Why did the small car die back in the early '90s?

[deebrown]

Interesting article on the MSN site talking about how fuel economy actually has gotten worse in the last 15 years as the cars have gotten bigger:

http://autos.msn.com/advice/article....tentid=4024682

The question I ask is - why did these cars get bigger in the first place?

My own hypothesis would be that the smallest of cars HAD to get bigger otherwise they were quite literally death traps on the highway if hit by a monster SUV (another reason how the SUV helped ruin the American car industry/environment)

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

[ChinoCharles]

Many older SUV's are no safer than the Yaris. They're too roll-happy.

You see SUV's on the roads en masse for the same reason Bush is in office. 52% of America is literally mentally insane.

I can understand having one in the garage for the family trip, but past that they're dumb. I can fit the groceries in the Yaris just fine... and a friend.

[captainzerocool]

Originally Posted by ChinoCharles

Many older SUV's are no safer than the Yaris. They're too roll-happy.

You see SUV's on the roads en masse for the same reason Bush is in office. 52% of America is literally mentally insane.

I can understand having one in the garage for the family trip, but past that they're dumb. I can fit the groceries in the Yaris just fine... and a friend.

Your hilarious. Really....

It all boils down to image. Wagons were cool at one point then they died out in favor of minivans, who's death lead to "SUV's". Small cars like the Yaris may be next on that list.

[static808]

Originally Posted by captainzerocool

Wagons were cool at one point then they died out in favor of minivans, who's death lead to "SUV's". Small cars like the Yaris may be next on that list.

hahah...HEY! wagons, vans and hatchbacks will always be as cool as the other side of the pillow! if we're the only ones on the block with them, while everyone else has a SUV, doesnt that make us cool?? i always thought it was the less you were concerned about being cool, the cooler you actually were?? if thats the case, then all YW members are as cold as ice...

--B

[acrbill]

In this day and age of crumple zones and multiple airbags small cars are a lot safer than decades ago. Did anyone see that video of a Smart ForTwo hitting a concrete barrier at high speed? It bounced off and had no cabin intrusion at all. The doors still opened and shut. Its considerably easier to avoid an accident with my Yaris vs. my Expedition. In some respects a truck/SUV is safer, basically when someone hits you. Some of the turns I make in my Yaris on a daily basis would flip my truck over. Even something as simple as a tire blow out on the expressway might spell disaster for a tall SUV. My Yaris on the other hand had a totally flat RR tire that I noticed when I was getting out of the car. I very likely was driving on it for at least a mile and did not even notice it.

I personally like small cars, my wife on the other hand likes large SUV's. Its all a matter of personal opinion. In the past week I used loaded the Expedition with a load that would not have fit in an Explorer. It would have fit in a Grand Caravan but neither my wife or I have any desire to own a minivan. I always figured I would end up with a minivan until I used my sisters Odyssey to drive 10 hours straight. As soon as I got home I realized I could never own a minivan.

[BailOut]

It basically comes down to one thing: gullibility/sheepability.

In America the auto manufacturers spent billions marketing to us that a bigger car meant better performance, more safety on the roads and in accidents, were more cool and desirable, etc. and we bought not only that ideology but the vehicles it represents.

In "Who Killed the Electric Car?" there's a lady that says something along the lines of, "If you feed people that for long enough they'll begin to think it's the diet.". That sure does work easily in America.

On the other side of the pond Europeans were telling the auto manufacturers that they needed smaller, more efficient cars due to the cost of fuel, and that's what they got.

During the 90's and early 2000's we fought not one but two wars in the middle east to ensure the flow of oil through exactly the channels we want in order to keep it cheap and available. Think about that... 2 wars in less than 2 decades over the same resource in the same place for the same reasons... so that metanational corporations could get rich and by proxy make their pocket politicians rich, and so that people would keep driving Hummers and Excursions, which feeds right back in to the need to keep the oil flowing.

It's the biggest racket the world has ever seen and each time we visit the pumps we pay and play right into it.

Vote the big car/small car issue with your wallet. It's the only thing metanational corporations listen to.

[Astroman]

I guess we all know how I voted

[foober]

Originally Posted by BailOut

It basically comes down to one thing: gullibility/sheepability.

