US Yaris to be imported from France ?

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by Yaris240

I agree that Country of origin probably should not matter in biuld quality of a Yaris. But I have to admit, one of the main reasons I bought my 2010 Yaris was that it was one of the last Toyota econocars that were still made in Japan. My 2 previous Toyota's, a 1986 Corolla SR5 and a 1990 Celica ST in my signature that I still own were solid cars. I am probably old fashioned in that I favor made in Japan Toyotas.
If something were to happen to my Yaris, I would probably purchase something else as a replacement if the newer ones are no longer made in Japan. I could always get another used Japanese made Yaris or even a Lexus.

[bentjazz]

mrpj,
I, too, have read about the Aygo and it's water leaking interior problems. I'd have a shit fit if I bought a car and water leaked into the interior when it rained. Oy.

[tk-421]

How about bad roads? I've heard much more expensive cars than ours get rattles because of potholes. Is lame German manufacturing to blame because of this?

[Billiam]

Originally Posted by tk-421

How about bad roads? I've heard much more expensive cars than ours get rattles because of potholes. Is lame German manufacturing to blame because of this?

Exactly...road conditions can play a huge part in how quiet a car is. So do mods...like stiffer springs, plus-size wheels/tires and even temperature. The guy who lives in a hot climate for most of the year will complain less about interior pops and creaks than the guy who lives in a cooler climate...or at least one that gets cold in the winter.

According to CR interior noises are the number one complaint for all makes and models across the board.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by Billiam

Exactly...road conditions can play a huge part in how quiet a car is. So do mods...like stiffer springs, plus-size wheels/tires and even temperature. The guy who lives in a hot climate for most of the year will complain less about interior pops and creaks than the guy who lives in a cooler climate...or at least one that gets cold in the winter.

According to CR interior noises are the number one complaint for all makes and models across the board.

Your assertion about the climate makes quite a bit of sense to me re N.A.---re why I wouldn't have creak and rattle issues and those in a cold climate in the U.S. would. However, could this be the case for MRPJ? Does the climate really differ enough in parts of England to make that case? I don't think so, but I could easily be wrong on that particular point. If MRPJ has always lived in the same climate within England, climate might not be a point he'd be consciously aware of (the roads would be something he'd be aware of and I think would have mentioned had they contributed to his experience). In addition, if MRPJ's experience does not include any appreciable difference in climate, then he is comparing his Yaris experience to other cars within that climate---his 'apples to apples'. The climate differences between regions is an interesting point that you bring up and I'd be interested to know other points of view re climate making a difference re rattles and squeaks.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by tk-421

How about bad roads? I've heard much more expensive cars than ours get rattles because of potholes. Is lame German manufacturing to blame because of this?

I think this is definitely a plausible answer to my question. I've driven on a fair number of roads in England (as well as all over the U.S) and I'd have to say, in my experience, that on average the roads are better in England. However, that is just my experience and the particular roads that MRPJ drives on might be crap and be causing his Yaris to creek and rattle, although he doesn't mention this as an issue for him.

[why?]

country of origin matters. More importantly, how old the plant is that is making the cars matters. Frankly, everything matters.

And mrpj is more pissed about the crappy transmission in his car, it is basically on par with the smarts tranny, ie utter crap.

But I've never heard any bad about British Yaris'. My sisters mother in law has had one for about a decade and loves it. I am sure they all have issues, just like our cars do.

But don't bring Chrysler into this, somehow they still make their minivans quality products, but the entire rest of the company, from the dealer network on up, is a total joke. I don't know how they still exist, oh wait, yes I do, someone stole our money and gave it to them, repeatedly. How many times should a company be bailed out before it is realized they don't deserve to be in any business at all?

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by why?

country of origin matters. More importantly, how old the plant is that is making the cars matters. Frankly, everything matters.

And mrpj is more pissed about the crappy transmission in his car, it is basically on par with the smarts tranny, ie utter crap.

But I've never heard any bad about British Yaris'. My sisters mother in law has had one for about a decade and loves it. I am sure they all have issues, just like our cars do.

But don't bring Chrysler into this, somehow they still make their minivans quality products, but the entire rest of the company, from the dealer network on up, is a total joke. I don't know how they still exist, oh wait, yes I do, someone stole our money and gave it to them, repeatedly. How many times should a company be bailed out before it is realized they don't deserve to be in any business at all?

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by why?

country of origin matters. More importantly, how old the plant is that is making the cars matters. Frankly, everything matters.

