One Trillion

[Bob_VT]

Originally Posted by Shroomster

Same thing I was taught



call it depreciation all you want it's just a lbel...My Wife and I had three choices:
1. get a new car w/o any major defects/needed work and pay it off over 6 years

2. pour money into a car with a failing engine and transmission (total parts would be well out of immediate liquid financial availability = no way in hell to come up with 3-4k on the spot)

3. find an alternate mode of transportation that is both safe & reliable (no way is she riding the bus or a bike in this neighborhood)


I'm not disagreeing with you I'm just saying for every opinion there is an explanation that falls outside the noted solution.

Okay so you had a need to ne filled. What about the person who is maxed out ...... owes money on the current vehicle and then is talked into leasing or buying for a few bucks a week more ....... under the impression the economy would get better. These are people not buying with their brain but with an impulse and desire.

Hell I know my credit is good and I would love a nice Mercedes but my entire life would be around that payment....... I refuse to be held hostage to desire.

I'm not trying to pick a fight but answer this honestly...... don't you feel that many people will always take the easy way out with a lower payment for a longer period of time? That also means higher insurance premiums for longer and mandatory repairs. The "average" warranty is 3/36 and powertrain averages are 5/60.... sometimes they are gambling without thinking through the entire picture.

Take the person who can afford a yaris at about $14K but for an additional couple of years and a few bucks more they can buy a car for $20K..... not that the need is there but they do it on desire! Why in the hell does a family of 2 or 3 need a $40K truck or SUV when the cheaper car does the same thing.

[Phaeton]

Hitler declared a year of Jubilee, all debts forgiven. Worked great for the Germans, not so much for everybody they owed money outside of the country.

[Shroomster]

Originally Posted by Bob_VT

Okay so you had a need to ne filled. What about the person who is maxed out ...... owes money on the current vehicle and then is talked into leasing or buying for a few bucks a week more ....... under the impression the economy would get better. These are people not buying with their brain but with an impulse and desire.

Hell I know my credit is good and I would love a nice Mercedes but my entire life would be around that payment....... I refuse to be held hostage to desire.

I'm not trying to pick a fight but answer this honestly...... don't you feel that many people will always take the easy way out with a lower payment for a longer period of time? That also means higher insurance premiums for longer and mandatory repairs. The "average" warranty is 3/36 and powertrain averages are 5/60.... sometimes they are gambling without thinking through the entire picture.

Take the person who can afford a yaris at about $14K but for an additional couple of years and a few bucks more they can buy a car for $20K..... not that the need is there but they do it on desire! Why in the hell does a family of 2 or 3 need a $40K truck or SUV when the cheaper car does the same thing.

No, I understand and see your points, I just don't know how to properly classify desire vs. necessity when talking about a large scale of people

[bobselectric]

The issue is about people with good intentions spending more than they can afford. Also the dumbing down of America. If there was a class in school that was mandatory that would teach the everyday common sense ideals...
1. Basic Economics- how to balance a checkbook, why having a "emergency fund" is a good idea, how to calculate sales tax and tips, and a "real time" way to figure what money is worth.
2. Basic law- What bankruptcy means, What foreclosure means, what petty crimes will do to you later in life
3. Basic Common Sense- What you put on facebook will come back to haunt you, Not everyone on the interwebz is your friend, If it sounds to good to be true, it probably is.


What angers me is the people who got scammed, most recently by this Madoff guy, and lost there life savings. Oh pity me! When you get returns on an investment paying minimally 12-15% for twenty years, something has to be up.
I'm not saying it's not possible, but usually the people who make that kind of yield are doing it personally, hands on 100% of the time with a lot of diversity to offset losses. Not handing over all of your money to someone who is shady about the details and keeps you quiet with a check.

My two favorite quotes about money and wealth are-

"If you want to know what God thinks of money, look at the people he gives it to"- Woody Allen

"If you think that Micheal Jordan has wealth, you're wrong. Mike is rich... the guy who pays Mike has wealth"- Chris Rock

[JBIZZ]

Without the bailouts CEO's and corrupt politicians don't get paid. It would make too much sense to distribute that money to everyone equally, in order to stimulate the economy. The elite get 1st dibs on taxpayer's money, the rest trickles down to us peons (majority).

This is ultimately caused by the elite, mostly republicans (a.k.a. filthy rich people) for eliminating certain lending regulations. I am glad Obama was elected, but this mess just seems too big to clean up.

As far as the big 3 go, they will go bankrupt eventually. I know my friends and I will never buy an American car again. I use to like GM vehicles too, til I realized thy just don't last as long as Japanese cars. As far as the Unions go, They helped cause this financial catastrophe, which may just lead us into a depression. Its funny how someone working at a fast food place makes minimum wage, and how someone working at GM installing one screw on each car makes at least 3 times that.

