Fuel Economy

[jdium]

diesel empeegees > gasoline empeegees http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smilies/expressive/tilt.gif

I'd like a small 600cc car if I knew I didn't have to drive much at freeway speeds or up anything steeper than a crushed dixey cup...

[churp]

Thought I'd post a copy of my mileage spreadsheat....maybe a little boring, but someone may be interested.

[churp]

I have also had a Honda 600. If I remember correctly, it was a car with a two-stroke engine. In the place where I lived then, I think it was called Honda N600. Just can't remember clearly. It was a frugal car but I believe it won't pass the stringent exhaust tests of today.
Also, I have been told that small engines enjoy very good fuel economy in city traffic but loose their advantage to slightly bigger engines at highway speeds. Correct me if I am wrong.
The small Honda may have given me good memories but rationally, it should possibly be inferior to the Yaris in almost every important respect.

It was a 4 stroke, air cooled, 2 cylinder....and yes it was inferior to any car built today, but fun. I always got 30 mpg, town or hwy, because of leadfoot disease. I saw one win best mileage in a rally at 60 mpg, but was disqualified because of emissions....I think the govenment is wrong using parts/million in their standards, it should be parts per mile---then we would really get rid of the large displacement engines (a 454 ci engine puts out 12 times as much exhaust as the 600cc). Yes, I think it was a n600, they had a sedan which was a total block and the coupe which was a smoothed block.

[sherryberry]

HOLY COW, CHURP.. that's one detailed spreadsheet! lol

[swng]

Re: Posts #1541-1542.
Thanks churp for sharing your data and your good memories! It is the nice and knowledgeable people like you that make me come back to watch this thread time and again.
It appears from your spread sheet that your mpg numbers are very good. If you are not hypermiling (frankly, it appears from the numbers that you are not), you must have been driving very conscientiously. Your lead foot disease must have healed completely.

[churp]

Re: Posts #1541-1542.
..... Your lead foot disease must have healed completely.

The first 1.5 months it maybe came back for a while....but it may not have been broken in, and at that point I put on the Megan springs and aired the tires to 40 psi. As far as hypermiling the only thing I do is (most of the time) I coast down 1 hill (about 1/2 mile) in neutral going and coming from work, 40 mile round trip. Most of my miles driven are 2 lane blacktop at 55-65 mph, but I've taken 2 1k trips at 70-80 mph.

I'm happy with the automatic, although I'm sure the 5sp would do better.

[g man]

Hey Can you send a copy of that spread sheet??

[swidd]

With my manual Yaris, bought used with 8300 miles on it two weeks ago:
Tank1:
37.8MPG, n00b driving, 80% city, traffic jams. 170 miles. Tire pressure 32psi.
Tank2:
277 miles, 35.2MPG, 70% highway going 75-80mph, trying to "hypermile" by turning off engine in intersections and tailgating trucks/trailers to lessen drag. Tire pressure 32psi with 28psi on right front tire, causing right turning tendency and unstable handling.
Tank3:
402 miles, 40.5MPG, 75% highway, one 70 mile trip to the top of a mountain (8000 feet altitude, 6000 feet altitude gain/ascent), three 52-mile trips to work, one 122 mile trip to another place of work and about 5 trips in city stop&go traffic. 60-65mph even on interstate, turning off engine as often as I can, including in downhill traffic and rolling into my parking spot. Tire pressure increased to 38psi on all tires, noticeable reduction in rolling resistance and improved handling.
Tank 4 - filled today: Cost for filling up: $30.29. 9.917 gallons, which means I had well over a gallon left. In the future I will drive to 400 miles and then start looking for a gas station somewhere in the next 50 miles!! (still had two bars left when I filled it up at 402 miles).

I drive about 2700 miles/month.

With my Yaris:
- The 52 mile round trip to local place of work costs $4.
- The 177 mile round trip to distant place of work costs $13 driving 70mph, $15 if keeping up with traffic at 80mph.
- Cars are constantly stuck behind me trying to pass, constantly tailgating and signaling for me to speed up.
- My estimated monthly gas expense is just around $210/month.
- I will visit the gas station five times less per month than before. This translates to less soda, ice cream, hot dogs etc. I will lose weight because of Yaris!:bellyroll:

With my old Ford Explorer V8:
- The 52 mile round trip to local place of work would cost $12.
- The 177 mile round trip to distant place of work usually cost $27 dollar if I drove 5 below speed limit - $32-$35 if I followed the traffic flow at 80mph. Minimum pay at this place of work is $40/day if activity is low, so there goes my profit.... I would be at the gas station every day to have enough fuel for the round trip.
- I drove up the mountain mentioned above, with over 3/4 tank of gas (about 16-17 gallons). I drove down the mountain 70 miles later with tank empty light flashing!! (engine didn't handle increase in altitude very well.....).
- Cars would still be stuck behind me due to my slow driving, but would not signal for me to get out of the way.
- My monthly gas expense was $550/month (using premium gas to obtain higher MPG - cost would be slightly higher using regular gasoline which in my experience gave significant reduction in MPG).

[g man]

Has anyone experimented with the difference between regular and premium fuel in the Yaris, Is there a worthwhile gain to justify the extra cost?

Glenn

[BailOut]

swidd:

Good stuff, and it will only get better as you dial it in some more. :)

g_man:

You just opened up a flamefest-worthy topic, but I'll bite. First let me say I am not a scientist nor an automotive engineer. I'm just a Joe Six Pack that did his own testing, using his own driving style.

As most of you know, my driving style is feather-light, as is the hypermiling way.

I tried 89 octane for 3 tanks and lost 8% of my MPG.

Yes, my ignition timing didn't retard as much with the higher octane (on average 89 octane was 6 points advanced), and there was a small amount of more torque available (i.e. I could climb Mount Rose to Thomas Creek in 5th gear WOT instead of 4th gear 80%), but it simply used more fuel to accomplish these things.

87 octane and a light driving style is where the efficiency is at.

[leasaunce]

quick question, does the hatchback (liftback) Yaris has the "how many Litre/100km" gauge? (the australia version)

[Masteraal]

quick question, does the hatchback (liftback) Yaris has the "how many Litre/100km" gauge? (the australia version)

it wouldnt be extremely accurate anyway. easiest way is to divide the km done by the litres put into the car at the servo

[Bredayaris]

What octane number is standard in the USA for example?

Here in the Netherlands for petrol it's 95 and 98, anyway not lower than 95.

[g man]

I believe standard Octain in the States and Canada is 87 for regular fuel.

[BailOut]

It can vary a bit in the U.S., but I'd say that at least 90% of the stations in the country serve 87 (regular), 89 (super) and 93 (premium or supreme) octane, with most vehicles capable of working with the 87.

Like just about every other measurement system, the U.S. uses a screwed up one when it comes to measuring octane. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating#Measurement_methods

[g man]

keep in mind what some have been saying on this site. Don't let your fuel level get too low since apparently the gas pump motor is cooled by the gas in the tank? Don't know if this is true but if it is then its a good reason to fill at 1/4 tank.

[g man]

I agree Bailout

I had a 1983 Reneau Alliance Remember they partnered with AMC. Anyway it had a 60 HP 4 cyl and we managed just fine with it. You just have to be carefull merging on the highway but it worked.

[Masteraal]

What octane number is standard in the USA for example?

Here in the Netherlands for petrol it's 95 and 98, anyway not lower than 95.

US 87 is RON 91
89 - RON 95
93 - RON 98 i think

[petesimac]

My most recent tank: 95% city, 5% hwy = 34.23 mpg!

[alhope34]

In Toronto we get 87 octane as standard, 89 and 91 as premiums, and only one gas station offers more than 91, which is Sunoco. They offer "ultra94" which, as you can probably tell, 94 octane. Has anyone ever tried those octane boosters in the yaris? I've seen some from NOS that say they make any pump gas into 113 octane race fuel. Does that stuff really work? what would it do to our engines if used?

[churp]

In Toronto we get 87 octane as standard, 89 and 91 as premiums, and only one gas station offers more than 91, which is Sunoco. They offer "ultra94" which, as you can probably tell, 94 octane. Has anyone ever tried those octane boosters in the yaris? I've seen some from NOS that say they make any pump gas into 113 octane race fuel. Does that stuff really work? what would it do to our engines if used?

To me the only reason to use it would be if you had a real high compression 'toy' that would require it all the time to run....or a turbo that you wanted to kick the boost up ocassionally.

Otherwise.....+1 with PK198105

[swng]

In Toronto we get 87 octane as standard, 89 and 91 as premiums, and only one gas station offers more than 91, which is Sunoco. They offer "ultra94" which, as you can probably tell, 94 octane. Has anyone ever tried those octane boosters in the yaris? I've seen some from NOS that say they make any pump gas into 113 octane race fuel. Does that stuff really work? what would it do to our engines if used?

Fuel of octane numbers up to 94 are quite widely available in the Greater Vancouver Area. Petrol Canada and some other gas stations everywhere sell them all the time. However, like in Toronto, as you have said, 87 is still the standard (regular) fuel.
IMHO, cars need to be designed to take advantage of high octane fuels in order to really benefit from them. As far as I know, the Yaris is not designed to take advantage of very high octane numbers. I have tried a tank of octane 92 which is high but not exceedingly high and have not noticed any significant difference in terms of mpg. Yet admittedly, a short period of experiment in an uncontrolled environment can hardly be regarded as conclusive. Anyhow, the car's computer, aka ECU will take care of any slight change in the octane number of the fuel. Whether high numbers up to, say, 113 are still within or already outside the computers manageable range is beyond my limited knowledge.
As many of us have noticed, this is a much debated subject (NB: this is an understatement:wink:) and I would prefer to leave it here. The bottom line is using slightly higher octane fuel will very probably not do harm to the engine of the Yaris. Honestly, though I cannot remember where, I have read articles/posts saying that a car that requires regular fuel may benefit from a higher octane number when its engine is old and under-maintained, or when it is required to work very hard to carry heavy loads or drive up very long and steep slops.
In short, I tend to believe the two gentlemen above:smile:.
Something for further reference:http://en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/Guides_and_Advice/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=5156081
http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/SavingandDebt/SaveonaCar/20waysYouWasteMoneyOnYourCar.aspx

[alhope34]

its a temporary fix , that does more harm than anything. some of these additives create deposits in the fuel line ,pistons etc. plus the injectors dont like this stuff. its a Yaris not a rocket ship use normal fuel.


Of course I will only use normal gas for the Yaris, just wanted to know what it would do if used. Haha, I don't see a point of buying a can of this stuff for $20. Just curious. And I know with cars meant for premium, it makes a difference. One of my friends has a 1997 acura TL with the 3.2 engine auto trans, he says he sees a 40km difference between a tank of 87 and a tank of 91. Another friend has an '89 mustang GT cobra, and his engine gets real bad knock if he uses anything except 91 and 94 octanes. Even my own experience when I had my 94 Probe GT 2.5L MTX, I would see about 50kms less on a tank of 87 octane and there would be a noticeable loss in power and the engine would bog down sometimes with 87 if I put 100% throttle from a stop. The one thing I don't like about buying premium is the mark up in price. I was reading an article somewhere saying that 91 only costs the gas stations 2-2.5 cents a litre more than 87, but on average they charge 10 cents a litre more for 91 over 87. But then if 91 was only 3 cents a litre more, I'm sure most people would be buying 91. All in all, from what I've read, cars designed to run on 87 should be used with 87, as the higher octane won't get power worth the cost over 87.

[landrym28]

On average, I can get between 620 and 650km per tank...which works out to be in the 40mpg range...give or take, since It's a 42L tank(roughly 11 gallons)

[swng]

On average, I can get between 620 and 650km per tank...which works out to be in the 40mpg range...give or take, since It's a 42L tank(roughly 11 gallons)
Not bad indeed! The traffic on the beautiful PEI must be quite smooth these days!

[landrym28]

Not bad indeed! The traffic on the beautiful PEI must be quite smooth these days!


It's pretty good...well, when construction workers aren't working on main highways in the middle of summer! So yeah, it might not be a smooth ride, even in a Yaris. :laugh:


I am going to work on my "lead foot" problem. Quite a few Yaris drivers have told me they can get close to 800km on a tank..which is closer to the 50mpg that toyota lists for the Yaris. For once, I'd like to see my numbers get that high! :laugh:

[swng]

It's pretty good...well, when construction workers aren't working on main highways in the middle of summer! So yeah, it might not be a smooth ride, even in a Yaris. :laugh:


I am going to work on my "lead foot" problem. Quite a few Yaris drivers have told me they can get close to 800km on a tank..which is closer to the 50mpg that toyota lists for the Yaris. For once, I'd like to see my numbers get that high! :laugh:

Good additional info! Keep posting your data as you go, please! Just not sure Toyota says 50 mpg:tongue:. Must be an all highway number. Anyway, I think amongst non-hypermilers, only UncleYaris (a fellow member) has once posted an mpg number exceeding 50 (refers to Imperial gallons). Forgive me Uncle, if you are in fact a hypermiler or if I remember your numbers incorrectly.
Cheers!

[landrym28]

Good additional info! Keep posting your data as you go, please! Just not sure Toyota says 50 mpg:tongue:. Must be an all highway number. Anyway, I think amongst non-hypermilers, only UncleYaris (a fellow member) has once posted an mpg number exceeding 50 (refers to Imperial gallons). Forgive me Uncle, if you are in fact a hypermiler or if I remember your numbers incorrectly.
Cheers!


Yep, it was 40 for city driving, and 50 for highway driving. Usually, i'm about 70% city, 30% highway.

I'm actually leaving PEI and moving to Saint John, New Brunswick tomorrow(Thursday), so I'll drive a little bit slower to get there, to see if I can get any better mileage (The speed limit is 110km/hour, but I usually do 125 or 130...I'll try sticking around 110 and seeing what happens).

[swng]

Wish you all the best for the move!
Safe and happy and ECONOMICAL motoring!

[joyts]

OK, I know, not representative for the time being, because it the first time I have refuelled it...

http://www.spritmonitor.de/de/detailansicht/197750.html

And currently -after 1 1/2 weeks owning the car- my board computer says 7.0l / 100km. But due to the rush hour I mostly drive slow up to 80km/h - just sometimes up to 120km/h.

greetz
joyts

[swng]

OK, I know, not representative for the time being, because it the first time I have refuelled it...

http://www.spritmonitor.de/de/detailansicht/197750.html

And currently -after 1 1/2 weeks owning the car- my board computer says 7.0l / 100km. But due to the rush hour I mostly drive slow up to 80km/h - just sometimes up to 120km/h.

greetz
joyts

As I have been suspecting, the Yari in Europe are fitted with an onboard computer, which can help improve fuel economy by providing virtually instant feedback to the drivers so that they can know how do their driving styles affect their cars' F.E.
Thank you joyts!

[Ron]

to give you guys an update, just finished a 4200km road trip from Vancouver to Yellowstone National Park and back. Total overall average was about 6.1km/100km for the whole trip, or 38.5mpg. Not a fantastic number imo, but taken into account that 1/4-1/3 of the driving was done at 110km/h-130km/h (70-85mph), it was to be expected. I drive a 5dr auto liftback, had my fiance and myself in the car with the rearseats folded down and the back packed with camp gear. Even managed to fit a wedding dress in the back on the way home :)

In Yellowstone Park, we saw a fantabulous reading of 405km with the 4th bar of gas just expiring from a regular fill up, on the way to a 700km tank! I usually read about or just under 300km at this point when I am commuting to work and driving about in the city. I attribute this to travelling at speeds of 70-85km/h (~45'ish mph) and longer trips than typical city driving, although we did stop, start and go to see all the different things and wildlife in the park.

This was not my ideal choice in roadtrip vehicle, but her car was in the bodyshop due to an accident. The versatility of the hatch was great, we would have preferred to have the privacy of her trunk though. My lowering springs provided a decent but stiff ride. The only thing I really wished for was cruise control, but life goes on. We found out that it was a great roadtrip vehicle for the future, for the two of us anyways, and came up 20% under our planned fuel budget for the trip if we were to use her car!

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j81/ron_ufo/DSCF0233.jpg
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j81/ron_ufo/DSCF0130.jpg

[swng]

Thank you Ron for the vivid description.
I believe the 38.5 mpg number you quoted refers to the US gallon. It is perfect to quote mpg numbers in US gallons terms but for additional reference purposes I would like to add that 6.1 liters per 100 km should be about 46.33 miles per Imperial gallon, good considering the load that you carried and all other factors that you described in your above post.
You mentioned something about a wedding dress. I wish to say "Congratulations!"
Also, nice pictures!

