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05-17-2009, 10:37 AM | #181 |
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05-17-2009, 10:39 AM | #182 |
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Ha. I'm serious about it though. I've been a capitalist all my life. But recently I've been noticing many Europeans are living much better than I thought. Add to that the recent string of events in this country and I'm just not sure anymore. For every American who tells me it's better here there is one telling me the opposite.
Which is why I'm curious to see KCALB's answer. :p
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05-17-2009, 11:20 AM | #183 | |
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They're not doing well.... not in the slightest. Especially Germany. Gene |
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05-17-2009, 11:29 AM | #184 |
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But it seems as though they are in recession now because we are. I was hearing that the Euro middle class was living with many of the same material things the US middle class was in the last decade or so. This was something I was always told was untrue before. It just seems like America was far better from 1900-1950, but from 1950-now we've been in decline while Europe has slowly but steadily gotten better. But then I still read how their unemployment rates have and still are far above ours and when you can't find a job in France/Germany ect that you literally cannot. Not like here where "I can't get a job" means I can only get a job at Walmart or Mcdonalds.
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05-17-2009, 11:41 AM | #185 |
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^I'm not disagreeing, but why not?
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05-17-2009, 11:56 AM | #186 |
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Well I would agree about Communism. But Socialism isn't as harsh. Also it seems like here the corruption makes all the wealth at the top while everyone else is left with nothing. That being said I am still a capitalist. But all my volunteer work at local shelters and my under-grad years of studying politics and world history has me questioning just how much I actually know. But I'm kinda threadjacking KCALB's thread. It's technically ask him. Maybe I should start a separate thread for this and just let him answer here??
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05-17-2009, 12:32 PM | #187 | |||
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Case in point has been the trend towards reducing the number of hours per week which are worked. Does anyone imagine that reducing your labor output magically makes you more prosperous over the long run? If the State raises your wages then the prices of goods also eventually rise. Who does this hurt if not the people who work for a living? Quote:
We had more oil because the US is one of the largest producers of oil in the world. Where the Europeans have it "good" is that they don't send their military on adventures all over the world. That Imperial routine is mighty expensive. Quote:
Gene |
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05-17-2009, 12:38 PM | #188 |
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^ That's all the kind of stuff I've read and heard before hence why I've been a capitalist. I guess the big problem for me is it's all the same stuff I've been hearing my whole life, and when you look at the crazy evangelicals or the crazy Muslim extremists (or any extremist group for that matter) they always seem to believe what they believe because it's all they've ever known. I just want to be sure my views are correct and not just "all I've ever known".
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05-17-2009, 12:54 PM | #189 | |
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Just last week an engineer from northern Italy and I were discussing calculators. Back in the 1980s when he was in high school he bought an HP for about $400.00 in Lire. Took him "all summer long" to earn it. How much money could a US kid in high school make in three months? More or less than $400.00 dollars? At that same time I made over $1000.00 working minimum wage (lots of OT) in one summer. I live in a "blue state". Were it not so quiet I would probably move because of all of the statist non-sense that goes on here. We have all sorts of "programs" and special "industrial zones" that grow more weed patches than businesses. Most of my peers left the area years and years ago. The elected clowns have more government programs than Carter has little pills but things never seem to improve all that much. Meanwhile we have some of the wealthiest people in the US out in the mountains. They live real well. In grotesquely large mansions with kept grounds and loyal staff. We're told that taxes are "graduated" to "make things more equal". Yeah, right. Gene Last edited by GeneW; 05-17-2009 at 01:10 PM. |
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05-17-2009, 12:59 PM | #190 |
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We agree on a lot. But every now and then some European comes over here and tells me how much better it is over there. I just don't know. Either KCALB needs to answer this for me or I guess I'll have to go over there myself and find out first hand. :p
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05-17-2009, 04:15 PM | #191 | |||
それを吸ってください
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Quote:
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I'm taking the day off, but I did have a nice conversation last night with one...smokin hot! |
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05-17-2009, 04:51 PM | #192 |
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Is it wrong to want to fall asleep at work? When we were kids they made us take naps during our days, why did this stop?
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05-17-2009, 05:35 PM | #193 | |
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If you think success under Capitalism is based on merit then you haven't worked in the corporate world at all. Cronyism is a human condition not a symptom of political/social ideology. Have you seen how great the income disparity in the US is these days? I have no problem with people making lots of money but first they must deserve it. Unfortunately that's usually not the case as evinced by the financial sector meltdown that still rewarded those responsible with huge pay and bonuses. A political/social system is only as "honest" as those that operate within it and seeing as how the majority of people are corrupt or corruptable and ultimately self interested it doesn't matter what tenets or rules apply. In other words, people suck. |
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05-17-2009, 05:40 PM | #194 | |
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Did want to mention ONE giant difference between Corporations and Communism. A Corporation might have you killed but they cannot always do it under the color of law. In a communist nation there is no law only political influence. Gene |
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05-17-2009, 06:31 PM | #195 |
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Boo to no answer. :p Alright if I really want an answer I'll create a new thread. :)
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05-17-2009, 10:41 PM | #196 | |
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I'll take a shot
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To really answer this question for yourself (and remember, the answer that is right for you may not be right for me and vice-versa) you need to study economics. I mean it seriously. Just a basic JC class will help a lot. I took Econ 101 and Econ 102 (Micro and Macro econ.) , one of them with a "liberal" teacher and another one with a hard core republican, a long time ago, and I pretty much got my answer right around that time. And you know a basic Econ class isn't has hard as people tell you. But seriously, it will help you answer that question for yourself because nobody else can and there is way too much misinformation out there. By the way, "capitalism" in its purest form hasn't existed in the US in a very long time, I mean in a few decades at least. That's all I can tell ou on a car forum. |
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05-17-2009, 10:47 PM | #197 | |
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05-17-2009, 11:03 PM | #198 | |
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My brother lives in Europe. We bought the same japanese cars (his was slightly better, actually). We have similar electronic equipment at home. His standard of living might be higher in some ways (he doesn't spend as much for health care and health insurance, and has way more vacation time than we do) but we have other stuff in the US. BTW, I was looking for the original comment from PK but I can't find it. Did it get deleted? PK's folks (from what I understand from previous posts), come from a "true communist" country. No fun at all. You don't want that model. But communism is NOT socialism, so let's not confuse everything. No system is perfect anyway and the little guy pretty much always suffers. Don't feel bad if KCALB doesn't answer your question, maybe he just wants to stay neutral on that one so he doesn't hurt anyone's feelings Now, if you'll excuse me, I gotta find my red stapler after I'm done moving my stuff to the basement Last edited by tomato; 05-18-2009 at 03:12 AM. |
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