And mrpj is more pissed about the crappy transmission in his car, it is basically on par with the smarts tranny, ie utter crap.

But I've never heard any bad about British Yaris'. My sisters mother in law has had one for about a decade and loves it. I am sure they all have issues, just like our cars do.

But don't bring Chrysler into this, somehow they still make their minivans quality products, but the entire rest of the company, from the dealer network on up, is a total joke. I don't know how they still exist, oh wait, yes I do, someone stole our money and gave it to them, repeatedly. How many times should a company be bailed out before it is realized they don't deserve to be in any business at all?

Still as before. The answer to your last question is zero. However, the potential exists for it to happen again until either : 1. The U.S. Government gets to the point where it can't borrow the money to do it (in which case the world would already be a very different place) OR 2. The U.S. citizens who aren't facing reality/have their heads in the proverbial sand (like the French citizens who voted for Hollande---he who has now pledged 'no austerity' and to create 150,000 STATE-AIDED jobs) pull their heads out of the proverbial sand and vote accordingly. The needed economic healing process could START if #2 occurs in November, but an optimal result would still be at the end of a bumpy and uncertain road.

[Kioshi]

country of origin does matter, to me...and i could back it up with handheld products -> automobiles.

While I haven't owned more than 2 cars, i can use my Father as a primary example. He has owned a Mercury Topaz (loved that car, it could fit 6 people in the back easily), Ford Escort, Ford Taurus 98, Toyota Camry 86, Toyota Camry 97, Toyota 4Runner 96, and now Toyota Camry 90.

Made in Japan is quality build, whether you want to believe that or not. Sure, it sounds superficial, but compare a handheld product (if you can find one nowadays 'Made in Japan' to 'Made in Taiwan/China'.....

The power button sunken in on people's HTC smartphones, slide-out keyboard falling apart on a Motorola Droid 2, etc.
Friend in Japan is sporting a Sharp smartphone for more than 3 years and her has seem to hold up through several drops and one accidentally dropped in the swimming pool.

In the same sense, my Dad's old Toyota cars have been extremely good to him vs the money he had to put down to fix the Mercury Topaz car when first arriving to America and supporting just himself.
Sure, the Yaris has rattles, but thats due to the cheap plastic materials used in the car..AND yes, road and modding equipment plays a HUGE factor in interior noise and performance.

A lot of the older products i have lying around the house that have been been put to extreme use 4 years ago..ie: Panasonic Sv-SD 100 mp3 player STILL turns on after sitting in direct sunlight and with dust covered over it.

I stand by --> it DOES matter where the product is coming from (not hating towards German cars)

[Billiam]

Well...I have a great deal of knowledge concerning automotive production and I've said my peace in this thread. There's really nothing more I can add to this one without seriously stirring things up.

I'm out.

[Flipper_1938]

I WILL NOT BUY A FRENCH MADE CAR!

I have owned Toyotas since 1991. Not even Toyota can make the french build a GREAT car.

My 1991 toyota mini truck was great.
My 1984 Toyota landcruiser that followed it was great (I still have it).
My 2001 Toyota Echo that followed the Cruiser was GREAT!!!! (crashed at 318,000 miles)
The 2010 Yaris that followed the Echo has been pretty darn good so far.

All four were built in Japan.

My wife's 2005 Corrolla is OK, but not engineered or built to the same level as the Japan assembled ones. It is put together more like an american car.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by Billiam

Well...I have a great deal of knowledge concerning automotive production and I've said my peace in this thread. There's really nothing more I can add to this one without seriously stirring things up.

I'm out.

Whatever......I never said you were wrong, I just asked you to prove your point. Your last sentence seems to imply that no link re a statement from Toyota would be available because Toyota would never make such a statement because the statement (your assertion) is so obvious/self-evident. If you had to 'go into the weeds', so to speak to prove your point then so be it. I have a thick skin. It wouldn't have bothered me if you had gone over my layman's (on this subject) head. If you had done so then someone else on Yarisworld (someone WAY, WAY, WAY beyond my level of knowledge) could have critiqued your answer. The resulting discourse WOULD LIKELY HAVE EDIFIED ALL OF WE LAYMEN. It would seem to me that the only reason you wouldn't put forth a more 'in the weeds'/technical explanation is that you think you might be proven wrong. I can't imagine that you would hold back just because you think you might offend me, especially when one of your last statements involves asserting that you have 'extensive knowledge'.