In America the auto manufacturers spent billions marketing to us that a bigger car meant better performance, more safety on the roads and in accidents, were more cool and desirable, etc. and we bought not only that ideology but the vehicles it represents.

In "Who Killed the Electric Car?" there's a lady that says something along the lines of, "If you feed people that for long enough they'll begin to think it's the diet.". That sure does work easily in America.

On the other side of the pond Europeans were telling the auto manufacturers that they needed smaller, more efficient cars due to the cost of fuel, and that's what they got.

During the 90's and early 2000's we fought not one but two wars in the middle east to ensure the flow of oil through exactly the channels we want in order to keep it cheap and available. Think about that... 2 wars in less than 2 decades over the same resource in the same place for the same reasons... so that metanational corporations could get rich and by proxy make their pocket politicians rich, and so that people would keep driving Hummers and Excursions, which feeds right back in to the need to keep the oil flowing.

It's the biggest racket the world has ever seen and each time we visit the pumps we pay and play right into it.

Vote the big car/small car issue with your wallet. It's the only thing metanational corporations listen to.

Well said. If americans had a brain they'd realize they're being taken to the cleaners. I'm sure politicians and corporations are glad they most americans do whatever they're told.

[MudBug]

Originally Posted by BailOut

It basically comes down to one thing: gullibility/sheepability.

Sure


Post a picture of your small car with a quad in the back, pulling a boat 500 miles across the state to lake havasu or a trailer filled with camping gear 40 miles off the main roads into the middle of the desert, or filled with enough tile to do your kitchen and bathroom, or enough plywood, 2x4's, and roofing materials to build a shed.


Small cars good for people that live in huge cites, as a second car for commuting, or for kids. Anyone else is either stuck with it (Economy), batshit crazy (Eco freaks), or just plain crazy about small car tuning for performance. (probably the majority of the people here)

[vodkalush]

Originally Posted by MudBug

Sure


Post a picture of your small car with a quad in the back, pulling a boat 500 miles across the state to lake havasu or a trailer filled with camping gear 40 miles off the main roads into the middle of the desert, or filled with enough tile to do your kitchen and bathroom, or enough plywood, 2x4's, and roofing materials to build a shed.


Small cars good for people that live in huge cites, as a second car for commuting, or for kids. Anyone else is either stuck with it (Economy), batshit crazy (Eco freaks), or just plain crazy about small car tuning for performance. (probably the majority of the people here)

gahhhh hahaha

[wagoneer]

Originally Posted by MudBug

Sure


Post a picture of your small car with a quad in the back, pulling a boat 500 miles across the state to lake havasu or a trailer filled with camping gear 40 miles off the main roads into the middle of the desert, or filled with enough tile to do your kitchen and bathroom, or enough plywood, 2x4's, and roofing materials to build a shed.


Small cars good for people that live in huge cites, as a second car for commuting, or for kids. Anyone else is either stuck with it (Economy), batshit crazy (Eco freaks), or just plain crazy about small car tuning for performance. (probably the majority of the people here)

ummm. what he said.

[Typer73]

You should've see us driving down the highway with a 7-ft sofa tied to the top of our '73 VW beetle! Never found anything that wouldn't fit in or on that car.

[Black Yaris]

I owned a 00 Blazer b4 I bought my Yaris

[MudBug]

Originally Posted by Black Yaris

I owned a 00 Blazer b4 I bought my Yaris

I still own my 00 Z71 4x4.

I just crossed 100k and finished paying it off and was just about to trade it in on a brand new one since I actually often need a big truck (Construction, Camping, Hunting, Quad, and just carrying a bunch of stuff), but at the last minute decided that one of these little things as a second car made more sense.

my Truck probably has another 80 - 100k, but if I traded it in on a new one I would have probably had to pay another $24k and I would have had just one vehicle. This way I'll still have a truck when I need one, but I also have a second vehicle that gets great gas mileage, and still can carry a lot of stuff.

If it came down to having just one vehicle, it would be a full sized, extra-cab, Chevy 4x4 with a big 8 cylinder engine, cuz I need one. In fact I believe everybody should own a truck, I'm tired of moving everyone else's shit.

As for why small cars died in the 90's, have you ever heard of the Yugo?