[Goalie]

I put this on another 07 VS 08 thread but did you guys notice that the 08 brocures reduce the mileage estimates reduced from 40 down to 36 MPG. Any info there or thougths?? Does this reflect 07 false estimates???

Just got my 07 LB today!!! Sweeeeeeet.

[BailOut]

The 2008 MPG numbers are lower because the EPA has changed their testing to be more like how a country full of aggressive, testosterone-infested, jerk-headed and inattentive drivers drive rather than how intelligent, level-headed and attentive people are expected and intended to drive.

[alhope34]

So basically, more realistic mpg then? Seems like the better idea, nobody who would drive normally would ever get the mpg most companies claimed their cars to get. The most mpg I've calculated on the Yaris for one tank of gas was 32mpg. Refilled at 1/4 tank, forget how many km's but it was 100% highway.

[black2yaris]

if I can keep my foot out of it .. I get about 39/40 mpg just driving normally as half my commute is freeway ,the rest is crossing San Francisco on City streets ..

[roxy84]

sorry, but i think its B.S. when people say "no one can drive normally and get posted mileage figures" or "we need more realistic figures."

on this forum and corolla forums, there are tons of people who drive their corollas and yarii "normally" (that is which minimal effort, just driving reasonably) who get or exceed the pre 2008 mileage figures.

i think MOST drivers are in denial about their driving habits. some people may have gotten cars that are mileage "lemons", but those are few and far between.

[bnther36]

I went through 3 brand new cars in 7 months for exactly that reason...they didn't do what was advertised on the sticker. I've only ever had 2 cars that exceeded what the sticker said. The first was a Chevy Cavalier and the second is my Yaris.

[Goalie]

You would ditch a car if it did not get the mileage advertised??? How did you pull that off at the dealer. Did they actually take the car back or penalize you on miles, depreciation and the like?

My 96 Ford Aspire 1.3 ltr did anywhere from 37-42MPG in summer and 34-38MPG in winter. I assume the warm ups and cold did that. The hotter it got, like over 85Deg, the better mileage it got. Hate to see it go. Bought it for 300 bucks, put on 70K and sold it for 500. People were having bidding wars at work to get that car from me. Took care of it and did good maintenance on it. It leaves tomorrow.

[black2yaris]

sorry, but i think its B.S. when people say "no one can drive normally and get posted mileage figures" or "we need more realistic figures."


Hey most people who say they can't get the listed milage figures, have No Idea on what their driving style really is ! They don't seem to look way down the road at all .The clueless slam on brakes just when they get close to a light , nail it when it turns green just to slam on brakes agin a block down the road at the next light , these are the same people who creast a hill with their foot in it then hit the brakes & stay on the brakes , half way down the other side of the hill . These people are the ones on yer ass following way to close, hitting the binders & gas petal in rapid order all the while Yakkin' on the cell & flashing their lites at you just cause you got 2 M/T car lengths in front of yourself . Now i'm no pussy when when it comes to driving , I nail it when i have to, pop off the line when needed to change lanes / pass someone . but I am aware of what is going on around me & in front of me . My brakes last a long time . a clear sign that i drive Smart ! OK, :flame: Rant Over !

[swng]

I agree to some salient points raised in some of the above posts and appreciate members' interest in the subject of this thread.
Most people who regularly visit this forum/thread know why some people don't get good fuel economy. In fact, as far as the Yaris is concerned, if the goal is just to achieve EPA rated fuel economy, particulary the numbers that have been made more "realistic" recently, a driver just has to follow the free advice published widely by concerned parties all the time (http://www.google.ca/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4ADBF_enCA234&q=fuel+economy+tips). Basically, the guidelines consist of steps more or less like those shown here:
http://retail.petro-canada.ca/en/seasonalarticles/1687.aspx
There may still be many other sites that offer very similar advices. Some links have already been suggested in several previous posts here.

[sherryberry]

I already know what my driving style is. Sometimes I am in a rush so I do gas it and I don't like people passing me so I go faster to keep them from passing. I don't slam on the brakes a lot though. Just reasonably normal stopping. However, I have always gotten the posted city mileage.. except once when I wasn't the one driving. I always drive city and it's always 35mpg so it's accurate enough for me.

[swng]

I already know what my driving style is. Sometimes I am in a rush so I do gas it and I don't like people passing me so I go faster to keep them from passing. I don't slam on the brakes a lot though. Just reasonably normal stopping. However, I have always gotten the posted city mileage.. except once when I wasn't the one driving. I always drive city and it's always 35mpg so it's accurate enough for me.
:thumbsup:Good to know! Your post confirms my observation that one does not have to exert undue efforts to get the EPA rated fuel economy. One just has to follow the guite general guidelines suggested by my humble self and other members here time and again. Thank you! As far as not letting people pass you, do it as you like and as long as it is safe:smile::wink:. Your results are already quite satisfactory and from what you have described, it seems that you only have to pay a little more attention to the various fuel saving techniques to accomplish an even better result. Shouldn't be difficult. Also, "my" Yaris is now driven by my wife more. I do not have absolute control over the car's overall F.E. Yet, I have to let her drive. More mileage on the road generally means better safety.
Safe and happy motoring to you and everyone!

[landrym28]

I already know what my driving style is. Sometimes I am in a rush so I do gas it and I don't like people passing me so I go faster to keep them from passing.

Seriously, I hate it when people do that...but since you're driving a Yaris, I'll let it go :thumbsup:

[sherryberry]

well, it's more like when the lanes are turning into one lane and I can tell this person who has been behind me this whole entire time and they suddenly speed up to try and pass me and I know that they are going to get right back to being slow once the road has merged. That's usually why I do it. Other than that, I'm nice enough :smile:

[Goalie]

Does Toyota mess around with Flex Fuel set up's like Ford and Chevy? My 06 Camry is not approved. Nor is the Yaris. Never looked into that with any of the Toyota line up. Lots of E85 here in Wisconsin and Minnesota.

[swng]

Does Toyota mess around with Flex Fuel set up's like Ford and Chevy? My 06 Camry is not approved. Nor is the Yaris. Never looked into that with any of the Toyota line up. Lots of E85 here in Wisconsin and Minnesota.
You are probably right. According to P.178 of my owner's manual, ethanol up to 10% or MTBE up to 15% should be acceptable. The descriptions about what fuel to use are actually found on P.178-179. My car is a 06 RS Hatchback (Canadian model). I think the manuals for other Yari should probably contain similar descriptions. They are too long for here and I recommend that interested members read their own manuals for accurate and detailed information.
BTW, P.218-219 of my manual are about how to get good fuel economy and help extend the life of the car.

[Goalie]

All fuel here is like 10% ethanol. Unless you go WAY up in northern MN or WI. The E85 is like it says, at least 85% Ethanol. We went to South Dakota last summer in the 06Camry, got like a 3 MPG increase with the SD non ethanol fuel fill ups.

[swng]

We still have 100% gasoline (no ethanol) here in BC. All my mpg numbers quoted previously referred to 100% gasoline. Well, may be not 100% because there are additives in them. I don't know the details.

[Shroomster]

heh if it's allowed my 2001 civic sedan is averaging 30 mpg city and its an automatic...oh and it's got 78,xxx miles and I drive like 40+ a day commuting to work...
:(

[swng]

heh if it's allowed my 2001 civic sedan is averaging 30 mpg city and its an automatic...oh and it's got 78,xxx miles and I drive like 40+ a day commuting to work...
:(
I personally think that it is good to know how some of the rivals of the Yaris perform:smile:. The Civic is a very strong rival but its fuel economy is not as good as that of the Yaris. Even the Fit is slightly behind the Yaris when it comes to F.E.

[MarkBen]

Yes! Yes! Yes!!! I had a trip to Columbus, Oh this weekend from MD, and on the return tank of gas I averaged 43.16 MPG!! I did mostly 65-70mph and 95% highway with no special techniques. Man was I happy. I have been averaging about 33-34 since my third tank of gas, with a high of 37 mpg once. And I thought I would never hit 40.... man I love this car! :)

[flagmunkey]

got about 38 this time around. i inflated my tires and used lucas. im gonna try inflating more. im also gettin used to engine braking. learning how to use that more efficiently..

[bigdoglover]

last tank i got just under 35 mpg-mixed driving but i seemed to be stuck in construction traffic a lot on that tank.

[lloe]

I average between 35-38mpg. When I started out it was like 32 then broken in I was averaging 37-38 but now I take the freeway to work(while running late) and am averaging about 34-35.

[ECHOKnight2000]

I got the most mileage I had since I got new tires in June. When I got them my mileage went down. Not bad but certainly not as good. Today I managed 47mpg. Not my best but certainly better than 37mpg or 33mpg. yeah my standards are high when you hit 50mpg more than once:laugh::laugh::laugh::thumbsup:

Of course the warm weather helps:wink:

[ALY]

We still have 100% gasoline (no ethanol) here in BC. All my mpg numbers quoted previously referred to 100% gasoline. Well, may be not 100% because there are additives in them. I don't know the details.

Mohawk/Husky uses approx 10% Ethanol in BC.

[BailOut]

While E10 certainly dings your mileage it's not the end of the world. I've pulled several 50+ MPG tanks and my liftback has never seen straight gasoline. Both Nevada and California (the only 2 States I've fueled up in so far) are E10 year round and E10 RFG (reformulated gasoline) in the Winter.

[marcus]

i noticed that regular driving city full tank will get me about 580-590 km compare that to hwy drove to go fishing on one full tank 90 % hwy. its about 640-660 km assuming that last bar is 50km travel. my gain for driving on hwy is about 50km more... kinna odd where my old celica city wise is about 350 km and full hwy 550 km...thats 200 km difference..wow big difference..same driving habits. i even gunned my celica up to 180 km/hr at that camp trip; still got over 500 km on full tank.

[swng]

Mohawk/Husky uses approx 10% Ethanol in BC.
True, I have tried Mohawk in my former car. Didn't give me good fuel economy and starting took a couple of seconds more to crank (may be for my car only). Otherwise not too different from the regular stuff. When I said "we still have" (Post #1591), I meant we could still find:smile:.

[Goalie]

First tank full, made it 377 miles till the last blip started blinking 37.26 MPG. 5 speed with AC on the entire time.

Sweeeeeeeeet:headbang:

[swidd]

I got 43.63MPG on todays fill-up, tires at 41PSI, driving 65mph 80% highway. Was stuck in traffic a few times. Turns off engine at red lights most of the time.

[BailOut]

I've set a new personal record. I fueled up this morning with 8.453 gallons after 444.1 miles for 52.538 MPG. :smile:

[marcus]

ok i got 620 km and filled up to 38.5 liter of gas =16.1km/liter. 45.5m/gal, 6.2liter/100 km.

[enkid]

One thing I've noticed using the SGII and different driving styles and road conditions:

The ECU seems to adjust/tune the performance to the style and conditions of driving over a period of time...for example, if I go from Providence to Boston and back on a warm summer day, and do 70 to 80 MPH, my gas mileage will be in the low 40's that day.....then the next day, same weather, same route, if I semi-hypermile the FE will only be a little better - mid/high 40's....but the following day it'll be back up to 52 - 55 MPG. I've noticed this about a dozen times this summer. The same thing seems to happen when and after rainy weather impacts the FE. The conditions of the previous trip seem to affect the FE performance of the current trip. Could it be that for many drivers, the capability of realizing this really high gas mileage with the Yaris is never noticed because it takes a couple of days of conservative driving under good conditions before it happens?

[swng]

Follow up to Post #1523, Page 102:

Fuel Cost
$40 Canadian

Distance travelled
553.6 km
344.01 miles

Fuel Amount
38.32 litres
10.12 US gallons
8.43 Imperial gallons

Cost of Fuel
$1.04 per litre
$3.95 per US gallon
$4.75 per Imperial gallon

Fuel Economy
6.92 litres per 100 km
33.98 miles per US gallon
40.81 miles per Imperial gallon

Mileage Costs
7.2254 ¢ents per km
11.63 ¢ents per mile

No significant change to driving conditions except wife drives more than I do. See Post # 1523 and also: http://www.gassavers.org/garage/viewgaslog/264. Also, we have encountered a lot of road works which created traffic jams. We always drive for maximum safety and comfort but do not waste fuel unnecessarily. In essence, we drive the Yaris like it is a family car and in that sense, the fuel economy numbers should not be too different from those of a typical common Yaris user.
Results have become quite consistent. Fuel calculator used:.http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/tools/fuel-trip-calculator/fuel-calculator-input.cfm?attr=16.
Easy to use. Just copy the result and paste it to the post. Uses up some space though. Fortunately there seems to be no shortage of space here.

[swng]

One thing I've noticed using the SGII and different driving styles and road conditions:

The ECU seems to adjust/tune the performance to the style and conditions of driving over a period of time...for example, if I go from Providence to Boston and back on a warm summer day, and do 70 to 80 MPH, my gas mileage will be in the low 40's that day.....then the next day, same weather, same route, if I semi-hypermile the FE will only be a little better - mid/high 40's....but the following day it'll be back up to 52 - 55 MPG. I've noticed this about a dozen times this summer. The same thing seems to happen when and after rainy weather impacts the FE. The conditions of the previous trip seem to affect the FE performance of the current trip. Could it be that for many drivers, the capability of realizing this really high gas mileage with the Yaris is never noticed because it takes a couple of days of conservative driving under good conditions before it happens?
I agree. I do not have a scangauge on my Yaris but I do have something like a trip computer on my other car with which I also get better than EPA fuel economy: http://www.gassavers.org/garage/viewgaslog/266?. I do share your observations. I have been suspecting that I might have been too subjective but now I am more inclined to think that the ECU remembers things.

[Shroomster]

One thing I've noticed using the SGII and different driving styles and road conditions:

The ECU seems to adjust/tune the performance to the style and conditions of driving over a period of time...for example, if I go from Providence to Boston and back on a warm summer day, and do 70 to 80 MPH, my gas mileage will be in the low 40's that day.....then the next day, same weather, same route, if I semi-hypermile the FE will only be a little better - mid/high 40's....but the following day it'll be back up to 52 - 55 MPG. I've noticed this about a dozen times this summer. The same thing seems to happen when and after rainy weather impacts the FE. The conditions of the previous trip seem to affect the FE performance of the current trip. Could it be that for many drivers, the capability of realizing this really high gas mileage with the Yaris is never noticed because it takes a couple of days of conservative driving under good conditions before it happens?


most al cars with FI do this. because the computer sends info for how much output from the injectors it wants. thats why if any of you ever go on a trip that first tank is not the best...the second and subsequent tanks are...everything is calculated from how much throttle to o2 temps....

[Rain]

I've set a new personal record. I fueled up this morning with 8.453 gallons after 444.1 miles for 52.538 MPG. :smile:

wow that's good :thumbup:

[bogey mo]

just finished my first tank...630 km on the full tank from the dealer...doing mostly hwy km from oakville to scarborough on .. approx 60 km one way...approx 140 km avg speed with air...im soooo happppy! lol 6.4 L /100km is the shiza!!!

[roxy84]

i think shes gettin broken in. previous 4 tanks:

431.8 mi/10.17 gal=42.4 mpg
424.9 mi/10.016 gal=42.42 mpg
427.3 mi/10.041 gal=42.55 mpg
422.8 mi/9.88 gal=42.79 mpg

my latest tank 406.2 mi/9.16 gal=44.34 mpg--identical driving pattern to the previous 4 tanks. (oops, i just remembered that i changed the tire pressure from 32 psi to 36 psi before this tank, so that may be the reason for the increase)

[YarisPR]

My car has never pass the 250 miles per tank.:mad: I don't know if it is my style of driving :burnrubber: or the fact that I drive on City 24/7 there is no highway where I live and PR is consider extreme driving conditions due to the constant stop and go (stop lights and traffic jams). And lets not forget the constant hill climbs. I really don't know but its not what I expected from a 30+ MPG car

[death is my gift]

My car has never pass the 250 miles per tank.:mad: I don't know if it is my style of driving :burnrubber: or the fact that I drive on City 24/7 there is no highway where I live and PR is consider extreme driving conditions due to the constant stop and go (stop lights and traffic jams). And lets not forget the constant hill climbs. I really don't know but its not what I expected from a 30+ MPG car

I'm pretty much the same. Last tank I got 288 miles. All city, stop and go, red lights. Plus, I drive hard. The gas pedal is my friend.