One thing we can probably ALL agree on is our general faith in U.S. Spec vehicles that Toyota has exported from Japan to the United States....and most of us can probably agree on our faith in the built in Japan U.S. spec Yaris as a subset of that larger whole.

[jalancast]

I doubt Toyota would let a bad Yaris leave the plant - they've got plants all over the world and their reputation for quality is just as good in China as it is in Brazil as it is in the USA. Great engineering and great management are universal.

[tk-421]

I just can't fathom a company like Toyota settling for worse quality in components and manufacturing just to save a few bucks, especially when one considers that doing recalls afterwards is one of the most expensive things that can happen to a car company. They need to be sure that their quality (at least in those areas) is top notch, simply because the alternative is much more expensive.

Another point that I would like to make is that things change. Japan used to build really bad electronics just a few decades ago, and US automotive quality standards was considered to be among the best in the world at the time.

Is there any chance that car production has evolved in the last 50 years to a point where the end product is exactly the same no matter which factory they came out of? I think there is. The thing about building machines with machines is that the outcome is predictable and can be controlled.

OTOH, is there a chance that even the most profitable companies make stupid mistakes like cutting corners in the manufacturing process, even if that means that the quality will most likely suffer? Of course there is.

So I guess that in the end it's up to the people at the top to decide. And with competition being the way it is these days, it just seems unlikely that they would introduce inferior components in one plant and better ones in another, or simply hire just anyone to be in charge of production and/or assembly. But I do acknowledge that everything is possible in this crazy world of ours.

[nookandcrannycar]

Originally Posted by tk-421

I just can't fathom a company like Toyota settling for worse quality in components and manufacturing just to save a few bucks, especially when one considers that doing recalls afterwards is one of the most expensive things that can happen to a car company. They need to be sure that their quality (at least in those areas) is top notch, simply because the alternative is much more expensive.

Another point that I would like to make is that things change. Japan used to build really bad electronics just a few decades ago, and US automotive quality standards was considered to be among the best in the world at the time.

Is there any chance that car production has evolved in the last 50 years to a point where the end product is exactly the same no matter which factory they came out of? I think there is. The thing about building machines with machines is that the outcome is predictable and can be controlled.

OTOH, is there a chance that even the most profitable companies make stupid mistakes like cutting corners in the manufacturing process, even if that means that the quality will most likely suffer? Of course there is.

So I guess that in the end it's up to the people at the top to decide. And with competition being the way it is these days, it just seems unlikely that they would introduce inferior components in one plant and better ones in another, or simply hire just anyone to be in charge of production and/or assembly. But I do acknowledge that everything is possible in this crazy world of ours.

I agree that competition plus automation in some areas has narrowed the gap so to speak, but I don't think we've gotten to the point where the human component has been wrung out of the quality equation...yet. A rising tide has definitely lifted all boats though re quality and that day is getting closer.


In the last paragraph of my previous post (when I was addressing the faith we all have in Japan built Toyotas no matter the different feelings we have about Toyotas manufactured elsewhere) I was thinking how great it is to have such faith in a company that has a wide enough product line that a customer can temporarily change course and then change back again if the original product is still worthy. If my Yaris lasts 4-5 years into the French production of the Yaris, that would probably be long enough to assess if a drop in quality from Japanese production has occurred. If my Yaris doesn't last that long I can always buy the Prius C/Yaris Hybrid/Aqua which is scheduled (from what I've read) to have production remain in Japan during the run of its current generation. I then could go back to the French built Yaris equivalent after the 'C' if the quality has remained at the level of my original Yaris.

One of the questions this thread triggered in my mind is what are the production location issues in the Honda Fit universe. I did a search and learned that the U.S. spec Fit will also be experiencing a migration re its production location. Starting with the 2014 model year, the U.S. spec Fit will be assembled in Mexico. A different hit on the same search discussed Honda's plans to cut its vehicle production within Japan by 50 percent by moving that production elsewhere. Yet another hit suggested that one of the motivations behind such plans is that Honda recently lost the #2 spot among Japanese auto makers to Nissan. The strong Yen is really having an effect accross the industry.

[bronsin]

A French Yaris? Doesnt bear thinking about!

If that happens I will be going with a Mazda 2. My Miatas have been outstanding cars every bit as good as the Toyotas.

Besides this waterpump shit is turning me off Toyotas!

[bronsin]

Pretty scary how long some of these posts are getting, eh?