AWD info

[myfirstyota]

Seriously guys. Is this possible?

I have no issues cutting up the floor, making custom parts, or welding them all up after.

I'm looking to turn my lifted blue 2008 hatchback into an awd snow monster.

I know there was a first gen awd, but it doesnt look like those suspension parts will fit.

I'm looking to keep this a manual transmission.

Ether powered by a 1nz or 2zr. I dont want to deal with cable throttles and engine management.

I can only assume a rav4 would be the most practical choice for a rear differential. Its plentiful and easy to get.

I'm gonna have to fabricate a differential mount, which would be pretty straightforward, no sense in going there.

Anyone have any thoughts on rear suspension?

Anyone know if an older rav4 transmission will bolt up to a 1nz or 2zr engine?

All thoughts and opinions welcome.

[myfirstyota]

According to wiki these were the gasoline engines available in the 2000 to 2005 second gen. Rav4

1.8 L 1ZZ-FE I4 (gasoline)
2.0 L 1AZ-FE I4 (gasoline)
2.4 L 2AZ-FE I4 (gasoline)

Looks to me like the transmissions associated with these engines would fit a 2zr-fe, which is a relatively easy swap.

What say?

[CrankyOldMan]

Why not an AWD second gen from Japan? It would be RHD but in theory you can cut the spot welds from the floor pan and Frankenstein it back together. Canada allows 15yo cars without North American safety/emissions to be imported iirc, relatively inexpensive as well.

[CrankyOldMan]

Read your comments on the MCM swap thread and moved my reply here.

The 1st gen RAV4 was based on the 3S engine, not a bolt-on option for the C50/150 family as far as I know. The 2nd gen was ZZ/AZ based, which means compatible bell housings for the C56 and C60 potentially exist for a 1ZZ model, so there's some hope for that tiny part of the swap.

I also agree with the concerns of the AWD Vitz drive train not being able to handle a lot of power since it was engineered around 1.0/1.3 L engines. That said, the brackets and some of the hardware may be interchangeable with the RAV4 running gear, hard to know for sure until you pull the trigger and source some.

[myfirstyota]

Originally Posted by CrankyOldMan

Why not an AWD second gen from Japan? It would be RHD but in theory you can cut the spot welds from the floor pan and Frankenstein it back together. Canada allows 15yo cars without North American safety/emissions to be imported iirc, relatively inexpensive as well.

After some quick research I see a couple issues with importing a jdm model.

The first problem I realized is the canadian 15 year old import rule. A 2006 vitz isn't 15 years old yet. Gonna have to wait a year or 2 for that option.

Second problem (for me) is the jdm awd transmission choices. You can get any trans you want as long as it's an automatic cvt. Heartbreaking. I could never drive a cvt and enjoy it. So the trans would be garbage to me or anyone else in north america.

3rd issue is the overall cost to import a car. Sure the car is only $1400cad but theres about $4500 of import fees on top of that. So ballpark 6 grand to import an awd jdm vitz....to Vancouver. I still gotta get that car to Toronto.

Even if I did all that and paid the money, the only parts we figure are useable (for this manual trans awd left hand drive swap) is the floorplan and rear suspension. We all seem in doubt if the rear diff from the 1.3L awd vitz will hold up to a 2zr and my driving style, so I wouldn't want to use the diff either.

If the rav diff and vitz diff have the same spline count, I'd imagine the rear axles could be used though.

So it import an awd vitz I figure I'd get use of the floorplan, rear suspension and axles.

[WeeYari]

Not that it would impact your decision making one bit, but the Gen2 Vitz was introduced as a 2005 model year. Just a but of fyi.

[Leegamer]

Sounds like fitting the second gen Rav4 stuff might be more cost-effective, at least due to availability. Not sure how difficult it would be to adapt the rear suspension and make space for the driveshaft, though.

[myfirstyota]

Originally Posted by WeeYari

Not that it would impact your decision making one bit, but the Gen2 Vitz was introduced as a 2005 model year. Just a but of fyi.

I thought I noticed that while searching through all gens of awd jdm vitz. The 2005 jdm models looks like our 2006.

Good info. Thanks WeeYari

[myfirstyota]

Originally Posted by Leegamer

Sounds like fitting the second gen Rav4 stuff might be more cost-effective, at least due to availability. Not sure how difficult it would be to adapt the rear suspension and make space for the driveshaft, though.