[nsmitchell]

I did about 50/50 city hwy and got 35MPG.

[BailOut]

Due to my usage of advanced efficiency techniques my mileage in the city is the same as it is on the highway. In the city I have to accelerate many times over short distances due to stop lights and such but that's about the only time my engine is actually running. On the highway the driving is much lighter on the throttle (lots of pulse and glide, never over 55 MPH, etc.) but my engine is running about 98% of the time in order to maintain a speed.

The two sets of techniques end up at the same mileage every time.

[bogey mo]

i've found city driving to be similar as well..although I am a manual driver and am able to avoid stopping whenever possible...if people all drove standard cars..we'd all be better drivers!!!

[nsmitchell]

Due to my usage of advanced efficiency techniques my mileage in the city is the same as it is on the highway. In the city I have to accelerate many times over short distances due to stop lights and such but that's about the only time my engine is actually running. On the highway the driving is much lighter on the throttle (lots of pulse and glide, never over 55 MPH, etc.) but my engine is running about 98% of the time in order to maintain a speed.

The two sets of techniques end up at the same mileage every time.

You must use the "Little Miss Sunshine" method of taking off. hehe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4O5cTnX8iw
If you haven't seen the movie, you should.

[swng]

Thank you all friends for the discussion about fuel economy in ctiy traffic in the previous posts.

IMHO, as far as fuel economy is concerned, the Yaris is basically designed with city driving in mind without losing sight on the possibility of not infrequent highway trips. I base my opinion on the fact that whilst the Yaris gets practically the best fuel economy in city traffic among cars in the same class, yet on the highway, its F.E. whilst still good, is no better than that of its heavier sibling, the Corolla, with a bigger (1.8 liter) engine. Here are the ratings:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorCompareSideBySide.jsp?column=1&id=23548
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorCompareSideBySide.jsp?column=1&id=22749

My wife and I drive our Yaris not too differently from any ordinary person driving a family car, in the city and on the highway alike, and our mpg numbers are comfortably above the EPA's average rating. Note that the traffic that we drive in is by no means smooth. The car carries two people plus belongings most of the time. The sound system and the AC are also on most of the time. We always drive for maximum safety and comfort, though fuel is not wasted unnecessarily.

I believe fellow members here can all achieve better and better results as they gradually become more and more fuel economy conscious. I wish to encourage those who have not yet been enjoying the good fuel economy that can be expected from a Yaris (in city traffic for the purpose of this discussion) to try harder. Fuel economy conscious driving is not boring and is in fact very additive. Once one starts, one will try to do better on every occasion of driving. There are lots of fuel saving tips here and everywhere on the net (but to state the obvious, please note that there are always risks associated with net surfing). Here is a page of tips that I have casually found, just for an example:

http://www.google.ca/search?q=gas+saving+tips&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Safe/save:wink: and happy motoring everyone!

[roxy84]

yet on the highway, its F.E. whilst still good, is no better than that of its heavier sibling, the Corolla, with a bigger (1.8 liter) engine. Here are the ratings:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calcu...umn=1&id=23548
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calcu...umn=1&id=22749

swng, i think the data you cited disproves your point. the yaris average from actual drivers is 35.1, while the avg for actual corolla drivers is 31.2, so the yaris is a 12.5% increase over the corolla based on that. looking at the chart from actual yaris drivers, many of the very highest mpg figures come from tanks that were primarily highway. my tanks (5 speed yaris) have been more highway than city lately, and im getting 4-5 mpg's more than i ever achieved with my 5 speed corolla over the same routes.

[swng]

swng, i think the data you cited disproves your point. the yaris average from actual drivers is 35.1, while the avg for actual corolla drivers is 31.2, so the yaris is a 12.5% increase over the corolla based on that. looking at the chart from actual yaris drivers, many of the very highest mpg figures come from tanks that were primarily highway. my tanks (5 speed yaris) have been more highway than city lately, and im getting 4-5 mpg's more than i ever achieved with my 5 speed corolla over the same routes.
Thanks for the response.
I was only referring to the mpg numbers for city/highway driving in the new EPA official ratings and nothing else. The Corolla and the Yaris are both rated at 35 mpg for highway, with the Yaris getting a better number for city traffic. The Corolla is heavier and equipped with a bigger engine. On the other hand I respect the fact that you actually get good mpg numbers with your Yaris on highways. I feel happy for you.
I do not know why on the EPA site, both the Yaris and the Corolla get 35 mpg for highway. Please note however, that the EPA has strict rules about what is "highway driving" as opposed to many individual drivers' own perceptions. Anyhow, I cannot dispute the EPA ratings because I have nothing solid enough to base on. On the other hand, I find that your points are moot and are worthy of further discussion/observation.
Of course the Yaris' fuel economy is good on highway, as I have already pointed out. I was only trying to follow up the discussion in a few previous posts by some fellow members who felt that in city traffic, the Yaris was not performing well enough for them fuel economywise. I was proposing that with its design (I meant characteristics), the Yaris should in fact do well, and be better than other comparable cars, in city traffic.
In a vague attempt to explain why despite both models get 35 highway mpg according to EPA, more Yaris drivers report good highway F.E. to the EPA site than Corolla drivers, as you may have implied (I admit I have not gone through all the data on that site and please forgive me if I understand you wrongly), I would say that it may have something to do with why certain people acquire certain cars. You know, people choose different cars for different purposes and understandably they drive in different styles. As for me, I have bought the Yaris for, inter alia, its good F.E. I tend to believe that Corollas are more likely used as primary family cars (for e.g. taking children to school and groceries shopping etc.) compared with the Yaris, which I believe are more likely used by single/younger people as a commute/pleasure car (but not without significant exceptions on either side). This may give rise to a result that Corollas may on average carry more people and other loads. In the absence of proof that Corolla and Yaris drivers drive with the same/different styles under the same/different conditions, I tend to treat the new official EPA rating (as opposed to the F.E. numbers uploaded by individual drivers to the site) as relatively more objective because at least EPA rate cars under same rules and conditions. I think that the collective results of the individual makes/models' groups of drivers are more appropriate for further but not basic reference. To quote an extreme hypothetical example, I think an expensive big car like a Mercedes S Class is less likely to be reported as more fuel economical than the Yaris on the EPA site when it comes to individual drivers' reports to that site, partly and mainly because it in fact needs more fuel to run but also partly because a typical S Class driver will less likely (but not without exceptions) be a hypermiler, or a very frugal driver. On the other hand, there are obviously some Yaris drivers who are hypermilers or frugal drivers. So when the drivers' results are uploaded to the EPA site, the average mpg numbers for those cars you can see will be affected accordingly by such trends.

In summary, I referred in my previous post only to the new EPA official ratings for the Corolla and the Yaris, both being 35 mpg for highway but the Yaris has better city F.E., as a point of interest. I referred to those EPA ratings to illustrate that in fact the Yaris should be quite good for city driving as far as F.E. is concerned. I may or may not have proven my point successfully though, yet I definitely enjoy the meaningful discussion. For sure, I am not trying to draw a definite conclusion about the two models' F.E. More views from knowledgeable people like you are always welcome.

I apologize for this verbose reply and thank you for contributing your views and sharing your experience, which have high reference values in their own right.

[petesimac]

Due to my usage of advanced efficiency techniques my mileage in the city is the same as it is on the highway. In the city I have to accelerate many times over short distances due to stop lights and such but that's about the only time my engine is actually running. On the highway the driving is much lighter on the throttle (lots of pulse and glide, never over 55 MPH, etc.) but my engine is running about 98% of the time in order to maintain a speed.

The two sets of techniques end up at the same mileage every time.

Okay, Bailout, please to be explaining the techniques for city driving. Now that school has started for my kids, I do a lot of short distance driving with loads of stop signs, traffic, short red lights, etc. Only once with predominantly city driving have I been able to get 34 mpg (note, I've had no problem getting the high 40s for hwy driving), and the current tank looks like it'll end up at around 31 mpg. So, please, tips on how to get this number up. Thanks!

[BailOut]

Okay, Bailout, please to be explaining the techniques for city driving. Now that school has started for my kids, I do a lot of short distance driving with loads of stop signs, traffic, short red lights, etc. Only once with predominantly city driving have I been able to get 34 mpg (note, I've had no problem getting the high 40s for hwy driving), and the current tank looks like it'll end up at around 31 mpg. So, please, tips on how to get this number up. Thanks!

Please see the stickied efficiency thread at http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5979 as it covers everything I do. To be more specific regarding city driving I:

- Make use of my block heater every chance I get, carrying an extension cord to plug in at the homes of friends and family when we visit. I also have the ability to plug it in at work. Between this and errand organization it's a rare day when I do a cold start.

- Never speed.

- Never run the a/c, opting instead for window tint, a sun shade, window deflectors, keeping the windows cracked a bit, and a homemade ice vest for the truly miserable times.

- Never get above 2,000 RPM in the city.

- Use the lowest gear possible to maintain a speed when needed (i.e. 4th gear at 25 MPH).

- FAS a whole lot, basically slowly accelerating to the desired speed between known stops (i.e. stop signs, long lights, etc.) and then cutting the engine ASAP and coasting a great distance to the stop.

- Keep the engine off at stop lights, construction stops, drive-thru windows, etc.

- Park way out in the parking lots so I don't waste fuel looking for a space, and can FAS all the way to a space and park face-out.

- Use the DWB technique in combination with DFCO and P&G or FAS/P&G wherever possible to deal with red lights or lines of traffic.

- Combine all my errands into one trip, starting with the furthest one and ending closest to home.

- Constantly assess the road ahead for several blocks in order to have the time to make any needed lane or speed changes slowly, deliberately, and well ahead of time.

- Use my SGII to help keep myself dialed in.

- Try to stay informed of road work/construction areas and route well around them.


That's about it. :smile: Now you know why I say that, in the city, my engine is only running about 30% of the time. I know it sounds like a lot but by adopting and becoming comfortable with just one technique at a time, over a few weeks it all becomes second nature.

[petesimac]

Yeah, but none of what you've written can account for 20 miles per gallon; is it because my car usually has 3 people in it? Can an extra 200lbs take away 20 mpg? Is there a difference between city driving and CITY driving? I must be missing something. I already do DFCO; I don't FAS, though, although I try to DWB, but on a steep hill going down, you either use the brakes or crash, plus, again, that can't account for 20 mpg. Any thoughts?

[BailOut]

Although every change I've made added to my MPG numbers by far and away the largest item was FAS. If the engine isn't running it isn't using fuel. That's as MPG-friendly as it gets.

To give you an example of how FAS works for me let me tell you how I drive home through my neighborhood. Keep in mind that the higher tire pressures I run really help with decreasing rolling resistance, so I can coast much farther without losing much speed than someone running their tires at 32 PSI.

I've already been FAS'ing long before my exit from the highway, so when I get to the bottom of the off-ramp I brake at the light, which is usually red. I wait for the traffic to pass and once I see an opening I start the engine and lightly accelerate to the speed limit of 45 MPH, unless the next light a short distance away is red in which case I only accelerate to 10 MPH and then FAS again.

Once I reach 45 MPH I FAS and coast the next 3/8 mile to the turn onto the avenue that goes to my subdivision, and continue the FAS through my left turn onto that road. Once I'm on the avenue I can see that shitty light at the Starbucks/Home Depot complex, and if it's red I just keep coasting at like 10 MPH while I time the green. Once it's getting close to green, or of it was green to begin with, I start the engine back up and lightly accelerate to 35 MPH, then FAS the next 3/8 mile to a stop sign.

As I brake at the stop sign I start the engine up just as it's my turn to traverse the 3-way intersection, then accelerate back up to 45 MPH again. From this point I go into my last FAS for a total of a 1/2 mile that goes to my entrance road into my subdivision, then has an immediate left, then a right 100m later, then 100m to my house, finished by a left turn and a 7-9 MPH coast right up the driveway and into my garage (the trick is to start the garage door opening from a ways back).

The total distance driven in this scenario is about 1.5 miles containing moderate traffic, 3 lights and a stop sign, but my engine was only turned on for about 3/8 mile of it despite me keeping up decently with the traffic patterns.

[Astroman]

Doesn't all that shorten the life of your starter though?

[BailOut]

Doesn't all that shorten the life of your starter though?
That it does, but a new starter - which I can install myself - costs about $40. FAS'ing saves me more than that in fuel costs each month.

I don't expect it to be much of a problem in the future, though. Most starters used by Toyota are good for around 17,000 uses, which should last me about 3 or 4 years. I'm still on the stock starter and it's 7 months old now

[adamschneider]

After owning my Yaris for 3 months now (AT liftback), it seems my gas mileage is very consistent: I get about 34 MPG in the city and 40 MPG on the highway.

(For you north-of-the-border folks, that's 6.92 L/100km city and 5.88 L/100km highway.)

[ECHOKnight2000]

Although every change I've made added to my MPG numbers by far and away the largest item was FAS. If the engine isn't running it isn't using fuel. That's as MPG-friendly as it gets.

To give you an example of how FAS works for me let me tell you how I drive home through my neighborhood. Keep in mind that the higher tire pressures I run really help with decreasing rolling resistance, so I can coast much farther without losing much speed than someone running their tires at 32 PSI.

I've already been FAS'ing long before my exit from the highway, so when I get to the bottom of the off-ramp I brake at the light, which is usually red. I wait for the traffic to pass and once I see an opening I start the engine and lightly accelerate to the speed limit of 45 MPH, unless the next light a short distance away is red in which case I only accelerate to 10 MPH and then FAS again.

Once I reach 45 MPH I FAS and coast the next 3/8 mile to the turn onto the avenue that goes to my subdivision, and continue the FAS through my left turn onto that road. Once I'm on the avenue I can see that shitty light at the Starbucks/Home Depot complex, and if it's red I just keep coasting at like 10 MPH while I time the green. Once it's getting close to green, or of it was green to begin with, I start the engine back up and lightly accelerate to 35 MPH, then FAS the next 3/8 mile to a stop sign.

As I brake at the stop sign I start the engine up just as it's my turn to traverse the 3-way intersection, then accelerate back up to 45 MPH again. From this point I go into my last FAS for a total of a 1/2 mile that goes to my entrance road into my subdivision, then has an immediate left, then a right 100m later, then 100m to my house, finished by a left turn and a 7-9 MPH coast right up the driveway and into my garage (the trick is to start the garage door opening from a ways back).

The total distance driven in this scenario is about 1.5 miles containing moderate traffic, 3 lights and a stop sign, but my engine was only turned on for about 3/8 mile of it despite me keeping up decently with the traffic patterns.


Wow that's intense! Isn't there concern for safety? Like what if you have to suddenly accelerate or whatever? Also in some situations you have to accelerate hard for "safety" reasons meaning to get out of the way or get in a lane, knnow what I mean? Even if your going on the on-ramp for the highway you have to accelerate even faster than gradual sometimes for "safety" of you and others so they don't rear-end you or have to slow way down and almost rear end you. Also, how do you deal with rush hour driving like that and impatient people? Tailgaters? I hate rush hour cause well, its rush hour and it kills my mileage! And I know that's for any car. Sure there are techniques but still.
I'm NOT bashing you or putting you down, just curious how you deal with it. Mileage is important to me as well but I'm not as cautious as you are.
But keep up the good work mileage king!:laugh::bow::thumbsup:

[bogey mo]

i agree man..thats just waaaay too much..buy a scooter!!!

[BailOut]

No worries at all, ECHOKnight2000. I'm always happy to discuss these things. :smile:

Isn't there concern for safety? Like what if you have to suddenly accelerate or whatever?

If you pay attention to the world around you there is never a need for anything like that.

Also in some situations you have to accelerate hard for "safety" reasons meaning to get out of the way or get in a lane, knnow what I mean?

No, I don't know what you mean. hehe In more than 20 years of driving on 4 continents I have never experienced that. It comes back to paying attention to the world around you and planning ahead.

Even if your going on the on-ramp for the highway you have to accelerate even faster than gradual sometimes for "safety" of you and others so they don't rear-end you or have to slow way down and almost rear end you.