Sorry if I offended anyone (republicans/union workers), just wanted to add my 2 cents

[GeneW]

Debt forgiveness creates a moral hazard of encouraging future mistakes "They'll bail us out again". This was why a lot of people were against Bank Bailouts.

Gene

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by JBIZZ

This is ultimately caused by the elite, mostly republicans (a.k.a. filthy rich people) for eliminating certain lending regulations.

Oh yeah....?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbOGRg3VzlQ


All Recipients of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac Campaign Contributions, 1989-2008

Name Office State Party Grand Total Total from
PACs Total from Individuals
Dodd, Christopher J S CT D $165,400 $48,500 $116,900
Obama, Barack S IL D $126,349 $6,000 $120,349
Kerry, John S MA D $111,000 $2,000 $109,000
Bennett, Robert F S UT R $107,999 $71,499 $36,500
Bachus, Spencer H AL R $103,300 $70,500 $32,800
Blunt, Roy H MO R $96,950 $78,500 $18,450
Kanjorski, Paul E H PA D $96,000 $57,500 $38,500
Bond, Christopher S MO R $95,400 $64,000 $31,400
Shelby, Richard C S AL R $80,000 $23,000 $57,000
Reed, Jack S RI D $78,250 $43,500 $34,750
Reid, Harry S NV D $77,000 $60,500 $16,500
Clinton, Hillary S NY D $76,050 $8,000 $68,050
Davis, Tom H VA R $75,499 $13,999 $61,500

Please note who got the six figure contributions from Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac.

http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008...d-freddie.html

Now then.... I have to ask... why should Countrywide and other Mortgage pushers get hammered while the market leaders of subprime mortgages, the two Federal Agencies, gets a pass and a bailout?

By the way, the Rockefellers, Kennedys and John Kerry are multi-milloinares. Are they not "filthy rich" too?

Genes

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by Bob_VT

Well what pisses me off is the fact that I pay my bills on time....have never de-faulted on anything ..... don't make much money and I will just never get ahead.... but I am following the example I was taught ..... get married, kids, buy a home but now retirement is going to be when I eventually drop dead.

Retirement, Bob, is a recent historical thing. Most people died young or worked well into their elder years. I think retirement is a second childhood and is usually a horrifying experience, one that accelerates degeneration.

I never expected to retire. My parents are in their early seventies, both work and one is in Grad School. So for me this isn't big shakes.

Gene

[Bob_VT]

Originally Posted by JBIZZ

Without the bailouts CEO's and corrupt politicians don't get paid. It would make too much sense to distribute that money to everyone equally, in order to stimulate the economy. The elite get 1st dibs on taxpayer's money, the rest trickles down to us peons (majority).

This is ultimately caused by the elite, mostly republicans (a.k.a. filthy rich people) for eliminating certain lending regulations. I am glad Obama was elected, but this mess just seems too big to clean up.

As far as the big 3 go, they will go bankrupt eventually. I know my friends and I will never buy an American car again. I use to like GM vehicles too, til I realized thy just don't last as long as Japanese cars. As far as the Unions go, They helped cause this financial catastrophe, which may just lead us into a depression. Its funny how someone working at a fast food place makes minimum wage, and how someone working at GM installing one screw on each car makes at least 3 times that.

Sorry if I offended anyone (republicans/union workers), just wanted to add my 2 cents

You need to do your homework there. Look at who was behind the lending acts..... you will discover it started with Jimmy Carter and expanded with Bill Clinton. YOU also helped cause the financial problems. No one is without blame. So you support Obama spending a minimum of 850 billion and posssibly 1 trillion dollars to be raised by taxes? BUT you don't like the idea of the bailout?

[Bob_VT]

Hmmmmmmm 60 days after this post..... Where's the change? What's the figure up to?

[KCALB SIRAY]

ohhh don't forget the cost of flying the big plane all around the country to sign it days after making someone leave their mothers wake just to vote....

[jclo3313]

Originally Posted by JBIZZ

just wanted to add my 2 cents

Can I have half of that?

[churp]

Originally Posted by KCALB SIRAY

ohhh don't forget the cost of flying the big plane all around the country to sign it days after making someone leave their mothers wake just to vote....

Our legislators at work.....no time to read it just vote----what the heck are they getting paid for?

Did Obama just not want them to read it? He took 3 times as long to sign it as they got to read it! Transparency at it's worst.

[yaris-me]

You're looking at sub-prime mortgages, consumer loans, people living beyond their means and corrupt politicians. The news does not understand the crisis we face, so they present misleading information. Later when things get sorted out and there is a clearer understanding, you will learn of structured finance and how CEOs took their bonus' up front before the loss' instead of the back end where they were suppose to. It is much more complicated than this, and add to that the deficit spending and the making of financial bubbles and trying to prevent them bursting. In the end your children and grand children will be holding the bag.