Yea I'm not sure if adapting the rear suspension from the rav4 is the most practical idea. Pretty sure the rav has an independent rear suspension while the yaris/vitz has a torsion beam.

I may have noticed a possible substitute for the awd vitz rear torsion beam. The yaris axle has no provisions for the rear CV shaft to enter the rear wheel bearing to drive the wheel. Anyone know if a 2000-2005 echo rear axle bolts into the yaris?!? Lol it would appear this axle has room for the cv shaft to enter the wheel bearing.

[Maritime]

What about adapting some bits from an ATV or side by side? they'd be smaller but still robust enough for a Yaris. I know in the Honda world, the CRV AWD system shares parts with 3-4 ATV's. When the U-Joint shits the bed for example you have to buy the whole drive shaft form Honda Auto, but the U-Joint exactly the same can be just bought for the ATV and saves you 8-900 bucks.

to elaborate, If you can get a transmission with a drive shaft for the rear, you can maybe adapt an ATV rear or front end diff with axles and hubs etc. to it.

[Maritime]

Oh and I love this Idea a lot.

[myfirstyota]

You're right, some sort of custom length driveshaft will probably be needed. Theres actually quite a few driveline and bearing shops just to the east of me in oshawa.

I have a strong desire to keep this as oem as possible though. Not necessarily model specific (ie a rav diff in a yaris), but use toyota parts where possible.

It may be naive of me to think, but if everything is installed where it should be (ie correct driveshaft angles and such) I shouldn't have many problems with broken parts. The ravs are apparently just as bulletproof as a yaris. But maybe I think that way cause of my 4"lift kit. Over 20,000km and no issues yet!

And to touch on Honda, I seen a YouTube video where a guy bolted crv rear end bits onto a civic. Kinda pissed me off a bit lol honda guys have it easy. Awd, endless motor setups, big power for cheap and all the support you could ask for. But easy isn't challenging :)

I do think the rear suspension will be the hardest thing to make work.

[Maritime]

Originally Posted by myfirstyota

You're right, some sort of custom length driveshaft will probably be needed. Theres actually quite a few driveline and bearing shops just to the east of me in oshawa.

I have a strong desire to keep this as oem as possible though. Not necessarily model specific (ie a rav diff in a yaris), but use toyota parts where possible.

It may be naive of me to think, but if everything is installed where it should be (ie correct driveshaft angles and such) I shouldn't have many problems with broken parts. The ravs are apparently just as bulletproof as a yaris. But maybe I think that way cause of my 4"lift kit. Over 20,000km and no issues yet!

And to touch on Honda, I seen a YouTube video where a guy bolted crv rear end bits onto a civic. Kinda pissed me off a bit lol honda guys have it easy. Awd, endless motor setups, big power for cheap and all the support you could ask for. But easy isn't challenging :)

LOL you are correct on Ravs, Had a 1998 that went over 500K with only a few rust issues, I'd still have it if it wasn't written off by shady iunsurance when a lady ran a stop sign and clipped me. As for Honda, I have a Pilot, had a CRV have motorcycles, civics etc. They are easy and bullet proof. My 79 GL1000 had 7 parts that swapped into my 92 civic. when a part works, it works and they use it accross all their platforms.

That said look into Dhaihatsu Hijets (Toyota) they have 4wd systems and manual transmissions etc.

[Maritime]

http://hijet.forumotion.com/t1828-as...the-4wd-system I wonder if the front diff could be used in the back in 4 HI and make the car full time 4wd?

[myfirstyota]

A little more picture surfing and I think my trans assumption is not valid for a 2nd gen. The bellhousing looks nothing like a yaris transmission. There may still be a chance with the first gen rav however. I'll keep looking.

[Maritime]

Wonder if you could swap a whole engine and transmission etc. from a first Gen 4wd 2 door Manual?

[myfirstyota]

Originally Posted by Maritime

http://hijet.forumotion.com/t1828-as...the-4wd-system I wonder if the front diff could be used in the back in 4 HI and make the car full time 4wd?

My only issue with that is can a diff designed for 80 horsepower handle my 2zr with a couple bolt ons?

[Maritime]

From what I've read they can handle a lot more power than given from factory. the components are used in larger engine rigs outside of Japan. the Kei restrictions keep the power down etc but if you look at other non-Kei models in the lineup of toyota, same parts are used, just harder to find than the kei.