Ummm... no. :smile: As long as I am doing the speed limit, or close to it, by the time we reach the merge point we're all perfectly OK. If someone behind me is unhappy about that they'll just have to get over it. If they rear-end me they are automatically at fault in my State, and I get some free work done on the Yaris. I am not here to help other people waste fuel and create extra emissions by aiding them in their aggressive driving.

Also, how do you deal with rush hour driving like that and impatient people? Tailgaters?

For me rush hour is no different than any other time of day as we're all still on the same roads going the same places... there's just more of us. Impatient people are not my problem as their impatience will only get them home 3 seconds faster, and their impatience is one of the pure indicators of everything that's gone wrong with drivers today.

Tailgaters are usually not a problem for me as I live in the right-hand lane but they sure are an odd breed as they do things that make no sense at all. They tailgate me even in the right lane whether I'm doing 10 over the limit, the limit, or 10 under the limit. As such I've learned to just ignore them for the most part, but if I get one on me that's really aggressive about it I simply take my foot off the throttle and gradually slow down to about half the speed limit. That gets them to change lanes every time.

I also get the occasional tailgater on Mount Rose which is a very dangerous and intensive 2-lane highway, meaning only 1 lane in each direction. The speed limit on the mountain is 50 MPH and that's exactly what I do both up it and down it. Some folks like to think of this highway as a race track and are most unhappy with doing the speed limit but that's a problem between them and the Nevada Department of Transportation as far as I'm concerned. As such I never take it personal and I never pull out in the "slow vehicle turnouts" because I'm not going slow... I'm going the speed limit.


It's a different way of looking at and interacting with the world. Much safer, much saner, much more efficient and much more logical.

Just in case you're wondering, yes, I do get flipped off about once per month, and it's always by someone who is driving so aggressively that if a Police Officer were present they would go right past a citation to getting arrested and having their vehicle impounded.

I also get the occasional glare, but we all get that. hehe Window tint helps a bit with the evil eye types.

What's funny is once you become this attentive you begin to realize just how bad most other people actually drive. There's not a week that goes by where I don't see something that makes me drop my jaw and gasp in astonishment at the sheer stupidity and poor decision making. It would be funny if these people weren't putting us all in danger every time they get on the road.

[bogey mo]

i do agree with you..as someone who commutes across 3 major highways in the Greater Toronto Area....there are some astonishing things going on on the roads these days!!!

[ECHOKnight2000]

BailOut, THanks for the explainations! With the acceleration on the ramp, I too just gradually accelerate as there is no need to floor it. But that's because there is little to no traffic but when traffic is a little heavier I have to accelerate to merge or even if I'm getting off one highway to the next (think clover leaf). Especially if a big truck is barreling down and since I have to slow down going around a curve let alone the clover leaf I have to floor it to get back up to speed when I get to the highway that was under the one I got off on, so I don't get crushed. So do you experience that? I totally agree with you in observing the driving, even I do it too (observe) and sometimes appauled at what some people do. In fact not long ago when I drove up to the north western part of Minnesota the speed limit out of the city was 70 but I went 65...until my mom (which I was following) was going 80 if not more cause we were late for something which sucked not only my gas and money but just you know...hurt. Then on the way back I was so uncomfterable with my sister driving as she is not MPG conscience like I am so I was upright and concerned the whole time. I should have took over but...I don't know! But knock on wood according to my scanguage I got 47mpg which I've done better and could have done better that time but oh well!
Oh even if you are taking it easy sort to say, in rush hour there are some moments you have to slam on your brakes, tell me you come accross that, well even generally just for safety reasons. I know you are aware but you can only do so much...and plus people might cut in front of you and what not or the light will change and you realize you don't have time so you put the breakes on or the person in front of you puts the breaks on. And I know braking hard kills mileage so...but thanks for the explainations. I'll take what you said in consideration.:thumbsup:

[BailOut]

Especially if a big truck is barreling down and since I have to slow down going around a curve let alone the clover leaf I have to floor it to get back up to speed when I get to the highway that was under the one I got off on, so I don't get crushed. So do you experience that?

I experience the scenario you're talking about but it looks much different to me. If I'm going the speed limit, or at least close it, I don't care if there's a big truck bearing down. If he's speeding that's his problem, not mine, and with my blinker on well in advance I merge. If it's a scenario where he's doing the speed limit or less and we're going to be in the same place at the same time I just drop back and let him pass before I merge. At no point in any of that does my throttle pedal get depressed any more than the speed limit, or a reasonably lower speed, requires.

Oh even if you are taking it easy sort to say, in rush hour there are some moments you have to slam on your brakes, tell me you come accross that, well even generally just for safety reasons. I know you are aware but you can only do so much...and plus people might cut in front of you and what not or the light will change and you realize you don't have time so you put the breakes on or the person in front of you puts the breaks on.

Again, this is where situational awareness comes in. No, I can't remember the last time I had to stand on my brakes in heavy traffic because I use the DWB (Driving Without Brakes) technique to avoid the jackrabbiting, and it requires constantly readjusting your forward speed to kind of pre-react to events that are unfolding up ahead before they become a problem. Yes, people often jump in front of me but I always have enough of a gap to absorb this without a problem.

I did have to stand on my brakes once last Winter, though, on Mount Rose. A tourist in an inappropriate vehicle (read that as a RWD rental SUV) lost control around a sharp and icy corner as they came downhill, and they were careening off the inside snowbank and outer guardrail like a pinball. They were completely out of control and their movement was so erratic that it was impossible to judge what the safest thing to do was so I just moved as far right against the snowbank as I could and then stopped as quickly as possible in order to eliminate my kinetic input in case we would collide. Luckily they missed me by a good margin and I was able to continue on my way unscathed.

Even then, though, because I was paying attention I had more time than I needed in order to come to a decision and implement it. I was in position and stopped from 35 MPH and just watching this fellow for a good 4 seconds before he passed me.

The same held true when my driver's door got hit this Summer. I didn't have enough time or space to fully get out of that guy's way after he failed to give me the right of way so I made a calculation and stopped where I thought he would only hit my door rather than scraping down the entire side of the car. It worked. My door got creamed but the damage was isolated only to the door. I saw him so early on that I had more than a full second to just sit there and simply watch him coming to hit me. heh

[marcus]

drafting eh....hmmmm the only problem with that is stone chips!!!

[bogey mo]

i agree..merging in the GTA is impossible if you are going to try bailout's method of gradually accelerating..its actually quite dangerous not to be at about 110 or 120 when merging into hwy traffic in the GTA

[Shroomster]

i agree..merging in the GTA is impossible if you are going to try bailout's method of gradually accelerating..its actually quite dangerous not to be at about 110 or 120 when merging into hwy traffic in the GTA

GTA=?

[bogey mo]

greater toronto area

[Pavel Olavich]

i agree..merging in the GTA is impossible if you are going to try bailout's method of gradually accelerating..its actually quite dangerous not to be at about 110 or 120 when merging into hwy traffic in the GTA


I think BailOut runs a manual tranny, but with my auto liftback, increasing speed gradually, or shall I say too slowly will actually decrease MPG...there is a sweet spot...too fast is bad, too slow bad for MPG too.

As to getting on the freeways, I treat it like a game. The objective is to get onto the freeway in such a way as not to force the dude coming on behind you to slow or speed up. If the dude bearing down on you is going over the speed limit, sure he's breaking the law, but will you still think that if you're laying in a hospital bed? I think we need to be pragmatic here. Safety trumps the law every time.

When the dude is bearing down too fast as I merge on, I will match or exceed his speed, then once on the freeway, I will gradually slow down to the posted speed limit, forcing him to do same....doing this while getting on is not often safe IMHO, and could turn this whole endeavor into a kind of contest of wills; something I don't want to get into.

In other words, there are a hell of a lot of dead people who've died in traffic accidents eventhough they were in their rights....the Californiam DMV driving manual states that one should never insist on their right of way, and I agree with this.

[bogey mo]

i agree as well...safety before law...i am running a manual as well...i would never attempt to save a couple cents rather than get up to a speed where i can merge seemlessly into traffic

[Black Yaris]

i agree as well...safety before law...i am running a manual as well...i would never attempt to save a couple cents rather than get up to a speed where i can merge seemlessly into traffic

bail out would because he is:w00t: I would love to see BailOut drive in ATL... he would be ran off the road, litteratly. I do not know how many time I have seen trucks purposly run slow pokes off the road in ATL traffic... if you are not going 70-80mph (speed limit is 45-65mph), you are getting ran off the road by a semi, or a beatup hooptie that just don't care

[swng]

See the list of top ten least expensive cars, according to Forbesautos.com, as seen through this link:
http://www.forbesautos.com/advice/toptens/least-expensive-to-own-all-2007.html?
Click the slideshow in the article. The Yaris is ranked number one mainly because of its lowest five-year ownership cost.
I guess that the Yaris' low fuel consumption rate has contributed significantly to such a low cost. Its lower fuel demand is mentioned in the article.

[bogey mo]

ou are getting ran off the road by a semi, or a beatup hooptie that just don't care

HAHAHA yeah man...and not to pick on bailout..but u it does show you the difference in driving situations in different areas...he stated hes never had to apply speed to avoid danger around him cause hes conscious about whats going on at all times..but the plain fact is hes conscious of a one lane hwy...where as in TO u have to drive for 4 lanes...I agree with him you have to drive for others..but the way he drives is a joke!!! your car is fuel efficient...u've done ur part...

[Pavel Olavich]

your car is fuel efficient...u've done ur part...

Completely false....just because you have a Yaris does not mean one automatically gets great MPG...don't fool yourself....I can drive like a maniac and get just 22 MPG from my Yaris or drive normal and get 36 MPG, or drive for best MPG and get 44.5 MPG....

[bogey mo]

please...thanks for stating the obvious..i was just eluding to the fact that I think bailout tries extremely hard to conserve gas in a manner that i wouldn't even constitute as driving..constant meddling and complete over attention to detail..but to each his own right...as long as he stays glued to that right lane and isnt one of those goofs who merges into the highway at 80 km then hes alright in my books...there will always be a left lane for me to pass him in

[petesimac]

Okay, so with my latest tank, with 95% city driving, AC on, perhaps, 1/4 of the time, usually with 3 people in the car, I got 33.5 mpg. Better than I thought I'd get this time around; close enough to the 34 mpg promised that I'm more than pleased. How I long for the open road again though and the
45+ mpg!!!

[cute_lil_yaris]

I average about 39 mpg, but 90% of my driving consists of highway miles plus conservative driving. Now, if i drive like a speedracer going 90-100 mph with the AC blowing...then its more like 35 mpg. LOL. But no complaints here! My 96 celica only gave me 25 mpg...groan... Definitely much better off now!

[enkid]

More things I've noticed using the SGII and different driving styles and road conditions:

After coasting down the same hills in neutral hundreds of times over different weather conditions, I can state with confidence, that the temperature's effect on the rolling resistance of the tires significantly impacts fuel economy.

While it's common knowledge that cold weather is bad for FE, I've come to the conclusion its mostly due to: 1. Increased warm up time, especially when the temp is below freezing; proportion of warm-up time as part of trip time is larger. 2. Rolling resistance is the greatest of all temperature FE effects after the motor is fully warm.

Where to go from here:

Research tire rolling resistance?
I've never seen it listed as a parameter, but I suspect
1. High performance tires are "stickier", and therefore worse for FE.
2. Narrower tires and tires with a smaller contact surface (perhaps even snow tires) are better for FE.
3. Are southern/tropical region OEM tires different from temperate or arctic region OEM tires? If so, is it due to a need for different temperature ranges? If so, does this include rolling resistance performance? Do ratings standards organizations mandate that the OEM state which tires are going to be used in different markets/regions, etc?
4. Research optimum tire pressure for temperature & FE. Cruising with under inflated tires is definitely worse, but what is optimum? Cold air decreases air pressure and stiffens rubber, rolling resistance creates heat, heat increases air pressure, higher pressure decreases rolling resistance, etc

Possible mods - My first thought was to redirect the air intake to pull air from inside the cabin, but lowering the cabin pressure might create a carbon monoxide hazard. An alternative might be to cut a hole in the air intake duct between the inlet and the filter so it gets more air from behind the radiator & duct-tape the hole in Summer. I suspect this won't decrease the warm-up time by much (if at all) because hot water doesn't flow through the radiator till the motor is warm. Probably the best thing for cold weather FE would be a block heater to decrease warm up time...and perhaps narrower tires.

Scangauge Calibration

Speed & Miles driven - My SG registers about 1/6 of a percent longer distance traveled per tank than the ODO. Adjustment unnecessary.
Fill tank - correction adjustment ranges from -3% to -6%.

Fairly aggressive hypermiling, but without shutting the engine off while moving, coasting at idle instead of DFCO tends to make the SG say the FE is better than actual, and a -6% fill adjustment corrects it to within a percent.

Less aggressive hypermile, and increased use of DFCO, SG still says FE is better than actual, but less so, and -3% fill adjustment corrects it to within a percent. This is my usual mode.

Driving aggressively in commuter traffic, idling at stops, hundred mile trips in the rain, etc, and SG fill adjustment will want to be around zero.

Last winter, the SG fill adjustment was consistently around -7 percent, and my FE was around 40-43 MPG depending on how cold it was. Since then the SG fill adjustment has drifted to around -3%. I don't know if the difference is because of temperature, motor break-in or both.

32560 Miles, 693 gallons, one year (4 seasons) average FE 46.98 MPG, 90% highway, manual sedan, no mods, Goodyear Eagle GT OEM tires, Rhode Island (sea level).

[bogey mo]

wow..thanks for the info!!

[Ferret_san]

Bahhh.... Drive it like you stole it.

[bogey mo]

hahahahah wordson!!

[Bredayaris]

My average is now 46 MPG (5.1 l/100km), i'm going to try to get 52.2 MPG (4.5 l/100km) wich are the fabric standards. But that that's going to be difficult because i have to drive some 10% in cities with a lot of traffic lights and the rest (90%) is highway driving.

[swng]

Very enviable! Bredayaris, you are almost hypermiling without hypermiling because diesel engines are wonderfully fuel economical.

[Bredayaris]

Thanks swng!

I'm now driving with normal speeds and acelleration, ''going with the flow'' and my mileage is getting better:

47 MPG , 5 l/100km

[ECHOKnight2000]

Thanks swng!

I'm now driving with normal speeds and acelleration, ''going with the flow'' and my mileage is getting better:

47 MPG , 5 l/100km



That's great mileage, lucky you have a diesel...I'm sure you can get in the mid-50's? I've gotten 53mpg with my gas engine which is amazing in itself.

[swng]

Follow up to Post # 1609:

Fuel Cost
C$37.39

Distance travelled
552.6 km
343.39 miles

Fuel Amount
36.62 litres
9.68 US gallons
8.06 Imperial gallons

Cost of Fuel
$1.02 per litre
$3.86 per US gallon
$4.64 per Imperial gallon

Fuel Economy
6.63
litres per 100 km
35.49
miles per US gallon
42.63
miles per Imperial gallon

Mileage Costs
6.7662
¢ents per km
10.89
¢ents per mile

Car was used as and driven like a family car and was driven by wife 95% of the time during the period covered. Regular fuel used. Tire pressure @ 34 PSI all around. Normal maintenance schedule followed. City/highway = about 40/60. Lots of road works. Load = 2 people with groceries and/or belongings, plus or minus. AC on about half of the time. Other factors basically unchanged.

[marcus]

47 MPG , 5 l/100km wait is this for the d-4d engine.. isnt that just about 86 hp on it..

[swng]

I think Bredayaris has a diesel engine. Diesel engines are known for their good fuel economy. Although the d-4d engine may not have as many hp as our gas engines have, relatively speaking, it enjoys an abundance of low end torque which can compensate somewhat for its limited power.
I believe if Bredayaris tries harder, he can achieve an even better result.

[GrassrootsMS]

I drive almost 100% city driving (under 50 mph) and when driving normally (accelerating moderately hard, but not stomping it), I get about 33 mpg. When I barely touch the pedal, shift at about 2300, then I get about 44. My record on gas is 47 mpg, awesome for even a hybrid!

Also, to figure out your rpms at a certain speed (for those like me without a tach), I went to vehix.com and found the gear ratios for my manual transmission (the autobox ratios are also there I believe), and then plug them into a gear ratio/tire size/rpm speed calculator. At 40 mph in 5th, the engine is at 1800, at 60, it's at 2800, and at 80, it's at a lofty 3600. But on a trip to Canada once, crusing steadily at 82 on flat terrain, I still averaged 37 mpg!