[Astroman]

I owned a '87 Chevy Astro van before my Yaris. Sure, it was a great hauler, seated up to 8, had a 27gal tank, could tow more than any other van in its class, but I never sat more than 6 people in it at one time. When I went over 75mph, I got 8mpg. At 55mph, I got 22mpg. It was a GREAT rig when I needed to haul things like furniture, my yamaha scooter, anything over 4ft long, etc. But more often, I drove it with just me, not hauling anything. Most of the time I owned the van it never had the seats in. My daily commute is 3.2 miles to work, times 4 (work, home for lunch, back to work, back home) and that was too much vehicle for just that. My girlfriend has a taurus wagon and it has a roof rack. Since I got rid of the van anytime we have needed to haul anything long, or say like a couch, we can either fit it with the seats down or strap it on top. And even though it gets maybe 16-24mpg, it is WAY better on gas than my van ever was. Sure, little cars are not the best rigs for towing, mud bogging, penis envy, seeing over the top of everyone else, hauling your entire extended family on a month long camping trip, but they are perfect for couples, singles, anyone who drives a lot in town, 3 people on a week long camping trip (I did it, you can too!). I commute a lot, about 1500-2500 miles each month. 99.5% of the year my yaris fits my needs. Getting to work, shopping, visiting family 2 hours away, trips to california, hauling around a few friends, my gas & insurance budget, the list goes on. I would love to have a old truck for hauling or towing, but not as a daily driver. My mom bought a '72 chevy C20 for just that. She wanted a old, 4x4 truck to be able to haul & tow. She puts about 2,000 miles a year on it hauling hay, wood, furniture, manure, gravel, dirt, trailer. It's her work truck. It's a tool. A small car is a tool that works for 4 or less people, grocery shopping, environmental impact, fuel economy, etc. Vehicles are tools, they are machines. If you live up in the mountains and you need a 4x4 in the winter so be it, you have to do what you have to do. If you have a 4-wheeler or snowmobile, need to haul manure or gravel so be it. If you need to haul a lot of people get a damn van, they do have them as well in front/rear/all/4 wheel drive. And believe me, there is more room inside a van than a SUV. My 2 cent rant.

[static808]

Originally Posted by Astroman

And believe me, there is more room inside a van than a SUV. My 2 cent rant.

nice post. its one of the big reasons why we got our van. we find it funny when kids being picked up at school have to pole vault into their moms' huge SUVs. i agree with mudbug that the utility purposes of large vehicles are very underappreciated, but i live in SoCal. i guarantee you that 95% of large vehicle (SUV, large Pick-up) owners out there DO NOT need the size of their vehicle. how much lumber is that 17 year old blonde going to carry from home to school in her chevy tahoe?? NONE. how much manure is that 25 year old stock broker going to transport from his work in century city to his condo in venice beach with that ford f-250?? NONE. when you look in the carppol lanes, what do you see here?? a shit load of civic hybrids and priuses with their carpool access stickers draped all over their bumpers and fenders. where are all of the SUVs and trucks?? stuck in traffic, since all of the drivers are riding by themselves, completely alone, carrying no cargo whatsoever. how do i know that?? yuppies in business suits, teenagers on cell phones, and metrosexuals fixing their hair using the rear view mirror DONT HAUL CRAP. but i totally give mad respect for the 5% of truck owners out there in SoCal that actually USE their vehicles. guess that's my rant for the day. sorry if i offended anyone, but if you're a single person who drives a big-ass vehicle and DOESNT need it, my apology doesnt apply to you...

--B

[Black Yaris]

small cars sucked in the early 90's.... some of the most problimatic cars/trucks stem back to the late 80's early 90's, and they problems still persist today... I will not get into specifics, cause I will just cause a HUGH fight.... so I will leave it at that :)

[churp]

There were good Japanese cars in the 60's....Triumphs and MG's were good if you liked to maintain them (my brothers 67 Spitfire got 37mpg on a 500 mile trip I made,while totally overloaded with junk)...early 60's falcons and corvairs weren't 'too' bad but otherwise the US never made a good economy car (50's Studes and Ramblers were ahead of their time).

.....and several guys at work just about shit their pants when they find a 10 year old 4x4 pickup under 10 grand!?!?!?!? The majority of Americans (the US ones) are brain dead enough to think their Chrysler 'K' car was an economy car

Seems to me the emission problems were too much for the US automakers.