 2 psi = mid 12's, 5 psi = low 12's and hits hits 10-11's at 7psi (btw two different boost gauges and the map sensor is seeing 9 psi at wot ) However if I am partial throttle (vacuum) then press to activate d s/c although the afr is still 10-11's I can hear a lot of detonation/ping during the transition into boost (vacuum to 5-7psi). The knock sensor reading in AEM confirms the detonation/ping. The car sometime throws the code P0172: System Too Rick Bank 1. Could this be the cause of the ecu not adjusting timing sufficiently? Also the egr valve next to the s/c manifold was blanked off. What advice can you guys advise/suggest/comment. Thanks in advance

05-27-2015, 08:17 PM	#2
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	I am getting some security token error so I cannot upload pics. sorry guys.

05-27-2015, 08:26 PM	#3
CrankyOldMan 2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how! View User's Garage Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: West Michigan Posts: 2,333	Do you mean the knob for setting the engagement point, or the box with the electronics for controlling the clutch? The switch is just a voltage divider--I posted a schematic of it a year or two ago. The injectors may be too big, causing the rich condition, but that should negate detonation. Very strange.

05-27-2015, 08:44 PM	#4
CrankyOldMan 2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how! View User's Garage Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: West Michigan Posts: 2,333	Perhaps not having the switch module is preventing the blitz from forcing the stock ecu from going into open loop during acceleration?

05-27-2015, 10:44 PM	#5
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	I have only the fuel controller with the 8/9 wires. I do not have the selector engagement switch nor the clutch relay box hence my decision to use the AEM EMS-4 for fuel and s/c activation. I do get some hesitation when manifold pressure reaches 0 psig. Is there some way for me to force the ecu into open loop to test? Also I will confirm but when the car is cold I don't have this issue. It's only when the coolant temp approaches 80's then this problem occurs. Thanks cranky.

05-27-2015, 10:53 PM	#6
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	Like disconnecting the OEM o2 sensor?

05-28-2015, 05:57 AM	#8
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	Is this a wise approach by disconnecting the afr sensor to trouble shoot the issue?

05-29-2015, 06:21 AM	#9
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	I disconnected the oem afr sensor. The car felt a lil lazy while driving but didn't hear any detonation during the transition into boost. On checking the AEM EMS-4 it showed some knock but not as much as before. I'll continue to monitor. I do a compression test and post the results.

05-29-2015, 08:43 AM	#10
CrankyOldMan 2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how! View User's Garage Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: West Michigan Posts: 2,333	That makes sense then--one function of the blitz switch module is to force the ecu into open loop, which makes the injectors run rich. I'm not sure how you could make the ems do the same, since I don't know how you trigger the clutch on the blitz...

05-30-2015, 06:20 AM	#11
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	The AEM EMS-4 has 8 input/output triggers called GPIO's. I am using a GPIO set at 25% throttle (I have also been testing the activation at 2000rpm) to activate a relay to engage/disengage the s/c clutch. The blitz switch module is the on/off/25/50/75 throttle switch? Is there a specific wire on the ecu that needs a 12V or ground to put the ecu in open loop? If it is like this I can the properly use a GPIO to trigger open loop condition. Can you identify the wire?

05-30-2015, 11:36 AM	#12
CrankyOldMan 2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how! View User's Garage Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: West Michigan Posts: 2,333	I'm looking at the Blitz wiring diagrams, but it's not very clear what each wire does. I would assume that CTScott has this info, but I'm going to try to sort it out myself since I may go this route in the future.

05-31-2015, 12:28 AM	#14
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	Thanks CTScott and Cranky. I wouldn't be driving the car for a few days. I will wire the coils into the AEM EMS-4 and have an attempt at tuning fuel and ignition. Of this doesn't work ill use the blitz fuel controller and use an autometer rpm activation switch and the 1zz injectors. Thanks again guys.

07-12-2015, 08:06 PM	#15
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	Update: Wired up the coils to the aem ems-4 so now I have fuel and ignition control. I also installed reinstalled 1zz throttle body as the car was idling at 1500rpm with the 1nzfe throttle body. I adjusted the 1zz throttle body idle screw and got the and the car is idling at 700rpm. Issue: There is excessive noise in in the cam and crank signal going to the aem ems-4. Trouble shooting at the moment using resistors to attempt to filter out the noise.

07-12-2015, 08:08 PM	#16
CrankyOldMan 2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how! View User's Garage Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: West Michigan Posts: 2,333	Do you have access to a scope that can do frequency analysis? If you know the specific frequencies or range, I could probably help you design a filter. Sent from my XT1031 using Tapatalk

07-12-2015, 08:21 PM	#17
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	No easy access to an oscilloscope but I can arrange to use one from a school lab. I ill pm you if I get access to it, thank you. The other day we were able to achieve the filtering: reverse the polarity of the cam sensor wires and use a 1k ohm resistor across the cam sensor wires. I reproduced this this weekend but haven't tested it yet as there was too much rain. I will be able to test this later in the week when I return home.

07-25-2015, 09:54 PM	#18
KTS Drives: Vitz RS Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Trinidad and Tobago Posts: 272	We are not having success using the AEM EMS-4 Standalone ECU therefore how will I go about using the 8 wire blitz fuel controller without the activation switch and relay? This is what I have gathered so far.... 1Pink: C20-81 (IGF) 2Red: [4] A21-28 (ign switch) 3Yellow: [5] C20-107 (inj#2) 4Orange: [6] C20-108 (inj#1) 5Green: [9] activation box 6Black: [10] C20-44 (battery -) 7Blue:C20-105 (inj#4) 8White: C20-106 (inj#3) I know there is a 9th wire? where does it connect? I am correct in saying that the 8 wire fuel controller does not connect to the MAF sensor?