[Bredayaris]

@ swng

My Yaris D-4d has 90 hp and 140 lb-ft instead of 106 hp and 103 lb-ft.
0-60 mph isn't that good as for the 1.5l gasoline engine, the diesel does that in 10.7 sec, but the high torque is really impressive. It pushes you in your seats.

I think i can easily get a better mileage, but remember the Netherlands is one of the most populated countries in the world, everybody is in a rush.
Our maximum speed at the highway is 75 mph, in the US slower correct me if i'm wrong.
My colleague has driven for over 30 years in the US and he says it's a really slow way of driving instead of in Europe, not even talked about the Netherlands ;)
But if i drive 62 mph i can get easily 52 mpg or better.

[swng]

Thanks Bredayaris for the additional information. Your fuel economical and yet fun to drive diesel Yaris is a very enviable car. Hope you enjoy your visits to this thread.
Safe/save:wink: and happy motoring!

[Nigal]

Just got back from a 2,000 mile trip. Two people plus about 200 lbs. of gear @ about 73 MPH and still averaged 40 MPG on the dot.

[Lafiro]

I dont get it, I have nothing in my car, keep gear changes between 1.7 and 2.7k on my automatic, and drive at max 70mph, but usually 55-60. And I dont get anything above 32MPG.

The most I ever got was 35-37mpg when I first got my car, and only maybe 1-3months later it went downhill. From there its been the same, 25-28mpg winter, and 28-32mpg summer.

I have done all services on the car, including changing spark plugs, switch to synthetic oil, and changed tranny oil.

[Nigal]

I dont get it, I have nothing in my car, keep gear changes between 1.7 and 2.7k on my automatic, and drive at max 70mph, but usually 55-60. And I dont get anything above 32MPG.

The most I ever got was 35-37mpg when I first got my car, and only maybe 1-3months later it went downhill. From there its been the same, 25-28mpg winter, and 28-32mpg summer.

I have done all services on the car, including changing spark plugs, switch to synthetic oil, and changed tranny oil.

How many miles do you have on the car? My engine didn't break in until about 27K miles. When I hit that my mileage went up.

[Shroomster]

still getting 29.5 mpg city in my 2001 civic 4-door hehe

I'm trying to keep up with you all...

[swng]

Five ways to greenify your car:

http://en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/caa/article.aspx?cp-documentid=5286407

Better fuel economy will come as a by-product. Just one more reason to try harder to save earth, and gas and money of course:smile:.

[Lafiro]

I have been trying not to accel fast, and living in a packed place/close to the city, I have 99% of people who always speed. And this includes having to rev to 2000rpm minimum when allowing it to change gears because the guys behind will have a titty attack and almost hit my bumper.

As for driving the speed limit, it says 50mph, most people during the day do 60-65, and at night up to 70. So you see its hard for me just to even do 60mph at times. But even so, I tried my best and only got 32mpg. Mind you this is also after taking out two 12" sub's and changing back to stock rims/tires. I guess Im just unlucky with my car?

Also, I have now about 24,000 miles on the car.

[marcus]

I have been trying not to accel fast, and living in a packed place/close to the city, I have 99% of people who always speed. And this includes having to rev to 2000rpm minimum when allowing it to change gears because the guys behind will have a titty attack and almost hit my bumper.

As for driving the speed limit, it says 50mph, most people during the day do 60-65, and at night up to 70. So you see its hard for me just to even do 60mph at times. But even so, I tried my best and only got 32mpg. Mind you this is also after taking out two 12" sub's and changing back to stock rims/tires. I guess Im just unlucky with my car?

Also, I have now about 24,000 miles on the car.

2 things i can think of!!

1. check tire pressure! add about maybe 5 psi over stock.
2. and air filter may be the cause as well...:thumbsup:

[Canuck]

Lafiro,

When we quote mpg, check the location of the poster. Canadian posters may be posting imp mpg. 40 imp mpg is about 33 us mpg.

Quoting L/100km or even kml is more accurate as the litre is standard.

[Zinck]

I find the most i have gotten with my tank is 640km, and my first bar on my tank gose away after 140 km, the second one drops at about only 80 to 90km

[marcus]

I find the most i have gotten with my tank is 640km, and my first bar on my tank gose away after 140 km, the second one drops at about only 80 to 90km

the most i can get on the 1st bar is 126km. i fill up on 570 with 38.5 liters.. with 3.5- 4 liters left over..

[swng]

At the earlier days of my Yaris, I sometimes filled the tank until it spilled and I have for once exceeded 180 km with the first bar. I believe that some member(s) has/have done even better. Now I just fill till the nozzle automatically stops and I get more or less what marcus gets as described in his above post.
There are lots of road works on my way recently. My fuel economy is bound to be adversely affected. I am not too optimistic about the result of the current tank.

[Bredayaris]

Here's a blurry shot wich i've made this morning with my phone.

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/5097/spa0380sp5.jpg

If you can read it a little bit, my mileage dropped to 4.9 L/ 100km, almost 48 MPG. You have to keep in mind that i always drive just around 77 mph.
If i lower the speed to around 62 mph i'll get a much better mileage, it's oh so fun with my diesel :biggrin:

[BailOut]

I fueled up this morning with 10.436 gallons after 538.8 miles driven for 51.629 MPG US.

[Goalie]

Show off Brian. Nice job!!!!Wish we had a diesel here in the US. Nice little 3 cyl turbo like in the Smart Car would be sweeeeeeeeet

[sjyaris]

Hi, I am a new member to this forum. I found this thread very informative and resourceful. So, I thought I might as well share my fuel consumption numbers with all of you. Firstly, we have two Toyotas in our household, namely a 2007 Yaris LE (5dr)(auto) and a 2002 Corolla CE (auto). The average number for the Yaris is 6.54L/100km (15.3km/L). The average for the Corolla is 6.83L/100km(14.6km/L). The numbers represent purely highway driving (~95%) of 37km(one-way to work). I am a bit concerned considering that Yaris is a lighter car (1050kg) compared to the Corolla (1200kg). I usually drive at around 110-120km/h on highway 401. I will keep you updated with my future consumption numbers for the Yaris. Hope this was a useful piece of data.

[BailOut]

You can't go by the bars, voodoo22. They are not linear nor static. The only measurement you can count on is at the pump (dividing your distance traveled by the amount of fuel you fill with).

Even then your best bet for measurement consistency will be to always fill up at the same time of day (i.e. on the way to work in the morning), at the same station and at the same pump.

[Lafiro]

I get the same thing.

This tank si strange cause I did not follow the rules of accelorating slow and not driving at the speed limit, but somehow, the half-way point on the indicated didnt lose that bar until 242miles!!!! Which is a record for me!!

But watch it start blinking when I hit 310miles or so :( I dont get how I lose 3 bars in 60-70miles, but lose the first four after 200-240miles.

[swng]

I get the same thing.

This tank si strange cause I did not follow the rules of accelorating slow and not driving at the speed limit, but somehow, the half-way point on the indicated didnt lose that bar until 242miles!!!! Which is a record for me!!

But watch it start blinking when I hit 310miles or so :( I dont get how I lose 3 bars in 60-70miles, but lose the first four after 200-240miles.

As you described it, it is strange. IMHO, under normal conditions, it is unlikely that three gauge bars can be lost in a matter of just 60-70 miles considering that the same car has covered 240+ miles for the first half of its fuel gauge range i.e. half the number of the bars (NB:not the car's real range). It is my presumption that all relevant conditions have remained more or less unchanged. Otherwise, anything can happen, right? Yet on the other hand, it is not too unreasonable for the last bar to start blinking at 310 miles (about 500 km). All gauge bars are understandably not equal when it comes to the distances that they individually cover but your case appears a bit too weird.
The car should presumably be under warranty and I would suggest taking it to the dealership for a checking.
All the best!

[Lafiro]

I did that one when my last bar started blinking at 240miles or so for a few tanks. They said it was bad gas, and even took a cup of it out and showed it to me in the room with everyone and they said it smelled bad. Lets just say I never went nor want to go to a BP station ever again. But they told me that they would not do the work to check the fuel tank/filter, and that the ECU didnt show anything wrong, and this was even after I insisted. Whatever maybe I was pushing it but I dont like how I drive like a grandma most of the time, and all I get on average is 3mpg more. :( I could race the car all I want and drive at 90mph all the time and I would always average atleast 26-29mpg. I drive slow, and now its just 32. Lets see tomorrow when I fill her up.

And that was also the tank after pushing the car to the gas station cause I ran out of fuel!! Stupid me forgot to put gas i the car and ignored the miles that day. Ran out completely at like 336miles or something which isnt that good either.

Anyway, its at 310miles right now and still got a bit more I suppose before it starts to blink!

Maybe it is the crappy air filters they are putting in the car?
I mean I got the pil changed to synthetic and changed the tranny fluid and it didnt really do anything, but the car felt a bit stronger.

[swng]

Thanks Lafiro for the additional information above and the friendly communication as a whole. I think you have done a lot of things conscientiously trying to bring about some improvement. Let's hope that it is just the gas that has caused you the relatively low F.E., as the dealership seems to have claimed. Frankly 26-32 mpg (US) is not too good but also not extremely bad. IMHO, improvements are not impossible.
There are better ways to drive to save fuel other than just to drive like a grandma:smile:. Here are some tips that may be worth going through (again, if you already have):
http://www.howtoadvice.com/SavingGas
There are lots of similar tips on the net, with some contradicting the others. I have chosen this particular link for you because among others, Tip #7 thereof seems quite relevant:wink::smile:.
Please keep on reporting your progress on this thread if you don't mind.
Thank you in anticipation.

[Bredayaris]

I've got my 50 mpg today, but i can do it much better.

My boardcomputer said that i can drive 434 miles with one tank of diesel, but my boardcomputer is very negative. And it's better to have 1/4 filled up of your fuel tank.

In the Netherlands it's called : ''het nieuwe rijden'', the new driving.
You have to drive in 4th gear if you go 31 mph, but if i do that my dieselengine doesn't like that. It revs less than 1800 rpm at 31 mph.
43 mph in 5th isn't good for my engine too i think.

[marcus]

well i finally hit the highest mileage average.. 44 miles/gal. about 15.6km/liter, and 6.4/100 km... i had to go back to premium gas. I know I know "premium doesnt give you better gas mileage" but hey i gain 3miles /gal switching over.. or it could also be the break in period kickin in..big coincidence though..i got almost 10000 km on her. oh well...lets hear the negative comments! hehehe..

[Lafiro]

Thanks Lafiro for the additional information above and the friendly communication as a whole. I think you have done a lot of things conscientiously trying to bring about some improvement. Let's hope that it is just the gas that has caused you the relatively low F.E., as the dealership seems to have claimed. Frankly 26-32 mpg (US) is not too good but also not extremely bad. IMHO, improvements are not impossible.
There are better ways to drive to save fuel other than just to drive like a grandma:smile:. Here are some tips that may be worth going through (again, if you already have):
http://www.howtoadvice.com/SavingGas
There are lots of similar tips on the net, with some contradicting the others. I have chosen this particular link for you because among others, Tip #7 thereof seems quite relevant:wink::smile:.
Please keep on reporting your progress on this thread if you don't mind.
Thank you in anticipation.

Hey thank you.

I will follow this. Would it also make a difference that I have two nice amps still connected to the battery? I would assume all extra demand on the alternator would then mean less miles per gallon? Specifically since I removed the two sub's the 2600watt amp is still connected. The 4 speakers then are connected to a 1200watt 4channel amp which is always on and I always listen to music. Maybe this is affecting it as well? But I cant assume this will affect it any at all?????

[petesimac]

Okay, so I had my first instance of premature bar droppage; I usually get about 46 miles per bar, not including the first one which varies from 68-75 miles, and the second one which sometimes gets me 50+ miles, so when my bar dropped 20 miles short of this, I was disappointed. It happened while idling in a bank teller line; I would normally have turned my engine off, but there was only one car ahead of me and it looked like she was done. So as I'm waiting, whoosh, the bar drops, and I grumble. Once it's my turn, I pull up and turn the car off. After my business, I turn the car back on, but the bar is still down. I head off down the road, I'm coasting down a hill and "pop" the bar comes back :) So, how often has this happened to any of you, and why does it happen? Any thoughts?

[marcus]

Okay, so I had my first instance of premature bar droppage; I usually get about 46 miles per bar, not including the first one which varies from 68-75 miles, and the second one which sometimes gets me 50+ miles, so when my bar dropped 20 miles short of this, I was disappointed. It happened while idling in a bank teller line; I would normally have turned my engine off, but there was only one car ahead of me and it looked like she was done. So as I'm waiting, whoosh, the bar drops, and I grumble. Once it's my turn, I pull up and turn the car off. After my business, I turn the car back on, but the bar is still down. I head off down the road, I'm coasting down a hill and "pop" the bar comes back :) So, how often has this happened to any of you, and why does it happen? Any thoughts?

gauge bar aint accurate..actually they are very inaccurate... all that matter is what you get an the end of your 7th bar..mine leaves me about 4- 5 liters once the last bar starts blinkin..

[stuffy]

well i finally hit the highest mileage average.. 44 miles/gal. about 15.6km/liter, and 6.4/100 km... i had to go back to premium gas. I know I know "premium doesnt give you better gas mileage" but hey i gain 3miles /gal switching over.. or it could also be the break in period kickin in..big coincidence though..i got almost 10000 km on her. oh well...lets hear the negative comments! hehehe..

hey marcus, i also noticed an improvement in fuel economy when using a tank of premium gas.

i made the same 600 km round trip on two weekends, one with premium gas and one with regular.

the premium tank was 41 mpg with poor traffic conditions, the regular tank was 36 mpg with better driving conditions.

i know they say it doesn't make a difference, but that has not been my experience.

[marcus]

hey marcus, i also noticed an improvement in fuel economy when using a tank of premium gas.

i made the same 600 km round trip on two weekends, one with premium gas and one with regular.

the premium tank was 41 mpg with poor traffic conditions, the regular tank was 36 mpg with better driving conditions.

i know they say it doesn't make a difference, but that has not been my experience.

you got it. the question is is it worth the extra money for premium gas to get the extra mileage? also i put premium only because the engine runs quiter on it specially during acceleration....but be ready once other sees this we gonna get jumped.. with "oh premium dont give us better mileage and stuff" hehehe good luck!:thumbsup:

[BailOut]

Well, it looks like the premium gas worked for a few of you but my MPG actually decreased by 9% on 93 Octane vs. 87 Octane.

Perhaps it's because my driving style is so different.

[marcus]

try 89 instead of 93 thats too high of an octane for our car.. maybe u may notice the diff... again i only do it for the engine running slightly quieter on premium..89 ofcourse.

[BailOut]

I've done that. 89 Octane = a loss of 5% MPG, 93 Octane = a 9% loss.

I tried 2 tanks in a row of each to get a more accurate test (and the low numbers hurt my running tank average). Without a doubt I consistently get the highest MPG with 87 Octane.

Aside from my much calmer driving style two other things that may make a difference for me are that we're always on 10% Ethanol here and I'm at a higher altitude than most folks (my home is at 4,500ft., my office is a 6,350ft., and I traverse an 8,900ft. summit to get there).

[jmharn]

Does anybody notice that the 2008 yaris mpg ratings are lowered from 34/39 to
29/35? (mpg, that is)

I asked my dealer, and he mentioned that it has something todo with the government's policy to conduct the test has changed in 08...anyone second that?

[ern-diz]

I've done that. 89 Octane = a loss of 5% MPG, 93 Octane = a 9% loss.

I tried 2 tanks in a row of each to get a more accurate test (and the low numbers hurt my running tank average). Without a doubt I consistently get the highest MPG with 87 Octane.

Aside from my much calmer driving style two other things that may make a difference for me are that we're always on 10% Ethanol here and I'm at a higher altitude than most folks (my home is at 4,500ft., my office is a 6,350ft., and I traverse an 8,900ft. summit to get there).

facinating...i just filled up with my first tank of 91...have been running 89 and it appears as though to start i'm getting a bit better mpg with the 91 than i have with the few tanks of 89...as far as conditions go, i'm in socal and its been warm (besides today lol)...trying to figure out what would be the best octane to run for engine life vs. FE...87, 89 or 91...

[BailOut]

Does anybody notice that the 2008 yaris mpg ratings are lowered from 34/39 to
29/35? (mpg, that is)

I asked my dealer, and he mentioned that it has something todo with the government's policy to conduct the test has changed in 08...anyone second that?

The EPA changed the way they do the test to reflect the way people are actually driving rather than how they are supposed to be driving, starting with the 2008 model year.

http://fueleconomy.gov/feg/ratings2008.shtml

[swng]

Hey thank you.

I will follow this. Would it also make a difference that I have two nice amps still connected to the battery? I would assume all extra demand on the alternator would then mean less miles per gallon? Specifically since I removed the two sub's the 2600watt amp is still connected. The 4 speakers then are connected to a 1200watt 4channel amp which is always on and I always listen to music. Maybe this is affecting it as well? But I cant assume this will affect it any at all?????
Once again thanks for the communication and your interest in the subject of this thread.
I am no expert but I know that amplifiers do not run with 100% efficiency. Some amps (for that matter, sound systems) can have a higher efficiency then the others. When an amp is switched on, a certain power, which has to come from the gas you buy, is lost i.e. not producing sound. Say if the amps' average efficiency is x %. Then each time an amp is on, (100 - x)% of power is simply lost. At the same overall sound level (deep bass requires a lot of power anyway), the greater is the amp's list power, the more power, hence your fuel, is likely lost. A distant analogy is that at the same speed and carrying the same driver, an SUV uses more fuel than our Yari:wink:. Most amps consume a certain power whenever turned on, whether the volume is turned up or music is played at all or not. A visible circumstantial evidence of the power lost I am talking about can be found in the big heat sinks (the multiple heat dissipation fins) that are built into the high power amplifiers. Apart from whether they are electrically safe to touch, those things are very warm or even hot to touch after the amplifiers have been switched on for some time. Even when we are not talking about amplifier efficiency, generally, using the sound system consumes power. Again, some systems are more efficient than the others, but no sound system can run without using power. As a rule of thumb, heavy bass consumes the most power.
I submit that for comfort (e.g. masking the noise), pleasure, safety and convenience (i.e. traffic and weather reports etc) and alertness (that is keeping you from falling asleep whilst driving), there are certain advantages of turning on the sound system, so the fuel is not consumed for nothing. However, bigger sound systems usually mean bigger fuel bills.
Just a further note about http://www.howtoadvice.com/SavingGas, there are some links to a few very useful articles at the bottom of the page. If you have time, I recommend that you go through them, at least cursorily. As a disclaimer, I wish to point out that some gas saving tips may contradict with some others and they are to be adopted (or otherwise) with good sense, with reference to the local laws and driving environment, and at one's own risk.
Just my humble opinions. Correct me if I am wrong. Please post here often:smile:.

[BailOut]

Do you have Shell gas around there which put 0% ethanol in their V-power? I wonder how that would result. I can't see you gaining over 9% based on no ethanol. I only use regular and can't justify spening over 10% more for gas when the car doesn't need it. After years of buying premium, spending less than $30 on gas at the end of the week is something I don't want to give up:thumbup:

I only use Shell gas and E10 is a mandate. Regardless of the Octane level, if you buy it in Nevada or California it's 10% Ethanol. In the cold months it gets worse as our Winter fuel - by mandate - is E10 RFG (reformulated gasoline).

This helps the lead-footers produce much less emissions, which is a good thing, but by proxy it robs the proper drivers of lots of mileage.

[eTiMaGo]

Wahoo! just got 30MPG today :laugh:

Minimal use of aircond, DFCO to the max, and rarely revved over 3000RPM. And not a whole lot of highway driving as well which surprises me...

[jdium]

Wahoo! just got 30MPG today :laugh:

Minimal use of aircond, DFCO to the max, and rarely revved over 3000RPM. And not a whole lot of highway driving as well which surprises me...

I've never had a tank below 34 empeegees in 5,000 miles...you driving in 110% humidity, 125 degrees? :eek:

[eTiMaGo]

I've never had a tank below 34 empeegees in 5,000 miles...you driving in 110% humidity, 125 degrees? :eek:

Something like that... but also very very short trips usually, which does not help at all. Previous best tank was 26MPG, so this was a nice little jump!

[Lafiro]

Ok, just put has and noticed Ive been running on low PSI on my front two tires the whole tank. BUT!
Previous tank was 32mpg, this tank was 33.1 MPG!!!!!!!

Now Im going to inflate the tires to like 43PSI instead of there maybe 26 there at now. And then I will see what happens this tank.

[swng]

I am preparing to find some time to read all these articles. I know I may not agree to everything that they say, but I know I am going to enjoy every article immensely. I also know that I may be surprised by something that they say as I read on:

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/fueleconomy/articles/index.html

These articles touch on many subjects that are frequently asked about by members interested in fuel economy.

[SuperFunBall]

wow after reading 115 pgs, i'm tired

[briman]

I've never had a tank below 34 empeegees in 5,000 miles...you driving in 110% humidity, 125 degrees? :eek:

I'm routinely 26 mpg in the city. I do not drive the car hard. My last tank was 23 mpg, all city. I'm more than a bit disappointed. I'm beginning to wish I had just bought a corolla or camery.

[yarswiss]

I just got 40mpg! W00T! Haha I usually get around 50, but this tank I decided to go berserk and see just how LOW I could take it. Driving at 80-90mph, treating each green light like a drag strip, going flat-out on the gas on uphills, etc. I was going to get 36mpg at one point, but then I started driving on the freeway again, and my numbers went up, darn it! :biggrin:

[mkaresh]

I'm routinely 26 mpg in the city. I do not drive the car hard. My last tank was 23 mpg, all city. I'm more than a bit disappointed. I'm beginning to wish I had just bought a corolla or camery.

The automatic isn't helping. But the big difference is the number of stops per mile--people mean very different things by "city." The more there are, the better off you would have been in a Prius.

The figures owners have been reporting on TrueDelta's Fuel Economy Survey:

Toyota Yaris fuel economy (http://www.truedelta.com/fuel_economy.php?stage=pt&bd=Toyota&mc=469)

[Stargate YARlantIS]

Each bar is 1.3875 gals....if my calculations are correct.

[BailOut]

I'm routinely 26 mpg in the city. I do not drive the car hard. My last tank was 23 mpg, all city. I'm more than a bit disappointed. I'm beginning to wish I had just bought a corolla or camery.

Hello briman,

Please read through the 3 stickies in this subforum for some additional ideas on how to improve your mileage.

[briman]

The automatic isn't helping. But the big difference is the number of stops per mile--people mean very different things by "city." The more there are, the better off you would have been in a Prius.

The figures owners have been reporting on TrueDelta's Fuel Economy Survey:

Toyota Yaris fuel economy (http://www.truedelta.com/fuel_economy.php?stage=pt&bd=Toyota&mc=469)

I have auto/sedan. My city driving is in a town of 20,000 people, so a lot of stop and go driving. Stop signs every quarter mile or so. No merges or blending traffic like in a larger metro. It's also colder which means it's idled longer than normal. But still, 23 mpg is disappointing. It is under 3000 mile and I'm hoping for improvement upon break in. I do not mash it ever I coast as much as possible but I do keep up to the speed limit. Some people tell me their Corolla is getting better mileage. :frown: Or their lying.

Hello briman,

Please read through the 3 stickies in this subforum for some additional ideas on how to improve your mileage.

Thanks, I always welcome advice.

[mkaresh]

Each bar is 1.3875 gals....if my calculations are correct.

I doubt the gauge is this precise or this linear. At least I've never come across one that was.

There's one reasonably accurate way to measure fuel economy. Fill the tank. Drive. Fill the tank again (hopefully to the same point each time--two clicks with a few seconds in between is what I do). Divide miles driven by gallons used.

Some people might think this method is just common sense. But I've come across many people who estimate MPG based on the fuel gauge. Usually a bad idea.

[TinyGiant]

Miles --- gal-- MPG
276.0-- 7.824-- 35
367.0-- 9.977-- 36
215.0-- 6.294-- 34
247.0-- 6.264-- 39
316.0-- 8.231-- 38
249.3-- 7.134-- 34
277.6-- 8.164-- 34
295.9-- 8.558-- 34
345.0-- 10.247-- 33
319.9-- 10.507-- 30
315.0-- 9.892-- 31
261.2-- 8.439-- 30

lol.. can you tell when i put on my rims/tires and took off the stock ones?
i've also started getting more relaxed driving a little faster... i guess i'll have to get back on the ball.



this is with no engine mods, 205/40/17 tires on enkei rims, custom woofer box in the back that probably weights 20-30 lbs

[talnlnky]

Miles --- gal-- MPG
276.0-- 7.824-- 35
367.0-- 9.977-- 36
215.0-- 6.294-- 34
247.0-- 6.264-- 39
316.0-- 8.231-- 38
249.3-- 7.134-- 34
277.6-- 8.164-- 34
295.9-- 8.558-- 34
345.0-- 10.247-- 33
319.9-- 10.507-- 30
315.0-- 9.892-- 31
261.2-- 8.439-- 30

lol.. can you tell when i put on my rims/tires and took off the stock ones?
i've also started getting more relaxed driving a little faster... i guess i'll have to get back on the ball.



this is with no engine mods, 205/40/17 tires on enkei rims, custom woofer box in the back that probably weights 20-30 lbs

OUCH!.... I hate myself unless i get 40+mpg. Even when i've got some weight in the car and drive 80 I still manage 35+ mpg.

[landrym28]

I can usually crack the 40mpg mark in the summer, but in the winter, I'm usually in the 29-33mpg range. It's good that gas prices have decreased so far, as it kind of offsets the fact that I can't get as far on a tank.

[BailOut]

Miles --- gal-- MPG
276.0-- 7.824-- 35
367.0-- 9.977-- 36
215.0-- 6.294-- 34
247.0-- 6.264-- 39
316.0-- 8.231-- 38
249.3-- 7.134-- 34
277.6-- 8.164-- 34
295.9-- 8.558-- 34
345.0-- 10.247-- 33
319.9-- 10.507-- 30
315.0-- 9.892-- 31
261.2-- 8.439-- 30

lol.. can you tell when i put on my rims/tires and took off the stock ones?
i've also started getting more relaxed driving a little faster... i guess i'll have to get back on the ball.



this is with no engine mods, 205/40/17 tires on enkei rims, custom woofer box in the back that probably weights 20-30 lbs

Whoa... With gas at $3 those wheels are costing you $200 per year, and driving faster is costing you another $200 per year.

[TinyGiant]

yeah I plan on starting to hypermile more again and keep it under 55 on the hwy

35 seems to be about the best i can get with the wheels .. but they make the car look so sporty.. lol i'm not going to get rid of them

with the money i'm saving since i got rid of my jeep 16-18mpg that $200 a year is nothing lol

[TinyGiant]

my spedometer is about 4mph higher than actual speed at about 50mph

[TinyGiant]

if i remember right

[TinyGiant]

it just dawned on me..

when the mpg started going south was when the weather started getting colder.. and i had to run the Defroster for the front windshield alot.. from what i was reading earlier the defroster runs the AC too... thats probably more likely the cause.. whenever i have the heat on its always on the defrost/footwell setting...

[Jem_hadar]

I've come across many people who estimate MPG based on the fuel gauge. Usually a bad idea.
LOL! Thats too funny!

[Revsson]

it just dawned on me..

when the mpg started going south was when the weather started getting colder.. and i had to run the Defroster for the front windshield alot.. from what i was reading earlier the defroster runs the AC too... thats probably more likely the cause.. whenever i have the heat on its always on the defrost/footwell setting...

In my 2009 owner's manual, page 178 states that:
"If A/C is not pressed, the system will blow ambient temperature air or
heated air."
And then later on page 183, it states:
"When the outside air temperature approaches 32 F (0 C)
The air conditioning system may not operate even when A/C is pressed."

Perhaps that has changed from the 2007 or 2008 model year, as my buddy
who has a 2007 said that he thought the A/C came on automatically when
he moved the selector to the feet and windshield defroster setting.

Is that a definitive answer or not. :iono:

I have heard that other makes of cars use the A/C when in defrost, but who knows?

[gid]

40 m.p.g. . Trip was many steep hills , 20 m.p.h. winds , 28 > 30 degrees , 2 people , 30% city 70% highway , 1/3 tank of SUNOCO 87 octane along with 2/3s 93 octane containing 10% ethanol , and GOODYEAR Eagle LS tires set at 34 p.s.i.. Using SHELL Full Synthetic 5w-30 and REDLINE MT-90 true synthetic for gear oil . Quite good for these temps and the winterblend of gas . :thumbsup:

[hshi]

very poor gas consumption: 22MPG or 400 KM off 42 L
My car: 2008 Yaris Hatchback Auto. total mileage is 10800KM.
I have some strange issue. Everytime when I start the engine and give the gas, the car engine will be revving but the speed stays slow, this may last around 5 mins and when I loose the gas a bit, the rpm will drop sharply and I feel a sudden push somehow. I always drive around city limits and mainly do the city driving. Any recommendations for that?
It kinda drives me insane as the main reason I go for yaris is for the gas consumption but it did not give what I expect.
Thanks

A Puzzled Yaris Owner

Hui

[BailOut]

That is odd indeed, hshi. It sounds as though your air and/or fuel flow is restricted, either by physical blockage or by the ECU. Since your vehicle is still within the warranty period I encourage you to take it to a dealership for repair. If you are more the DIY type here are a few things to try:

1) Check the air filter and reseat/replace it if necessary.
2) In the fuse box in the engine compartment pull the ECU fuse for 15 minutes and then put it back in.
3) Get a fuel injector cleaning gasoline additive and use it.

[marcus]

very poor gas consumption: 22MPG or 400 KM off 42 L
My car: 2008 Yaris Hatchback Auto. total mileage is 10800KM.
I have some strange issue. Everytime when I start the engine and give the gas, the car engine will be revving but the speed stays slow, this may last around 5 mins and when I loose the gas a bit, the rpm will drop sharply and I feel a sudden push somehow. I always drive around city limits and mainly do the city driving. Any recommendations for that?
It kinda drives me insane as the main reason I go for yaris is for the gas consumption but it did not give what I expect.
Thanks

A Puzzled Yaris Owner

Hui

i have this feeling that ur not using the right gear when you drive....use D...rather than 1 or 2

[SpaceShot]

Hui,

Do you have a very short commute? Your symptoms sound like the engine warm-up cycle is affecting your shifting. My wife's auto XB retards the shifting while the engine is in the initial warm-up phase. Get out for a highway drive on the weekend for a good 20 minutes or more to make sure the engine gets to full temperature for a good while. If that tank significantly improves your average, consider a higher temp thermostat, engine heater, different oil, or other tricks to warm it up faster.

In Canada you should have gotten the cold weather package Yaris. The dealers shouldn't have had any others. If your not sure, have a mechanic check and evaluate if you are having cold engine problems.

[Yaris#2]

Less than 3000 miles on the care and last tank was 44.8. In town and rural roads. Some 2 lane highway driving mostly 70 degree weather. I can hardly wait for highway driving in the summer!

[Hershey]

we've averaged close to 41 m.p.g. for the last 3 fill ups . These cars are cold blooded , love the heat .

[shastatodd]

I am surprised so many people are reporting such low fuel economy with the Yaris.

I have a 2009, 3 door, well broken in now with 31K on it. On the freeway (74 MPH with A/C on) I typically get in the low 40's... 42 is very common.
In town with hypermileing techniques I have gotten as high as 51, but more typically get around 48 or 49 MPG.

These are the same kinds of numbers we got in our Prius (which my ex-wfe now has). I used to love the Prius, but now... considering the embedded energy in that vehicle, it seems silly to buy one when with conscious driving (what the Prius tries to do for you) you can obtain similar fuel economy. Plus the Yaris was $11.5K & the Prius was over $30K.

[Thai_Dang]

I think everybody who speeds above the speed limit on the highway should stop on the shoulder and look out their window. When I'm going 65 mph on the freeway, I feel like I'm moving in slow motion, but it's scary how fast 65 mph looks when you're completely stopped.

[Hershey]

2008 automatic sedan : 44.56 for calculated mileage . ECO-METER : 44.2 . E.M.. Set at 98 . When set at 99 it's too high . No in betweens .

[STC]

In town with hypermileing techniques I have gotten as high as 51, but more typically get around 48 or 49 MPG.

These are the same kinds of numbers we got in our Prius (which my ex-wfe now has). I used to love the Prius, but now... considering the embedded energy in that vehicle, it seems silly to buy one when with conscious driving (what the Prius tries to do for you) you can obtain similar fuel economy. Plus the Yaris was $11.5K & the Prius was over $30K.


Using hypermiling techniques, I'm typically getting 48-50 MPG too! My highest so far was 53 MPG. The car is a 2010 with about 5,600 miles.

I'm actually doing about the same average as a Prius... at half the showroom price. That is why it was important for me in purchasing the Yaris. You can squeeze out comparable MPG with pretty much the same 'footprint' as the Prius! Go figure!

It would be nice if all people across the board purchased small vehicles and drove thinking common sense, efficiency, and used hypermiling techniques. Then we would really be 'green' even without having to drive marketed 'hybrid' cars!

Cheers! :smile:

[Hershey]

here's our latest mileage when we went to look at a 2011 Fiesta . The 1st pic is M.P.G. average ( 45.3 ) when we arrived at the dealer lot . The second pic is the overall average ( 43.4 ) and miles when got home . The E.M. is set at 98 so reads slightly lower than the calculated fill , when at 99 reads too high . So likely at 44 avg.. Not so bad for a automatic . Still found a slight leak of the head gasket . Tip of finger was wet with fresh oil after cleaning it before the trip . Seems to be slowing down .

[KrazyDawg]

Using hypermiling techniques, I'm typically getting 48-50 MPG too! My highest so far was 53 MPG. The car is a 2010 with about 5,600 miles.

I'm actually doing about the same average as a Prius... at half the showroom price. That is why it was important for me in purchasing the Yaris. You can squeeze out comparable MPG with pretty much the same 'footprint' as the Prius! Go figure!



If you use the same hypermiling techniques plus the special ones for the Prius e.g. super highway mode which lets you get 70+ MPG on the highway http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=171831#post171831 the Prius would have a much higher MPG than the average driver. :biggrin:

[BailOut]

If you use the same hypermiling techniques plus the special ones for the Prius, the Prius would have a much higher MPG than the average. :biggrin:
That's certainly true, but then you'd have spent at least twice as much for the Prius which takes an awful long time to break even on, and there are batteries to contend with.

Don't get me wrong - I have no problem with batteries and would absolutely love to have an electric car. I just don't care for the hybrid concept, or the tiny battery that the Prius uses which mandates a lot of load on it.

[KrazyDawg]

That's certainly true, but then you'd have spent at least twice as much for the Prius which takes an awful long time to break even on, and there are batteries to contend with.

Don't get me wrong - I have no problem with batteries and would absolutely love to have an electric car. I just don't care for the hybrid concept, or the tiny battery that the Prius uses which mandates a lot of load on it.
I've purchased all my cars used. I've seen a used Prius at Enterprise for around 16-17k. My used Yaris was 10,600. I commute 130 miles a day but I don't plan on having this commute forever. I would probably break even sooner than the average person but you can't go wrong with either car.

There are reports of the original batteries on Ford Escape hybrids running past 300,000 miles. http://www.greencarreports.com/blog/1020431_more-proof-that-batteries-last-ford-escape-hybrid-taxis-retire-with-300000-plus-miles A Prius taxi driver in Canada was still running past 200,000 miles. I don't have any doubts about maintenace or longevity on the batteries.

[daf62757]

I've purchased all my cars used. I've seen a used Prius at Enterprise for around 16-17k. My used Yaris was 10,600. I commute 130 miles a day but I don't plan on having this commute forever. I would probably break even sooner than the average person but you can't go wrong with either car.

There are reports of the original batteries on Ford Escape hybrids running past 300,000 miles. http://www.greencarreports.com/blog/1020431_more-proof-that-batteries-last-ford-escape-hybrid-taxis-retire-with-300000-plus-miles A Prius taxi driver in Canada was still running past 200,000 miles. I don't have any doubts about maintenace or longevity on the batteries.

You can always find the exception to the norm. All it takes is one time and you are stuck with a fortune in battery replacement costs. A Yaris battery is cheap..and the cost benefit of a Yaris over a Prius or any other hybrid is a no brainer.

[KrazyDawg]

You can always find the exception to the norm. All it takes is one time and you are stuck with a fortune in battery replacement costs. A Yaris battery is cheap..and the cost benefit of a Yaris over a Prius or any other hybrid is a no brainer.
It's unfortunate when it happens even to the most reliable brands out there. A battery replacement at Art's Automotive would be around $2850 (including labor) if the battery packs remain at $2500. http://www.artsautomotive.com/hybrid-articles/38-hybrids/140-predictive-battery-failure-analysis-for-the-prius-hybrid

Battery replacement on 1st gen Prius: http://www.artsautomotive.com/hybrid-articles/145-installing-a-prius-hv-battery

Art's Automotive from a mechanic's standpoint does point out that overall the maintenance cost and gas savings on a hybrid will cost you more than purchasing a high MPG commuter car like the Prius or "new" Fiesta.

I'm still trying to break the 40 MPG barrier and I have an Ecometer on the way. I'm going to try testing it with A/C on/off, fresh air vs circulating with with A/C off, etc to see what the MPG impact is.

[Thai_Dang]

I only get 37.3 mpg with AT. Wondering if I could get better? I do 60% hwy, 40% city, live in suburb Garden Grove, CA. I accelerate really slowly, time red lights and limit brake lights, limit idling, go 5 mph below speed limit in city, go 65 mph on freeway, no AC usage. Have 0w20 syn motor oil. How do you guys get above 40 mpg or even 50? I believe I drive slower than 100% of the people in my area.

[brg88tx]

I only get 37.3 mpg with AT. Wondering if I could get better? I do 60% hwy, 40% city, live in suburb Garden Grove, CA. I accelerate really slowly, time red lights and limit brake lights, limit idling, go 5 mph below speed limit in city, go 65 mph on freeway, no AC usage. Have 0w20 syn motor oil. How do you guys get above 40 mpg or even 50? I believe I drive slower than 100% of the people in my area.

tires pumped up to 45? i think this is the best single thing to improve mpg on any vehicle.

[Yaris Hilton]

That's about what I get, doing all of the above and with tires pumped to 44 PSI. Nearly all my driving's in town, though.

[Hershey]

we achieve 40+ for both automatics with 35 > 36 P.S.I.. Just filled the sedan earlier and got 41.35 miles per gallon .

[docB]

Since I have owned my Yaris, including all the gas I've put in, my overall mpg is currently over 41. I just drive it. I shut off at long lights, it has been over 90mph, just auto crossed it last weekend. It has been to the fuel cut off. I get stuck in stop & go traffic. 42 psi frt, 35 rear. Synthetic oil, some stuff stripped out. 45mpg one time high on a tank full. Put 14" BBS wheels w/ 185/60-14 and it runs even better. I put photos on the forum.
doc
12k on it now in 13 months

[krolos]

There seems to be real difference what mpg people get in there Yaris,
I know drive style, Auto Vs manual and hybermile tricks account for some Of
that, but could it be that some Yaris just simply gets better mpg than others
regardless of Driver ,I am thinking there must be some kind of technical inconsistency in the engines or computers, there seems to be a fair amount
people here with similar driving styles, but big difference in mpg.

[SpaceShot]

I don't think the inconsistency theory about engines holds up.

I got 20-25% over EPA in my last ride which was a Suzuki XL-7.
24Mpg for a small/mid size SUV is not that bad.
But with the Yaris, and starting with an EPA rating of 36, my commute average is 45. It took 16 months to get from 38 to 45, but now it is very consistent.

Small tweaks (improved oil, filters, aero changes) by themselves might only get 1mgp improvement, but several of them combined with great driving will get very good mileage numbers.

[42ezra]

I own a 2008 hatchback and used to average 35 mpg with fast starts from lights and high speed on the interstates - all of a sudden when odometer turned over 70,000 typical mpg declined to 28. I have been using A/C this summer but also used A/C in the past. How can I check my emissions status, O2 sensor, etc. Anybody have any thoughts? Thank you for your kind attention.

[SpaceShot]

The ScanGuage has ability to read engine error codes and it would be worth your time to borrow one for a week or more.
If you want to spend just a little money you can get a Toyota capable engine code reader or have a local shop plug one in a give you a printed report.

I think an O2 sensor going bad at 70K is a little early. But emissions related devices are more likely than other items.
However, I would also look toward your wheels. (really low tire pressure, stuck or dragging caliper, serious misalignment) 70K worth of New England potholes could most certainly have worn something out...

[mkaresh]

O2 sensors can go at any time, it seems. But in this case there would be a CEL.

[henry33]

I get the fuel consumption of 5.5 l/km, should be something around 43 mpg I do not really know how you are able to get 50 mpg
I have 1.33 1nr-fe engine and manual 6 speed trany ;) it helps a lot on the highway ;) nut still not able to get 50 :(

[Eatoman]

I get stuck in stop & go traffic. 42 psi frt, 35 rear.
Does it make a difference in gas mileage if you inflate the front tires more than the rear?
I currently have all tires at 40psi...

[nmgolfer]

I get the fuel consumption of 5.5 l/km, should be something around 43 mpg I do not really know how you are able to get 50 mpg
I have 1.33 1nr-fe engine and manual 6 speed trany ;) it helps a lot on the highway ;) nut still not able to get 50 :(

Drive like a sailor.... Think SMOOOOOOOOOTHHHH....Don't turn that tiller or you'll scrub off some speed. Pretend you don't have any brakes and drive accordingly. When I was a kid my boss had a truck with crappy brakes I occasionally had to drive... Old Swede farmer that he was, he had no sympathy for me and simply said: don't get into a position where you need your brakes! I still drive that way today nearly forty years later and I still have nightmares of standing on those brakes and that thing slooooooowly coming to a stop.

Thing is anytime your foot is off (I mean off) the gas pedal you're getting better than 200 mpg (ac off right?) It adds up. Too bad our littl' Yaris doesn't have regen brakes say spinning up a little flywheel so we wouldn't have to feel so bad about using them... In time it will I suppose :laugh:

[STC]

I get the fuel consumption of 5.5 l/km, should be something around 43 mpg I do not really know how you are able to get 50 mpg
I have 1.33 1nr-fe engine and manual 6 speed trany ;) it helps a lot on the highway ;) nut still not able to get 50 :(

Drive below 55 MPH (88 KPH). Be very gentle on the accelerater, as if it is an egg! Pump up your tires to manufacturer maximum rating. Use long in gear glides on hills/grades... coasting. Drive 70% of the time or above highway miles. Limit your weight of car...

Cheers! :smile:

[SimTronik]

40psi, really? Damn

[bkrownd]

Drive below 55 MPH (88 KPH). Be very gentle on the accelerater, as if it is an egg! Pump up your tires to manufacturer maximum rating. Use long in gear glides on hills/grades... coasting. Drive 70% of the time or above highway miles. Limit your weight of car...

Walk, bike and bus whenever possible. :smoking:

[henry33]

I am trying everything possible but it is very hard in the city to push it below.
on the highway when I was doing 100 km/h I was able to push it on 4 l/100km ;)

[STC]

I am trying everything possible but it is very hard in the city to push it below.
on the highway when I was doing 100 km/h I was able to push it on 4 l/100km ;)

If you are able to drive over 70% on super highways or xpressways you can get over 45 mpg, considering you keep the car's speed at under 85-88 kph... super gentle on the accelerator, and major glides (foot off gas pedal) using the car's inertia (momentum). City driving - stop and go driving limits FE!

Cheers! :smile:

[STC]

Walk, bike and bus whenever possible. :smoking:

YES! Would be nice if this was promoted and actively encouraged by American culture!

Cheers! :smile:

[DevilGirl]

Walk, bike and bus whenever possible. :smoking:

YES! Would be nice if this was promoted and actively encouraged by American culture!

We lack the infrastructure in most cities/towns/counties to make this practical.

Case in point:

I live near Allentown, PA, but work in Philadelphia, PA. Philly does have Septa (public trans) which does extend up relatively close to where I live. But to catch one of their trains, I still have to drive an hour to the train station. Than sit on the train for 40-55 minutes (depending on express or local train, and if they're running on time). Then take the subway for 5 minutes to walk the 4 blocks to work. Total commute, approximately 2 hours 20 minutes (depending on traffic, Septa running on schedule, etc).

BUT, if I drove all the way to work, it'd only take approximately 1 hour 25 minutes (depending on traffic).

Yes, I know I'm the exception to the norm, given how far I live from work. However this is becoming even more popular. Where I live, we're close enough to NYC, Philly, Poconos that a lot of people live in our area but commute to work to those areas, particularly NYC.

Even if I worked locally (within the Lehigh Valley), our public trans is not up to par. It works great if you live within the larger city limits and only want to get around the city. But it does not exist in the outlying towns. So I'd still have to drive, to catch the bus, and probably wouldn't get close enough to work that I'd have to walk 10+ blocks. It's a lot easier to just drive where you need to go.

[bkrownd]

Even if I worked locally (within the Lehigh Valley), our public trans is not up to par. It works great if you live within the larger city limits and only want to get around the city. But it does not exist in the outlying towns. So I'd still have to drive, to catch the bus, and probably wouldn't get close enough to work that I'd have to walk 10+ blocks. It's a lot easier to just drive where you need to go.

Americans...always making excuses, always avoiding solutions. :wink: The root of your problem is not "transportation infrastructure" - it's that you simply chose to live much too far from work (or work much too far from home, take your pick), without consideration for efficient transportation. It's a serious cultural/societal disfunction here.

If you really worked "locally" you'd be able to walk or bike to work by definition. We are born with feet, but recently people seem to have a real mental block against using them for their intended purpose...transportation. I've always lived within an hour's walk to work....or 10-15 minutes by bike. Yeesh, "10+ blocks" is nothing! Love a good walk. :wub:

[DevilGirl]

Americans...always making excuses, always avoiding solutions. :wink: The root of your problem is not "transportation infrastructure" - it's that you simply chose to live much too far from work (or work much too far from home, take your pick), without consideration for efficient transportation. It's a serious cultural/societal disfunction here.

If you really worked "locally" you'd be able to walk or bike to work by definition. We are born with feet, but recently people seem to have a real mental block against using them for their intended purpose...transportation. I've always lived within an hour's walk to work....or 10-15 minutes by bike. Yeesh, "10+ blocks" is nothing! Love a good walk. :wub:

I live in the country. There is NOTHING within walking distance. And I'm not making excusing, I am explaining the situation as it it. There are some very rural areas in this country. There are very few jobs in those rural areas. Come visit sometime. I'll show you.

[docB]

I have a neighbor that works .3 miles from where he lives. He starts up his mustang to drive back and forth. I wonder if he drives to a gym for a run on the tread mill? Americans are not always the brightest bulbs.
doc

[why?]

Americans...always making excuses, always avoiding solutions. :wink: The root of your problem is not "transportation infrastructure" - it's that you simply chose to live much too far from work (or work much too far from home, take your pick), without consideration for efficient transportation. It's a serious cultural/societal disfunction here.

If you really worked "locally" you'd be able to walk or bike to work by definition. We are born with feet, but recently people seem to have a real mental block against using them for their intended purpose...transportation. I've always lived within an hour's walk to work....or 10-15 minutes by bike. Yeesh, "10+ blocks" is nothing! Love a good walk. :wub:

I have a neighbor that works .3 miles from where he lives. He starts up his mustang to drive back and forth. I wonder if he drives to a gym for a run on the tread mill? Americans are not always the brightest bulbs.
doc

wow, way to show your egalitarian stuck up cluelessness. Sorry but Americans don't want to live in a city, we really don't want to live in apartments that are 10 square feet at best. If you want that you are free to move to some european country.

I'll take the living in the middle of nowhere any day. No crime, very little noise, neighbors who i've never met, never will, but I know I can trust.

I'll take that any day over being crammed into a sardine can because it makes someone who is so messed up they want to run everyone else's life while they destroy their own.

btw, I like mass transit. It is great in certain places. Washington DC's metro is phenomenal. The NY subway system might be infamous, but it rocks. I have to throw in Boston's T, which is pretty darn good too. However, unless you want to give every penny you earn to the federal government we cannot have mass transit for everyone.

I wish they would throw Amtrak overboard, it is a disgusting waste of money and they run it as terribly as they possibly can.

I do wish we had some of those awesome high speed trains. 250 mph + would make boston to ny a breeze.

[bkrownd]

I live in the country. There is NOTHING within walking distance. And I'm not making excusing, I am explaining the situation as it it. There are some very rural areas in this country. There are very few jobs in those rural areas. Come visit sometime. I'll show you.

Good grief, of course you're making excuses. You CHOSE to "live in the country" where you can't possibly hope to find efficient transportation options, but then you make excuses that instead "lack of infrastructure" makes anything but driving an automobile impractical. Incorrect. The actual problem is that you simply limited your own transportation options by making a poor choice of where to live.

[SimTronik]

Does inflate your tires with azote is really better and worth it ?

[TLyttle]

bkrownd has it right. I moved here to retire, less than a mile from "town". When I lived in the Big City, I made sure that I was within biking distance of my job, and only drove my vehicle if I needed it to transport goods. Now, my vehicle stays home unless the weather is simply too stupid, or if I must travel to the Big City (some things cannot be managed locally). For a short time, I was an hour's commute from home, so I spent all my off-hours looking for a job close by. Not many people see this approach as "possible": nothing could be further from the truth.

In fact, none of this is new. 100+ years ago, one worked on the property, or rented a minimal apartment near their jobsite where the wage-earner stayed all week, commuting (by train, usually) home for the weekend. No, no, now we have the automobile so that we can spend 2, 3, 4, hours A DAY in that tin box, commuting. What an outrageous waste of one's life!!!

[nmgolfer]

Good grief, of course you're making excuses. You CHOSE to "live in the country" where you can't possibly hope to find efficient transportation options, but then you make excuses that instead "lack of infrastructure" makes anything but driving an automobile impractical. Incorrect. The actual problem is that you simply limited your own transportation options by making a poor choice of where to live.

Please... Off your high horse. Some cannot afford to live in the city. Some want their children to be able to leave the house without having to worry about gangs and gunfire. Their only (real) option is a long commute to where the work is. Now consider that you CHOOSE to live on an island in the middle of the Pacific. How wasteful! Think of all of the energy used to deliver the goods you need to live the life you do... I wonder how much we mainlanders are subsidising your poor choice of where you live.

[nmgolfer]

bkrownd has it right. I moved here to retire, less than a mile from "town". When I lived in the Big City, I made sure that I was within biking distance of my job, and only drove my vehicle if I needed it to transport goods. Now, my vehicle stays home unless the weather is simply too stupid, or if I must travel to the Big City (some things cannot be managed locally). For a short time, I was an hour's commute from home, so I spent all my off-hours looking for a job close by. Not many people see this approach as "possible": nothing could be further from the truth.

In fact, none of this is new. 100+ years ago, one worked on the property, or rented a minimal apartment near their jobsite where the wage-earner stayed all week, commuting (by train, usually) home for the weekend. No, no, now we have the automobile so that we can spend 2, 3, 4, hours A DAY in that tin box, commuting. What an outrageous waste of one's life!!!

BC, not even Vancouver, has nothing like the war zones (i.e. affordable housing districts) which define America's major (and even not so major) inner cities. Its easy for a Cannuk to tell someone else where they should live (as long as it NIMBY).

If America were serious about ending dependence on foriegn oil (its not) ... If America were serious about ending long commutes which epitomize the American way of life (especially the western states), then America would solve the problems in the inner cities. Our dysfunctional government lacks commitment to tackling ANY of these supposed concerns. (Because they are somebody else's problems)

[DevilGirl]

Good grief, of course you're making excuses. You CHOSE to "live in the country" where you can't possibly hope to find efficient transportation options, but then you make excuses that instead "lack of infrastructure" makes anything but driving an automobile impractical. Incorrect. The actual problem is that you simply limited your own transportation options by making a poor choice of where to live.

Really? You are correct. I do chose to live in the country. For the simple fact that I like to be able to breathe. I work in Philly. I've seen the city life. And it SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

City living is not for everyone. And that is not an excuse.

Please get off your high horse.

[daf62757]

We lack the infrastructure in most cities/towns/counties to make this practical.

Case in point:

I live near Allentown, PA, but work in Philadelphia, PA. Philly does have Septa (public trans) which does extend up relatively close to where I live. But to catch one of their trains, I still have to drive an hour to the train station. Than sit on the train for 40-55 minutes (depending on express or local train, and if they're running on time). Then take the subway for 5 minutes to walk the 4 blocks to work. Total commute, approximately 2 hours 20 minutes (depending on traffic, Septa running on schedule, etc).

BUT, if I drove all the way to work, it'd only take approximately 1 hour 25 minutes (depending on traffic).

Yes, I know I'm the exception to the norm, given how far I live from work. However this is becoming even more popular. Where I live, we're close enough to NYC, Philly, Poconos that a lot of people live in our area but commute to work to those areas, particularly NYC.

Even if I worked locally (within the Lehigh Valley), our public trans is not up to par. It works great if you live within the larger city limits and only want to get around the city. But it does not exist in the outlying towns. So I'd still have to drive, to catch the bus, and probably wouldn't get close enough to work that I'd have to walk 10+ blocks. It's a lot easier to just drive where you need to go.

Public transportation is about convenience. If it is cheaper to use it, both in terms of time and cost, you probably would. When it costs more, you won't.

People need to use common sense about transit....and it sounds like you are using very good common sense!

[DebbyM46227]

Good grief, of course you're making excuses. You CHOSE to "live in the country" where you can't possibly hope to find efficient transportation options, but then you make excuses that instead "lack of infrastructure" makes anything but driving an automobile impractical. Incorrect. The actual problem is that you simply limited your own transportation options by making a poor choice of where to live.

I choose to live in the suburbs where I can have a large condo with a large yard surrounding it, all mine, no loud city noises, no crime, etc. I drive 30 miles RT each day to work. Who cares? I certainly don't as my car gets good mileage. I'm not into being "green", I don't know anyone at all who rides the bus downtown. We don't have a subway in my city; we all drive, one to a car here. I don't believe in sharing a ride either, its too much trouble.

:burnrubber:

[KrazyDawg]

Washington DC's metro is phenomenal.
I lived in the DC area for a few years. The metro is good if you live nearby and you work in areas where it runs. I didn't get my driver's license until my mid 20s and I relied on public transit to get around everywhere. WMATA's buses aren't that great. The lines I took ran every 30 min to an hour and these were major bus lines. On the other hand, it did run every 15-20 min during commuting hours but if you wanted to get anywhere it took time. Nothing like NYC's subway.

[why?]

I lived in the DC area for a few years. The metro is good if you live nearby and you work in areas where it runs. I didn't get my driver's license until my mid 20s and I relied on public transit to get around everywhere. WMATA's buses aren't that great. The lines I took ran every 30 min to an hour and these were major bus lines. On the other hand, it did run every 15-20 min during commuting hours but if you wanted to get anywhere it took time. Nothing like NYC's subway.

yea, but I don't think I would want to take one of those busses. To do busses right you'd need millions of people willing to use them. London's bus system is pretty sweet, but I'd hate to see the cost, and every bus I went on had at least a dozen people on them.

[North Star]

1st tank

560km - 40L

Mostly highway.

[TLyttle]

nmgolfer's idea that Canucks have a free ride as far as commuting is concerned isn't quite right. We DO have high-traffic areas, not as many as the US, but they are there, as are the commute time numbers. If I was forced to give away 3 hours of my life EVERY DAY to commuting, it simply would not happen. Going to where the "work" is becomes a lame excuse IMHO. I would rather "learn" to shovel manure on a local farm than give away such a large part of my day!

Everyone looks at their "investment" in education, and how it would be a waste if not used. Not true. The waste is in throwing away 3 eight-hour days per week to commuting. Why is it so hard for people to recognise why they are here? Is it to jeopardise one's life in the daily suicide race? Gee, I don't think so...

[KrazyDawg]

Everyone looks at their "investment" in education, and how it would be a waste if not used. Not true. The waste is in throwing away 3 eight-hour days per week to commuting. Why is it so hard for people to recognise why they are here? Is it to jeopardise one's life in the daily suicide race? Gee, I don't think so...
That's what I'm doing right now. Commuting 135 miles a day which takes over 3 hours. I'm working full-time while attending school full-time and also supporting a family.

[TLyttle]

So, is that 3 hours one way? In the SF area, that sounds about right, so you are donating 6 unproductive hours to what?? It doesn't go to your education, your job, or your family... Oh, dear...

[why?]

just to chime in, I drove from florida to mass, and I averaged 38 mpg for the 1300 mile trip.

For some reason the fill ups from the northern states gave me better mileage than the southern states did.

[TLyttle]

I've been called lots of things, Canuck doesn't bother me a bit. As a Canuck, I have travelled in the US and Europe without penalty, unlike some Americans I have met. The US has people travelling who should stay at home: somehow, they think that yelling at someone will help them understand English better! I've also met Americans here who think they are still in the US, and that US currency is to be treated the same as Canadian currency, and get REALLY huffy when they are told otherwise. Personally, I think it has to do with the parochial education system there...

[nmgolfer]

If that is your opinion I have to wonder if you've ever been to Vancouver. Are you aware that Vancouver's downtown eastside (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downtown_Eastside) is one of the poorest and high crime areas of North America? The amount of violence in the DES trumps many impoverished areas of plenty of North American cities -- combined.

If that wasn't bad enough, Vancouver's suburb of Surrey has a district known as Whalley that has almost as bad of a reputation as the downtown east side. Drugs, combined with gang turf wars and murders (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/from-heaven-to-hell-18-die-as-drugs-war-rages-on-streets-of-vancouver-1663008.html), have defined Vancouver's image and created a major issue for media relations during the run up to the 2010 Olympic games.

Anyways, Canadian cities are built with more public transit planning in mind and the Canadian culture, for the most part, does not lend itself to extremely long commuter networks. Toronto, however, is a exception as its commuter network extends to the sorts of distances common in many (albeit much, much smaller) American cities. Canadians love their inner cities and despite normal struggles they are still safe places to live. Even in Vancouver's case, the inner city continues to be very desirable.

PS...calling someone a "Canuck" with a hint of arrogance is no different than if someone were to condescendingly refer to you as a "Greengo" or a "Yank." I think most people on this board are well above that sort of condescending attitude, wouldn't you agree?

Yes... I've been to Vancouver many times. You seem to contradict yourself. First you seem to claim Vancouver is the arm pit of north america then in the next sentence you say Canadian inner cities are safe places to live (which is something Americans will never know since we cannot immigrate there unless we marry in). Make up your mind. Funny you think 'Canuk' is a derogatory term. If it were you would think the Vancouver's hockey team would be named something else so no... I don't agree with you

[KrazyDawg]

So, is that 3 hours one way? In the SF area, that sounds about right, so you are donating 6 unproductive hours to what?? It doesn't go to your education, your job, or your family... Oh, dear...
It's 1h30m one way due to taking a different route to avoid paying two tolls and driving 60 MPH. The return trip varies from 1h45m to 2+ hours. A typical work day for me is leaving at 6 in the morning and returning around 9, so I'm gone for about 15 hours.

The fortunate ones are the workers that are able to commute by a work shuttle such as the one Google provides.

[why?]

I've been called lots of things, Canuck doesn't bother me a bit. As a Canuck, I have travelled in the US and Europe without penalty, unlike some Americans I have met. The US has people travelling who should stay at home: somehow, they think that yelling at someone will help them understand English better! I've also met Americans here who think they are still in the US, and that US currency is to be treated the same as Canadian currency, and get REALLY huffy when they are told otherwise. Personally, I think it has to do with the parochial education system there...

I wish our schools were run by Church's, maybe more of the mental rejects would actually know something.

[TLyttle]

Gee, I would be careful of that one. The churches have a spotty record on schooling, from very good to very bad, about the same as the public-run institutions. Much of the failure of the school systems has more to do with political grandstanding than anything else: which President decided that "no child left behind" was a great policy? So now, the "mental rejects" end up with a high school diploma just as long as they actually show up at school. I am old enough to have survived a disciplined, complete education, based on the 3 Rs, plus a Social Studies course that taught us about more than just the country we lived in, and a history course covering the world. And if you didn't pass, you got to repeat it until you DID pass. Sure, spoken like an old dude, but I know my education is superior to anything taught in our schools now.

We also knew about guns, as WW11 was freshly over. We were taught to respect each other, not to fear each other. Much better.

[why?]

Gee, I would be careful of that one. The churches have a spotty record on schooling, from very good to very bad, about the same as the public-run institutions. Much of the failure of the school systems has more to do with political grandstanding than anything else: which President decided that "no child left behind" was a great policy? So now, the "mental rejects" end up with a high school diploma just as long as they actually show up at school. I am old enough to have survived a disciplined, complete education, based on the 3 Rs, plus a Social Studies course that taught us about more than just the country we lived in, and a history course covering the world. And if you didn't pass, you got to repeat it until you DID pass. Sure, spoken like an old dude, but I know my education is superior to anything taught in our schools now.

We also knew about guns, as WW11 was freshly over. We were taught to respect each other, not to fear each other. Much better.

Definitely better.Which President decided a federal board of education was a good thing?

I agree Bush was bad for us, he has a love of big government that is so wrong, and he allowed Obama to come in and grow the government even more.

[STC]

I agree Bush was bad for us, he has a love of big government that is so wrong, and he allowed Obama to come in and grow the government even more.

The workings of the false left/right political dichotomy!

When will America see it's all a lie! Government for the Corporations and Government by the Corporations. They determine the government policy...

US Government is best described as a:

"Techno-plutocratic business-associational Crony Corporate-fascist Media/Entertainment induced Crimeocracy State", with the US President's job being the pitchman to sell the illusion... the supplier of the ‘bread and circuses’ to you via the corporate controlled Mainstream Media (MSM). :wink:

Cheers!

[why?]

The workings of the false left/right political dichotomy!

When will America see it's all a lie! Government for the Corporations and Government by the Corporations. They determine the government policy...

US Government is best described as a:

"Techno-plutocratic business-associational Crony Corporate-fascist Media/Entertainment induced Crimeocracy State", with the US President's job being the pitchman to sell the illusion... the supplier of the ‘bread and circuses’ to you via the corporate controlled Mainstream Media (MSM). :wink:

Cheers!

Well of course the corporations are going to do everything they can to hide it as much as possible. However some of the whisperings I have heard is that a ton of things citizens would assume is completely under governmental control was given to, and then taken over completely by private corporations. Kinda scary.

[TLyttle]

Time for another book, gentlemen, on the fate of not only your country, but most other countries on the planet. "The Secret History of the American Empire" by John Perkins shows that the "corporatocracy" does not want nation states to have control fo their natural and human resources, pressuring national governments to get on board with the global free trade agenda. Seems to me that this will lead to something that has eluded righteous leaders and madmen for the last century, world domination. Only this time, no one will survive as an individual unless they work towards this end. Is everybody happy?

[redglare45]

Switched from 17's (Centerline RPM's) to 15 inch steelies.
1st pic is the night before. 2nd Pic is the morning after, right after I filled up.
Drove about 85% highway/ 15% city. :smile:

[redglare45]

This is my second tank, back-to-back in the 40MPG mile range :smile:

Been doing mainly highway, about 85% and 15% City.
Distance:447.8 mi.
Fuel Used:10.433
MPG: 42.92 :biggrin:

[redglare45]

My best so far to date:

Distance:475.4 mi.
Fuel Used:10.926
MPG: 43.51 :thumbup:

[Hershey]

2010 3 door w/ auto : 42.17 m.p.g. ( 87mis. / 2.063 gals. : 1 click of nozzle ) , E.M. ( Eco-Meter ) : 42 ; 2 people , many hills , 35 p.s.i. , VALERO 87 , avg. speed :47 m.p.h. , 42 degrees , Winds : N.E. 10 > 20 , dry roads , PENNZOIL Yellow Bottle ( conventional ) 5w-30 ( S.N. , GF-5 ) , and 25% Cty. / 75% Hwy.. Car has 12,350+ mis..

[2007yariz]

95% of in town driving, highway trips are around 4 miles.

35.3MPG！！！

I should get above 40s if i drive mostly highway.

[N9QGS]

I get between 38 and 42 mpg on my daily interstate commutes, I get closer to 38 mpg if Im driving 70+ and 42 if I drive like 63 mpg in cruise. here in Kentucky I-75. Keep the RPM below 3,000 and the car does really well. I like to run at a speed of 2800-2850 on the interstate in my AT.